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Biggs3535

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#15 : October 24, 2007, 02:25:02 PM

That is a great Article.



dbucfan

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#16 : October 24, 2007, 10:17:43 AM

Would not confuse offensive scheme with the lack of talent at the skill positions of RB and WR  - just saying it takes players to make plays - and with an oline almost done it is time to fill some holes, or needs at O skill position. 

And yea - Garcia is playing as well or better in this offense as any QB in buccs history regardless of the offensive scheme.   But that might conflict with your point.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

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#17 : October 24, 2007, 09:51:07 AM

2002 - Brad Johnson and the dozen or so newcomers that Gruden brought in that year seemed to pick it up pretty well. 2005 personell seemed to pick it up pretty well.
In 2002 the offense was ranked #24 in yardage and #18 in points. In 2005 the offense was ranked #23 in yards and #20 in points.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

CurtR1995

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#18 : October 24, 2007, 09:42:33 AM

Hate,

Disagree with you.

Our offense has put up a lotta points.

We have put up a lotta yardage.

We shot ourselves in the foot at Detroit.

I honestlly belive (maybe in hidsite), had we not gotten GArcia knocked out f the Seattle gane, we might have won that.

Gruden finally has his QB to run his system, and its working.

Simple or complex. I could care less. All I know is it works with the right QB.

Just sayin.



We are 24th in points scored per game and in yardage, even with Garcia playing brilliantly - and as well as any QB in franchise history. 

If this is the definition of the offense "working", then the offense isn't a very good offense. 

sammy8887

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#19 : October 23, 2007, 09:47:28 PM

Not sure that coming off 422 yards of offense is the week to question it...

The White Tiger

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#20 : October 23, 2007, 09:44:48 PM

One exception Ghost - Gruden has never been hit by a car while jogging.

Raye has never won a superbowl.

I'd rather have the system that wins when it counts.

Ghost buddy, I really think that if there was any ego or that it gave him something to brag about - it has been beaten out of him in Tampa - and I mean that literally.

Miami Dolphins proved Jimmy Johnson was human - due to cap and no one challenging him - and no one willing to trade their team for one one dimensional running back. Gruden is younger, is learning some non X's and O's advanced football - and seems to be responding.

Do you think it is possible that it may be you that is stuck in a rut when reviewing Grudens coaching ability - maybe there have been some changes in the areas you have concerns?

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Boid Fink

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#21 : October 23, 2007, 07:59:19 PM

Moving a fullback out to wide receiver, and then back might give away the type of defense the other team is using.  If they are man, or zone.  So that kind of shift makes sense.

Shifting a tight end in close, and a wideout into the slot is designed to create mismatches.  Problem is, you probably could have called that formation from jump, and what winds up happening is chaos and confusion amongst the younger players.  I.E. blown assignments, misjumps, wrong routes, etc...

I agree, the terminology doesn;t need to be confusing to the Einsteins of the field.  Gruden needs to adjust his thinking with this offense, and he has to a certain extent.  For instance the shotgun snapping.  He finally after years and years and years of being bull headed gave in and rolled with it. 

Ironically, it was a bad center-QB exchange that caused the  fumble at the goal line last week...the only miscued snap all year.


MiltonMack21

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#22 : October 23, 2007, 08:17:16 PM

Actually I love the fact that Michael bennet said "It was like trying to speak and read chinese". I think Gruden's system has far too much verbagem but I think he does some of out of ego. So he can boast about having this dynamic offense when in all actuality is no better than any offense that Jimmy Ray ran in Kansas City in 96,97 or 98. Same yardage, same points. Less wins though.


SunnyD

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#23 : October 23, 2007, 07:43:54 PM

scapegoat


Gruden's System is fine

The White Tiger

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#24 : October 23, 2007, 08:12:37 PM

poor execution of the play, foiled the play. The play calling did not cause problems in the execution. It looks like confusion to the untrained eye (fans and the opposition) because that is exactly what it is intended to produce.

I do not see WR's running incorrect routes (more than one receiver in the same spot at the conclusion of routes) I do not see RB's running to the wrong gap/hole, I do not see o-linemen blocking in the wrong direction.

All of this proves those that think the offense is too complicated - are all wrong.

Easy, is easily defensed.

Rookie and new hires are confused when they see ANY NFL offensive playbook.

2002 - Brad Johnson and the dozen or so newcomers that Gruden brought in that year seemed to pick it up pretty well. 2005 personell seemed to pick it up pretty well.

If you have the right QB (hey didn't our QB pick up the new terminology pretty quickly?) and the right personell this is not a tough system to understand.

When you lose 12 folks to IR - that means your reaching down then depth charts to personell packages that should fit but have been rated below the starters for a reason. Sometimes that's due to physical ability, sometimes it's due to mental ability, sometimes you have new people that have to forget one system and rapidly have to come up to speed.

This is a spurious cerrelation and it is a specious argument.

It is what most anti-Grudens fall back on after a loss.

IMO - that is...

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#25 : October 23, 2007, 07:14:07 PM

Hate,

Disagree with you.

Our offense has put up a lotta points.

2 tds per game is not a lotta pts.... 24th in the league by the way!!!

finnbluebucs

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#26 : October 23, 2007, 07:13:38 PM

His offense is complicated because of the terminology. Secondly, there is so much motion that goes on pre-snap that it has to complicate things as well.

The only thing is, unlike what Stan said it doesn't work. When you line a FB up at WR and then motion him to become the FB what the heck does that do? Nothing as far as I am concerned. I just don't see the results from all of it or how it is beneficial. It just causes penalties in my opinion.

Yeah I'd say its the verbiage and the pre-snap adjustments. Very rarely do you ever see a Gruden play, particularly in the IForm, which doesnt undergo some sort of personnel shift before the snap.

\"We are frustrated at not making the playoffs. It is a good start. That is all it is. It is a good start for something that we are going to be in the future. - Josh Freeman

dbucfan

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#27 : October 23, 2007, 06:37:20 PM

It just can't be so simple as this team needs more talent can it?  The dline needs players.  The o needs skill position help due to injuries (and before injuries for the wide out).  The system is the issue, the terminology - I don't think so.  Better players - hmmm

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

OpTiOnMaStA

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#28 : October 23, 2007, 06:25:14 PM

Yep, Marley. We don't make very good adjustments on either side of the ball.

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#29 : October 23, 2007, 06:22:51 PM

Maybe the problem lately is that we don't have good enough players to actually create a lot of good mismatches.

Scheme adjustments maybe coach?  AGH...never speak of adjustments to the scheme no matter the personnel or lack there of... [banghead]

Monte might also want to adjust a few things as well.  This isn't the same famed front 4 led by Sapp that could get constant pressure on the QB all by itself.  We may just need to blitz a little bit more in order to get pressure and not allow QB's all day to throw. 

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