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spartan

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#390 : November 30, 2012, 08:35:40 PM


OK, so increasing the cost of producing a product is going to do one of two things. What are they?

In the general sense, raise the price of the product, or cause companies to scale back on production to maintain profit margins.

Now as to the former, it is likely an unavoidable consequence to raising the cost of production. The latter is unlikely to occur unless their is a decrease in demand.

I can already guess what the next question will be, but I wouldn't dream of denying you the pleasure of asking it.

Close but no cigar. Raise the price of the product or reduce the production costs in other areas, normally, but not always cut employees. Now read this:

http://www.franchisehelp.com/industry-reports/fast-food-industry-report

Fast Food Industry Analysis 2012 Cost & Trends

The profit margin in the fast food industry is, to quote, south of 10%. The competition is also very fierce as the article points out. Market saturation is the phrased used. Just who do you think is going to survive? Him who keeps his operational costs as low as possible, or those who increase them? And, on top of that, what happens to the employees who do not "win" the battle of market share. They go from a low paying job to a no paying job.

I sympathize with your point of view, but it denies the realities of life. This really isn't about greedy rich people or ideologies. I got laid off last month, but thank the Lord I just finished my first week in a new job. My former company is trying hard but is struggling in the current market environment. I saw this coming, but they were paying me a boat load of money so I made a choice of riding it to the end. Market forces dictated that I was expendable. I understand that and hold no grudges. I am currently earning less than with my old job, but "less" is relative because my new job probably still pays more than most people will earn at the zenith of their career.

Raising the minimum wage as you suggest is fine theoretically, and I support it, theoretically, but it ignores the real world. And to be blunt, you cannot ignore that. There are certain facts of life that you have to deal with, regardless if you like them or not.

CBWx2

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#391 : November 30, 2012, 10:26:06 PM


OK, so increasing the cost of producing a product is going to do one of two things. What are they?

In the general sense, raise the price of the product, or cause companies to scale back on production to maintain profit margins.

Now as to the former, it is likely an unavoidable consequence to raising the cost of production. The latter is unlikely to occur unless their is a decrease in demand.

I can already guess what the next question will be, but I wouldn't dream of denying you the pleasure of asking it.

Close but no cigar. Raise the price of the product or reduce the production costs in other areas, normally, but not always cut employees.

How is that no cigar? You basically said what I said but added that the reduction in production costs might not lead to layoffs.

Also, I was waiting for the inevitable "and what does raising the price of a product do to demand" question. Everyone involved in this discussion taking the anti-increase stance has chosen to isolate price increases from other factors that affect demand. In a theoretical sense, if price is the only variable factored, then a price increase leads to a decrease in demand. However, in the real world, price is not isolated from all other factors. Consumer income, the price of related goods, and the overall desirability of the product by the consumer are all factors that can make a modest price increase completely irrelevant. This is why the theory that price increases inherently lead to a decrease in demand is not always the reality when price increases actually occur.

This is why I have asked for empirical evidence as opposed to general theories. We aren't talking about a theoretical occurrence here. We are talking about a minimum wage increase, something that has been done time and time again, and something that has had measurable effects that have been studied. So if there is evidence that suggests that all of the things that you say theoretically will occur from an increase actually have occurred on some level with past increases, then your point is proven. Should be rather simple.

Now read this:

http://www.franchisehelp.com/industry-reports/fast-food-industry-report

Fast Food Industry Analysis 2012 Cost & Trends

The profit margin in the fast food industry is, to quote, south of 10%. The competition is also very fierce as the article points out. Market saturation is the phrased used. Just who do you think is going to survive? Him who keeps his operational costs as low as possible, or those who increase them? And, on top of that, what happens to the employees who do not "win" the battle of market share. They go from a low paying job to a no paying job.

If the minimum wage were increased, you would see across the board rises in operating costs and across the board price manipulation to offset the increased costs. Essentially, the dynamics of the industry likely would not be changed much, if at all.

I sympathize with your point of view, but it denies the realities of life. This really isn't about greedy rich people or ideologies. I got laid off last month, but thank the Lord I just finished my first week in a new job. My former company is trying hard but is struggling in the current market environment. I saw this coming, but they were paying me a boat load of money so I made a choice of riding it to the end. Market forces dictated that I was expendable. I understand that and hold no grudges. I am currently earning less than with my old job, but "less" is relative because my new job probably still pays more than most people will earn at the zenith of their career.

Raising the minimum wage as you suggest is fine theoretically, and I support it, theoretically, but it ignores the real world. And to be blunt, you cannot ignore that. There are certain facts of life that you have to deal with, regardless if you like them or not.

I'm glad everything worked out for you in the end, spartan. Trust me, I'm not ignoring the real world at all. My entire position is based on the real world. The real world consequences of continuing to allow wages to remain static when prices continue to rise, and the real world effects of raising wages in the past, none of which has lead to the economic collapse suggested to occur by many conservatives on this issue.


tripblood

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#392 : December 01, 2012, 12:08:04 AM


Show No MRSA..

FIRE SCHIANO!!!!

Its so hard for me to sit back on this forum, lookin at a guy on here, holler in\' my name!  When last year i spent more on 5 electric bills from this side of the country to the other, than you made! You\'re talkin to the Rolex wearing, diamond earring wearing, kiss-stealin, WOOOO!, wheelin dealin\', CTS drivin, jet-flyin sonofagun.. And I\'m havin a hard time holding these alligators down! WOOOO!

Dolorous Jason

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#393 : December 01, 2012, 08:04:15 AM

Permanent or not, what the hell can anyone buy or how the hell can anyone live in the US making a wage that low?



LOL. You wreak of stupidity. There's a simple answer to this , but really , why bother ?


What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#394 : December 02, 2012, 02:58:28 AM

Permanent or not, what the hell can anyone buy or how the hell can anyone live in the US making a wage that low?



There's a simple answer to this

I know. The answer is not a damn thing and they can't. And get your head out of Vinny Peanuts' butt with that black hole schtick. If you are going to be a jackass, at least be an original one.


Dolorous Jason

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#395 : December 02, 2012, 08:21:55 AM

It's a very fitting name for you. What's wrong , don't like it ?

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

VinBucFan

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#396 : December 03, 2012, 12:35:03 AM

It's a very fitting name for you. What's wrong , don't like it ?

he doesnt like it because it hits home, describes him perfectly

Biggs3535

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#397 : February 25, 2013, 10:42:01 AM

The System is Broken:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/02/25/7k-worth-of-food-stamps-per-person-the-state-where-this-is-happening-might-surprise-you/


Mean D

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#398 : February 25, 2013, 07:02:21 PM

Barack Obama is the food stamp president.  Mooches, leeches and parasites think we owe them a living.

BucfanNC12

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#399 : February 26, 2013, 08:44:51 AM

The System is Broken:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/02/25/7k-worth-of-food-stamps-per-person-the-state-where-this-is-happening-might-surprise-you/

That is a poorly written article that doesn't say much. I was expecting to read something addressing the problem.

BucfanNC12

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#400 : February 26, 2013, 08:46:52 AM

Barack Obama is the food stamp president.  Mooches, leeches and parasites think we owe them a living.

I disagree with Obama on a lot of thing but at least be fair. People complain about the working class now taking food stamps but don't say anything about those well off filing bankrupcy every so odd years.

Oracle

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#401 : February 27, 2013, 06:15:52 AM

I know an Indian family who moved to the USA from Delhi.   They are rich and have plenty of money in the bank, but none of them work.   Guess what?   They collect welfare money from our government every month.

Dolorous Jason

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#402 : February 27, 2013, 07:45:03 AM

I know an Indian family who moved to the USA from Delhi.   They are rich and have plenty of money in the bank, but none of them work.   Guess what?   They collect welfare money from our government every month.

...and you want to know the real reason we have an immigration problem ?? It's not because we need a wall , folks...

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

BucNY

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#403 : February 27, 2013, 08:05:30 AM

NY is now one of 7 or 8 states, I think, in the country that have more people collecting government benefits than paying into them. NY is widely known for giving the best benefits to recipients. The problem in NY is three fold right now.
1. Taxes are so high young people are moving out of state to start their job or business. This is not new, it's been happening for several years.
2. Taxes are so high currently established businesses are moving out of state or even moving their "home office" across state lines
3. The biggest is people on welfare are moving into NY for better benefits.

I'm involved in the salvation army where I live. I know a person who works there and has for years. They give people a place to stay who are homeless. That person sees more and more people from out of state moving into the state for the benefits. They end up at a salvation army or something to that extent because it takes only 2 months of them living in NY for them to qualify for full welfare benefits.

I regret my decision to come back to NY, it's only a matter of time until I have to sell my house and move. I'm willing to live 2 hours away from my family and have a much better quality of life.

\\\\\\\"This forum needs a poster like BucNY now more than ever\\\\\\\"
      - Everyone

2002Champs2055

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#404 : March 17, 2013, 01:22:32 AM

Get's into a Cadillac DTS. I would estimate it to be a 2008 or 2009.

I stood behind this guy in the grocery store and noticed how he was paying. I checked out quickly and decided to see what kind of vehicle he got in. Not sure why I decided to do this but it really pissed me off.

Doesn't matter what year it is, it's a better vehicle than I own and I'm buying him groceries? This is why people want to stop the handouts. I have no problem giving some of my hard earned check to help those in need. It gets to a point where I feel taken advantage of enough that I no longer am okay with it. So many people scamming the system out there.

I buy groceries with this.....


and drive this....



Maybe I got this car from a Settlement Check when I had a good job and and now I'm broke as a joke and need food stamps to live. Maybe this car was a graduation present from a wealthy family member whose not willing to buy me food everyday. Maybe this a car from a family member who passed away. Maybe I bought this car when I had a good job but got fired and now need a little help eating.

Don't judge people. The person your judging may be in the same predicament as me
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