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warrenfb12

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#15 : October 22, 2009, 01:28:15 PM

best player available. You would think teams would get this by now.

its not always about the best player available

In the premium rounds it is. This team needs help at every position. Remember when we passed on AP to take Gaines. Why did we do that? Because we had Caddy and were looking to fill a need.


bizkitlimped

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#16 : October 22, 2009, 01:33:31 PM

Or how about when we passed on Mark Anderson for Julian Jenkins? or Steven Jackson for Clayton. We have way too many misses in recent past than hits and it is ultimately kicking us right square in the ass.


bizkitlimped

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#17 : October 22, 2009, 01:35:13 PM

We quit drafting winners a long time ago. We need to start putting more focus on the big time schools and look at the players there. This team needs winners and leaders, right now there aren't very many on this roster.


warrenfb12

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#18 : October 22, 2009, 01:41:04 PM

We quit drafting winners a long time ago. We need to start putting more focus on the big time schools and look at the players there. This team needs winners and leaders, right now there aren't very many on this roster.

Yep. Best player available. It's not brain surgery. Identify the most talented players in the draft and create a board. When your pick is up, take who is left at the top of your board. Fortunately for the bucs, we will have the top pick in the draft; this should make it easy for us to get "the guy" in the draft.


Feel Real Good

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#19 : October 22, 2009, 02:25:22 PM

We quit drafting winners a long time ago. We need to start putting more focus on the big time schools and look at the players there. This team needs winners and leaders, right now there aren't very many on this roster.
I disagree. We largely have been picking winners. Clayton won a national championship, Carnell was on an undefeated team, Joseph was on a perennial contender, etc. Team success can cloud judgment on an individual player. Arguably the best player from the 2005 draft played on a team that went 7-5 in the Sub Belt, DeMarcus Ware's Troy Trojans.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

dalbuc

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#20 : October 22, 2009, 02:30:23 PM

We quit drafting winners a long time ago. We need to start putting more focus on the big time schools and look at the players there. This team needs winners and leaders, right now there aren't very many on this roster.

Other than Djax I'm not sure that guys we drafted aren't big time schools. Stovall is a bust from ND. Alan Zematis is a bust from Penn State and those places are historic for the love of god. Colmer was from a BCS school in BCState. Adams was from Clemson, Marquis Coooper form UW. I don't think we've been strip mining the small schools and getting robbed there and when we do go small scholls it is usally been later day 2 type players (JJ, Grads, Hayward, Peterson).

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

bucs1

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#21 : October 22, 2009, 03:39:25 PM

Hickey has a huge amount of influence in the final decision. It is even greater under Mark Dominik.

Charlie is absolutely right about this. Hickey had a major influence in many previous draft selections and was directly responsible for a few of them, making the final selection. Now under Dominik, like CC said, I think that Hickey will be completely in charge of the draft.

Uncle Stan

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#22 : October 22, 2009, 03:50:07 PM

Here are the draft picks on the present active roster only.  Listed by Round.

That's 23 draftees on the present roster of 53. Balance are trades and FA.

1st  Freeman         Kansas State
 Â      Williams          Auburn
 Â      Talib               Kansas
 Â      Joseph           Oklahoma
 Â      Clayton          LSU

2nd  Piscitelli         Oregon State  
 Â       Ruud             Nebraska
 Â       Trueblood     Boston College
 Â       
3rd   Barber          Virginia
 Â       Black             New Mexico
 Â       Stovall          Notre Dame
 Â       Miller            Texas
 Â       Zuttah         Rutgers

4th   Allen            Ohio State
 Â       Jackson        Syracuse
 Â       D. Moore      Maryland
 Â       K. Moore      Southern Cal

5th  Johnson       San Diego
 Â      Mahan          Pittsburgh

6th   Cox             Pittsburgh
 Â       Hayes          Florida State
 Â       Hayward     Portland State    

7th   Stroughter  Oregon State

Learn to disagree without being disagreeable-Ronald Reagan circa 1981

Madman

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#23 : October 22, 2009, 03:52:31 PM

Hickey has a huge amount of influence in the final decision. It is even greater under Mark Dominik.

Charlie is absolutely right about this. Hickey had a major influence in many previous draft selections and was directly responsible for a few of them, making the final selection. Now under Dominik, like CC said, I think that Hickey will be completely in charge of the draft.

There you have it.

I guess we can nail Hickey to the wall now.

Biggs3535

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#24 : October 22, 2009, 03:52:51 PM

Hickey has a huge amount of influence in the final decision. It is even greater under Mark Dominik.

Charlie is absolutely right about this. Hickey had a major influence in many previous draft selections and was directly responsible for a few of them, making the final selection. Now under Dominik, like CC said, I think that Hickey will be completely in charge of the draft.

How much (by percentages) did each of these fellas have influence over the Freeman pick, in your opinion:

Dominik - ?
Morris - ?
Hickey - ?

The rest of this year's draft was pretty solid, so if Hickey was running the show there - that's great - but I'm curious about that first one.


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#25 : October 22, 2009, 03:55:37 PM

Dexter Jackson, Marquis Cooper, etc were Bruce Allen picks given he has a tendency to focus on players with raw speed as a previous scout.

The safe picks were players that Gruden felt comfortable with except for Talib who genuinely reminded Gruden of Charles Woodson (and Allen as well).

I am not buying the idea that Hickey had a major say when Bruce/Jon were around.  That to me sounds like sour grapes IMVHO. 

Madman

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#26 : October 22, 2009, 03:58:47 PM

Dexter Jackson, Marquis Cooper, etc were Bruce Allen picks given he has a tendency to focus on players with raw speed as a previous scout.


When and where was Bruce Allen a scout?

CyberDilemma

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#27 : October 22, 2009, 04:03:22 PM

Dexter Jackson, Marquis Cooper, etc were Bruce Allen picks given he has a tendency to focus on players with raw speed as a previous scout.


When and where was Bruce Allen a scout?

He was a former player agent.

alldaway

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#28 : October 22, 2009, 04:06:19 PM

After the debacle of the 2003 draft class from the point forward Jon made it a priority to draft polished, hard working players out of college (no more Marquise Walker/Travis Stephens type of players).  Ironically the best pick from the Gruden era is the biggest gamble arguably in Talib who had the opposite reputation in college.





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#29 : October 22, 2009, 04:10:18 PM

Bruce Allen was never a scout to my knowledge. He was a player agent before becoming the Senior Executive of the Oakland Raiders for seven years and then moving on to the Buccaneers as a general manager.

But I think you will agree, Talib, that privately Bruce fancied himself a high-level talent evaluator.
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