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alldaway

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#30 : November 18, 2006, 08:52:41 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?





You probably also think the SD front office made a mistake trading down and not taking Vick too right?  [banghead]

Was it the same front office?

In 2001 John Butler was the GM of the Chargers that orchestrated that.  He died April 11th, 2003 of lung cancer.  A.J Smith took over as a result from that point foward.



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#31 : November 18, 2006, 09:00:57 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?






You probably also think the SD front office made a mistake trading down and not taking Vick too right? [banghead]

Was it the same front office?

In 2001 John Butler was the GM of the Chargers that orchestrated that. He died April 11th, 2003 of lung cancer. A.J Smith took over as a result from that point foward.





SD is a team.  1 man does not make a front office. 

alldaway

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#32 : November 18, 2006, 09:03:04 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?






You probably also think the SD front office made a mistake trading down and not taking Vick too right? [banghead]

Was it the same front office?

In 2001 John Butler was the GM of the Chargers that orchestrated that. He died April 11th, 2003 of lung cancer. A.J Smith took over as a result from that point foward.





SD is a team.  1 man does not make a front office. 

Enough with the semantics.  The current front office Bruce leads is not the same front office that McKay led unless we go by your definition. 

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#33 : November 18, 2006, 09:08:29 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?



No.

Yeah, SD was real stupid.....Rivers sucks right?

The only thing SD did that was dumb was not trade Brees rather than letting him walk.

If you are comparing Grads to Brees that is too funny!

Not too bright I see.

Brees+ Roy Williams > Rivers



Right. The only one not bright here is you, thinking Grads is the answer at QB.

Grads is not the best answer but for Gruden's offense he is. Can you honestly say that Gruden will draft a QB in the top ten of the draft next year and afford to sit that player with his job on the line? And lets assume Gradkowski fails next year? Then what? With three losing seasons already and adding a fourth I can not imagine Gruden being around. And then having to hand over the reigns to a second year QB? Chalk up the possibility of another losing season.

I am sorry but your suggestion that Gruden drafts a QB next year in the top ten of the draft is simply over the top. The only way your suggestion is logical is if Gruden has the blessing of the Glazers to draft a QB in the top ten (highly doubt it) or Gruden is fired this year and the new coaching staff wants to draft a QB in the top ten.

If you think Grads is the answer then there won't be much difference between him starting next year whether we draft a QB or not.  We can draft a QB next year and have Grads hold it down until he is ready, I don' care.  But it is time in TB to have a Franchise QB.  We have NEVER had one.  We have had some go on to become them elsewhere, but in TAMPA we have never had one.  Grads is not the answer.  Grads is a guy that every season we willa sk the same question, shoudl we  draft a QB?  If the Glazers are smart they realize we need a bona fide superstar QB, and will give the ok.  If you are assuming Grads fails next year that is even more reason to draft a QB this year. Last time we took the franchise RB with out top 5 pick, this time I say we get the QB to go with him.  If the Glazers, Gruden, and fans care about the long term future and success of this team, a QB is the pick.  If they look want to look for a quick fix then it is not.  But I say now is the perfect time to rebuild, starting with the QB.  It is time to get one here to call the face, the franchise, and the future.  I don't think anyone we take with that first pick is going to have such a great impact on next year that we need to take him rather than a guy who could potentially lead our team for 10+ years.

alldaway

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#34 : November 18, 2006, 09:12:27 AM


If you think Grads is the answer then there won't be much difference between him starting next year whether we draft a QB or not.  We can draft a QB next year and have Grads hold it down until he is ready, I don' care.  But it is time in TB to have a Franchise QB.  We have NEVER had one.  We have had some go on to become them elsewhere, but in TAMPA we have never had one.  Grads is not the answer.  Grads is a guy that every season we willa sk the same question, shoudl we  draft a QB?  If the Glazers are smart they realize we need a bona fide superstar QB, and will give the ok.  If you are assuming Grads fails next year that is even more reason to draft a QB this year. Last time we took the franchise RB with out top 5 pick, this time I say we get the QB to go with him.  If the Glazers, Gruden, and fans care about the long term future and success of this team, a QB is the pick.  If they look want to look for a quick fix then it is not.  But I say now is the perfect time to rebuild, starting with the QB.  It is time to get one here to call the face, the franchise, and the future.  I don't think anyone we take with that first pick is going to have such a great impact on next year that we need to take him rather than a guy who could potentially lead our team for 10+ years.

Perfect time to rebuild? How do you figure that?  This will be the third losing season in four years.  Add in a losing season next year and it is really ugly.

Any other player that is not a QB will not have an impact next year? How do you figure that?  You can have Quinn but I would happily take Joe Thomas, Calvin Johnson, Branch, or Gaines Adams.

Gruden has to be fired most likely for the Bucs to even entertain the thought of drafting a QB in the top ten of the draft.  The chance that the Glazers endorse Gruden drafting a QB in the top ten is a very small chance.

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#35 : November 18, 2006, 09:14:30 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?






You probably also think the SD front office made a mistake trading down and not taking Vick too right? [banghead]

Was it the same front office?

In 2001 John Butler was the GM of the Chargers that orchestrated that. He died April 11th, 2003 of lung cancer. A.J Smith took over as a result from that point foward.





SD is a team. 1 man does not make a front office.

Enough with the semantics. The current front office Bruce leads is not the same front office that McKay led unless we go by your definition.

If I recall, SD ownership had a large say in both cases.

alldaway

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#36 : November 18, 2006, 09:15:54 AM

If I recall, SD ownership had a large say in both cases.

All owners in the NFL have a say.  In the end it is the GM's that make the final decisions for most teams (except for the Raiders).

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#37 : November 18, 2006, 09:18:34 AM


If you think Grads is the answer then there won't be much difference between him starting next year whether we draft a QB or not. We can draft a QB next year and have Grads hold it down until he is ready, I don' care. But it is time in TB to have a Franchise QB. We have NEVER had one. We have had some go on to become them elsewhere, but in TAMPA we have never had one. Grads is not the answer. Grads is a guy that every season we willa sk the same question, shoudl we draft a QB? If the Glazers are smart they realize we need a bona fide superstar QB, and will give the ok. If you are assuming Grads fails next year that is even more reason to draft a QB this year. Last time we took the franchise RB with out top 5 pick, this time I say we get the QB to go with him. If the Glazers, Gruden, and fans care about the long term future and success of this team, a QB is the pick. If they look want to look for a quick fix then it is not. But I say now is the perfect time to rebuild, starting with the QB. It is time to get one here to call the face, the franchise, and the future. I don't think anyone we take with that first pick is going to have such a great impact on next year that we need to take him rather than a guy who could potentially lead our team for 10+ years.

Perfect time to rebuild? How do you figure that? This will be the third losing season in four years. Add in a losing season next year and it is really ugly.

Any other player that is not a QB will not have an impact next year? How do you figure that? You can have Quinn but I would happily take Joe Thomas, Calvin Johnson, Branch, or Gaines Adams.

Gruden has to be fired most likely for the Bucs to even entertain the thought of drafting a QB in the top ten of the draft. The chance that the Glazers endorse Gruden drafting a QB in the top ten is a very small chance.

Well, you just answered it.  3 losing seasons in 4 years.  Obviously things need a shake up.  We may as well secure a great QB, then rebuild the D and possibly add OL and some WR through the rest of the draft and FA the next 2 seasons.  

And I didn't say any other player would not have an impact.  What I said no 1 player is going to have such an impact that it would make picking a QB dumb.  Adams, Johnson, etc. are fine players, but they are NOT going to make us an instant SB contender.  We have been trying for the quick fixes for the past few years now, and it is not working.  

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#38 : November 18, 2006, 10:57:58 AM

San Diego was stupid becuase some fans and their front office prematurely jumped all over Brees before even giving him a chance? Sound familiar?



No.

Yeah, SD was real stupid.....Rivers sucks right?

The only thing SD did that was dumb was not trade Brees rather than letting him walk.

If you are comparing Grads to Brees that is too funny!

Not too bright I see.

Brees+ Roy Williams > Rivers



Right. The only one not bright here is you, thinking Grads is the answer at QB.

Grads is not the best answer but for Gruden's offense he is. Can you honestly say that Gruden will draft a QB in the top ten of the draft next year and afford to sit that player with his job on the line? And lets assume Gradkowski fails next year? Then what? With three losing seasons already and adding a fourth I can not imagine Gruden being around. And then having to hand over the reigns to a second year QB? Chalk up the possibility of another losing season.

I am sorry but your suggestion that Gruden drafts a QB next year in the top ten of the draft is simply over the top. The only way your suggestion is logical is if Gruden has the blessing of the Glazers to draft a QB in the top ten (highly doubt it) or Gruden is fired this year and the new coaching staff wants to draft a QB in the top ten.



 

Then we'd have another option.  If he fails and we have no other options, that's even more losing!  A QB is a pick for the future, not next year.  This team is not going to win next year and maybe not even the year after that.  We have nothing to lose.

alldaway

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#39 : November 18, 2006, 11:13:42 AM

Well, you just answered it.  3 losing seasons in 4 years.  Obviously things need a shake up.  We may as well secure a great QB, then rebuild the D and possibly add OL and some WR through the rest of the draft and FA the next 2 seasons. 

Not really.  If things need a shake up then it should be done THIS off season if the Bucs need to start from scratch.  You are talking about Gruden as if he is a lame duck coach but he should draft a QB in the top ten in 2007 anyways?  I think that is a big reach.  You are already assuming that a top ten QB is a great QB?  How do you know that?

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#40 : November 18, 2006, 11:17:47 AM

Well, you just answered it. 3 losing seasons in 4 years. Obviously things need a shake up. We may as well secure a great QB, then rebuild the D and possibly add OL and some WR through the rest of the draft and FA the next 2 seasons.

Not really. If things need a shake up then it should be done THIS off season if the Bucs need to start from scratch. You are talking about Gruden as if he is a lame duck coach but he should draft a QB in the top ten in 2007 anyways? I think that is a big reach. You are already assuming that a top ten QB is a great QB? How do you know that?

Then why bother drafting players at all?  Trade all the draft picks for vets! 

History says that most good QB's come in the first round.  Some are busts some aren't.  You could say the same for any position.  The QB's just get more press when they bust.

alldaway

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#41 : November 18, 2006, 11:18:24 AM

Then we'd have another option. 

How do you know that?  What if the Quinn is not a good fit for the NEW coaching staff?  All of you advocating the Bucs take a QB in the first round of the draft are most likely assuming Gruden is a lame duck coach for 2007 it seems.  Lets assume that for a minute.  A new coaching staff comes in and Quinn is not a fit. You say they need to adjust to Quinn but is it fair to the new coaching staff? No.  Is it fair that a top ten QB in the draft will command +20 million in guaranteed money which makes him uncuttable and untradable? No.

When drafting a QB in the top ten QB in the draft you do not want to have a change in a coaching staff.  You need stability.  So I lay down the gauntlet.

For those asking for a top ten QB in the draft the only way it happens (and logically) is if a new coaching staff is here for 2007.  The likelyhood that Gruden takes a QB in the top ten with the job on his line is ZERO.  If he takes a QB in the top ten this year it means he is here for the long haul.  I better not hear any of you complaining about Gruden's performance down the road if he does take a QB in the top ten this year.

leeroybuc93

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#42 : November 18, 2006, 11:20:44 AM

You should read my previous posts
Then we'd have another option.

How do you know that? What if the Quinn is not a good fit for the NEW coaching staff? All of you advocating the Bucs take a QB in the first round of the draft are most likely assuming Gruden is a lame duck coach for 2007 it seems. Lets assume that for a minute. A new coaching staff comes in and Quinn is not a fit. You say they need to adjust to Quinn but is it fair to the new coaching staff? No. Is it fair that a top ten QB in the draft will command +20 million in guaranteed money which makes him uncuttable and untradable? No.

When drafting a QB in the top ten QB in the draft you do not want to have a change in a coaching staff. You need stability. So I lay down the gauntlet.

For those asking for a top ten QB in the draft the only way it happens (and logically) is if a new coaching staff is here for 2007. The likelyhood that Gruden takes a QB in the top ten with the job on his line is ZERO. If he takes a QB in the top ten this year it means he is here for the long haul. I better not hear any of you complaining about Gruden's performance down the road if he does take a QB in the top ten this year.

You should read my previous posts in this thread.  I think taking a QB would bolster Gruden's job security.

alldaway

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#43 : November 18, 2006, 11:21:08 AM


Then why bother drafting players at all?  Trade all the draft picks for vets! 

Drafting has to have a direction not sheer madness!



History says that most good QB's come in the first round.  Some are busts some aren't.  You could say the same for any position.  The QB's just get more press when they bust.

History says that most good OT's come in the first round.  Some are busts some aren't. You could say the same for any position.


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#44 : November 18, 2006, 11:22:17 AM

And why does Gruden have to come in a package deal with Grads?  Why on earth do I have to choose both or neither?  
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