Scientists: Homosexuality occurs in "hundreds" of species

[ufojoe]

You can choose to act gay or straight, but you might be acting against your own nature (or natural predilection).  Many, many people, prior to about the '70s, got married and had children despite being gay.  They followed social norms and peer pressure even though it created poor marriages and unhappy people.

You need to check out the Mother Jones article because that is not what they're saying.

[John Galt?]

I know I am only attracted to females, �there is no choice about it. �I could not choose to be gay. �So it makes sense to me that gays might have an equally difficult time choosing to be straight. �Your physical reaction to being in a room full of sweaty football players and a room full of sweaty swimsuit models is different, and that reaction is determined either before birth or very early in life and not something you can consciously change. �You can change how you act upon those feelings, �but the feelings themselves are more primal than conscious thought.

According to the Mother Jones article I linked to earlier, you CAN choose to be gay or straight. Or some some
argue. Interesting read if you have the chance, and time.

You can choose to act gay or straight, but you might be acting against your own nature (or natural predilection).  Many, many people, prior to about the '70s, got married and had children despite being gay.  They followed social norms and peer pressure even though it created poor marriages and unhappy people.

On a side note, I choose to use proper grammer including double spaces after sentences, but the damn php puts those little boxes in for the second space whnever I am quoted.  I demand equal treatment for proper grammer.

[ufojoe]

I know I am only attracted to females,  there is no choice about it.  I could not choose to be gay.  So it makes sense to me that gays might have an equally difficult time choosing to be straight.  Your physical reaction to being in a room full of sweaty football players and a room full of sweaty swimsuit models is different, and that reaction is determined either before birth or very early in life and not something you can consciously change.  You can change how you act upon those feelings,  but the feelings themselves are more primal than conscious thought.

According to the Mother Jones article I linked to earlier, you CAN choose to be gay or straight. Or some some
argue. Interesting read if you have the chance, and time.

[John Galt?]

i just find it odd that being homosexual can be something one is born with, something that one is unconsciously nurtured into, and something that one freely chooses at will. if they are born with it i find it odd that these renowned scientists cant find it.

i watched the 60 min and didnt get too much out of it. i did wonder how an 18th month old is getting his hands on barbie dolls.

To seperate and clarify:  the question is whether certain people are born with a predilection/predispostion to homosexuality.  Are some born with an inate attraction to one sex over the other.   This is not to be confused with choosing a gay lifestyle, because one can always choose to be celibate.  How one physiologically reacts to hormones and pheromones (which are different in men than women) does not seem like something one can choose.  

I know I am only attracted to females,  there is no choice about it.  I could not choose to be gay.  So it makes sense to me that gays might have an equally difficult time choosing to be straight.  Your physical reaction to being in a room full of sweaty football players and a room full of sweaty swimsuit models is different, and that reaction is determined either before birth or very early in life and not something you can consciously change.  You can change how you act upon those feelings,  but the feelings themselves are more primal than conscious thought.

[ufojoe]

Amazing how I posted an article that disagreed with some of what I have said about gays and not one of you
commented on it. Guess I'm just trying to push MY opinions, right?

By the way, my dog also licks her butt. That kinda grosses me out as well but I have come to live with it as it is a method by which she keeps herself clean. That, I suspect, is not genetic but learned behavior. I don't see people licking their butt because they have learnt that it's pretty gross, if they were flexible enough to reach that is.

Last time I checked, dogs can't reach the sink or grab soap or even think about doing it. Poor analogy.

[spartan]

If you want to have a debate, have a debate, but isn't a debate when anybody who disagrees with you is:

a. Homophobic
b. Hateful
c. Stupid or
d. Juvenile.

A legitimate reason why a person may not like homosexuality is that it grosses them out. That does not necessarily make them one of the above. By the way, my dog also licks her butt. That kinda grosses me out as well but I have come to live with it as it is a method by which she keeps herself clean. That, I suspect, is not genetic but learned behavior. I don't see people licking their butt because they have learnt that it's pretty gross, if they were flexible enough to reach that is. My point is that just because animals exhibit behavior that we equate with homosexual acts does not necessarily mean it is a homosexual act, and it doesn't necessarily equate to people. Until the day comes Dr. Doolitle makes an appearance I guess we will never know. All we are doing is extending human behavior to the animal world which may or may not be relevant.

[GameTime]

not sure what you are asking.  gay rights activists seem to want 3 divisions of gays - those born, those unconsciously nurtured, and those by choice.  i find it odd that it can be all 3 ways.   now it can be something innate and something chosen.  i just think if there is a gay gene it should have been found already.

i already stated that i dont keep up on modern science.  but if 60 min is doing a show on it im sure there are some good researchers doing work.  am i not supposed to believe in all the european countries where homosexuality is more open that they dont research it as well?  find the gene, solve the mystery.

[cyberdude557]

According to University of Oslo zoologist Petter Böckman, about 1,500 animal species are known to practice same-sex coupling, including bears, gorillas, flamingos, owls, salmon and many others.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20080516/sc_livescience/samesexcouplescommoninthewild

[Biggs3535]

Well, if somebody from the University of Oslo came to that conclusion, it must be true.

this does occur. i've seen many documentaries and studies on it. this isn't the only research out there.
google it

good thing animals can't get married uh?

[ufojoe]

Well, if somebody from the University of Oslo came to that conclusion, it must be true.

LOL. You serious? It's been known for a long time by science that this occurs in the animal
kingdom. It's rampant. And I thought most people knew it too.

We've discussed it on this board in the past.

Here's one of the articles I posted a few years back...

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0722_040722_gayanimal.html

[Biggs3535]

It was a joke about the University of Oslo, ladies...calm down.

[ufojoe]

After thinking about it, I thought so...

But on this board, you never know.

[ufojoe]

From 2006...

http://www.livescience.com/health/060224_gay_genes.html

Excerpt:

The arrangement of a mother's genes could affect the sexual orientation of her son, according to a new study.

The finding, detailed in the February issue of the journal Human Genetics, adds fuel to the decade-long debate about whether so-called "gay genes" might exist.

The researchers examined a phenomenon called "X chromosome inactivation" in 97 mothers of gay sons and 103 mothers whose sons were not gay.

* * *

Most researchers now think that there is no single gay gene that controls whether a person is homosexual or not. Rather, it's the influence of multiple genes, combined with environmental influences, which ultimately determine whether a person is gay.

* * *

"I have no doubt that at some point we'll be able to manipulate all sorts of aspects of our personality and physical appearance," Bocklandt said. "I think if there's ever a time when we can make these changes for sexual orientation, then we will also be able to do it for intelligence or musical skills or certain physical characteristics - but whether or not these things are allowed to happen is something that society as a whole has to decide. It's not a scientific question."

[SON-OF-ZELL]

THe difference is that animals are creatures of instincts and urges and humans have a large cerebral cortex in which they can control behavior.  Bonobo's screw all of the time, doesn't matter what the sex is.  They have no norms in their society and they have no behavioral pressure.  You can't compare gay sex in animals to humans,  make so sense. 
I really don't care if you like men and your a man, or you like women, big deal. Just don't try to make yourself out to be a minority like your African American or Hispanic,  the only thing that makes you different is your need to have sex with a man, and that does not make you a "specialized" culture.......the whole gay culture thing is what offends people.