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dalbuc

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#30 : April 27, 2009, 11:41:48 PM


Dalbuc, when you say you "looked" at his College production are you merely referring to his stats, or did you watch any of his games? The reason why I ask is we have been provided 'reasons', and we have stats, but like most people on this board I did not watch many (any?) KSU games. If he thew 99% of passes on the money and his bozo's simply dropped them, tipped them for interceptions etc (I know, extreme examples) his stats might not tell the whole story. I hope you get my point though.


I watched a few of his games and truth be told he never jumped out at me as "the guy" an he looked like an Aaron Brooks type with a big arm and poor accuracy.

Other than those it is a look at his stats. I know the poor supporting cast bit but who did Rivers have, Cutler, Rothlisberger, Ryan and all have? I don't buy that anymore than I buy the WR's with poor production blaming the QB's. Great players, and a franchise NFL QB better be great, should make their teams look better than they are. Heck, even Nate Davis shredded Nebraska and his team also had no talent.

I'm not saying the kid is doomed or a flop but you look at these types of number and this level of inconsistency and you see why he wasn't a top 5 type pick with all the physical tools he has and you can understand why some folks are not enamored with what he's got.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

oregonbucfan

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#31 : April 27, 2009, 11:45:28 PM


Dalbuc, when you say you "looked" at his College production are you merely referring to his stats, or did you watch any of his games? The reason why I ask is we have been provided 'reasons', and we have stats, but like most people on this board I did not watch many (any?) KSU games. If he thew 99% of passes on the money and his bozo's simply dropped them, tipped them for interceptions etc (I know, extreme examples) his stats might not tell the whole story. I hope you get my point though.


I watched a few of his games and truth be told he never jumped out at me as "the guy" an he looked like an Aaron Brooks type with a big arm and poor accuracy.

Other than those it is a look at his stats. I know the poor supporting cast bit but who did Rivers have, Cutler, Rothlisberger, Ryan and all have? I don't buy that anymore than I buy the WR's with poor production blaming the QB's. Great players, and a franchise NFL QB better be great, should make their teams look better than they are. Heck, even Nate Davis shredded Nebraska and his team also had no talent.

I'm not saying the kid is doomed or a flop but you look at these types of number and this level of inconsistency and you see why he wasn't a top 5 type pick with all the physical tools he has and you can understand why some folks are not enamored with what he's got.

Your dead on IMO. And if this draft actually had decent QB talent, where would he actually go? IMO 3rd rd.


alldaway

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#32 : April 27, 2009, 11:45:55 PM

I do not understand why people are so defensive about calling Freemen inconsistent.  He truly was inconsistent at the collegiate level which is why he was drafted where he was.  The numbers simply back this up, so I do not find this surprising.

Having access to superior coaching at the pro level will be the key.  The fact that he admitted he needs help in his PC is a encouraging sign.  




SunnyD

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#33 : April 27, 2009, 11:48:37 PM

He is definetely a project.

Compared to many other first round QBs.

Should be interesting.

The Q

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#34 : April 27, 2009, 11:49:42 PM

If you look at Freeman game by game in college....You have to scratch your head to see how he was taken in the
first 17 picks in the NFL draft. It defies logic, but the homerism of the young HC is truly showing thru.



The BUCS are gonna surprise people this year!

LFO

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#35 : April 27, 2009, 11:51:37 PM

If you look at Freeman game by game in college....You have to scratch your head to see how he was taken in the
first 17 picks in the NFL draft. It defies logic, but the homerism of the young HC is truly showing thru.

Don't forget, our GM who also went to KSU.....

SunnyD

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#36 : April 27, 2009, 11:52:05 PM

Not really dude.

Look at Joey Harrington game by game in college and Kyle Boller.

It happens.

alldaway

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#37 : April 27, 2009, 11:52:10 PM

If you look at Freeman game by game in college....You have to scratch your head to see how he was taken in the
first 17 picks in the NFL draft. It defies logic, but the homerism of the young HC is truly showing thru.

Players are not merely drafted on the merit of college production, but how they translate at the pro level.  In fact the safe picks is what has haunted the Bucs drafts the last few years.  I am surprised people want to go back to drafting guards in rounds 1. >.>


SunnyD

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#38 : April 27, 2009, 11:53:17 PM

If you look at Freeman game by game in college....You have to scratch your head to see how he was taken in the
first 17 picks in the NFL draft. It defies logic, but the homerism of the young HC is truly showing thru.

Don't forget, our GM who also went to KSU.....

Pretty sure that is incorrect.

He went to Kansas.

SunnyD

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#39 : April 27, 2009, 11:54:15 PM


  I am surprised people want to go back to drafting guards in rounds 1. >.>




Yeah. Exactly.

This pick needed to happen.

For better or worse

Boid Fink

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#40 : April 27, 2009, 11:55:30 PM

http://www.kstatesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=3062&SPID=212&DB_OEM_ID=400&ATCLID=251134&Q_SEASON=2006

Looking at these numbers, and the competition he had to play with very inferior teammates leads me to believe Freeman can only be SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER than what he did in college...

Read the positives.  And then look at the negatives.  But keep in mind, he had his sorry O-line in front of him every game, bad or good, his sorry defense backing him up EVERY game, and they were not contenders ever.

He was picked 17th.  NOT 3rd, or 10th.  There is a big difference in where he was picked, but it is no suprise to me he is scrutinized...

We'll see if Freeman puts up better numbers than Sanchez or Stafford...it will be interesting (I doubt he starts this year, but when they are all on the field, we'll see...).



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#41 : April 27, 2009, 11:55:41 PM

I do not understand why people are so defensive about calling Freemen inconsistent. �He truly was inconsistent at the collegiate level which is why he was drafted where he was. �The numbers simply back this up, so I do not find this surprising.

Having access to superior coaching at the pro level will be the key. �The fact that he admitted he needs help in his PC is a encouraging sign. �





I don't think anyone is defensive. I think people are just getting sick of the negative attitude of our fan base. Nothing our guys do seem to be right for many of our fans - even if its a logical choice. What has caused our fans to be so negative about the Buccaneers? Has this franchise not given us entertaining, albeit at time frustrating, football over the last decade or so? Sure the way last season was greatly disappointing, but the constant barrages on Dominik, Morris, and now the pinata Freeman seem to just be ridiculous.

I don't know if Freeman will become Brett Frave or Heath Shuler...but I think the kid deserves a chance before being raked over the coals here. He won't be the same quarterback here as he was at K-State because a) He'll finally be coached up out of some of his bad tendancies and b) He'll actually be surrounded with talent and not have to do it all by himself.

Freeman is going into the perfect situation. A talented offensive team with a great o-line, a running game, and receiving threats. A coach that knows him and supports him. A solid offensive coordinator with a track record for developing QBs. From everything we've read about the kid, he's a leader and he has confidence in himself. He's a tireless worker who's going to bust his butt to get better. He's not going to be Trent Dilfer...who thought he was too good to do film study or take coaching...Freeman knows he needs to get in the lab and get his mechanics and consistency down. He doesn't need some fan on a message board to point that out.

So like I said before...all this b.s. about he's not this and he's not that is senseless. He's your quarterback. Either you get behind him or you find another team - because this one is going to live or die on his arm and we damn well better all hope he does well. Fostering this negative attitude toward him will just make the fanbase impatient when he throws a pick or struggles early and will hurt his confidence.

Support your quarterback, support your team.



dalbuc

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#42 : April 27, 2009, 11:57:30 PM

Players are not merely drafted on the merit of college production, but how they translate at the pro level.  In fact the safe picks is what has haunted the Bucs drafts the last few years.  I am surprised people want to go back to drafting guards in rounds 1. >.>

All QB's have risk. The question is why does a potential franchise QB not get picked early in the draft. He's got better tools than Stafford or Sanchez so what held people back from making the pick? The inconsistency is really easy to see and it is what folks talked about.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

Boid Fink

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#43 : April 27, 2009, 11:58:43 PM

I do not understand why people are so defensive about calling Freemen inconsistent. �He truly was inconsistent at the collegiate level which is why he was drafted where he was. �The numbers simply back this up, so I do not find this surprising.

Having access to superior coaching at the pro level will be the key. �The fact that he admitted he needs help in his PC is a encouraging sign. �





I don't think anyone is defensive. I think people are just getting sick of the negative attitude of our fan base. Nothing our guys do seem to be right for many of our fans - even if its a logical choice. What has caused our fans to be so negative about the Buccaneers? Has this franchise not given us entertaining, albeit at time frustrating, football over the last decade or so? Sure the way last season was greatly disappointing, but the constant barrages on Dominik, Morris, and now the pinata Freeman seem to just be ridiculous.

I don't know if Freeman will become Brett Frave or Heath Shuler...but I think the kid deserves a chance before being raked over the coals here. He won't be the same quarterback here as he was at K-State because a) He'll finally be coached up out of some of his bad tendancies and b) He'll actually be surrounded with talent and not have to do it all by himself.

Freeman is going into the perfect situation. A talented offensive team with a great o-line, a running game, and receiving threats. A coach that knows him and supports him. A solid offensive coordinator with a track record for developing QBs. From everything we've read about the kid, he's a leader and he has confidence in himself. He's a tireless worker who's going to bust his butt to get better. He's not going to be Trent Dilfer...who thought he was too good to do film study or take coaching...Freeman knows he needs to get in the lab and get his mechanics and consistency down. He doesn't need some fan on a message board to point that out.

Yep.


alldaway

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#44 : April 27, 2009, 11:59:23 PM

The positives are he can make every single throw which makes defending him difficult when he is on fire, is durable, and he has the highest wonderlic score of any young Buc QB in some time.

It is ironic that Jon Gruden coveted intelligent QB's, but never brought in any young QB with a high level of intelligence.  The closest QB to Freemen's wonderlic is none other than Luke McCown.

Simms, and Gradkowski had average wonderlic scores in comparison.
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