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mjs020294

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#30 : November 14, 2006, 09:00:02 PM

What do you think timing is bro...you have to work at that.  You have to know and feel the speed of the game.  You have to have a feel for the speed of your receivers.  That's timing.  When you don't have that feel it means the game is still too fast for you.  I personally don't think it slows until you know what the heck it means to be a pro player. Then the game slows down, progressions are second nature, and you hit the wide open receivers in stride...

AMEN  ;)






Boid Fink

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#31 : November 14, 2006, 09:02:42 PM

...and with that said Chev, are you saying you think Bruce is the answer for Tampa?  I don't.  Charisma can only do so much for you.... in practice.


mjs020294

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#32 : November 14, 2006, 09:04:33 PM

Okay then.  Good points.

But I have this feeling Gradkowski is going to be a great #2.  He is great at the short passes, the timing on those are pretty decent aren't they?  What about the rest of the stuff?

Deep passes require a couple of things short passes don't; more time in the pocket(pressure), and extra velocity in the arm action.   Add the two together and it makes getting the timing on the deep passes considerably more difficult.  

Have faith Boid.....Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.


Boid Fink

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#33 : November 14, 2006, 09:07:50 PM

Okay then.  Good points.

But I have this feeling Gradkowski is going to be a great #2.  He is great at the short passes, the timing on those are pretty decent aren't they?  What about the rest of the stuff?

Deep passes require a couple of things short passes don't; more time in the pocket(pressure), and extra velocity in the arm action.   Add the two together and it makes getting the timing on the deep passes considerably more difficult. 

Have faith Boid.....Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.

He had time to throw those "bombs".  And as a QB who has played for more than 10 years, you would think he knows how to throw a deep pass to an open receiver anyway...

I have faith in Hackett, and Gruden.  I also think next year they get a new QB in here, or work with Simms again.  Just a hunch.  We shall see.  I am not bashing anyones opinion on the matter, I have mine, and you have yours.  No one knows for sure, so everybody has valid claim to their reasoning.


keeponbucn

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#34 : November 14, 2006, 09:09:11 PM

  Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.


you're damn right on that.



mjs020294

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#35 : November 14, 2006, 09:10:33 PM

  Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.
you're damn right on that.

Well i hope they do.  :P


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#36 : November 14, 2006, 09:11:38 PM

  Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.


you're damn right on that.



Funny how if you mention the name hackett in Kansas City, you might get punched in the face. They absolutely hate Hackett from his time served here as OC!!!!

keeponbucn

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#37 : November 14, 2006, 09:13:36 PM

Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.


you're damn right on that.



Funny how if you mention the name hackett in Kansas City, you might get punched in the face. They absolutely hate Hackett from his time served here as OC!!!!


I'm sure as an OC but as a QB coach Hackett's track record speaks for itself. He's worked some of the best QB's of all time. I've seen nothing but positives come from Hackett being here.

mjs020294

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#38 : November 14, 2006, 09:14:12 PM

I have faith in Hackett, and Gruden.  I also think next year they get a new QB in here, or work with Simms again.

Chances are they will add a veteran QB, but only for depth and competition.  Even a veteran would take a season to get up to speed with the playbook, Griese was quicker because of his high IQ.

Simms just doesn't fit the offense, it took him three years to get the center exchange right.  They will work with Grads and there is a good chance he will improve like most rookies in their second season.  Right now it is Grads's job to lose.


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#39 : November 14, 2006, 09:17:26 PM

Hackett and Gruden know what they are doing.


you're damn right on that.



Funny how if you mention the name hackett in Kansas City, you might get punched in the face. They absolutely hate Hackett from his time served here as OC!!!!


I'm sure as an OC but as a QB coach Hackett's track record speaks for itself. He's worked some of the best QB's of all time. I've seen nothing but positives come from Hackett being here.
that's a peculiar statement coming from a guy who hated our former QB, said he sucked, and regressed under Hackett. Are you sure you know what you think? A regressing QB is your idea of positives? Griese regreseed from '04 to '05 right? Are you just posting to raise your post count, because that last post is totally contradictory to everything you have posted about our QB situation the last two seasons.

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#40 : November 14, 2006, 09:40:18 PM

BBG, you weren't replying to me, but I'd like to suggest: perhaps the player himself as well as opposing defenses deserve some blame for taking a step back, rather than just laying it at the feet of the QB coach. I think there is a mistaken impression among fans, and you hear it stated often, that this player or that player "can only get better". That's just not the case at all. Some players get worse, in spite of good coaching.

Hackett may not be a great OC, but that doesn't mean he's not a good QB coach. I happen to think he's right at his best level: coaching QB's, not coordinating offenses.

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#41 : November 14, 2006, 10:15:24 PM

Boid wrote:

Quote
and with that said Chev, are you saying you think Bruce is the answer for Tampa?  I don't.  Charisma can only do so much for you.... in practice.

I don't think anybody here is saying Bruce is the answer. I think I speak for most of us by saying:

We just don't know. It's way too early to draw any conclusions. Boid, some of the things you are
pointing out are also being experienced by Leinart and Young. Obviously, neither of those guys
are going anywhere. I'm not saying Grads belongs in their class. All I'm saying is don't draw
any conclusions whatsoever. It's a fruitless endeavor with rookie QBs.

We shouldn't even have this debate until the end of the season. We should see some sort of
progress. If not, it's time for the FA search.

mjs020294

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#42 : November 14, 2006, 10:32:53 PM

Boid wrote:

Quote
and with that said Chev, are you saying you think Bruce is the answer for Tampa?  I don't.  Charisma can only do so much for you.... in practice.

I don't think anybody here is saying Bruce is the answer. I think I speak for most of us by saying:

We just don't know. It's way too early to draw any conclusions. Boid, some of the things you are
pointing out are also being experienced by Leinart and Young. Obviously, neither of those guys
are going anywhere. I'm not saying Grads belongs in their class. All I'm saying is don't draw
any conclusions whatsoever. It's a fruitless endeavor with rookie QBs.

We shouldn't even have this debate until the end of the season. We should see some sort of
progress. If not, it's time for the FA search.

AMEN brother Joe.   ;)


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#43 : November 14, 2006, 10:41:21 PM

Boid wrote:

Quote
and with that said Chev, are you saying you think Bruce is the answer for Tampa? I don't. Charisma can only do so much for you.... in practice.

I don't think anybody here is saying Bruce is the answer. I think I speak for most of us by saying:

We just don't know. It's way too early to draw any conclusions. Boid, some of the things you are
pointing out are also being experienced by Leinart and Young. Obviously, neither of those guys
are going anywhere. I'm not saying Grads belongs in their class. All I'm saying is don't draw
any conclusions whatsoever. It's a fruitless endeavor with rookie QBs.

We shouldn't even have this debate until the end of the season. We should see some sort of
progress. If not, it's time for the FA search.
Joe, answer me this then.

If you had your choice of all three ROOKIE qb's, who would YOU take right now?  Even with their less than stellar numbers, who would you want running the Bucs offense?

If you say Bruce, you are a flat out liar. 

If you mean it though, you are not that smart, and I know better than that.

I am just saying the upside of these guys is on a different plane.  Young would be AWESOME on this team.  Leinart is a much better passer, and if he were in Tampa, I think he would have better numbers, despite the weapons he has in Arizona.  Why?  Hackett and Gruden are better coaches.  Bruce?  He has had knocks on him from day one.  There is a reason why he went round 6, and that was he is small, and can't throw a deep pass very well.  Even in college, he did not throw it all that well downfield.

I think Bruce is doing a quality job right now.  But will he be the answer?  Wether I have this discourse now, or at the end as you insist I should, I doubt his numbers will improve, nor will he show us the things we need out of him to right the ship, and save some jobs.  You can deny this, but it is just my opinion as I have said nyumerous times, and your point of view is just as relevant as mine.  Why?  Because frankly, we don't know.  But I have watched him for a few games now, and some of things he does tell me that he is not the guy for this job.  It is just a hunch.

No point in arguing, as you said.  Grads has been the most consistent man on this team, as far as O goes.  But this O is dead last in the NFL...so go figure that one out.


ufojoe

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#44 : November 14, 2006, 10:56:38 PM

Who would I choose from those three? It's a silly question which I don't need to answer. The fact
is, we don't have those guys, we have Bruce. Young and Leinhart would be struggling too if they
were here. As much as Bruce? I don't know.

I think Bruce will be fine downfield. He's shown he can do it. Just needs time, IMO and once the
game slows down for him, we'll see what he has to offer.
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