Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Dominik: Preparation, flexibility key to draft success « previous next »
Page: 1 2 3

keeponbucn

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 11481
Offline
#15 : April 18, 2009, 03:01:43 PM

Gruden

Calvin Johnson vs. Gaines Adams?

Are you serious? You can't be that dumb.......wait, nevermind

SHIVVER

*****
Pro Bowler

Posts : 1300
Offline
#16 : April 18, 2009, 04:04:13 PM

Gruden

Calvin Johnson vs. Gaines Adams?

Are you serious? You can't be that dumb.......wait, nevermind

Serious that Gruden was in-fact so infatuated with Calvin Johnson that he wasn't motived by the choice of Gaines Adams?  Yessir...........  My apologies if you're to much of a moron to decipher that. 


Calvin Johnson

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 2290
Offline
#17 : April 18, 2009, 04:21:23 PM

Gruden

Calvin Johnson vs. Gaines Adams?



Are you serious? You can't be that dumb.......wait, nevermind

Serious that Gruden was in-fact so infatuated with Calvin Johnson that he wasn't motived by the choice of Gaines Adams?  Yessir...........  My apologies if you're to much of a moron to decipher that. 


Yup I remember that; Heck when Gruden introduced Gaines as our first rounder he didn't look to excited. I forgot was it Allen or the Glazer Bros who prevented Gruden from giving the farm up for CJ? 

Blaze688

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 3092
Offline
#18 : April 18, 2009, 04:33:35 PM

I'd think it'd be Cadillac.

Gruden actually pulled him out of the Senior Bowl early, in -- what I can assume is -- an effort to keep him healthy and hide his ability from other teams.

I think he would've pulled a Mike Ditka to get Williams after what he saw from him during that week in Mobile.


redbeard10

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 2355
Offline
#19 : April 18, 2009, 07:30:53 PM

Sounds to me like the player was either Chris Simms or Marquise Walker.

Feel Real Good

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 27528
Offline
#20 : April 19, 2009, 10:36:40 AM

I'd think it'd be Cadillac.

Gruden actually pulled him out of the Senior Bowl early, in -- what I can assume is -- an effort to keep him healthy and hide his ability from other teams.

I think he would've pulled a Mike Ditka to get Williams after what he saw from him during that week in Mobile.
That's what I would bet. Though it could have been the Joseph-Trueblood-Stovall draft, too.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

dalbuc

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 21495
Offline
#21 : April 19, 2009, 11:26:37 AM

Leeland McElroy over Alstott?? I am starting to believe that only fate guides the success of any franchise...the reality is that outside of a small handful of players, the GMs and scouts are just guessing.

There is no doubt some of that. Some teams seem to cheat fate better than others so there's some marginal talent edge but even the best teams aren't as good as they want to be. I mean when SD took Leaf they were one of 20+ teams that was gonna make that same mistake.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

Madman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 5598
Offline
#22 : April 19, 2009, 02:09:17 PM

That's what I would bet. Though it could have been the Joseph-Trueblood-Stovall draft, too.

Yeah, the Joseph - Trueblood - Stovall draft felt like it was predetermined. Gruden was intent on building the o-line that offseason and he fell in love with them playing next to each other at the senior bowl. Plus it was also safe to assume they'd both be there when the Bucs picked.

Maybe it was Carnell and Ruud though. Gruden definitely targeted Carnell and Ruud had a Monte/Nebraska connection.

Still. Not the way to run a draft.

CyberDilemma

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 8223
Offline
#23 : April 19, 2009, 02:13:37 PM

Dominik said, "It didn't work out for the team and it didn't work out for the player", so I am guessing it was a player that is no longer with the team.

Mellow

****
Starter

Posts : 850
Offline
#24 : April 19, 2009, 09:13:15 PM

it is a crapshoot, plain and simple. every year you get people saying we could of had this guy over this one. as soon as that argument presents itself, i go to the tom brady/ryan leaf argument. the truth is, teams can review every game tape and scout evaluation for every single player and still know no more than when they started. guys like chris johnson live up to there draft status, and guys like clifton smith go undrafted. you never know about any player until they step on the nfl field.

This is such a stupid argument.  Why not just put the names in a hat and pick them randomly then?  Go with whatever Mel Kiper says is the "best available player".  Just throw darts.

Here's the deal: it's a decision fraught with uncertainty, sort of like picking stocks.  Yes, you can put all your money in a fly-by-night penny stock and make millions, but chances are you're not.  You pick players that have you think have the greatest probability of being successful, on your team--recognizing, at the same time, that there's a finite chance they won't.  If you're smart you factor in scouting, your system, and the historical record of success/failure for players at different positions.   If you're not, you just throw up your hands, declare it a 'crapshoot', and pick players at random.

HughC

*****
Pro Bowler

Posts : 1762
Offline
#25 : April 20, 2009, 01:13:12 PM

it is a crapshoot, plain and simple. every year you get people saying we could of had this guy over this one. as soon as that argument presents itself, i go to the tom brady/ryan leaf argument. the truth is, teams can review every game tape and scout evaluation for every single player and still know no more than when they started. guys like chris johnson live up to there draft status, and guys like clifton smith go undrafted. you never know about any player until they step on the nfl field.

This is such a stupid argument. Why not just put the names in a hat and pick them randomly then? Go with whatever Mel Kiper says is the "best available player". Just throw darts.

Here's the deal: it's a decision fraught with uncertainty, sort of like picking stocks. Yes, you can put all your money in a fly-by-night penny stock and make millions, but chances are you're not. You pick players that have you think have the greatest probability of being successful, on your team--recognizing, at the same time, that there's a finite chance they won't. If you're smart you factor in scouting, your system, and the historical record of success/failure for players at different positions. If you're not, you just throw up your hands, declare it a 'crapshoot', and pick players at random.
I agree; to call the draft a crapshoot because some late-round and undrafted picks turn out to be gems, and some first round selections turn out to be busts is short-sighted.  Might as well say there is no difference between major league baseball players because even the best make an out more often than a hit, and therefore making a base hit is pure luck.  Rather than focus on a small sample size (one specific pick), if you look a larger sample size (several years of drafts) then a trend starts to unfold.  Certain teams stand out above the others (Colts, Steelers, Patriots), others whiff more often than other teams (Lions, Raiders, Bengals) and other teams like the Bucs fall in between those extremes.

There was a recent article by John Czarnecki of Fox Sports, rating all 32 teams in Draft Review: How every team ranks from 2003-'08.  As much as we complain about the Bucs ability to draft here, they've done better than a lot of other teams in his analysis.



Guest
#26 : April 20, 2009, 01:23:34 PM

Nice link Hugh - looks like Jax and Det got the worst grades.

BucsPirate

*****
Pro Bowler

Posts : 1791
Offline
#27 : April 20, 2009, 01:43:56 PM

It sounds like the 2002 draft he is talking about. That would go a long way toward explaining the rift between McKay and Gruden. Interesting comment that McKay was  'very compartmentalized in his approach', so in other words he wasn't taking input from anyone.

Madman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 5598
Offline
#28 : April 20, 2009, 01:56:27 PM

Ah 2002. The infamous Marquis Walker over Brian Westbrook draft.

Could be.

Pteranodon

*****
Pro Bowler

Posts : 1285
Offline
#29 : April 20, 2009, 02:07:05 PM

2002 there weren't other draft picks on day 1 and he said the first 3 were decided so it was probably a different draft. Dexter Jackson is the only one that makes sense to me, they did trade back but missed some guys that weren't supposed to be there by making that move.
Page: 1 2 3
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Dominik: Preparation, flexibility key to draft success « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools