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I'm not cherry picking anything. People talk about how elite QB's overcome our shortcomings all the time, mentioning Manning quite often. They forget that he was a mess his first couple of years, turning the ball over at a staggering rate.

Yes, you are.  Manning made *massive* improvements between years 1 and 2, and lumping them together obscures that fact.  He was a legit pro-bowler in 1999.

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