Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  Pirate's Cove (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: World Court tries to get a rapist and killer of 2 teens girls off death row!! « previous next »
Page: 1 2

dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46026
Offline
#15 : July 16, 2008, 07:03:02 PM

I don't care to get biblical - I would like to see what I posted responded to if you care to.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

cyberdude557

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 11834
Offline
#16 : July 16, 2008, 07:18:46 PM

According to Amnesty International...

-137 nations have banned capital punishment. That's more than 2/3rds of the nations on the planet.
-Between China, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, and the United States there was 1,252 people executed in 2007.

When you look at the nations that allow the death penalty.....most are not American allies. There are some real ugly countries in that group. And the only debate people here have on the death penalty is the "need" to speed it up. Did you know DNA evidence just recently cleared a man who has been sitting on death row for more than 20 years?

I'm sorry, eye for an eye or not, I dont trust our justice system. Juries are too easily manipulated. Prosecutors and law enforcement only care about winning. And unless you have money....your defense team is going to suck and you are screwed before the trial even starts.

John Galt?

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 18831
Offline
#17 : July 16, 2008, 07:22:31 PM

It would be a cold day in hell if I was president

yes, it would.


dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46026
Offline
#18 : July 16, 2008, 07:28:14 PM

According to Amnesty International...

-137 nations have banned capital punishment. That's more than 2/3rds of the nations on the planet.
-Between China, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, and the United States there was 1,252 people executed in 2007.

When you look at the nations that allow the death penalty.....most are not American allies. There are some real ugly countries in that group. And the only debate people here have on the death penalty is the "need" to speed it up. Did you know DNA evidence just recently cleared a man who has been sitting on death row for more than 20 years?

I'm sorry, eye for an eye or not, I dont trust our justice system. Juries are too easily manipulated. Prosecutors and law enforcement only care about winning. And unless you have money....your defense team is going to suck and you are screwed before the trial even starts.

Rather than focusing on other issues - such as defense cost and financial standing, which admittedly can be a part of the process, - why not offer an answer.

In the case of a convicted child rapist and murderer, what outcome from the conviction do you offer?

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

cyberdude557

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 11834
Offline
#19 : July 16, 2008, 07:32:50 PM


In the case of a convicted child rapist and murderer, what outcome from the conviction do you offer?

Life in prison.

dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46026
Offline
#20 : July 16, 2008, 07:42:33 PM

Why - do you find it more "humane"?  And do you include an opportunity for parole?

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

John Galt?

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 18831
Offline
#21 : July 16, 2008, 07:53:49 PM

All these Mexican criminals were provided attorneys.  Did the attorneys not notify their clients of their rights?  I doubt it.  Unless these were the crappiest attys ever, they are lying and saying their clients weren't informed because it is the only defense left.




Guest
#22 : July 16, 2008, 07:55:01 PM


In the case of a convicted child rapist and murderer, what outcome from the conviction do you offer?

Life in prison.

I am not opposed to capitol punishment on any moral grounds. I am, however, opposed to stripping someone of their right to due process.

A father whose son was raped by a man in New Orleans a few years back.  I believe the convicted rapist also killed the child - but of that I am uncertain.  While the rapist was being taken from New Orleans to be tried for another such crime in a different locale the father interceded and shot the rapist between the eyes, in the middle of the airport as I recall.

Shot him in the ear. I saw that on TV the day it happened. Gary Plauche was the father's name.

What is the answer for you Illuminator - when a person commits a detestable, heinous act?  Is their retribution involved?  Is it an eye for an eye?  When does punishment replace rehabilitation. 

Unfortunately, in this country punishment replaces rehabilitation as soon as anyone is sentenced to prison. Most people don't want justice, they want vengeance. That's why, in lieu of rehabilitation, we have a state run institute of sexual torture and violence. We happily give into our base instincts and call ourselves the good man.

dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46026
Offline
#23 : July 16, 2008, 08:02:08 PM

I am not opposed to capitol punishment.

I am opposed to any adverse impact on due process.

I am also opposed to Defense Counsel BS, as well as DA's BS.

Do you believe in rehabilitaton for detestable, heinous act(s).  I don't have such reservations.  Child rape and 1st degree murder - I just don't think I would let someone out or be upset if they paid with their lives.

And the prisons are a sin as well.  Not one for coddling, but zero tolerance for prison crimes.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

LFO

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 6531
Offline
#24 : July 16, 2008, 08:04:39 PM

Reminds me of Bowden trying to get this guy leniency:
Quote
It was Christmastime, 1993, when former Florida State football player Michael Gibson raped her.

He broke into her apartment, shot her twice, leaving two gaping holes in her chest. Then, as she lay there bleeding and crying, he continued with the sexual assault. And then he left her for dead.

Except before he left the scene, this deranged monster of a man took one final liberty:

Michael Gibson stole the Christmas presents on his way out.

"How low can you get?" says John Witherspoon, the husband of the young woman who was raped that day. "How could Bobby Bowden ever write a letter in that man's behalf, to try and help that man someday get out of prison?"

Good question and one that hasn't been asked nearly enough. Since when did Bobby Bowden become a spokesperson for rape and rapists?

Bowden chose to speak out the other day in support of embattled Colorado Coach Gary Barnett and, in the process, questioned the validity of recent rape allegations against Colorado football players. Bowden, who seems suddenly to have become an expert on rape crisis counseling, questioned why the alleged victims took so long to report crimes that happened a few years ago.

"I did not understand how a young lady can say she was abused, or whatever it was, two years later," Bowden told reporters in South Carolina. "At the time, why don't you go report it? It seems like you ought to report it right [away]. So it makes me say, 'Well, did it really happen like that? I don't know.' "

I wonder if Bobby also questions the integrity of the boys who were abused by Catholic priests and were too ashamed and embarrassed to come forward until years later? Or is it only boys who tell the truth?

"I wish I could say that I'm surprised by Bobby Bowden's comments," says Witherspoon, an attorney in South Carolina. "Doesn't he always take the side of the athlete no matter what? It sure seems that way."

Bowden, of course, knows nothing about the specifics in Colorado. He doesn't know the alleged victims. He doesn't know the players involved. All he seems to know is that he's a football coach, and football coaches defend their brethren and their boys -- defend them all the way to the penitentiary if necessary.

If anybody has a right to feel betrayed by Bowden's public stance on rape, it is Witherspoon and his wife. She's a former Florida State student who was the victim of the horrifying sexual assault at the hands of Gibson, a former FSU running back who was on the team for less than a season. Gibson also was convicted on three other rape charges -- one in which he held a gun on a man and made him watch while he sexually assaulted his girlfriend. Gibson received six life sentences: four for rape, one for armed burglary and one for attempted felony murder.

"What we have here is a serial rapist who has raped, we know of, four women," Tallahassee state attorney Willie Meggs said in court. "Brutalized them with firearms, physical force, deadly weapons. I want to be sure he never gets out."

This serial rapist is the man for whom Bowden wrote a self-described "letter of reference" a few months ago before a hearing in which Gibson's lawyers tried to get the life sentences overturned so that Gibson someday would be released from prison. Gibson is the adopted son of former FSU player Ernie Sims Jr. and Alice Sims. Their son, Ernie Sims III, is a sophomore linebacker for the Seminoles who was rated by some recruiting analysts as the nation's No. 1 prep player coming out of high school.

In the reference letter to Circuit Judge Kathleen Dekker, Bowden wrote, "I can only account for what I know about him when I was recruiting him out of [Tallahassee's] North Florida Christian High School and for the time he was on our football team at Florida State University." Bowden went on to write that Gibson was "no problem" when he suited up for the Seminoles and that he has a "loving, caring family." At the end, Bowden concluded: "Thank you for reading my letter and may God direct you in your decision."

The letter was written on Florida State stationery and signed "Coach Bowden."

When the letter became public through court records, Witherspoon said his wife was "crushed and crestfallen." This is a woman who loved Florida State, graduated from the school, and was a huge football fan whom friends say "revered Coach Bowden."

"When she first found out about Bobby Bowden's letter, she couldn't even watch Florida State games on TV anymore," Witherspoon said. "How can you support a serial rapist? How could any coach speak up on behalf of this animal?"At the hearing in October, Witherspoon's wife had to get up and relive that horrible day once again. She's 34 now, an attorney and a mother of two. But, still, 11 years later, she can't forget. How could she?

"He shot me first, and then he raped me," she testified. "There's not a day that goes by that I don't think about it. The thought of him getting out of prison terrifies me."

Judge Dekker agreed. She ruled that Gibson must spend the rest of his life in jail. "You have committed unspeakable crimes," she told him. "Monstrous crimes."

It has been said that Bobby Bowden sees the good in people, almost to a fault. But despite this penchant for blind loyalty, how could you ever see any good in any man who has shot and then raped a woman?

After the Gibson hearing, Linda Miklowitz, the president of Florida's branch of the National Organization for Women, wrote a letter of protest about Bowden to Florida State President T.K. Wetherell. In the letter, obtained by the Sentinel on Thursday, Miklowitz lashed out: "Until FSU starts taking seriously sexual violence against women by athletes, the school will continue to send the de**CENSORED**able message to hundreds of young men that rape is okay. Censuring Bowden would be a good first indication of change of course."

Miklowitz's suggestion obviously never was heeded because this week Bobby Bowden, it seems, once again turned into Bobby Knight -- except Bowden's graduation rate isn't nearly as high. It was Knight who once advised victims that, "if rape is inevitable, relax and enjoy it." Bowden's comments and actions, although not as callous, are just as insensitive.

Wetherell came to Bowden's defense Thursday in an e-mailed statement in which he wrote: "I have known Coach Bowden for years. I am sure he never meant to suggest in any way that he condones any type of abusive behavior." What's even more troubling is that this isn't really just about Bowden; it's about the culture and the code of the locker room. In a sports world filled with attractive recruiting hostesses and under-the-table sex favors, women are treated as accessories and enticements.

Boys will be boys. Girls will be toys.

"It seems to me that these coaches help create this atmosphere of entitlement," Witherspoon says. "The athletes are led to believe that they are special; that the system owes them something. They think they can take anything they want, and that includes women. It's like, 'If she doesn't want me, I'm just going to take her.' "

This is not to say Bowden or any coach condones rape, but -- at the same time -- shouldn't they go out of their way to condemn it? Rape is a serious problem in college, and one study found that one-third of campus rapes are perpetrated by athletes.

Instead of always defending the players, just once wouldn't you like to hear a coach say, "How's the victim doing? Is she OK? What can we do to help her?"

And instead of writing a letter of reference on behalf of the rapist, just once wouldn't you like the coach to write a letter of concern to the woman who was raped?

Bobby Bowden defends his insensitive comments about rape by railing against "political correctness." But this isn't about political correctness; it's about correctness -- period. It's about doing and saying the right things and sending the right message.

You don't question the honesty of an alleged rape victim you've never met.

And you don't write letters on behalf of serial rapists.

Especially if you sign your letters "Coach Bowden." That title means a lot to young men.



Guest
#25 : July 17, 2008, 08:34:20 AM

whatever... ::)

leeroybuc93

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4413
Offline
#26 : July 17, 2008, 12:58:38 PM

I'm not sure why everyone is so upset here.  The World Court is telling us what to do because we signed a treaty entering us in a pact with the other nations who signed it.  The World Court is the organization that deals with such treaties.  However, the World Court tells us to do lots of things but we don't always listen.  This guy will get what he deserves in the end. 
Page: 1 2
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  Pirate's Cove (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: World Court tries to get a rapist and killer of 2 teens girls off death row!! « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools