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Havok904

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#60 : July 05, 2013, 11:32:31 AM

This makes a ton of sense. Barron was primarily a in the box defender at Alabama. Ronde last year played that roll as Safety because he was to much of a liability in Coverage. That why he was moved to Safety because he couldn't play CB adequately.

This should be a breakout season for Barron seeing as he will be playering a position he is more suited for.
So we used a top 10 pick on a DB to stop the run.

yes....of the two safetes, thats primarily what a Strong Safety does...play run support
In the grand scheme of things, a safety who is good at stopping the run is a pretty easily attainable commodity. It's like finding a good run blocking offensive tackle. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You're supposed to use your premium picks on players who have multiple skills, i.e. safeties who can play the pass at a high level as well as stop the run. It's a passing league. You can get Jermaine Phillips in the 5th round any year. When you use a top 10 pick on a safety, he needs to be more than Jermaine Phillips.

...a good safety maybe; a great safety is not that easy to find...
besides, one of the greatest safeties of all time, John Lynch, gave the guy a ringing endorsement...


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#61 : July 05, 2013, 11:42:00 AM

...You can get Jermaine Phillips in the 5th round any year. When you use a top 10 pick on a safety, he needs to be more than Jermaine Phillips.

When drafting players, the most important thing should be getting players that actually can PLAY. Its not like Barron was NOT consider a early 1st rounder, to really compare him to a 5th rounder, nor is it his fault to get drafted so/too high.
The question is, rather then crying about spilt milk, can Barron PLAY for us NOW and BEYOND, so we maybe can now adress our positions of need. If not, we need to find a SS rather sooner than later, no matter how much we invested in Barron and what we should expect(or what he 'needs' to be)  because of this investment in the PAST.

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#62 : July 05, 2013, 11:43:44 AM

Do you guys really think MB is going to be that big of a detriment to the D this year.  If we don't make it to the playoffs this year I really doubt it has anything to do with Barron.  We all know he didn't play at an elite level last year but did show signs of being the guy we need him to be.  I've said it ( as many others have ) before and I'll say it again #1. He was a rookie. (did Lynch even start as a rookie?)  2. The D secondary sucked last year (he had no help) horribly.  3. His coaching sucked badly.  If he shows no sign of progression this year I'll start to question the pick as well.  We can almost be assured that corner coverage will be better this year and that DG will be better at the other safety position than Barber was last year.  We can hope for at least right now that we'll get better pressure on the QB than last year.  His pass coverage will improve with a year of experience.  We all pretty much agree he can play the run.  Everyone misses a tackle now and then so that doesn't concern me.  And one of the things I love most about the guy is the way he hits.  He brings a presence to the team that we need.

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#63 : July 05, 2013, 12:18:57 PM

it seems to me that about half of the top safties today played great right off the bat and about half took a year to adjust.  im not jumping off the cliff yet.

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#64 : July 05, 2013, 06:20:51 PM

IMO the question with Barron isn't whether or not he'll be a good player -- I don't doubt at all that he will be.  The question is going to be whether he lives up to his draft position. 

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#65 : July 05, 2013, 06:26:51 PM

IMO the question with Barron isn't whether or not he'll be a good player -- I don't doubt at all that he will be.  The question is going to be whether he lives up to his draft position.
stop worrying about that question...he wont.  most top10 players dont.  but if he's a good to great player then thats the question for me.  i also dont believe that morris claiborne will live up to being a top5 CB.

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#66 : July 05, 2013, 06:39:25 PM

you worried 'doc?

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#67 : July 05, 2013, 07:03:50 PM

you worried 'doc?











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#68 : July 05, 2013, 08:43:23 PM

This makes a ton of sense. Barron was primarily a in the box defender at Alabama. Ronde last year played that roll as Safety because he was to much of a liability in Coverage. That why he was moved to Safety because he couldn't play CB adequately.

This should be a breakout season for Barron seeing as he will be playering a position he is more suited for.
So we used a top 10 pick on a DB to stop the run.

yes....of the two safetes, thats primarily what a Strong Safety does...play run support
In the grand scheme of things, a safety who is good at stopping the run is a pretty easily attainable commodity. It's like finding a good run blocking offensive tackle. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You're supposed to use your premium picks on players who have multiple skills, i.e. safeties who can play the pass at a high level as well as stop the run. It's a passing league. You can get Jermaine Phillips in the 5th round any year. When you use a top 10 pick on a safety, he needs to be more than Jermaine Phillips.

QFT.

The only problem with that draft was that after we passed on Claiborne,  there were no players on the board that looked like a no.7 overall talent. So looks like they went with their highest ranked player at a position of need.

Too bad they didn't scout Harrison Smith. He is a baller.

Mike Glennon
6\' 7\" 220 pounds.
6\' 6\" 210
6\' 5\" 200
6\' 4\" 190 6\' 3\" 180 6\' 2\" 170 6\' 1\" 160  6\' 0\" 150 How does he compare to your favorite QB?

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#69 : July 06, 2013, 01:20:17 PM

IMO the question with Barron isn't whether or not he'll be a good player -- I don't doubt at all that he will be.  The question is going to be whether he lives up to his draft position.
stop worrying about that question...he wont.  most top10 players dont.  but if he's a good to great player then thats the question for me.  i also dont believe that morris claiborne will live up to being a top5 CB.
Chances are Claiborne won't be a top 5 corner, but you have a much larger margin for error with average corners than average safeties. Average corners make a lot more money than average safeties.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#70 : July 06, 2013, 03:35:49 PM

This makes a ton of sense. Barron was primarily a in the box defender at Alabama. Ronde last year played that roll as Safety because he was to much of a liability in Coverage. That why he was moved to Safety because he couldn't play CB adequately.

This should be a breakout season for Barron seeing as he will be playering a position he is more suited for.
So we used a top 10 pick on a DB to stop the run.

yes....of the two safetes, thats primarily what a Strong Safety does...play run support
In the grand scheme of things, a safety who is good at stopping the run is a pretty easily attainable commodity. It's like finding a good run blocking offensive tackle. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You're supposed to use your premium picks on players who have multiple skills, i.e. safeties who can play the pass at a high level as well as stop the run. It's a passing league. You can get Jermaine Phillips in the 5th round any year. When you use a top 10 pick on a safety, he needs to be more than Jermaine Phillips.

This has got to be one of the more idiotic, senseless statements made out of early prejudice I have seen on the Red Board. This is roughly the equivalent of saying "After one year, (his rookie year to boot), I have seen enough of Barron to just immediately know without doubt what he is, and always will be." No. No you don't. And the sad thing is, you know that you don't have a clue. You have some pretty rational thoughts from time to time FRG, but this is lazy and highly presumptuous of you, and again you know that. Dude struggled his rookie year. Shocker! :o ::) Don't troll for the sake of trolling. Plenty of other jack-wagons do that like it's their full-time job as is....

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#71 : July 06, 2013, 03:53:32 PM

This makes a ton of sense. Barron was primarily a in the box defender at Alabama. Ronde last year played that roll as Safety because he was to much of a liability in Coverage. That why he was moved to Safety because he couldn't play CB adequately.

This should be a breakout season for Barron seeing as he will be playering a position he is more suited for.
So we used a top 10 pick on a DB to stop the run.

yes....of the two safetes, thats primarily what a Strong Safety does...play run support
In the grand scheme of things, a safety who is good at stopping the run is a pretty easily attainable commodity. It's like finding a good run blocking offensive tackle. Those guys are a dime a dozen. You're supposed to use your premium picks on players who have multiple skills, i.e. safeties who can play the pass at a high level as well as stop the run. It's a passing league. You can get Jermaine Phillips in the 5th round any year. When you use a top 10 pick on a safety, he needs to be more than Jermaine Phillips.

This has got to be one of the more idiotic, senseless statements made out of early prejudice I have seen on the Red Board. This is roughly the equivalent of saying "After one year, (his rookie year to boot), I have seen enough of Barron to just immediately know without doubt what he is, and always will be." No. No you don't. And the sad thing is, you know that you don't have a clue. You have some pretty rational thoughts from time to time FRG, but this is lazy and highly presumptuous of you, and again you know that. Dude struggled his rookie year. Shocker! :o ::) Don't troll for the sake of trolling. Plenty of other jack-wagons do that like it's their full-time job as is....

Actually, it isn't all that idiotic. All he is saying is that Barron needs to have more of an impact than Jermaine Phillips to justify the top 10 selection. There was no prediction made on whether or not he would get to that point. Posters like you are the problem here. Not FRG. Instead of putting what he said into context, you saw red and couldn't believe that someone had the audacity to put Barron and Phillips in the same sentence. Fact is, Barron didn't have any more of an impact last year than Jermaine Phillips did when he was playing. Does stating that mean that Barron won't improve or be more of an impact safety than Phillips? No...but just because Barron has a lot of hype because he can lay the wood, doesn't mean that he will automatically be a stud Safety. He needs to get better. So you can criticize FRG for stating the obvious, but not for being a troll.


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#72 : July 06, 2013, 03:57:08 PM

So you think Barron, who wasnt great in coverage in college and wasnt very good in coverage in his first year in the NFL, and who doesn't have the physical attributes to be great in coverage , is going to magically become  a different player?  The best we can reasonably expect is that he becomes average in coverage and is a great run defender.  But that ain't a top 10 pick.  Not even a first rounder. 


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#73 : July 06, 2013, 11:37:35 PM

So you think Barron, who wasnt great in coverage in college and wasnt very good in coverage in his first year in the NFL, and who doesn't have the physical attributes to be great in coverage , is going to magically become  a different player?  The best we can reasonably expect is that he becomes average in coverage and is a great run defender.  But that ain't a top 10 pick.  Not even a first rounder.
What are the physical attributes needed to be great in coverage?

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

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#74 : July 07, 2013, 02:05:53 PM

So you think Barron, who wasnt great in coverage in college and wasnt very good in coverage in his first year in the NFL, and who doesn't have the physical attributes to be great in coverage , is going to magically become  a different player?  The best we can reasonably expect is that he becomes average in coverage and is a great run defender.  But that ain't a top 10 pick.  Not even a first rounder.

True, at this point he needs to be a turnover machine I would be happy.
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