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Morgan

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#30 : February 06, 2012, 08:57:01 AM

You're almost completely alone:



Remember the feeling when the NFL screwed up the '82 and '87 seasons with strikes.

You feel miserable not having football to watch on Sundays.

OP,  think what it would be like without NFL football every weekend.

As for the violent hit. There's a reason why the NFL is trying to protect the players and itself.  Haven't you been following the news on the long term effects of concussions?  Do you really want NFL players to walk off the field debilitated for life?

Maybe the NFL doesn't need fans like yourself. Maybe you'd be better off watching WWE or MMA.

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#31 : February 06, 2012, 09:32:46 AM

I am not a fan of the business side of the NFL, again a reality.  However, every success has within it the seeds of its own destruction.  I think the thread initiator is discussing a subtle feeling or fear that the NFL could be peaking.  Some of the NFLs long term goals do not necessarily bode well for the NFL such as the London commitment.  Let Europe start their own American style football leagues on their own.   Oh wait, they do have NFL Europe.

The unique American habit of over advertising,, over selling, hyping of merchandise ad nauseum detracts from the pure enjoyment of the sport.  All the endless sports comments on the same stories, Eli versus Peyton, Peyton coming or going, Ronkowskis damn ankle, Bill's mellowing, Tom's revival, Brady versus Eli vis a vis Canton and on and on and on.  OMG.  I was so tired of the SB before it even began, I barely watched it.  I am surely in the minority of football fans in my view, but given my love of the game since 1952, perhaps its worth noting that some of us are weary of the NFL machine who blacks out games, slows the game down with a gazillion reviews, and the requirement that I purchase NFL pass to watch all the games I want to when I want to.  Just saying.    And then, there was Madonna.  OMG.  What an embarrassment!  I'd rather watch 11 year old girls twirl batons for a half and hour.


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#32 : February 06, 2012, 09:39:35 AM

I am not a fan of the business side of the NFL, again a reality.  However, every success has within it the seeds of its own destruction.  I think the thread initiator is discussing a subtle feeling or fear that the NFL could be peaking.  Some of the NFLs long term goals do not necessarily bode well for the NFL such as the London commitment.  Let Europe start their own American style football leagues on their own.   Oh wait, they do have NFL Europe.

The unique American habit of over advertising,, over selling, hyping of merchandise ad nauseum detracts from the pure enjoyment of the sport.  All the endless sports comments on the same stories, Eli versus Peyton, Peyton coming or going, Ronkowskis damn ankle, Bill's mellowing, Tom's revival, Brady versus Eli vis a vis Canton and on and on and on.  OMG.  I was so tired of the SB before it even began, I barely watched it.  I am surely in the minority of football fans in my view, but given my love of the game since 1952, perhaps its worth noting that some of us are weary of the NFL machine who blacks out games, slows the game down with a gazillion reviews, and the requirement that I purchase NFL pass to watch all the games I want to when I want to.  Just saying.    And then, there was Madonna.  OMG.  What an embarrassment!  I'd rather watch 11 year old girls twirl batons for a half and hour.

Thanks Ladyfan, you are spot on.  Very well put.

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#33 : February 06, 2012, 11:31:45 AM

You're almost completely alone:



Remember the feeling when the NFL screwed up the '82 and '87 seasons with strikes.

You feel miserable not having football to watch on Sundays.

OP,  think what it would be like without NFL football every weekend.

As for the violent hit. There's a reason why the NFL is trying to protect the players and itself.  Haven't you been following the news on the long term effects of concussions?  Do you really want NFL players to walk off the field debilitated for life?

Maybe the NFL doesn't need fans like yourself. Maybe you'd be better off watching WWE or MMA.
If you've played football since you were little you knew what the NFL was all about. You know each Sunday could be your last. I don't see people no longer driving after seeing fatal accidents, people still ride bikes without helmets or any gear at all, and people still drink and drive like dumbasses.

The point is, you know the concequence(s). If you're going to get paid like a big boy then play like a big boy.


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#34 : February 06, 2012, 12:56:53 PM

I have zero problem with the commercialization of the NFL.  It is going to happen when you generate 8-9 billion.  I love the game....I hate the Glazers but love football....always have. 

But this is two arguments....the glitz and show are a direct result of the popularity of the game.  Money, money, money.  It is what it is.....if you don't like all the hoopla...find another sport.

But the ignorant people who have an issue with the NFL trying to reduce long term brain damage and dementia and DEATH.....you people are complete morons and frankly I question your judgement.  Comparing the NFL game to riding a bike or driving is asinine.  I can't even believe we are having this discussion.  57 yrs old......that's the life expectancy....that is very very sad and if we can change that?  Why wouldn't we?  Oh b/c redneck bob wants to see more bonejarring hits?  Yeah right.

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#35 : February 06, 2012, 01:04:53 PM

I have zero problem with the commercialization of the NFL.  It is going to happen when you generate 8-9 billion.  I love the game....I hate the Glazers but love football....always have. 

But this is two arguments....the glitz and show are a direct result of the popularity of the game.  Money, money, money.  It is what it is.....if you don't like all the hoopla...find another sport.

But the ignorant people who have an issue with the NFL trying to reduce long term brain damage and dementia and DEATH.....you people are complete morons and frankly I question your judgement.  Comparing the NFL game to riding a bike or driving is asinine.  I can't even believe we are having this discussion.  57 yrs old......that's the life expectancy....that is very very sad and if we can change that?  Why wouldn't we?  Oh b/c redneck bob wants to see more bonejarring hits?  Yeah right.
You want to reduce long term brain damage find a better manufacturer for your helmet. If all you can think of is football causing long term health issues than you are the one who is asinine. There are other sports that cause long term injuries and even DEATH, yet I don't see anyone **CENSORED**ing about it. Research your sports.
: February 06, 2012, 01:10:08 PM Bucweiser


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#36 : February 06, 2012, 01:43:27 PM

I have zero problem with the commercialization of the NFL.  It is going to happen when you generate 8-9 billion.  I love the game....I hate the Glazers but love football....always have. 

But this is two arguments....the glitz and show are a direct result of the popularity of the game.  Money, money, money.  It is what it is.....if you don't like all the hoopla...find another sport.

But the ignorant people who have an issue with the NFL trying to reduce long term brain damage and dementia and DEATH.....you people are complete morons and frankly I question your judgement.  Comparing the NFL game to riding a bike or driving is asinine.  I can't even believe we are having this discussion.  57 yrs old......that's the life expectancy....that is very very sad and if we can change that?  Why wouldn't we?  Oh b/c redneck bob wants to see more bonejarring hits?  Yeah right.

You my friend are a clown.


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#37 : February 06, 2012, 02:21:50 PM

57 yrs old......that's the life expectancy....that is very very sad and if we can change that?  Why wouldn't we?  Oh b/c redneck bob wants to see more bonejarring hits?  Yeah right.

This is kind of a silly argument. Even if those numbers were updated this year that means you're using players from at least 20 years ago... even in equipment things have changed a lot since then. Also I don't think anyone has a problem with taking out helmet to helmet hits, but it's things like with QBs where you not only have to keep your hits lower but if you happen to go too low then you're penalized. Just one example, but yeah your example isn't really all that relevant. There are maybe only a couple of the rules that are actually related to concussions... what about only being able to practice in pads like once a week? Seriously if they want to completely prevent any chance of tearing a muscle or breaking a bone then they need to start getting paid a lot less.

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#38 : February 06, 2012, 03:09:13 PM

57 yrs old......that's the life expectancy....that is very very sad and if we can change that?  Why wouldn't we?  Oh b/c redneck bob wants to see more bonejarring hits?  Yeah right.

This is kind of a silly argument. Even if those numbers were updated this year that means you're using players from at least 20 years ago... even in equipment things have changed a lot since then. Also I don't think anyone has a problem with taking out helmet to helmet hits, but it's things like with QBs where you not only have to keep your hits lower but if you happen to go too low then you're penalized. Just one example, but yeah your example isn't really all that relevant. There are maybe only a couple of the rules that are actually related to concussions... what about only being able to practice in pads like once a week? Seriously if they want to completely prevent any chance of tearing a muscle or breaking a bone then they need to start getting paid a lot less.

Nice point.  I don't think anyone opposes rules like those against helmet to helmet contact.  Heck, I'd like to see them tighten up on face mask penalties against offensive players.  A stiff arm should not involve wrapping your fingers around the face mask of a defender and twisting the hemet.  I thought A. Bradshaw should have been flagged at least twice for that Sunday. 

tonto

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#39 : February 06, 2012, 04:06:27 PM

You're definitely not alone, fanofkit.

The downfall started in 1978 with the new rules to emphasize the passing game.  Since then, the fan of the game that was played in the 70's and before has been treated like a frog in a frying pan.  We've been frying for over 30 years now and I think we're cooked.  The game is now geared to attract  women, children, and fringe fans.   The NFL has always assumed the old school fan will always be there. Hence, the frog analogy. 

It's gotten so bad that I noticed this year more than ever, that D linemen are "reaching" for the QB, trying to grab a jersey.  But you can tell  they are in no way going to put a blindside hit on the qb, for the most part.  Legal or not, they just don't want to take a chance on a  $25, 000 fine.

It's the Arena league now, played on a regulation size field.   And it's very boring.  The NFL of old was much more exciting to watch, i.e., db's would have a territory that a WR knew better than to enter,  running the ball was the wise thing to do if you didn't want your qb's ribs broken,  and the stiff arm was a lethal weapon.

There were no wierd, dancing celebrations after a TD, let alone after a simple first down or tackle is "achieved".   When you scored, you acted as if you had done it before. ( Barry Sanders was a throwback here).

As a kid of the 60's, we used to play a type of football in our neighborhood called "all Mountain dew".  That meant, the qb could not be touched and it was all passing.  I hated that game.  Only the weak, frail, kids wanted to play that style.  That's what the game has come to today...it's "all Mountain dew".

I keep believing that some day that 80 total  passes a game will even become boring to the Super Bowl "fans", the Madden generation, etc.    I believe it will, but we're obviously not there yet.

Switched from a Packer fan to a Buc fan in 1974.  That's when Tampa was awarded the franchise.  And this "frog in a frying pan" has always been able to keep kicking as a Buc fan.  I would say that's because the Bucs have been known for defense with a smattering of the running game from time to time.
This is why I'm so excited about the Schiano hire.   If what is advertised comes to fruition, I expect to see as much old school football from the Bucs  as one could hope for these days.

I could go on and on, and maybe I will if this thread sustains life.

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#40 : February 06, 2012, 04:16:52 PM

Thanks Tonto.  Glad to have you as a Bucs fan...

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#41 : February 06, 2012, 04:17:10 PM

Well put Ladyfan.  I think the game is changing, but not all change is progress.  As mentioned, this $9B industry needs and wants more, and its going to take lots and lots of casual viewers to do so, with cute and fancy marketing to reach out to them (AKA pink jerseys, cheap beads, and eyeglass rags as stadium handouts).  For those of us who think about football all the time and look forward to those few hours a week for less than half a year, change isn't always good. 

No one will argue that making the game safer is a valid and legitimate goal.  Football is entertainment for the masses, plain and simple.  The life expectancy is 57 for a football player...I suppose that's much lower than normal.  Nobody wants harm to come to football players, but those big checks come with some of those inherent risks.  Hell, my own mother passed at 57, which is indeed too young, and she never even enjoyed a yearly salary that equaled more than a game check for even the lowest paid NFL player.  These guys don't get to this level without understanding the risks.  To get there, you've played pee wee, high school, and college ball first, and maybe, just maybe, injuries during those developmental years does as much damage as in the NFL, minus the paycheck...

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#42 : February 06, 2012, 04:31:28 PM

Of course people are going to lament that passage of "the way it used to be"  There is no concrete "way its going to be" and everyone views the "good ole days" and the contrarian point of view with being a "real fan"  Its a way to elevate one's self above the herd. Problem is its a HUGE herd and they're heading in the opposite direction:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/06/super-bowl-draws-record-111-3-million-viewers/

: February 06, 2012, 04:38:47 PM vincepb3

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#43 : February 06, 2012, 04:54:03 PM

I have to admit that Ihave been in the past a fan of the big bone crunching hits.  But not since I've been educated along with some of you of the consequences of those hits.  I do not like seeing players get hurt.  But I am being naive and disingenuous since one can't have BOTH the big hit and improved safety for players.  So I choose the latter.  However, I do not choose the lengthy under the hood reviews by the fields refs and the "upstairs guys" ( whoever they are). 

I am also not a fan of the inconsistent calling of penalties.  Holding is regularly called against the Bucs but not against the teams we play.   Its like we're double penalized for being a bad team or something to that effect.
Announcers all over the league lose their cool when watching bad practices not penalized and penalties that were so borderline as not to exist.  Perhaps that is the sport the way it is and these kinds of errors are intrinstic to a fast  paced field of play.  But that drives me crazy.

After that, I think the power that Goodell has to be sole judge and jury for fines and suspensions should be curtailed.  That's too much concentrated power.  The NFL should establish a Supreme Court type model with players, coaches and refs sitting and listening to the opposing points of view and make a decision that the NFL has to accept as well as the players etc.  For some reason I cannot explain, I just cannot stand Goodell.


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#44 : February 06, 2012, 05:40:55 PM

Regarding player safety and the "big hit",  imo,  the NFL is protecting the QB for only one reason...$.    The QB goes down, so do the points, so does the revenue.   My answer to that is let's go  back to pre 1978 rules and do what other teams did to protect the QB....run the ball.   The game might even start attracting an audience the NFL didn't know was out there.

As far as DB's and LB's leading with the helmet, I bet there's not a reader anywhere on the red board that can honestly say he or she hasn't been frustrated with the inconsistent, phantom, calls.   I'm all for players not getting seriously hurt, but since they cannot make the judgement call in a consistent manner, the game loses credibility.  Again, the running game produces much less "dangerous" hits.   In addition, emphasize improvement in equipment.

If the NFL really wanted to cut down on injuries to non qb's, they'd have outlawed synthetic turf for new stadiums years ago.  And if you're one of those teams that  is afraid of outdoor elements,  just do what Arizona did and slide the real grass in and out.

: February 06, 2012, 05:42:31 PM tonto
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