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GameTime

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#45 : August 28, 2013, 11:22:52 AM

Dungy never had to build a DL and failed miserably when he attempted to. I like Dungy but that guy did less with more his entire time.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

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#46 : August 28, 2013, 11:33:16 AM

Dungy never had to build a DL and failed miserably when he attempted to. I like Dungy but that guy did less with more his entire time.

Rightttttt. We were a playoff caliber team prior to his arrival. He didn't do much for us.

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#47 : August 28, 2013, 11:35:01 AM

Do we really have a shot at a SB this year, to go all in this year with an expensive stopgap guy? Do we really need 1-2 more wins for such a hefty prize, or is 2013 still more about checking what we got for our run at a SB in 2014?
This season the Bucs are spending over $55 million this season on six players who are all at least 28 years old. If they're not trying to win a Super Bowl right now, just when are they? When those guys are in their mid-30s?

There are a few more seasons to be played until the are in there mid 30s.

How about 2014 or 2015, then those guys are around 30. We have not answered our question at QB yet, one option (Freeman) will cost a lot. I do not see how Freeney as the missing part getting us to a SB anytime soon though. to allow him to lower the chances of the rest maybe getting us there AFTER him.
By 2014 and 2015, more and more of the Bucs' young core will have expired rookie contracts and need pay raises. That will mean the older, higher paid veteran players will have to go in order to make room. The way you win Super Bowls is by having as many good players as possible working off cheap rookie deals so you can supplement them with year-to-year veterans to fill in holes. It's a lot easier to win the Super Bowl when Doug Martin is only making $2 million per year than when he gets older and starts making $8 million. Every year you have a good player on an undervalued contract, you have free money to play with.

And we do this by throwing more money at guys already in the mid of their 30s? This is how we make the Revis, Goldson, Nicks, Vjax and Penn contracts worth it?

Chicken or egg?
How do you think the Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002?

Because Ronde Barber intercepted a key pass and returned it for a TD ?

Correct me if Im wrong but he played in the secondary , did he not ?
: August 28, 2013, 11:37:12 AM Fire Mark Dummynik

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

GameTime

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#48 : August 28, 2013, 11:47:41 AM

Dungy never had to build a DL and failed miserably when he attempted to. I like Dungy but that guy did less with more his entire time.

Rightttttt. We were a playoff caliber team prior to his arrival. He didn't do much for us.
No, but we had Sapp and brooks prior to his arrival. Dungy did a lot for us, but left much more on the table than we care to admit.

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#49 : August 28, 2013, 11:48:23 AM

How do you think the Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002?

Why dont you tell me? I wonder what you think happened the 6 years before, leading to a SB and how that worked out the years after. I wonder what we can learn from 2002 TODAY, so we win a SB again. I wonder at which point we are right now...is it 2002 or 1997 or 99?

For instance, we trade away two 1st rounder and got ...not even a player for.

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#50 : August 28, 2013, 12:05:17 PM

Clayborn is a great rusher

Bowers was aruably the best pass rusher in his draft who fell due to his injury issues

Mccoy Is a disrupter

and our 2nd dts are just ok at bbest

Our LBs are fierce

Our secondary is top (although I wish they were faster on the back end)


We do need more DE depth though. I cant argue that

\\\"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.\\\"

Feel Real Good

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#51 : August 28, 2013, 12:10:40 PM

How do you think the Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002?

Why dont you tell me? I wonder what you think happened the 6 years before, leading to a SB and how that worked out the years after. I wonder what we can learn from 2002 TODAY, so we win a SB again. I wonder at which point we are right now...is it 2002 or 1997 or 99?

For instance, we trade away two 1st rounder and got ...not even a player for.
The Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002 because they had a really good front line of experienced players at the back end of their primes and then they signed a bunch of 1-2 year rental players to fill out the roster and not let any young players who were never going to develop into something ruin it for them. If the team gave Kenyatta Walker another year at left tackle they wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. Hugh Douglas would have murdered him again and Brad Johnson would not have been able to find Joe Jurevicius for that pass.

In 2002 Ronde Barber was 27, Simeon Rice was 28, Derrick Brooks was 29, Warren Sapp was 30, and John Lynch was 31. All the Bucs' front line veteran players are at least 28 with the oldest being Vincent Jackson at 30. The Bucs chose this strategy. This is the time to cash in unless you want to waste some of the last good seasons there guys will ever see.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

QaZ

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#52 : August 28, 2013, 12:27:26 PM

How do you think the Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002?

Why dont you tell me? I wonder what you think happened the 6 years before, leading to a SB and how that worked out the years after. I wonder what we can learn from 2002 TODAY, so we win a SB again. I wonder at which point we are right now...is it 2002 or 1997 or 99?

For instance, we trade away two 1st rounder and got ...not even a player for.
The Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002 because they had a really good front line of experienced players at the back end of their primes and then they signed a bunch of 1-2 year rental players to fill out the roster and not let any young players who were never going to develop into something ruin it for them. If the team gave Kenyatta Walker another year at left tackle they wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. Hugh Douglas would have murdered him again and Brad Johnson would not have been able to find Joe Jurevicius for that pass.

In 2002 Ronde Barber was 27, Simeon Rice was 28, Derrick Brooks was 29, Warren Sapp was 30, and John Lynch was 31. All the Bucs' front line veteran players are at least 28 with the oldest being Vincent Jackson at 30. The Bucs chose this strategy. This is the time to cash in unless you want to waste some of the last good seasons there guys will ever see.

So how do we get 'really good front line of experienced players'? Its nice to have one, but 1st you have to get one.
Again, in which year are we right now? 1996 or 2002 or...?

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#53 : August 28, 2013, 12:32:28 PM

How do you think the Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002?

Why dont you tell me? I wonder what you think happened the 6 years before, leading to a SB and how that worked out the years after. I wonder what we can learn from 2002 TODAY, so we win a SB again. I wonder at which point we are right now...is it 2002 or 1997 or 99?

For instance, we trade away two 1st rounder and got ...not even a player for.
The Bucs won the Super Bowl in 2002 because they had a really good front line of experienced players at the back end of their primes and then they signed a bunch of 1-2 year rental players to fill out the roster and not let any young players who were never going to develop into something ruin it for them. If the team gave Kenyatta Walker another year at left tackle they wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. Hugh Douglas would have murdered him again and Brad Johnson would not have been able to find Joe Jurevicius for that pass.

In 2002 Ronde Barber was 27, Simeon Rice was 28, Derrick Brooks was 29, Warren Sapp was 30, and John Lynch was 31. All the Bucs' front line veteran players are at least 28 with the oldest being Vincent Jackson at 30. The Bucs chose this strategy. This is the time to cash in unless you want to waste some of the last good seasons there guys will ever see.

So how do we get 'really good front line of experienced players'? Its nice to have one, but 1st you have to get one.
Again, in which year are we right now? 1996 or 2002 or...?
If Vincent Jackson, Donald Penn, Davin Joseph, Carl Nicks, Dashon Goldson, and Darrelle Revis are supposed to be the Sapp/Brooks/Rice/Lynch/Barber for this team, we're in 2001 territory because sooner rather than later those players are going to decline or get too expensive just like what happened in 2003 and beyond.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#54 : August 28, 2013, 12:59:49 PM

All in with a non franchise QB in the era if the QB. 


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#55 : August 28, 2013, 01:14:07 PM

I don't believe Dungy ever drafted a great DL, Linebacker or QB.

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#56 : August 28, 2013, 01:43:44 PM

Dungy wasn't "drafting" fyi.  This is awesome.  Dungy is one of the winningest coaches in NFL history.  We have an unproven MD and Schiano at the helm.  In year four of our "rebuild" we had one of the worst defenses of all-time.  MD sucks.  Schiano probably sucks too.  Some of you can't fathom this simple idea. 

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#57 : August 28, 2013, 01:50:40 PM

Again, I really liked Dungy. But what players did he develop? Lynch and Ronde? He did less with more here and in indy. Heck, he was fired for it. The guy walked into two pretty good situations and was able to lean on a guy named kiffin.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

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#58 : August 28, 2013, 01:58:32 PM

Again, I really liked Dungy. But what players did he develop? Lynch and Ronde? He did less with more here and in indy. Heck, he was fired for it. The guy walked into two pretty good situations and was able to lean on a guy named kiffin.

What does any this have to do with Tony Dungy and his thoughts on Defense?  He's not really saying anything out of left field, here.  Most people believe the defense (and offense, for that matter) begins up front.
: August 28, 2013, 02:00:17 PM Biggs3535


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#59 : August 28, 2013, 02:08:11 PM

All I want to know is, who were we supposed to get? ...one of the best corners ever to play the game, or a washed up DT or DE (dumervil was the only great one)?

Because the fact is, if/when Freeman's contract is up, we'll have to pay him. Then there is Doug, whom seems like a cool cat, but will probably want more money after next season if he has better yardage than last. RB position is on limited time, so he'll probably be looking for a bit more. The OL is having problems and nicks will be getting paid without playing for awhile. Point is, there has to be money in the coffers and right now there isn't very much.

But I agree to some extent. I truly do wish we could've gone "madden franchise" and signed revis, goldson, and dumervil all in one offseason.

Good news is though, if revis doesn't pan out, McCoy get a restructured contract, and nicks retires, we would have enough money to sign Atkins in fA next season when the Bengals screw that up. Forget "TNT," how about "atomic bomb?"

Naismith was right about Revis. Everyone else is a dummy.
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