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dbucfan

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#210 : February 25, 2013, 02:35:10 PM

I wouldn't mind getting back on topic.  Looking for info on Carson prior to the National Prayer Breakfast... and I have seen his biography - looking for speeches - articles he authored...

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

CBWx2

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#211 : February 25, 2013, 02:50:10 PM

Markets are created by humans and by definition they are created "free."

As I said, one could argue that a market can exist without government if you lived in a barter and trade society. In fact, those early "free" markets, created by people, were barter and trade markets. However, markets as we know them today didn't begin to manifest themselves until the governments of the world began to mint coins, and to imbue them with a relatable value, and until they created the legal infrastructures to enforce contract laws. The Code of Ur-Nammu, written by the ancient Sumerians, and The Code of Hammurabi, a set of laws implemented by a Babylonian king dating around 1800 BC is a perfect example of such an occurrence.

Modern markets are the creation of government. There is no need to create a separate thread to debate it, because to argue to the contrary is absolutely absurd, and can be refuted with a few short senteces.
: February 25, 2013, 02:58:06 PM CBWx2


VinBucFan

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#212 : February 25, 2013, 03:08:17 PM

Haha, happy to move back to the subject of the thread CBW. Not worth it

Dolorous Jason

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#213 : February 25, 2013, 03:39:06 PM

He is desperate  , and he mad ..... and now it looks like he is denying he said something.... again . "Intellectual Honesty" at it's finest....


How about you dedicate it working towards turning the US into that fasci....uh....I mean Libertarian utopia you believe in so much?

Oh don't get me wrong, Delirious Smurf. I'm not suggesting that it is your intent to turn the US into a fascist utopia, just as it wasn't the Russian people's intent to turn Russia into a Socialist dictatorship. Communism denotes a lack of a central authority or central planning, just as Libertarianism does. In fact, the only difference between a communist utopia and a Libertarian utopia is that the former advocates common ownership, while the latter advocates individual ownership. The propaganda that lead you towards joining this philosophical movement is one thing. The real life examples of what it's implementation looks like is quite another. That's what makes you a useful idiot, you see. 

There is no such thing as a "free market." Markets are the creation of government. Remove government from having a role in economic development and what you get is a plutocracy, of the wealthy, for the wealthy, by the wealthy.


Your surrender on fascism = libertarianism is noted.


As for your recent overuse of the "useful idiot" term : You seem ignorant of what that term even means . A "useful idiot" is someone who supports one side of an ideological debate  , but whom is manipulated and/or held in contempt by the leaders of their faction. It originated in socialist Russia . Since you yourself have called me a borderline anarchist in the past ,and I am admittedly distrustful of any government in general , it's hard to imagine how I could be the one who is the "useful idiot"  in this debate. On the contrary , I'm not very useful at all to anyone in power.

That would be you , comrade. ( Like when you ignore and support Chariman Maobama's regime as he kills innocent children with drone strikes  = useful idiot . Like when you claim there is no such thing as a free market = useful idiot  ) 













Oh and I almost forgot to ask .....U mad ?










What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

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#214 : February 25, 2013, 08:39:45 PM

He is desperate  , and he mad ..... and now it looks like he is denying he said something.... again . "Intellectual Honesty" at it's finest....


How about you dedicate it working towards turning the US into that fasci....uh....I mean Libertarian utopia you believe in so much?

Oh don't get me wrong, Delirious Smurf. I'm not suggesting that it is your intent to turn the US into a fascist utopia, just as it wasn't the Russian people's intent to turn Russia into a Socialist dictatorship. Communism denotes a lack of a central authority or central planning, just as Libertarianism does. In fact, the only difference between a communist utopia and a Libertarian utopia is that the former advocates common ownership, while the latter advocates individual ownership. The propaganda that lead you towards joining this philosophical movement is one thing. The real life examples of what it's implementation looks like is quite another. That's what makes you a useful idiot, you see. 

There is no such thing as a "free market." Markets are the creation of government. Remove government from having a role in economic development and what you get is a plutocracy, of the wealthy, for the wealthy, by the wealthy.


Your surrender on fascism = libertarianism is noted.

There is no surrender, you moron, because I never made the claim to begin with. You manufactured it in that little pea brain of yours in order to deflect from the fact that your libertarian gods were fascist sympathizers. Libertarianism isn't = fascism, nor is socialism = communism. Both fascism and socialism require the presence of a government, while communism and libertarianism wishes to create societies that contain little to no government.

The original argument was that your Libertarian gods were unopposed to using authoritarianism as a means of implementing liberal economic policies, and in fact, praised such actions in various instances, just as Lenin was unopposed to using authoritarianism as a means of implementing socialist economic policies in pursuit of his communist utopia. You shifted the argument because you cannot defend their actions, which is why you quickly retreat to defending their words instead. It would be specious for me to claim that Lenin was anti-authoritarianism because his writings were condemnatory of the state (which they were. Lenin viewed the state as a tool for class oppression, whether it be a social democracy or a dictatorship), just as it is specious for you to make the same argument for von Mises and Hayek. Their actions outweigh their words.

I'm not very useful at all to anyone in power.

Only because there are very few of your Libertarian gods to which you hold with such reverence actually in power. I suspect that you would have been quite useful in 1970's Chile, just as Hayek and Friedman were when they were writing letters to various world leaders expressing how Chile had become a shining example of liberalism under Pinochet.

That would be you , comrade. ( Like when you ignore and support Chariman Maobama's regime as he kills innocent children with drone strikes  = useful idiot.

One slight problem in equivalency there, sport. Obama isn't a dictator. He's an elected official. If he was a dictator, I suspect things would look a lot different in this country. For example, people such as yourself that express opposing viewpoints would be the victims of those drone strikes, or would be decaying in the bottom of rivers, or being held in torture camps, just as those who expressed opposition to economic liberalism were under Augusto Pinochet.

Delirious Smurf = Useful Idiot.
: February 25, 2013, 08:57:02 PM CBWx2


VinBucFan

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#215 : February 25, 2013, 08:43:52 PM

Interesting discussion on the use of religion:

http://spectator.org/archives/2013/02/13/the-stoning-of-dr-ben-carson

VinBucFan

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#216 : February 25, 2013, 08:56:46 PM

Convocation address:




VinBucFan

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#217 : February 25, 2013, 08:59:03 PM

Interesting comments about Bill Cosby and parenting:


dbucfan

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#218 : February 25, 2013, 09:06:00 PM

Convocation address:


Some people just choose to be offended.... nice

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

dbucfan

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#219 : February 25, 2013, 09:16:47 PM

Interesting comments about Bill Cosby and parenting:
His combination of knowledge and presentation is so welcomed. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

VinBucFan

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#220 : February 25, 2013, 09:18:38 PM

Interesting comments about Bill Cosby and parenting:
His combination of knowledge and presentation is so welcomed.

agree, fascinating guy

Dolorous Jason

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#221 : February 26, 2013, 07:26:14 AM

Comrade has lost the fascism debate , he's lost the 10th amendment debate , and now he's found out that HE is the useful idiot.... yet he soldiers on !






What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#222 : February 26, 2013, 07:43:51 AM

I guess just saying it makes it so in your tiny little brain, huh Delirious Surf?

Your surrender is noted by your clear lack of a rebuttal, BTW.


Dolorous Jason

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#223 : February 26, 2013, 08:27:48 AM

I think everyone would say it's so if we take a poll....you believe majority rule is always just , right?  Why don't you get on that. Take a poll and see who won these debates. LOL

 But wait .....it's everyone else .....not you.

We've gone deep enough down your idiotic rabbit hole  .You've already embarrassed yourself bad enough . (It's pretty bad when you get owned so badly that the butthurt causes you make a sig dedicated to the person. LOL )  Why continue ? U already mad.
: February 26, 2013, 08:29:44 AM Fire Mark Dummynik

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#224 : February 26, 2013, 02:22:16 PM

LOL at Delirious wanting to prop up his position with the consensus of his Libertarian brethren rather that actually by being able to refute an argument. Go ahead and post a poll if it will make you feel more secure. I'm sure all of your buddies will tell you you're right about von Mises and Hayek even in the face of clear cut evidence to the contrary.

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