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Bucs Not Big Spenders Over Past Five Years |
 Tampa Bay Buccaneers co-chairmans Joel and Bryan Glazer (Brian Dalton) |
The Buccaneers were the league's lowest spenders in terms of player payroll over the past five seasons (2004-08), according to a recent article published on NFL.com. The Bucs spent $449 million in payroll during that time period. The biggest spender - the Dallas Cowboys - invested $566 million in player payroll.
With the exception of owning the 32nd pick in the NFL Draft, teams typically don't want to be ranked dead last in the league in any category.
But that's where the Tampa Bay Buccaneers ranked in a recent article posted on NFL.com, which listed teams in order of the league's biggest spenders and lowest spenders in terms of player payroll from 2004-08.
While the article does not list each franchise's overall expenses over the past five years, the Bucs spent the least amount of money of any team in the NFL during from 2004-08, investing a total of $449 million in player payroll.
The next teams in line to the Buccaneers were the Kansas City Chiefs ($451 million), Green Bay Packers ($457 million) and Tennessee Titans ($465 million).
A total of 18 teams (more than half the league) spent over $500 million in player payroll from 2004-08. Dallas was the biggest spender, investing $566 million in player payroll.
NFL.com's report comes at a time of economic crisis for the United States of America, where even a business as successful as the NFL has not been immune to the nation's financial challenges.
The Bucs, who once had a season ticket waiting list of over 100,000, no longer are sold out of season tickets, and the team's owners, the Glazers, even acknowledged earlier this offseason that local television blackouts were possible in 2009.
The Glazers have also reworked season ticket packages in an effort to help fans afford to attend Bucs home games at Raymond James Stadium.
Some believe the Glazer's majority ownership in the world's biggest sports franchise, Manchester United, has hindered ownership's ability to invest in the Buccaneers.
Fueling that speculation has been a series of layoffs at One Buccaneer Place, ranging from people in the ticket sales department to the public relations staff.
The Glazers also decided to move training camp to One Buc Place in Tampa after seven years at Disney's Wilde World of Sports complex and Celebration Hotel in the Orlando area.
Some other factors played a role in Tampa Bay spending the least amount of any other team on payroll. The Bucs endured salary cap issues from 2004-05 and built One Buccaneer Place, a $30-plus million training facility.
The Bucs didn't necessarily get what they paid for in 2004-08. One could argue that the team got more. While Tampa Bay did suffer through 5-11 and 4-12 seasons in 2004 and 2006, respectively, the Bucs also won two NFC South division titles and posted winning records in three of those five seasons.
Tampa Bay's overall regular season record from 2004-08 was 38-42. Some wonder if the Bucs could have had more success had the team been able - and willing - to invest more in player salaries.
When asked about their financial commitment to the Buccaneers, who entered free agency earlier this offseason with more than $60 million in salary cap room, Bucs co-chairman Joel Glazer suggested ownership was just as dedicated today as it was when it purchased the team in 1995.
"We are just as committed today as we were, I think 14 years ago when we signed a contract to buy this team," said Glazer. "I'm as miserable today after a loss as I was 10 years ago. We are as committed today as we have ever been to this franchise, and we will always, have been, and will be always committed to doing what it takes to build a winner. If the right players are there, the money is going to be there, but you have to go about things wisely. Sometimes you can throw money at a situation and it can get you in trouble. We are big believers in building a sustainable franchise that is going to be in competition for many years for the ultimate prize. When you can add something that is going to make a difference, we are all for it. Let's add it."
But that's where the Tampa Bay Buccaneers ranked in a recent article posted on NFL.com, which listed teams in order of the league's biggest spenders and lowest spenders in terms of player payroll from 2004-08.
While the article does not list each franchise's overall expenses over the past five years, the Bucs spent the least amount of money of any team in the NFL during from 2004-08, investing a total of $449 million in player payroll.
The next teams in line to the Buccaneers were the Kansas City Chiefs ($451 million), Green Bay Packers ($457 million) and Tennessee Titans ($465 million).
A total of 18 teams (more than half the league) spent over $500 million in player payroll from 2004-08. Dallas was the biggest spender, investing $566 million in player payroll.
NFL.com's report comes at a time of economic crisis for the United States of America, where even a business as successful as the NFL has not been immune to the nation's financial challenges.
The Bucs, who once had a season ticket waiting list of over 100,000, no longer are sold out of season tickets, and the team's owners, the Glazers, even acknowledged earlier this offseason that local television blackouts were possible in 2009.
The Glazers have also reworked season ticket packages in an effort to help fans afford to attend Bucs home games at Raymond James Stadium.
Some believe the Glazer's majority ownership in the world's biggest sports franchise, Manchester United, has hindered ownership's ability to invest in the Buccaneers.
Fueling that speculation has been a series of layoffs at One Buccaneer Place, ranging from people in the ticket sales department to the public relations staff.
The Glazers also decided to move training camp to One Buc Place in Tampa after seven years at Disney's Wilde World of Sports complex and Celebration Hotel in the Orlando area.
Some other factors played a role in Tampa Bay spending the least amount of any other team on payroll. The Bucs endured salary cap issues from 2004-05 and built One Buccaneer Place, a $30-plus million training facility.
The Bucs didn't necessarily get what they paid for in 2004-08. One could argue that the team got more. While Tampa Bay did suffer through 5-11 and 4-12 seasons in 2004 and 2006, respectively, the Bucs also won two NFC South division titles and posted winning records in three of those five seasons.
Tampa Bay's overall regular season record from 2004-08 was 38-42. Some wonder if the Bucs could have had more success had the team been able - and willing - to invest more in player salaries.
When asked about their financial commitment to the Buccaneers, who entered free agency earlier this offseason with more than $60 million in salary cap room, Bucs co-chairman Joel Glazer suggested ownership was just as dedicated today as it was when it purchased the team in 1995.
"We are just as committed today as we were, I think 14 years ago when we signed a contract to buy this team," said Glazer. "I'm as miserable today after a loss as I was 10 years ago. We are as committed today as we have ever been to this franchise, and we will always, have been, and will be always committed to doing what it takes to build a winner. If the right players are there, the money is going to be there, but you have to go about things wisely. Sometimes you can throw money at a situation and it can get you in trouble. We are big believers in building a sustainable franchise that is going to be in competition for many years for the ultimate prize. When you can add something that is going to make a difference, we are all for it. Let's add it."
Comments
DLS5492
12:55pm, July 1, 2009
pinkstob
If we are looking at the facts there is no relationship between the amount of money spent on players and wins. The Cowboys spent more than anybody and I think we've been to the playoffs more times in the past 5 years than they have and we're both in the NFC. We've at least been there as many times as they have.
The Titans are a fine football team and they're almost as cheap as us as far as spending on players.
I don't think anyone would consider us cheap at this moment if we had landed Hayensworth, which the Bucs tried everything in their power to do. From what I understand the Glazers supported the move, but Hayensworth just didn't want to come here.
The Titans are a fine football team and they're almost as cheap as us as far as spending on players.
I don't think anyone would consider us cheap at this moment if we had landed Hayensworth, which the Bucs tried everything in their power to do. From what I understand the Glazers supported the move, but Hayensworth just didn't want to come here.
1:17pm, July 1, 2009
charbeth2
I've seen comments on this story in other newpapers and the fans seem to throw all the blame on Allen and Gruden. That is very naive. Coaches want to win and the way to win is to have good players. No, the directive had to have come from ownership. For some time now, it appears the Glazers have gone the way of Culverhouse who made money hand over fist on a losing team. While the Glazers have more window dressing the facts speak for themselves. This new management team is following the same script. They promised a splash signing in free agency but it never came. Albert Hayneworth's comments to the media only tell me that even thought the Bucs offered more money, they didn't pursue him the way Washington did. How many players in the past came here for less money because they were courted by Allen and Gruden. There has been a lot of show and very little substance to the Glazers willingness to spend money on the Bucs.
1:24pm, July 1, 2009
seat26
They are taking a gamble that they can rebuild this franchise on the cheap (draft) instead of paying the big money for veteran players like McKay and Gruden did.
In the long term it is a good move, but my guess is that there will be a few ugly yrs while we rebuild. Hopefully the recent draft will be a good one.
black outs would be a bummer but I have tickets so oh well.
In the long term it is a good move, but my guess is that there will be a few ugly yrs while we rebuild. Hopefully the recent draft will be a good one.
black outs would be a bummer but I have tickets so oh well.
1:28pm, July 1, 2009
Horse
The way the economy is and is going to be for years to come, I believe the Glazer's are being smart. The world's priorties have changed; professional sports overall have slipped. because they over priced tickets for the middle class which was the majority of the fan base. As like other bussiness, net worth has dropped. This is just the beginning for the NFL woes and I hope the players understand that they are not going to make the same wages as in the past.
1:31pm, July 1, 2009
mjmoody
I point out that I do not live in Tampa, and that I am not in the stadium on game day, so I lack some first hand knowledge that you season ticket holders have. My point though is that during some of those years the Bucs' were digging out of a big salary cap hole, and I am not as of yet dissapointed that they haven't jumped back in. I will be dissapointed if they do not back up this new youth movement with some capital in the very near future.
1:38pm, July 1, 2009
jongruden
Just spend the money and give Ruud and Penn long term deals they deserve it. Wait one more year and give Bryant and deal if he can show he is more than a one year wonder.
1:43pm, July 1, 2009
roster1969
We've had no Franchise QB or RB (Wouldn't consider Cadillac a Franchise Back) over that time. Nor really any what the pundits would consider Franchise Players on either side of the ball (Maybe D. Brooks). We should be ranked close to last or last. The Bucs have done well to win as much as they did over that span. No problem with the spending aspect. Would over paying for the players we had won us any Super Bowls over that time. No.
1:45pm, July 1, 2009
roster1969
"Just spend the money and give Ruud and Penn long term deals they deserve it." The Bucs are playing withi the rules that the Collective Bargaining Agreement set. If Rudd and Penn dont like it then they shouldn't have ratified the agreement. They aren't starving nor are their families. Why extend now when you dont have to? Spare me with the "Just pay them" comments. They are being paid.
1:48pm, July 1, 2009
jongruden
As a player you have to get yours there is no loyalty from the owners and Ruud is way under paid for the market he is getting like 1.5 mil this year are you kidding me ask Lofa Tatupu if he would play for that, so spare me jerk.
2:14pm, July 1, 2009
dtm517
Penny wise and dollar foolish-remember Alvin Harper
2:18pm, July 1, 2009
wnb0395
Is it coincidence that as soon as the Glazes purchast MU they quit spending money on players. Roster1969, we didnt have a frachise QB or RB when we won the Superbowl. And to answer your other question, yes spending money on quality players would have won us another SB. Players like Brees, Abraham, Samuel,and Turner come to mind. With players like this on our team I believe we could have won a SB last year. The Glazers were willing to spend as much as it costed to win a SB before they purchased MU. Now they are the cheapest team in the league.
2:25pm, July 1, 2009
trapper
I think since were installing a new O and D and with a rookie first round QB they are playing it smart and not just spending money to get big names until we see how our young players respond so we can see what we REALLY need.I hope in the next couple years they will spend the money to get the quality FA to fill the gaps that we have and build this team back into a champion.We wont really know (just like everthing else with the Bucs) for another year or two but i will be pissed if they dont do better in FA which will take big money.
4:58pm, July 1, 2009
JDouble
I actually agree with jongruden.
5:31pm, July 1, 2009
trapper
As a player (Ruud) you gotta try and protect yourself and get your money now but as a team i would wait and see how well Ruud does this year before i gave him a huge contract.
5:34pm, July 1, 2009
norris
This shows how good Gruden was to get us to 9-7 last year, win the south in 07 and 05. Free agents would not come here because we would NOT pay big signing bonus to the Jared Allen's of the world. in the nfl it all about the up front money.
7:31pm, July 1, 2009
JDouble
Yeah cause the Cowboys and Redskins have shown that paying big bucks to FAs is a sure fire way to win the SB.
On very rare occasions is it a good idea to pay a huge contract for FAs. If you draft well and build your team up from the inside, there is no need. We need to try an draft a few defensive probowlers in the next couple drafts to fill our holes, not overpay guys like Haynesworth.
On very rare occasions is it a good idea to pay a huge contract for FAs. If you draft well and build your team up from the inside, there is no need. We need to try an draft a few defensive probowlers in the next couple drafts to fill our holes, not overpay guys like Haynesworth.
9:53pm, July 1, 2009
BucHarbour
It's obvious why they are not spending money, and haven't been since the Man U purchase. Everything else said to steer the conversation away from that is nothing but a smoke screen. All of this is the reason why I let my tickets go and just can't seem to get up for this season. Maybe I'll come around by the time the games kick off, but I just can't get excited by everything that's gone on here.
The number of wins, with the lack of dollars spent on talent, is just another testament to how good the Gruden/Kiffin combo was.
The number of wins, with the lack of dollars spent on talent, is just another testament to how good the Gruden/Kiffin combo was.
9:57pm, July 1, 2009
termig8r
Wonder what Chucky could have done with with an average payroll vice the bottom spot?
Too many owners take advantage of loyal fans, just taking the money and committing as little financial resources to the team - as to get by. Sadly the Glazers seem to fall into this group.
The Glazers have tried to live off the SB trophy for too long, instead of building a perennial champion. So I guess the comparisons with the Steelers, and Patriots in rebuilding are unfounded.
It seems this year's F/A debacle is just part of a much bigger trend over the best part of a decade. It makes you wonder how committed they are to the current "rebuilding" job?
Too many owners take advantage of loyal fans, just taking the money and committing as little financial resources to the team - as to get by. Sadly the Glazers seem to fall into this group.
The Glazers have tried to live off the SB trophy for too long, instead of building a perennial champion. So I guess the comparisons with the Steelers, and Patriots in rebuilding are unfounded.
It seems this year's F/A debacle is just part of a much bigger trend over the best part of a decade. It makes you wonder how committed they are to the current "rebuilding" job?
11:43pm, July 1, 2009
drclaw
If the "fans" had it their way, we'd go after every big free agent and sign every beloved Buc's player to a long term and lucrative contract.
The Glazer's didn't get into the financial position to write a $500 million check for the Bucs franchise, plus whatever they invested in Man U to get majority, by being stupid with their money. I doubt anyone in this thread has the financial authority to lecture the Glazers.
Look past the rankings to the raw data and you'll see the discrepancy between the highest and lowest payroll investment ($566/$449) is $117 million over five years. So the Cowboys spend 26% more than the Bucs and everyone is up in arms wanting to trade places? Look who else is at the bottom; Titans, Packers, and Chiefs. When I look past the "analysis" to the raw data I see very little correlation between overall payroll investment and success. I would like to see the same numbers with 2003 included.
The Bucs have adopted a "build through the draft" ethos. The numbers look about right for a team trying to get younger and build through the acquisition of low priced, young talent through the draft. Every team in the league is laying people off. That's because the NFL is still a business and the money they use to pay their people just got more expensive. Unless you understand the Glazers and all the financial ramifications they have to deal with in the new economic environment, you can't effectively decipher their future investment intentions. I guarantee there are major variables the Glazers must contemplate that we have no idea exist. They just traded for Kellen Winslow, and signed off on trading for Jay Cutler, not to mention the Haynesworth efforts. Last year we were in the running to land Favre. He got paid what $12 million real dollars last year? The Glazers obviously agreed to it or Gruden wouldn't have been on the phone with him.
I personally think they've spent their money wisely and correctly got their team out of the year to year cap limbo other teams put themselves in by reaching for free agents and overspending. Now they are in a position to be flexible with their spending. The future in the NFL is very much up in the air. The Bucs seem to be positioning themselves to be able to deal with whatever the new CBA throws at them. I don't blame them one bit.
The Glazer's didn't get into the financial position to write a $500 million check for the Bucs franchise, plus whatever they invested in Man U to get majority, by being stupid with their money. I doubt anyone in this thread has the financial authority to lecture the Glazers.
Look past the rankings to the raw data and you'll see the discrepancy between the highest and lowest payroll investment ($566/$449) is $117 million over five years. So the Cowboys spend 26% more than the Bucs and everyone is up in arms wanting to trade places? Look who else is at the bottom; Titans, Packers, and Chiefs. When I look past the "analysis" to the raw data I see very little correlation between overall payroll investment and success. I would like to see the same numbers with 2003 included.
The Bucs have adopted a "build through the draft" ethos. The numbers look about right for a team trying to get younger and build through the acquisition of low priced, young talent through the draft. Every team in the league is laying people off. That's because the NFL is still a business and the money they use to pay their people just got more expensive. Unless you understand the Glazers and all the financial ramifications they have to deal with in the new economic environment, you can't effectively decipher their future investment intentions. I guarantee there are major variables the Glazers must contemplate that we have no idea exist. They just traded for Kellen Winslow, and signed off on trading for Jay Cutler, not to mention the Haynesworth efforts. Last year we were in the running to land Favre. He got paid what $12 million real dollars last year? The Glazers obviously agreed to it or Gruden wouldn't have been on the phone with him.
I personally think they've spent their money wisely and correctly got their team out of the year to year cap limbo other teams put themselves in by reaching for free agents and overspending. Now they are in a position to be flexible with their spending. The future in the NFL is very much up in the air. The Bucs seem to be positioning themselves to be able to deal with whatever the new CBA throws at them. I don't blame them one bit.
6:25am, July 2, 2009
DLS5492
drclaw,
WELL SAID!!!!!!!!!!!!
WELL SAID!!!!!!!!!!!!
7:44am, July 2, 2009
JDouble
Very well said DrClaw.
Some folks are always eager to make excuses for Gruden/Allen. I don't buy it. In the last two years we have tried to land Farve, Cutler, Haynesworth, and actually traded for Winslow. The whole "We're broke cause of ManU" bit doesn't hols any water.
Some folks are always eager to make excuses for Gruden/Allen. I don't buy it. In the last two years we have tried to land Farve, Cutler, Haynesworth, and actually traded for Winslow. The whole "We're broke cause of ManU" bit doesn't hols any water.
8:06am, July 2, 2009
wnb0395
JDouble, Favre and Cutler were trade attempts and Winslow was a trade. They werent FA aquisitions. We didnt spend big money to try to get them. The only FA was Hayesworth and we got out bid by Washington. We let FA like Brees, Abraham, Samual, and Turmer go elseware when we had the money to get them and they were worth every penny they got. Ever since they bought MU they havent spent big money on any player. I know its a business but you got to spend money to make money. Now they are paying for it with lack of tickets sold. The fans will pay for it to when games are blacked out.
9:11am, July 2, 2009
bucfan47
wnb0395 - They DID NOT get outbid actually. Haynesworth stated that just the other day on Sirius radio. Tampa outbid Washington.
IMO, he decided NOT to come because he feels like Washington is ready to compete for Championships NOW, and views Tampa as a rebuilding team that is a few years away.
IMO, he decided NOT to come because he feels like Washington is ready to compete for Championships NOW, and views Tampa as a rebuilding team that is a few years away.
10:42am, July 2, 2009
sunrisejeff
While agree we may not be Champion ready this year he is dreaming if he thinks Redskins are Super Bowl bound this year as well.....specially in that division.
12:12pm, July 2, 2009
trapper
I agree bucfan47
12:17pm, July 2, 2009
wnb0395
I agree, the Redskins are nowhere close to being SB bound. They will be lucky to place 3rd in thier division. Thier had to be other factors he is not telling us in his decision to go to Washington. Why would you want to live in Washington over Tampa?
12:59pm, July 2, 2009
bucdiesel
The big money they should have spent was on Michael Turner period. Our RB situation would have been thru. We had it but didn't use it instead signing Warrick Dunn & keeping Caddy on the roster. You ask about loyalty? Ask Derrick Brooks about that ! Do you think the Glazers gave a damn when he was cut? Year after year he took paycuts for the team and not one person said "no you can't release him!" Ruud should have played his ass off this year then when he is an unrestricted bounce to a team that will pay him the money because he is a stud!
2:11pm, July 2, 2009
sumosam
So where is the big news? It was painfully obvious to anyone paying attention that after the 03-04 season, the Glazers dumped salary and got cheap. They had their customer base and stadium deal done. You don't release hall of fame players. It smacks fans right in the face. I remember back to a quote from Gruden when he said " the future is so bright, I gotta wear shades". It was a sarcastic comment. He knew where the organization was headed financially and he knew that he would have to bust his hump with the talent he was given on their budget. The Glazers knew he would coach his butt off to win so they dumped salary in players. Do you really think Gruden did not want to keep players like Sapp? Why do you think he put up with NFL retreads that demand lower salaries? He nursed along guys like Galloway, whose carreer should have been over 3 years ago, trying to get whatever he could out of them.
It has now come full circle and the fans are showing the Glazers that we've had enough. When you don't sell out football stadiums, you are doing something wrong. I blame the Glazers 100% for the collapse of our fan base and the piecing together of our team. Then during all of this, they raised our ticket prices. You gotta have a sack as big as a bag of grapefruit.
It has now come full circle and the fans are showing the Glazers that we've had enough. When you don't sell out football stadiums, you are doing something wrong. I blame the Glazers 100% for the collapse of our fan base and the piecing together of our team. Then during all of this, they raised our ticket prices. You gotta have a sack as big as a bag of grapefruit.
12:18am, July 3, 2009
scubog
High price doesn't necessarily mean better product and high salary doesn't necessarily mean better player. Neither is the reverse true. There are countless examples.
One reason for the Bucs' lower player salaries is the fact that there are no longer the star players commanding those upper echelon pay checks. These past five years we have been a team of aging veterans with now comparatively low salaries and young unproven players still on their rookie contracts. We have few, if any players in their prime who are recognized as being in the top five or even top ten in the league at their position.
Many teams salary figure is askew based on one star quarterback, premier running back, pro-bowl left tackle or a dominant pass rusher inflating the team number while we were getting by with a retreads or stop-gaps at those positions.
If we are smart with free agent signings and draft players who progress from their rookie of the year honors instead of dropping on the depth chart, the amount paid to players will go up dramatically.
I went through the Culverhouse era; this ain't that.
One reason for the Bucs' lower player salaries is the fact that there are no longer the star players commanding those upper echelon pay checks. These past five years we have been a team of aging veterans with now comparatively low salaries and young unproven players still on their rookie contracts. We have few, if any players in their prime who are recognized as being in the top five or even top ten in the league at their position.
Many teams salary figure is askew based on one star quarterback, premier running back, pro-bowl left tackle or a dominant pass rusher inflating the team number while we were getting by with a retreads or stop-gaps at those positions.
If we are smart with free agent signings and draft players who progress from their rookie of the year honors instead of dropping on the depth chart, the amount paid to players will go up dramatically.
I went through the Culverhouse era; this ain't that.
6:48am, July 3, 2009
bucfan47
sumosam - But...Not so fast...Raising ticket prices combined with alot of change = good business.
As you can see if you follow this forum much bud, most of the posters on here have completely bought into the change. So much so, that they actually feel the team will be competiting for SuperBowls in 2-3 seasons. Some honestly believe that.
So, on one hand I can agree with most of what you say....On the other you must realize that most fans, at least the loyal ones, are complete die-hards who will back the team and ownership with their hard earned money, and they'll continue to do that no matter what. And that's the truth.
If this move doesn't work, I truly feel sorry for the fans who pay alot of money for season tickets. This change presents much more risk for them than anyone, as they could be stuck watching a doormat team until the next coaching change if this doesn't work out...Or if Freeman doesn't work out.
As you can see if you follow this forum much bud, most of the posters on here have completely bought into the change. So much so, that they actually feel the team will be competiting for SuperBowls in 2-3 seasons. Some honestly believe that.
So, on one hand I can agree with most of what you say....On the other you must realize that most fans, at least the loyal ones, are complete die-hards who will back the team and ownership with their hard earned money, and they'll continue to do that no matter what. And that's the truth.
If this move doesn't work, I truly feel sorry for the fans who pay alot of money for season tickets. This change presents much more risk for them than anyone, as they could be stuck watching a doormat team until the next coaching change if this doesn't work out...Or if Freeman doesn't work out.
10:42am, July 3, 2009
scubog
Let's see, this is a fan-based site. Why in the world would anyone think it odd and even stupid that the participants would hope for the future to be "so bright they have to wear shades"? The terms fan and loyalty together?
Of course, those of us actually sitting in the stands could be caught in a downpour as we were when the fledgling Buccaneers won the NFC Central Division in 1979. None of the experts predicted that one.
As a fan, one expects to have disappointment and hopefully some exciting moments. In spite of the disdain of some, no one is so naive to think their team is going to win every game and go to the Superbowl; but they do always hope for the best.
That's why every year the worst teams at the top of the draft select a player who they hope will be "the savior" even though most of their fans are intelligent enough to realize it's probably just a rung on the ladder out of the basement.
Always thinking your team is going to suck no matter what they do is no different than always thinking your girlfriend or wife is ugly and fat.
Of course, those of us actually sitting in the stands could be caught in a downpour as we were when the fledgling Buccaneers won the NFC Central Division in 1979. None of the experts predicted that one.
As a fan, one expects to have disappointment and hopefully some exciting moments. In spite of the disdain of some, no one is so naive to think their team is going to win every game and go to the Superbowl; but they do always hope for the best.
That's why every year the worst teams at the top of the draft select a player who they hope will be "the savior" even though most of their fans are intelligent enough to realize it's probably just a rung on the ladder out of the basement.
Always thinking your team is going to suck no matter what they do is no different than always thinking your girlfriend or wife is ugly and fat.
6:57am, July 4, 2009
dcrum35
BUCFAN47:
You are very wrong on this one. "Raising ticket prices combined with alot of change = good business."
First off, ticket prices did NOT raise this year.
Second, the past few years there has been more and more negative feedback and less and less at games ( I know, I was there) because people were getting fed up with the ticket price increases.
Third: people are not buying into the change. You have some diehards who like what they are doing, like me. But then you have many who see doom and gloom. Then you have the ones with blinders on who think they will be SB bound in 2 years.
For the most part it has all added up to BAD business. The stadium is not sold out and there is already talk about possible TV blackouts in the season.
All that said, the economy has not helped. The best thing they can hope for is that the offense make them exciting to watch at least.
You are very wrong on this one. "Raising ticket prices combined with alot of change = good business."
First off, ticket prices did NOT raise this year.
Second, the past few years there has been more and more negative feedback and less and less at games ( I know, I was there) because people were getting fed up with the ticket price increases.
Third: people are not buying into the change. You have some diehards who like what they are doing, like me. But then you have many who see doom and gloom. Then you have the ones with blinders on who think they will be SB bound in 2 years.
For the most part it has all added up to BAD business. The stadium is not sold out and there is already talk about possible TV blackouts in the season.
All that said, the economy has not helped. The best thing they can hope for is that the offense make them exciting to watch at least.
11:53am, July 4, 2009
gobucsgo
Just like Hugh Culverhouse the Glazers are laughing all the way to the bank.
1:02pm, July 4, 2009
mkurbo
From SI.com
Could not have said it better myself:
The Bad ... Where do I start? The Bucs started the offseason by firing a proven winner and Super Bowl champion in head coach Jon Gruden, as well as a general manager in Bruce Allen who single-handedly got the team from salary-cap purgatory to an enviable financial situation -- while generally fielding competitive teams in the process. Those two were replaced by a guy who has never called signals in the NFL, Raheem Morris, and an executive, Mark Dominik, whose initial financial decisions have been dubious at best. Among the duo's first transactions was the release of all-time favorites and role models for younger players like Derrick Brooks and Warrick Dunn.
Dominik's financial acumen must be called into question considering the moves he has made thus far. He gave $10.5 million in guaranteed money to wide receiver Michael Clayton, who hasn't been a legitimate receiving threat since his rookie season. I thought this was a production-oriented business. Then, he gave a contract extension totaling $20 million in guarantees to Kellen Winslow shortly after acquiring him from the Cleveland Browns. The money given to a player with known knee issues is not nearly as concerning as the fact the pact was signed even though Winslow still had two years remaining on his rookie contract. What message does that send to guys like Barrett Ruud and Donald Penn? All they've done for the past three seasons is everything asked of them by the organization, yet no new contract is in the offing for either one -- despite Ruud having only one year remaining on his rookie deal and Penn being a restricted free agent.
Could not have said it better myself:
The Bad ... Where do I start? The Bucs started the offseason by firing a proven winner and Super Bowl champion in head coach Jon Gruden, as well as a general manager in Bruce Allen who single-handedly got the team from salary-cap purgatory to an enviable financial situation -- while generally fielding competitive teams in the process. Those two were replaced by a guy who has never called signals in the NFL, Raheem Morris, and an executive, Mark Dominik, whose initial financial decisions have been dubious at best. Among the duo's first transactions was the release of all-time favorites and role models for younger players like Derrick Brooks and Warrick Dunn.
Dominik's financial acumen must be called into question considering the moves he has made thus far. He gave $10.5 million in guaranteed money to wide receiver Michael Clayton, who hasn't been a legitimate receiving threat since his rookie season. I thought this was a production-oriented business. Then, he gave a contract extension totaling $20 million in guarantees to Kellen Winslow shortly after acquiring him from the Cleveland Browns. The money given to a player with known knee issues is not nearly as concerning as the fact the pact was signed even though Winslow still had two years remaining on his rookie contract. What message does that send to guys like Barrett Ruud and Donald Penn? All they've done for the past three seasons is everything asked of them by the organization, yet no new contract is in the offing for either one -- despite Ruud having only one year remaining on his rookie deal and Penn being a restricted free agent.
2:18pm, July 4, 2009
termig8r
"The Glazer's didn't get into the financial position to write a $500 million check for the Bucs franchise, plus whatever they invested in Man U to get majority, by being stupid with their money. I doubt anyone in this thread has the financial authority to lecture the Glazers."
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I think you are missing the point. The Glazers are looking at the financial bottom line. If they can get a better return on their investment, with lower capital expenditures - they will do it & have done it. The problem is that philosophy rarely translates to a perennial winner.
Sure you can look at the Deadskins & Boyz in Dallas as two franchises that haven't achieved success with a high payroll (though I'll bet their return is as good as the Glazers). But you also need to look to the two model franchises in New England & Pittsburgh. Who are listed at #8 & #10 in the study.
Most fans could give a rat's a$$ if the Glazers are making good money with their Bucs investment. The majority want to see a winning product on the field, & they expect the owners to provide the means for that to happen.
Fans that do not hold the Glazers accountable for providing the means to create a winner are part of the problem. Those fans are being taken advantage of by multi-millionaires. From a 100,000 ticket waiting list to probable blackouts - that's the result of the Glazer's commitment.
I'll bet GoBucsGo, above is as big a Bucs fan as you'll find. But his one sentence commentary hit's the nail on the head. GoBucsGo is no fool!
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I think you are missing the point. The Glazers are looking at the financial bottom line. If they can get a better return on their investment, with lower capital expenditures - they will do it & have done it. The problem is that philosophy rarely translates to a perennial winner.
Sure you can look at the Deadskins & Boyz in Dallas as two franchises that haven't achieved success with a high payroll (though I'll bet their return is as good as the Glazers). But you also need to look to the two model franchises in New England & Pittsburgh. Who are listed at #8 & #10 in the study.
Most fans could give a rat's a$$ if the Glazers are making good money with their Bucs investment. The majority want to see a winning product on the field, & they expect the owners to provide the means for that to happen.
Fans that do not hold the Glazers accountable for providing the means to create a winner are part of the problem. Those fans are being taken advantage of by multi-millionaires. From a 100,000 ticket waiting list to probable blackouts - that's the result of the Glazer's commitment.
I'll bet GoBucsGo, above is as big a Bucs fan as you'll find. But his one sentence commentary hit's the nail on the head. GoBucsGo is no fool!
2:01am, July 5, 2009
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