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March 18, 2013 @ 9:48 pm
Current rating: 4.00 Stars/1 Votes

Bucs And Jets In A Standoff On Revis Trade

Written by Mark
Cook
Mark Cook

Mark
Cook

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With the NFL Owners meeting taking place this week in Phoenix, the trade rumors and talks about Darrelle Revis are heating up. A deal could be coming this week, depending on which teams blinks first, as both appear to be holding firm in their prices willing to pay or accept.
The NFL Owners Meetings kicked off in Phoenix on Monday with several topics – including rule changes and players safety – being on the forefront.

With all 32 teams represented by owners and general managers, combined with hundreds of media members from around the country attending, the topics of specific team issues always come up. As expected Monday, Jets star cornerback Darrelle Revis was the main focus that Bucs and Jets fans were trying to get a read on.

Jets owner Woody Johnson spoke about the possibility of Revis being traded, and tried to downplay it to a degree.

"If somebody wants to make an offer, for any of our players, we'd always listen," Johnson said as reported by ESPN.com’s Dan Graziano. "We're not actively beating the bushes."

General manager John Idzik echoed Johnson’s sentiment to Graziano.

"Any move that we contemplate with any player will be done with the sole purpose of helping the New York Jets," Idzik said. "So if there's merit to that, we'll contemplate it. And if not, we'll move on."

Revis is coming off a torn ACL and has one year left on his current deal with New York. Johnson downplayed the idea to Newsday on Sunday that he is unwilling to give Revis an extension beyond 2013, calling it "exaggerated" and "patently untrue."

"I think John (Idzik) is going to be looking at all these possibilities," Johnson said. "If he believes the terms of an extension would be acceptable to the team and would make the team better, we would do it."

Buccaneers general manager Mark Dominik spoke to the Tampa Bay area media in attendance late Monday evening, addressing the Revis situation in a roundabout way. The Tampa Bay Times Rick Stroud reported the following from Phoenix, including saying the Buccaneers very well may be willing to give up a No.1 pick for Revis.

“There’s only one (team) that knows who they’re taking,’’ Dominik said of the draft. “The thing I’d say is I feel really good about the success we’ve had drafting players. At the same point, I’m not going to sit there and be bull-headed and not think, “what’s the best thing for the team going forward?” That’s the only way you can build it right.’’

Dominik conceded a play of Revis’ caliber doesn’t just grow on trees.

“They’re really hard to find,’’ Dominik said. “They really are rare and that makes them an interesting commodity. You go into the draft every year and everybody thinks maybe that’s the guy but there are very few of them. When they come out, it’s pretty noticeable who they are.

“If we think it’s in the best interest of the team, we will do something,’’ Dominik said. “If that’s a player that everybody is speculating (Revis) or maybe it’s a player at a position that nobody has thought about. But certainly, these meetings are very healthy for those kinds of discussions to see if there is a way to get this team better and does that include players or draft picks or a combination? That’s what we’ll look at.’’









Last modified on Monday, 18 March 2013 22:40
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COMMENTS

  • avatar


    A strong pass rush will do more than a 28 year old CB with bad knees to make the defensive backfield look good. Revis is not worth our 13th pick or the ton of cash it will take to appease his ego. DT, DE, CB should be the order of our picks, and then maybe a RT. We have too many needs to play around with an old, gimpy legged prima donna CB. The NFL doesn't care what you did yesterday or what you might do tomorrow, they want results now, and Revis may not be ready by training camp. So what's he gonna do? Rush his rehab and take a chance on another injury? I hope we pass on Revis and use our draft picks to continue strengthening our defense.
  • avatar


    DOM will get Revis, and he has been smart to wait out the Jets. With their cap problems all the pressure is on them and they will end up compromising their demands. And if we give up a first round draft choice and we don't get Floyd, we could still luck out in the fourth round if DOM picks up Brandon Wms from Missouri Southern St. at 6'3" and 340 pounds who is massive with great athleticism, and a burst to get to the QB, with 68 tackles, 10 total sacks, and 20 total tackles for loss. And if we don't take Bostic in the third round we should seriously consider Jamie Collins for strong side LB who is 6-3 and 250 pounds with speed like David, who can run side line to side line, who had 10 sacks last year and a total of 21 tackles for loss, and can cover passes too.
  • avatar


    Biggers is gone! Wooo Hooo! He's the Redskins' problem now. That's addition by subtraction for us. I said if Dominik re-signed Biggers I wanted him fired so I'm still on the Dominik bandwagon it seems.
  • avatar


    We are really going to miss Benn this year. He's like Anquan Boldin if Anquan couldn't catch or stay healthy. I wonder what CB, TE or DT/DE we could have had instead. Oh wait, they selected Gronkowski 2 picks later. Fantastic!! Well at least Brian Price worker out. Oh.
  • avatar


    GrayBuc: Do you realize how many "ifs" (and assumptions) there are in your statement?: "IF we complete the rebuild of our d-line in this draft." IF "our two pro-bowl guards (come) back (solid), and IF left tackle (is in shape), and IF (we have) an improved center and (IF we have an improved) right tackle...". "And IF we make the right moves in the upcoming draft". "And then IF our linebacker corps develops as I expect..." GrayBuc...those "ifs" are exactly what I was talking about in my post...so you and I are nearly in agreement: As I said IF the Bucs can fill their 8 or 9 holes...then they can compete for a championship! Maybe you can tell I'm a long-time sufferer as a Buc fan since 1976 and without a single play-off win (and few appearances) over the past 10 years. I like your optimism and HOPE you are right. Go Bucs!
  • avatar


    Warren: You are right. My optimistic statement did contain a lot of "ifs". And I even left out the two biggest ifs: if our QB plays well and if the injury bug doesn't bite too hard...actually the two biggest if for all 32 NFL teams. Still I think there is good reason to believe that all these things could break the right way for us. I'm very impressed with this new Bucs front office. I've thought Dom was doing a pretty good job even before Schiano's arrival. I remember what we looked like when he took over. One of the oldest teams in the league, mediocre and declining, and in cap trouble. He's done a lot of good. But he's also made a fair number of mistakes along the way in terms of talent evaluation. I'm talking about guys like Haynesworth, K2, Brian Price, Rejus Benn. But this Schiano cat seems to have a very good eye for NFL talent. Since his arrival we've done a lot of addition-by-subtraction: Tenard Jackson, Sean Jones, K2, Talib, etc. And we've added some real nice pieces: Nicks, Jackson, Barren, Martin, David, etc. And his no-nonsense approach is, I think, exactly what a lot of our existing roster needs. That's why I think Penn will report in-shape for a change. Like you I'm a Bucs fan since they we an expansion team. So maybe I'm just drinking the Cool Aide, but I don't think so. I think we're really close and all the arrows are pointing up.
  • avatar


    Would not give up #1 for Revis. Age, coming off ACL - will not know if he's back until August and by then already committed to big price tag. If Revis is still the best CB in the league, why is he still available? Sign Grimes, draft solid CB and DL, rehabilitate Eric Wright for one more year, pick-up starters as draft and training camp. We have too many holes to work blockbuster deals for one guy that nobody can tell you if he's even healthy!
  • avatar


    I think we should sign Grimes. That will put added pressure on the Jets as we will already have a starting corner in place. It should allow for a better trading position with them and if it works out gives us two Pro Bowl corners. Maybe sweeten the pot and throw Blount in instead of a pick.
  • avatar

    Jets want to trade revis which should already have us having the leverage!
  • avatar

    I haven't heard anybody mention hometown boy Mike Jenkins? He played at a Pro Bowl level a couple years ago and we could get him real cheap even if he's our 2nd or 3rd corner. Why not just for depth?
  • avatar


    Horse I think your deal is about right
  • avatar

    He fell off since that pro bowl year. I remember a Cowboys game and saw Mike Jenkins literally just give up the Touchdown play that he should have easily made the tackle, not sure if that's the guy I would want on my team.
  • avatar

    The last three superbowl champions had terrible pass defenses...I just hope they don't give up too much for him if they land him. Corners to me are not as valuable as they once were...and you can look no further than the down market this year for Your proof. Teams are not throwing big $$$ their way. Why? The rule changes make it virtually impossible for shutdown corners to exist. That's all I'm saying.
  • avatar

    Are you kidding me? Not as valuable as they once were?!?! This is a pass first league now man, despite the past 3 superbowl champions having "horrible" pass defense, they still are very valuable. Just take a look at how horrible the Bucs secondary was last year..
  • avatar


    KINDERRT, the report you mention merely references the PFT report that led me to the question. The way they express ",we've been told," is not really a solidified report. It also amazes me how many articles in the sports world are re-created by referencing eachother and not really offering any new content or perspective. I find PR to rarely be guilty of this which Is why I enjoy their take on our team.
  • avatar


    I would love to get Revis also, but not for this year's first (13)!! ------ I would like to see us get someone like Johnathan Hankins (DT) in the first round or maybe a long term CB in the first and a Bennie Logan (DT) or Brandon Wiiliams (DT) in the second round. It wouldn't bother me to see us take an OT in the first either! Again, depending on how the CB situation shakes out via the combination of free agency and the draft.
  • avatar


    There is another article on Bucsnation.com saying that we are talking to Grimes.
  • avatar


    Assuming we are indeed moving on from this Revis drama, I say don't despair Bucs fans. Perhaps this has not all been for not. Revis may well be a free agent at the end of the coming season. He now must surely know that we covet him and are able and willing to pay him. Could be that the first in a long line of private jets he steps onto as a free agent is the one headed to Tampa Bay. In the meantime we will have to make-do at CB. If, as I hope, we complete the rebuild of our d-line in this draft -- we mostly need a stud nose tackle and perhaps some depth -- then it may well be that any weakness in our secondary won't too much matter because opposing QBs won't have time to throw. And yes, I think we can make a serious run at the national championship. I don't think we're as far away as some of you seem to believe. With our two pro-bowl guards back, and an at-weight and in-shape left tackle (for the first time in years), and an improved center and right tackle, we might just have one of the best o-lines in the league. And if we make the right moves in the upcoming draft -- and keep in mind that this last draft, since Shiano arrived, was outstanding -- we might well have one of the best d-lines in the league. And then if our linebacker corps develops as I expect -- mark my words...keep an eye on Mr. Najee Goode -- we may have one of the better groups of linebackers in the league. We're just not that far away. Go Bucs!
  • avatar


    PewterReport, can you confirm with any of your inside sources if the staff is meeting with/negotiating with Brent Grimes? I have found no solidified reports in this regard. I have to believe they would be interested in his services, but without confirmation I worry we are suffering from more trade posturing.
  • avatar


    Just read a report fron Rant Sports that the Buc's are close to moving on from the Revis trade. Rant Sports is saying we are going to look at Grimes. This would be the best move for us and the Jets can get stuck with Revis. Maybe there is hope for Dominik yet. I remember Dominik saying you pick up in F/A what you miss on in the draft. Why we have so many holes on this team is because Dominik has had some BAD drafts. We cannot pick up everyone we need in F/A. We need to due much better when we DRAFT that is how a great team is built.
  • avatar


    Here we are discussing ONE player extensively. Does anyone really feel the Bucs arfe one player away and that our Bucs are going to the Super Bowl regardless of whether or not we get Revis?? Every team in our division has gotten better...every team in the NFC west has gotten better...the Bucs have gotten a good safety and a couple of special team players so far. That leaves...oh I dunno know...about a total of 8 or 9 holes left to fill on offense and defense. We got a LONG way to REALLY get competitive. We'll see if this FO can get it done...otherwise I agree with earlier comments that this is Dom's last year.
  • avatar


    Well I see how the GM feels it would be great to get Revis, But I think if Jets wants more than what the bucs are offering I would do this now. #1 sign thru FA the best DE,DT and another CB in FA within 7 days or less. Then with Tampa with the #13 I would on Draft Day I would trade down example with Minn or Miami I understand that both these teams have mult #1 picks plus they do have a 2nd and a 3rd. The first player thru the draft If Tampa trades down I would get that big Defensive Linemen M.Hunt I understand Tampa talk with him for a long period of time, and get him on board with Tampa 2nd Rd and Minn or Miami picks I would get the best CB and DL available at the time of Pick. Then Tampa could move their 4 & 6 round picks to get another 3rd or even another 2nd rd pick and get the best LB available. Then they go after another CB with one of the pick then go after a small college QB to learn the buc system. This is how I would get Tampa fixed in a hurry. With Tampa getting that WR and TE thru FA. Then Tampa can go after the CB's and Defensive linemen at least two each. GO BUCS what do you think Tampa does have the extra picks to make things happen. I hope Rhonde Barber would come back another year to help the younger backs improve.
  • avatar


    If I went out right now and bought a Ferrari it would be worth less then what I bought it for as soon as I left the lot.hold on to the car for a while,add mileage and maybe a scratch or two,its worth even less..Revis is just like that car- it's a Ferrari still,but I'm never gonna get back what I paid for it - and who really knows what the hell I did to it in the time I had it..the Jets bought a Ferrari,it had some problems yet they want us to buy it for the sticker price PLUS the gas they spent driving it around..anyone can see its a bum deal- this past weekend they sunk another mil into the car,who's gonna have to cover that ? We would be doin the Jets a favor to take that headache off their hands...maybe if they throw in the Honda( Tebow) it's a better deal since there is no telling how often the Ferrari will be on the road- the Honda may not be as flashy but its useful,esp if it could help both out running and passing game..
  • avatar


    LOL - maybe a Yugo is a better analogy....
  • avatar


    That's right; the Jets want your entire draft; actually, they want two full drafts for Revis; the Jets problem is the league knows this.
  • avatar


    What gets me a little bit angry about the Jets is they remind me of the aggressive tactics I've seen too often; i get mail from magazines saying I must reup my subscription even though I've never had a subscription with these guys; i really hate such language tricks; the Jets are manipulating and using such aggressive language tricks with the Media, and the media folds likea lawnchair; reminds me of the scene in the "Abyss" movie; the owner lady of the oil rig comes in and yells correctly at one her employees for folding when the military tells him to cooperate; the employee replies to her, "the military told me to cooperate, so I am!" This is the type of mental tricks this 'wonderful' new Jets owner is player; he's the worst kind of rich man that everyone should hate.
  • avatar


    Here's what to do to these Jets; trade down this years first round right now, then go back and say, O.k. Jets, you can now have this years first rounder and this years second and next years third rounder.
  • avatar


    I don't mind giving up a 1st round pick either this year or next year for Revis. None of the first round picks Dominik has drafted have been to the playoffs. I'm trying to win the Super Bowl here, not some draft pick/salary cap chess match. Win dammit!
  • avatar


    Perhaps global warming has raised the ocean levels and Revis Island sank beneath the waves. Wait for the Jets to blink and get the best deal you can, or don't pull the trigger at all. Some decent veteran cbs will get cut after the draft and we will get one or two in the draft...we don't need to be the best backfield to win games, just not historically crappy like last year.
  • avatar


    I read on line somewhere from a NY reporter that if Revis is traded before June 1st, that the Jets will have to take a $13.75M salary cap hit this year. Perhaps a deal has been struck already, or not, but in any event they might be waiting until after that deadline to spread out the hit. We would know more about his health at that point anyway. Personally, even if he is in great shape, I would prefer to keep the draft picks and find lesser quality help elsewhere. It is not like we are ready for a Super Bowl run this year anyway. There are a lot of holes to fill, so save the money that would be spent on him and spend it more judiciously on several players and some depth instead.
  • avatar


    No man , i mean no man wants to take a trip to Revis Island alone. Revis at twenty percent is better than that crape we had at cornerback last year . Our 13th pick could end up being another Aquib Talib or Dexter Jackson. After last year, i'm starving for a great secondary. Remember we are in the NFC SOUTH, we need a great secondary just to servive . Revis , Goldson , Barron with a year under his belt and another decent corner thru FA or the draft, would put us there . Eric Wright would probably have a lot more success playing around this talent as well.
  • avatar


    Stick to your guns Mark. The Jets need this deal more than the Bucs do. Revis' days in the Meadowlands are over and everyone knows it. Why are the Bucs the obvious trading partner? Cap room...Cap room...Cap room! I'm hoping that the Bucs don't give up ANY first round picks to get this done. A 2 and a future 3 would be as far as I'd go. Keep in mind that in 11 months the Bucs wouldn't have to give up anything but big $'s to land Revis. If the Bucs were 1 player away, like they were back in 2000 with the Keyshawn deal, I'd see giving up more to land a player of Revis' caliber. This current team is still, at best 6-8 players away.
  • avatar

    What i want to know is why the Bucs didnt get any compensatory picks and the niners got 3?!? I think the niners have a total of like 15 picks or more...any one care to explain this for me? thanks
  • avatar


    Compensatory picks are measured based on the difference between FA losses and FA acquisitions - the Niners lost more than they gained - we didn't.
  • avatar

    Okay...I guess that makes sense. Still seems weird though. Thanks EastEndBoy!
  • avatar


    The proper term is "Fatal Embrace"!
  • avatar


    Mark - were you able to keep a straight face when Dom said "“The thing I’d say is I feel really good about the success we’ve had drafting players"? Dom has been either Head of Scouting or GM for over a decade (I believe); and in all of those drafts the only player outside of the 1st and 2nd rounds to develop into a current starters are Mike Williams (4th round), Zuttah (3rd round), Foster (3rd round). He has a few hits (and many more misses - Dexter Jackson anyone, Michael Clayton if you like...not doing it...how about Aaron Sears, Brian Price or Gaines Adams...still no, Dewayne White, Sabby Piscatelli...I'm stopping there) in the first two rounds (which really should be high-hit probability rounds) and then it's really scraping the bottom of the barrell to consider any other pick a "success". Does he really think he's a great drafter?...is this based entirely on the "what have you done for me lately" rule...in which case yes the first three guys last year look good, but after that it was back to plain old awful....For the record, there is a long line of probowler misses he's had when picking a player at a specific need (OL, receiving, DL, etc) over another that turned out to be good.
  • avatar


    Most teams don't have the cap room this year or next year to sign him to a huge contract, so we should wait until after the draft to make sure he's healthy. The only way I would trade for him and sign him is with set conditions. Jets get mid round picks this year regardless if he's healthy, but get conditional picks next year provided he makes the Pro Bowl or All-Pro, plus signs an extension with the Bucs before the 2014 Draft. I'd then tell Revis either he plays out his current contract and tests Free Agency or signs an extension with guaranteed bonuses and escalators based on performance. Say he makes the Pro Bowl or All-Pro in 2013, then his contract is guaranteed to get him to the $15-16million/yr. If he doesn't, then he makes above average CB money.
  • avatar

    This deal will get done and I would almost wait till the day of the draft find a trade partner to trade back and pick up some more picks then give the Jets the 1st round pick but I would only give a 1st and the extra 4th to do it.
  • avatar


    Revis will be 28 before we play our next game and we still have no clue as to what level he will be able to it at. Here's a deal I might offer the Jets? Our No.1's in 2013 and 2014 for Revis and their No. 2's in 2013 and 2014. It is not the end of the world if we do not pick up Revis. There is no way that he could play as a shut down corner with our poor pass rush defense. Think about that? The pass rush will resolve many defensive issues. I would keep my draft choices and select a DE, DT, CB in the first three rounds. We can pick up some older Free Agents that have a year left in their tank while the younger players learn from them and get some more playing experiences. Our year is 2014, not 2013. Go Bucs!
  • avatar


    Totally with you Horse on the pass rush problem that has been created....Revis Island could get flooded!
  • avatar


    We have no pass rush because top QBs can get passes of in 2 sec to wide open receivers.
  • avatar


    No sense bidding against ourselves. I don't think there's any other team out there who can do this, or wants to do this. We have time on our side, let's see how Revis recovers, let's see how the draft un folds. We can trade for Revis up until the trade dead line, by giving up 2014 picks. He's a vet, who can step in and play whenever we get him, so let the Jets sit, and stu.
  • avatar

    The assumption is that the free agent market is dried up. Lets be honest there weren't any shut down cornerbacks out there. Sean Smith was tall but was inconsistent and wouldn't just have a bad play he would have bad games. There were quality guys out there, but they have the same amount of skills as Eric Wight. I'm sure that the Bucs will make Wright take a pay cut to stay with the team. The only one that was really worth much was that guy Lewis who signed with the Saints and he took less money to do so, because that's his home town. There are still quality players out there in free agency still, and I'm pretty sure that Dom isn't stupid enough to sell out the draft over one player. I see Dom signing a player to cover his tail just in case the Revis thing doesn't workout.
  • avatar


    The fact is that the Jets can't afford to re-do Darelle Revis contract. Their cap situration was totally screwed up by their previous GM Tannenbaum. They will eventually need to move him. Is it a slam dunk that the Bucs get him? No. But the time will come (Dom and Idzik both know this) when the Jets will have to make a deal.
  • avatar


    Yes, the Jets are in the pressure position. 2nd or 3rd rounder this year and a 1st next year is the highest I'd go on this deal given the question marks and the salary. Even that might be too much. We need our 13th pick.
  • avatar


    Time to move on and get some starting CB. Wait. there aren't any quality CB left in Free Agency because the Bucs have been sitting and waiting on Revis. FML
  • avatar


    I really don't want to give up a 1st round pick at all. All I know is Revis better be healthy. He tore that ACL without any contact...that concerns me a little.
  • avatar


    Me too - we have quite a few knees to be worried about already this year....
  • avatar


    I feel like a lot of you are against the idea of revis on the team just for arguments sake! Ok he is coming off an ACL injury I understand that but if he comes back as 80% the player he was then that is a steal for giving only a 1st rounder for. I hate to burst bubbles but we're not getting the best player ever with the #13 pick. Think about it this way, just to get the best corner in this draft(dee milliner) we would have to move up and give up even more picks! A shutdown cornerback that can take up half the field by himself is tough to find so lets jump on it while we can and move on from all this talk and start getting prepared for what I see as a very successful season!!
  • avatar


    You dont know who is gonna be the best player ever. Revis wasnt drafted until 14th. What if we trade for him and he never fully recovers from his injury. Is he worth it then? A 80% revis is not worth the 13th pick plus 15 mil a year.
  • avatar


    Giving up a 1st rounder is about more than the difference between Revis and Milliner's play - it's about $13m per year!!!! and all the other players we could get with that money...or will have to let go in a year or two.
  • avatar


    We got Sapp with a 13 th and Brooks with a 20 something.
  • avatar


    Setting aside the ACL issue which obviously needs to be thoroughly assessed and a new contract that would need to be agreed upon. Arguably the best CB in the league is certainly worth a 1st round choice when one considers the mediocrity that many players drafted in the 1st round bring to their team. Our own Buccaneer history is filled with 1st round choices who proved to be unworthy of their draft position. I want to compensate the Jets as little as possible; but who would you feel more certain about; a proven Revis or any of the players available at # 13? Will any of them be the best player at their position in 2013?
  • avatar


    SCUBOG- The reality of the situation cannot be set aside. Revis has an ACL issue. We are not playing hypothetical here. The RISK is the ACL and what will be the short-term and long- term effects, this is unknown until it plays out and for that reason alone he is not worth a #1 pick IMO.
  • avatar


    Revis is not worth our #1 in any year. Let the Jets keep him and see what they get next year for him. Next year he will want 20 Mil and who is to say he is the same player. But IMO Dominik is going to give in because he waited to long and all the other CB's are gone. You can tell as he is telling everyone how great Revis is.
  • avatar


    You think a 32 yr old Anquan Bolden is worth more than a 6th rd pick. He won't get close to 1000 yds next year. You thinking he is the same player now then what he was 5 yrs ago is what's the problem with most of you on here. So the 49ers "stole" him with a 6th. Something is only worth what someone else is willing to pay. Hence... AB was worth a 6th rd pick. Not more because you think he was. That's called speculation and that's not worth anything.
  • avatar


    Has Dominik ever made a trade or signed a free agent that you felt we just stolen someone. Like the 49ers getting WR A. Bolden for a 6th rd pick.
  • avatar


    Ry893, I completely agree with your comments. No #1 pick for Revis. Not to mention, Revis is notorious for asking for more money almost every year. The guy is very talented, but he needs to realize he is blessed with what he makes for playing football.
  • avatar

    I think the only way I would want to see them make this deal happen is if they don't have to give up the 1st round pick of this years or next years. We still have other areas to fix on our defense and do still need a TE and RT too. Revis is great but he is really expensive and coming off an ACL injury so it's hard to tell if he will come back the same player he was before the injury. I just hope they don't give in and give the Jets our 1st round pick, they want to unload him cause we know he won't be back with the Jets next year but they need to drop the prices on him.
  • avatar


    Agreed, my friend!!!
  • avatar


    One of the problems we have is that Dom doesn't care about next year at all - draft picks next year mean nothing to him, because he is in his last year of his contract...he knows he needs to make the playoffs this year at a minimum or he's done....and if he makes the playoffs he probably gets a new 5 year deal, so the draft picks next year at not a premium for him....but they are for us fans!
  • avatar

    Get this *censored* done DOM
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