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John Galt?

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#15 : July 03, 2013, 01:58:10 PM

Here is a good example of how great unions are.

In 1980, the professors and instructors at Edison Community College voted to unionize. The union negotiated a 5 yr contract. In 3 yrs, ECC had the LOWEST average instructor pay in the State Community College system. For 3 straight years, the legislature passed significant pay raises to all instructors EXCEPT those under union contracts because the Dept. of Labor ruled that union contracts superseded the state legislature wages.

Unions and the Federal Govt........working for you????


CalcuttaRain

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#16 : July 03, 2013, 02:05:19 PM

Here is a good example of how great unions are.

In 1980, the professors and instructors at Edison Community College voted to unionize. The union negotiated a 5 yr contract. In 3 yrs, ECC had the LOWEST average instructor pay in the State Community College system. For 3 straight years, the legislature passed significant pay raises to all instructors EXCEPT those under union contracts because the Dept. of Labor ruled that union contracts superseded the state legislature wages.

Unions and the Federal Govt........working for you????

Good post

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#17 : July 04, 2013, 07:49:50 AM

Here is a good example of how great unions are.

In 1980, the professors and instructors at Edison Community College voted to unionize. The union negotiated a 5 yr contract. In 3 yrs, ECC had the LOWEST average instructor pay in the State Community College system. For 3 straight years, the legislature passed significant pay raises to all instructors EXCEPT those under union contracts because the Dept. of Labor ruled that union contracts superseded the state legislature wages.

Unions and the Federal Govt........working for you????

Cool story bro, but union workers on average make more money than non-unionized workers in the same field in virtually every scenario.

As to the other aspect of your argument, I have worked at a few unionized places. I don't recall it ever being sprung on me after the fact that I would have to pay union dues if I accepted the position. I wasn't forced to pay anything. There was a place right down the street hiring for the exact same job, albeit for about $2.00 less an hour and no health insurance. I had a choice. I made it because the union created a better situation. What I didn't do, was take the job, enjoy the higher pay and better benefits, and then **CENSORED** after the fact about having to pay dues to the union that negotiated that better pay and benefits that lead to me accepting that job as opposed to the other one.

If the gripe with unions is that they fund political action, fine. Make illegal for all corporations and organizations to do as much. If the argument is that because you have to pay dues to work there, then don't work there, because the alternative is that you get to take the job, enjoy all the benefits of a union contract, and not contribute to the entity that negotiated for them.


John Galt?

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#18 : July 04, 2013, 11:01:57 AM

Here is a good example of how great unions are.

In 1980, the professors and instructors at Edison Community College voted to unionize. The union negotiated a 5 yr contract. In 3 yrs, ECC had the LOWEST average instructor pay in the State Community College system. For 3 straight years, the legislature passed significant pay raises to all instructors EXCEPT those under union contracts because the Dept. of Labor ruled that union contracts superseded the state legislature wages.

Unions and the Federal Govt........working for you????

Cool story bro, but union workers on average make more money than non-unionized workers in the same field in virtually every scenario.

Even Air Traffic Controllers?

I guess the point of the story was Unions do have their place but there are definitely places where they don't belong. A union for college professors and instructors where the minimum educational requirement was a Masters, and where merit, research, and experience are a big part of determining your pay, doesn't belong.

In jobs where your individual skills and abilities are not greatly valued by the employer and where there is a large pool of potential replacements, unions certainly have a purpose. Also high risk jobs and positions where you need a single voice to express concerns.


As to the other aspect of your argument, I have worked at a few unionized places. I don't recall it ever being sprung on me after the fact that I would have to pay union dues if I accepted the position. I wasn't forced to pay anything. There was a place right down the street hiring for the exact same job, albeit for about $2.00 less an hour and no health insurance. I had a choice. I made it because the union created a better situation. What I didn't do, was take the job, enjoy the higher pay and better benefits, and then **CENSORED** after the fact about having to pay dues to the union that negotiated that better pay and benefits that lead to me accepting that job as opposed to the other one.


Bingo, YOU HAD A CHOICE.

In many states, you don't. There is no non-union competitor "right down the street".  If you are an auto worker in Michigan, you either join UAW or YOU DON'T WORK. If you are a forklift operator in NYC, you join the union or YOU DON'T WORK.




If the gripe with unions is that they fund political action, fine. Make illegal for all corporations and organizations to do as much. If the argument is that because you have to pay dues to work there, then don't work there, because the alternative is that you get to take the job, enjoy all the benefits of a union contract, and not contribute to the entity that negotiated for them.

The gripe is when union membership is compulsory (like Mich. Ohio, and public schools in Calf.) and union fees are compulsory, and they are using those fees to fund political action.


dbucfan

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#19 : July 04, 2013, 12:28:34 PM

Would that include Federal workers being required to be a part of a union.  Or perhaps for workers on Federally funded construction projects?   

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

John Galt?

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#20 : July 04, 2013, 12:37:26 PM

Would that include Federal workers being required to be a part of a union.  Or perhaps for workers on Federally funded construction projects?

If the Federal Government is our benevolent Big Brother, always looking out for our best interests, then why would Federal workers need a union????


dbucfan

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#21 : July 04, 2013, 12:51:54 PM

Would that include Federal workers being required to be a part of a union.  Or perhaps for workers on Federally funded construction projects?
If the Federal Government is our benevolent Big Brother, always looking out for our best interests, then why would Federal workers need a union????
I didn't offer the Federal Government is out benevolent Big Brother (having never directly experienced Federal hands but for my wallet around April 15th)- ... but rather I am noting unionization of State and Federal employees has taken place, and that many construction projects require Union Contractors (or require payment to workers as if they were Union workers by requiring that rate of payment)
: July 04, 2013, 01:34:15 PM dbucfan

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

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#22 : July 04, 2013, 03:05:02 PM

I am not aware of very many auto workers in Michigan that want to do away with the UAW. That sentiment seems to be being pushed by people outside of the union who claim that the only motivation is to help those poor workers forced to join them.


John Galt?

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#23 : July 04, 2013, 03:14:16 PM

Would that include Federal workers being required to be a part of a union.  Or perhaps for workers on Federally funded construction projects?
If the Federal Government is our benevolent Big Brother, always looking out for our best interests, then why would Federal workers need a union????
I didn't offer the Federal Government is out benevolent Big Brother (having never directly experienced Federal hands but for my wallet around April 15th)- ... but rather I am noting unionization of State and Federal employees has taken place, and that many construction projects require Union Contractors (or require payment to workers as if they were Union workers by requiring that rate of payment)


Sorry forgot the sarcasm font.


dbucfan

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#24 : July 04, 2013, 06:06:25 PM

Would that include Federal workers being required to be a part of a union.  Or perhaps for workers on Federally funded construction projects?
If the Federal Government is our benevolent Big Brother, always looking out for our best interests, then why would Federal workers need a union????
I didn't offer the Federal Government is out benevolent Big Brother (having never directly experienced Federal hands but for my wallet around April 15th)- ... but rather I am noting unionization of State and Federal employees has taken place, and that many construction projects require Union Contractors (or require payment to workers as if they were Union workers by requiring that rate of payment)
Sorry forgot the sarcasm font.
Me too

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant
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