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yuccaneers

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#15 : July 05, 2013, 12:52:42 AM


Ron Jaworski: Josh Freeman 'an enigma' on Buccaneers

Schiano's gone out of his way to squelch speculation that Freeman might be replaced by rookie Mike Glennon, but that assumes the fifth-year pro passer avoids another wildly erratic campaign. ESPN's Ron Jaworski, cycling through his annual quarterback review, said he saw more questions than answers in Freeman's play, summing him up as "an enigma."

During a midseason stretch that saw the Buccaneers go 5-1 last season, "Freeman played with a swagger," Jaws said. "He was always willing to pull the trigger, attacking all levels of the defense. What I really love was the anticipation."

Then Freeman tumbled off a cliff. "He was erratic with his accuracy. He had many communication issues with his receivers," Jaws said.

Jaworski pointed out a disturbing figure: Only Mark Sanchez of the New York Jets had a lower passer rating when facing pressure. That's when we saw Freeman mightily struggle at reading coverages and making split-second decisions.

Case in point: This ugly interception against the St. Louis Rams in Week 16, in which Freeman was picked off by James Laurinaitis.

"When you go play-action, you still have to locate your underneath defenders," Jaworski noted. "You can't assume they will not be a factor in coverage. ... Freeman threw this ball as if the linebacker wasn't even there. Freeman is an enigma. He has a lot of talent, but he should be a better quarterback after 56 NFL starts."

I have high hopes for this year's Bucs, but that's contingent on Freeman taking the next step. If he isn't a better passer by midseason, I wouldn't be surprised to see Tampa Bay explore what they have in Glennon, no matter what the team says today.


A few things with regards to what Jaworski references. If you go back and watch the second game against the Panthers, they ultimately laid the foundation and blueprint for other teams to follow. Freeman up until that game was being pressured on 28% of his pass attempts, the Panthers pressured Freeman on 43% of his pass attempts and played press man-to-man and rolled coverages.  Up to that point of the season (9 games) Freeman had only thrown 3 interceptions, while under pressure. During that game he threw a total of 2 interceptions while under pressure. Now on to how the Panthers got pressure. They basically made the Bucs offensive line block one on one occupying an offensive lineman with a defender not allowing the Bucs to double team any one defender.  Freeman finished the season throwing as total of 9 interceptions while under pressure tied for first among QB's he played in at least 50% of the teams offensive snaps. 53% of Freeman's interceptions came while he was under duress.

What compounded the problems during the Bucs nose dive and going 2-6 in the final eight games was the Bucs offensive line was shuffled and doing a remarkable job for the most part. But the individual parts are not as great as the sum of the whole. And they had problems blocking defenders one on one. Mix in a new offensive system and communication issues post snap between what the receivers and Freeman thought they saw and it was bound to be an obstacle for the offense.

Anyone who has read the Insider Board already knows where I think Freeman needs the most work...But for those who don't frequent the insider forum.

Quote
Where Freeman struggled mightily was the short passing game last season 9 yards and under not so much with his completion rate or accuracy of getting the football to his receivers  but with keying and reading what the defense is trying to take away as 8 of his 17 interceptions came in this area of the football field.  Yet he completed 70.6% of his passes. Again this is why I see the team working on utilizing the slant pass more in 2013. In 2011 he completed 76.4% of his passes in this area, but to illustrate the part of his game he needs the most work on he threw 9 of his 22 interceptions in this zone. So as you can see its not the intermediate area that should be cause for concern but the short underneath passing game that really flusters and frustrates Freeman. Out of his 39 interceptions the past two seasons 17 came within 9-yards of the LOS nearly 44%.

Its about simplifying his underneath reads, but having a more dynamic and complex grouping of route combinations to not allow defense to undercut the teams short passing game.

As Jaworski pointed out Freeman's two main areas that need work are glaring weakness in the short passing game and when pressured. Which is why so many have differing opinions on Freeman and why the team will only go as far as Freeman goes. If he limits his mistakes in the short passing game and when under duress then the sky is truly the limit for not only Freeman, but also the Bucs aspirations for a long playoff run.

But as where he ranked Freeman its hard to argue with anything between 21-17 based on his overall body of work the past two seasons.


gone

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#16 : July 05, 2013, 03:27:07 AM

Ultimately what all this really points to is Josh's complete inability to work progressions.  He locks on to his primary read and can't let go.  All his talent (and he is immensely talented)  is wasted because of that.

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#17 : July 05, 2013, 06:15:32 AM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.

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#18 : July 05, 2013, 09:43:32 AM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.
im not sure that will help going through progressions.

when freeman knows where he is (or even has to) go with the ball presnap, its usually good.  when something changes and his first option doesnt come open...thats when i worry.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

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#19 : July 05, 2013, 10:16:21 AM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.
im not sure that will help going through progressions.

when freeman knows where he is (or even has to) go with the ball presnap, its usually good.  when something changes and his first option doesnt come open...thats when i worry.

When Freeman feels stress, he seems to make quicker/misses reads than he does when he's feeling comfortable in the pocket. The return of Nicks and Joseph WILL help with that. Freeman is never going to be Tom Brady, but if the line can keep him comfortable, I think he'll do well.

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#20 : July 05, 2013, 10:25:22 AM

What really sucks is that a couple of years ago I really thought the Bucs had their guy for the next ten years...  Still not sure and the fact that we are discussing the same issues from a few years ago is depressing.

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#21 : July 05, 2013, 10:46:05 AM

What really sucks is that a couple of years ago I really thought the Bucs had their guy for the next ten years...  Still not sure and the fact that we are discussing the same issues from a few years ago is depressing.

Dont worry, this will end fast. Trust me, in 2014 we will be laughing at the 'depressing' problems of today.

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#22 : July 05, 2013, 12:18:57 PM


Ron Jaworski: Josh Freeman 'an enigma' on Buccaneers

Schiano's gone out of his way to squelch speculation that Freeman might be replaced by rookie Mike Glennon, but that assumes the fifth-year pro passer avoids another wildly erratic campaign. ESPN's Ron Jaworski, cycling through his annual quarterback review, said he saw more questions than answers in Freeman's play, summing him up as "an enigma."

During a midseason stretch that saw the Buccaneers go 5-1 last season, "Freeman played with a swagger," Jaws said. "He was always willing to pull the trigger, attacking all levels of the defense. What I really love was the anticipation."

Then Freeman tumbled off a cliff. "He was erratic with his accuracy. He had many communication issues with his receivers," Jaws said.

Jaworski pointed out a disturbing figure: Only Mark Sanchez of the New York Jets had a lower passer rating when facing pressure. That's when we saw Freeman mightily struggle at reading coverages and making split-second decisions.

Case in point: This ugly interception against the St. Louis Rams in Week 16, in which Freeman was picked off by James Laurinaitis.

"When you go play-action, you still have to locate your underneath defenders," Jaworski noted. "You can't assume they will not be a factor in coverage. ... Freeman threw this ball as if the linebacker wasn't even there. Freeman is an enigma. He has a lot of talent, but he should be a better quarterback after 56 NFL starts."

I have high hopes for this year's Bucs, but that's contingent on Freeman taking the next step. If he isn't a better passer by midseason, I wouldn't be surprised to see Tampa Bay explore what they have in Glennon, no matter what the team says today.


A few things with regards to what Jaworski references. If you go back and watch the second game against the Panthers, they ultimately laid the foundation and blueprint for other teams to follow. Freeman up until that game was being pressured on 28% of his pass attempts, the Panthers pressured Freeman on 43% of his pass attempts and played press man-to-man and rolled coverages.  Up to that point of the season (9 games) Freeman had only thrown 3 interceptions, while under pressure. During that game he threw a total of 2 interceptions while under pressure. Now on to how the Panthers got pressure. They basically made the Bucs offensive line block one on one occupying an offensive lineman with a defender not allowing the Bucs to double team any one defender.  Freeman finished the season throwing as total of 9 interceptions while under pressure tied for first among QB's he played in at least 50% of the teams offensive snaps. 53% of Freeman's interceptions came while he was under duress.

What compounded the problems during the Bucs nose dive and going 2-6 in the final eight games was the Bucs offensive line was shuffled and doing a remarkable job for the most part. But the individual parts are not as great as the sum of the whole. And they had problems blocking defenders one on one. Mix in a new offensive system and communication issues post snap between what the receivers and Freeman thought they saw and it was bound to be an obstacle for the offense.

Anyone who has read the Insider Board already knows where I think Freeman needs the most work...But for those who don't frequent the insider forum.

Quote
Where Freeman struggled mightily was the short passing game last season 9 yards and under not so much with his completion rate or accuracy of getting the football to his receivers  but with keying and reading what the defense is trying to take away as 8 of his 17 interceptions came in this area of the football field.  Yet he completed 70.6% of his passes. Again this is why I see the team working on utilizing the slant pass more in 2013. In 2011 he completed 76.4% of his passes in this area, but to illustrate the part of his game he needs the most work on he threw 9 of his 22 interceptions in this zone. So as you can see its not the intermediate area that should be cause for concern but the short underneath passing game that really flusters and frustrates Freeman. Out of his 39 interceptions the past two seasons 17 came within 9-yards of the LOS nearly 44%.

Its about simplifying his underneath reads, but having a more dynamic and complex grouping of route combinations to not allow defense to undercut the teams short passing game.

As Jaworski pointed out Freeman's two main areas that need work are glaring weakness in the short passing game and when pressured. Which is why so many have differing opinions on Freeman and why the team will only go as far as Freeman goes. If he limits his mistakes in the short passing game and when under duress then the sky is truly the limit for not only Freeman, but also the Bucs aspirations for a long playoff run.

But as where he ranked Freeman its hard to argue with anything between 21-17 based on his overall body of work the past two seasons.

The other issue with picks in the short game are defensive trips to the endzone and field position. An interception 35 yards down the field is similar to a short punt. An interception on a slant is a TD or possession where the offense had just lined up.

Happy and Peppy and Bursting with love.

ryan24

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#23 : July 05, 2013, 12:21:06 PM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.
im not sure that will help going through progressions.

when freeman knows where he is (or even has to) go with the ball presnap, its usually good.  when something changes and his first option doesnt come open...thats when i worry.

The issue has been referenced going back to pre draft days so it's likely not a coaching issue and is a player issue. The real question is can the team succeed with this particular shortcoming the player has.

Happy and Peppy and Bursting with love.

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#24 : July 05, 2013, 12:42:08 PM

21st seems like a pretty reasonable place to put him right now.  Hopefully he'll look better than that by the end of this coming season, but until he proves it?  21st sounds about right.  (And not enough to give him a big extension.)

Hate

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#25 : July 05, 2013, 01:15:11 PM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.

How is that gonna aid him in going thru his progressions and improve his accuracy??

-------------------------------------------------------
   

 I thought Lovie said he wanted quickness & speed, even at the QB position?

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#26 : July 05, 2013, 01:31:37 PM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.
im not sure that will help going through progressions.

when freeman knows where he is (or even has to) go with the ball presnap, its usually good.  when something changes and his first option doesnt come open...thats when i worry.

Isn't that when he used to take off running? I know it's probably not be pushed, but I'd be allot happier if he would tuck it and run when under pressure. Surely he could pick up those 5-7 yards he is trying to throw for.


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#27 : July 05, 2013, 01:33:19 PM

A second year in the system and the return of Nicks and Joseph should help immensely.

How is that gonna aid him in going thru his progressions and improve his accuracy??

Subconsciously understanding the play, getting less frequently pressured and by this FEELING less pressure should allow him to use his ressources elsewhere, for instance going through his progression or focusing on his mechanics.

I wonder how you got through driving school, i guess checking the rearview mirror become a habit the moment you sat in a car for the first time, right? F/e not having to check every single road name to find the way to your destination , subconsciously following your route, allows you to concentrate on other things, like energy saving use of the gas pedal or flirting with the hottie in the car next to you.

Simple things like getting married might already have a huge impact on him, in case some of the rumors are true and those really have negative effects on his play right now.
: July 05, 2013, 01:35:44 PM QaZ

GameTime

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#28 : July 05, 2013, 02:21:36 PM

Isn't that when he used to take off running? I know it's probably not be pushed, but I'd be allot happier if he would tuck it and run when under pressure. Surely he could pick up those 5-7 yards he is trying to throw for.
i would think so.  many QB's are more dangerous in a simple, athletic offense.  even with a great work ethic, the most productive choice might be to tuck it rather than work through progressions.    might just fit the players skillset better.

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#29 : July 05, 2013, 02:59:18 PM

Josh got married?  Hadn't heard that.  What's his husband's name?
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