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    • BucsBits

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      Post count: 2038

      From Gallup

      “WASHINGTON, D.C. — Republicans are less likely now than they were in the past to say they are confident in the accuracy of important medical advice their doctor gives them. Currently, 60% of Republicans and Republican-leaning independents are confident, down from 73% in 2010 and 70% in 2002. Meanwhile, more Democrats and Democratic leaners are confident now (71%) than were in the past, especially compared with the 62% measured in 2002.

      As a result, Democrats’ confidence exceeds Republican confidence for the first time in Gallup’s trend, though majorities of both groups remain confident.”

      NOT

      COINCIDENCE

      NOT A CHANGE IN MEDICINE, A CHANGE IN INFORMATION SOURCES

      and a desperate Trump GOP mainlining anti-vaxx stuff for political gain

    • BucsBits

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      Post count: 2038

      If you doubt is the result of information sources, then . .

      “A separate question in the survey, which asks Americans whether they have more — or less — trust and confidence in their doctor than they had a year ago, also suggests an erosion in trust among Republicans. More Republicans and Republican leaners say their trust in their doctor has declined in the past year than say it has increased, 22% to 13%”

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Or this, which we can call the “Joe Rogan Effect”

      “As fewer Republicans than in the past say they are confident in the accuracy of their doctor’s advice, more now say they “usually feel it is necessary to check for second opinions or do [their] own research on the subject.” Thirty-nine percent of Republicans and Republican-leaners hold this view compared with 26% in 2010 and 29% in 2002.”

      “their own research on the subject” leading to beliefs like a THERAPY is a replacement for vaccine

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Get a grip Verge.

      We live in a country where just last year you would be banned from twitter for implying that Covid may have originated in a Wuhan lab and you actually wonder at stuff like this? Right or wrong, people don’t trust the media and they don’t trust what their being told and that might have something to do with the fact that the shit they’re being told is turning out to be wrong at an alarming rate. There are countless examples one that comes to mind is the one that turned me against Fauci when he said that masks don’t work and then later said that he only said that because he was afraid there would be a run on masks and first responders wouldn’t have any. I know you don’t get it but that is just plain wrong on many levels and is one of the root causes of mistrust.

      Take some ownership. How about lets not demand that everything we disagree with it censored at the drop of the hat only to find out that we were wrong anyway…. how bout that for a start verge?

      And your answer? It seems to be that everything would be just great if not for Trump or Joe Rogan? It’s complete nonsense. As long as we have one side that says the answer to a covid spike is to force people out of work and mandate putting things into people’s bodies who don’t want it, you’re going to have dissent.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Get a grip

      what’s the other explanation, Java?

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      more now say they “usually feel it is necessary to check for second opinions or do [their] own research on the subject.”

      How dare those morons get second opinions and research.

      Elitist, condescending asshole.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      people don’t trust the media and they don’t trust what their being told

      I guess maybe you’re admitting I am right, just saying its justified?

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      more now say they “usually feel it is necessary to check for second opinions or do [their] own research on the subject.”

      How dare those morons get second opinions and research.

      Elitist, condescending asshole.

      The usual deflection followed by name calling

      YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY . . .awn

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      s fewer Republicans than in the past say they are confident in the accuracy of their doctor’s advice, more now say they “usually feel it is necessary to check for second opinions or do [their] own research on the subject.” T

      Keeping in mind “bookkeeper”

      highlighted the key . . small . . words for you Buggsy

      No one is saying DONT get a second opinion or don’t research . . GALLUP is saying FEWER of you now trust your doctors and MORE of you NOW get second opinion and do your own research

      FEWER

      MORE

      C-A-T spells CAT

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      one that turned me against Fauci

      yesterday:

      “Dr.” Sebastian Gorka (he’s not a medical doctor, but plays one on Twitter), tweeted a clip of Anthony Fauci on CNN, claiming, “Fauci finally admits it, it’s masks FOREVER!” Like a high percentage of Gorka’s claims, this one was bunk, too. (Fauci actually said, “One of the things that’s very clear is that if you have to be in an indoor congregate setting in which you’re unsure of what the vaccination status is of the people around you, wear a mask.” )

      weird

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      FEWER

      MORE

      Fewer people are sheeple.

      More people are taking a more active role in their health.

      Both of those are good things, you elitist, condescending asshole.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      More REPUBLICANS are taking a more active role in their health THIS YEAR . . reversing a decades long trend . . because they suddenly trust their doctors LESS . . . this year

      edits for accuracy

      Maybe by “elitist” and “asshole” you mean . . honest? LOL

    • Biggs3535

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      Post count: 7236

      Maybe by “elitist” and “asshole” you mean . . honest? LOL

      In the alternate reality you reside in, that’s certainly possible. Given your clinical lack of self-awareness, I can see how you would come to that conclusion in your alternate reality.

      However, in actual reality, you’re very clearly an elitist, condescending asshole.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Maybe by “elitist” and “asshole” you mean . . honest? LOL

      In the alternate reality you reside in, that’s certainly possible. Given your clinical lack of self-awareness, I can see how you would come to that conclusion in your alternate reality.

      However, in actual reality, you’re very clearly an elitist, condescending asshole.

      But an honest one.

      “your/youre”

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      Wondering if Democrats were so confident with the current medical advice when they were told masks would not help, then they would, then they wouldn’t, then they needed 2. Or that we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President. Or perhaps the medical advice we got that we got this thing licked, but then we haven’t and it’s back to masks and possible lockdown.

      I mean it’s not like the advice we are getting today might be obsolete or change by next week or anything is it? That would never breed some degree of sceptism at all. Good job Democrats are “sophisticated” and they can obviously differentiate between the real advice and not real advice.

    • BucsBits

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      Post count: 2038

      Exactly the point right here:

      Wondering if Democrats were so confident with the current medical advice when they were told masks would not help, then they would, then they wouldn’t, then they needed 2. Or that we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President. Or perhaps the medical advice we got that we got this thing licked, but then we haven’t and it’s back to masks and possible lockdown.

      You have to be a loon or in a cocoon to type stuff like that

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      Wondering if Democrats were so confident with the current medical advice when they were told masks would not help, then they would, then they wouldn’t, then they needed 2. Or that we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President. Or perhaps the medical advice we got that we got this thing licked, but then we haven’t and it’s back to masks and possible lockdown.

      I mean it’s not like the advice we are getting today might be obsolete or change by next week or anything is it? That would never breed some degree of sceptism at all. Good job Democrats are “sophisticated” and they can obviously differentiate between the real advice and not real advice.

      Why do you hate science?

    • Kermit56

      Participant
      Post count: 588

      You have to be a loon or in a cocoon to type stuff like that

      Nothing he posted is untrue.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You have to be a loon or in a cocoon to type stuff like that

      Nothing he posted is untrue.

      It is actually and that is the POINT . . the information sources you guys rely on have been leading you astray and that is why so many of you are dying

      So lets give you all collectively a chance to PUT UP OR SHUT UP. The official source of the government during the pandemic is Fauci and the CDC, but lets see you post a link to ANY CREDIBLE NEWS SOURCE to support this claim:

      we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President.

      Its actually MULTIPLE claims so here you go to make it easy. Post the credible link for any or all @Kermit56 @Spartan @Biggs3535 @Runole @IslandBuc:

      1. we would never get a vaccine

      2. but then we would (this should be easy)

      3. but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump

      4. it’s good because Trump is no longer the President

      I am sure that total BS multiple part claim is all over THE COCOON, so show me the FIRST person government statement that backs up any of those 4 things?

      It should be easy if its true, especially because OBVIOUSLY the science evolved over the two years a POINT SPARTAN HIMSELF CONCEDES by phrasing it as he did . . . SO BING IT HERE TO THE COVE . .. show us all the government (CDC/Fauci) saying those things AND I WILL ADDRESS ANY RESPONSE DIRECTLY

      LOOK FORWARD TO THE RESPONSES.

      THERES 5 OF YOU, SO PUT YOUR HEADS TOGETHER lol

    • Kermit56

      Participant
      Post count: 588

      You know, I would take the time to do this if I thought it would change anything about your condescending, know-it-all posts. But it won’t so I won’t.

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      You know, I would take the time to do this if I thought it would change anything about your condescending, know-it-all posts. But it won’t so I won’t.

      The only way to win is not to play.

      He’s only good for mocking. There is no honest discussion/debate to be had.

    • Kermit56

      Participant
      Post count: 588

      Exactly the point right here:

      Wondering if Democrats were so confident with the current medical advice when they were told masks would not help, then they would, then they wouldn’t, then they needed 2. Or that we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President. Or perhaps the medical advice we got that we got this thing licked, but then we haven’t and it’s back to masks and possible lockdown.

      You have to be a loon or in a cocoon to type stuff like that

      If you aren’t aware of what is posted it is you who are in a cocoon. You should read more than the NY Times, WaPO, and HuffPo.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You know, I would take the time to do this if I thought it would change anything about your condescending, know-it-all posts. But it won’t so I won’t.

      No you wouldn’t . . BECAUSE YOU CANT

      That you would try to cover up for that only say that much more about cocoon denizens . . . you all got NOTHING

      as I posted here many times, you all seem to want to live the lie. . . so anytime you’re asked to back it up . . . you run BECAUSE YOU CANNOT

      This is another one of those instances just like “during the campaign, dem candidates wanted to kill babies” . . didn’t quite ring true



      @Kermit56
      . . . thanks for proving me right . . again

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You know, I would take the time to do this if I thought it would change anything about your condescending, know-it-all posts. But it won’t so I won’t.

      This post should be a sticky. LMAO

      But its a close tie for idiocy with the discussion going on about “dem candidates . . espousing”

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You know, I would take the time to do this if I thought it would change anything about your condescending, know-it-all posts. But it won’t so I won’t.

      This post should be a sticky. LMAO

      But its a close tie for idiocy with the discussion going on about “dem candidates . . espousing”



      @Kermit56

      hilarious

      during the election campaign, the dem candidates were espousing abortion should be legal all the way up to 9 months, including killing a baby who survived abortion.

      During the campaign (you even gave it a time frame)

      “the dem candidates” ( you identified a specific group of actors)

      “were espousing” ( a verb)

      You subsequently admitted that during the campaign NO dem candidates espoused that position . . it was a VOTE . . when was that vote?

      (never mind)

      ROFLMAO

      I mean, how pathetic that not only can you not admit you were wrong, but you actually claimed that others twisted your own typed words

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You have to be a loon or in a cocoon to type stuff like that

      Nothing he posted is untrue.

      It is actually and that is the POINT . . the information sources you guys rely on have been leading you astray and that is why so many of you are dying

      So lets give you all collectively a chance to PUT UP OR SHUT UP. The official source of the government during the pandemic is Fauci and the CDC, but lets see you post a link to ANY CREDIBLE NEWS SOURCE to support this claim:

      we would never get a vaccine, but then we would, but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump or now it’s good because Trump is no longer the President.

      Its actually MULTIPLE claims so here you go to make it easy. Post the credible link for any or all @Kermit56 @Spartan @Biggs3535 @Runole @IslandBuc:

      1. we would never get a vaccine

      2. but then we would (this should be easy)

      3. but it’s shit because it was delivered by Trump

      4. it’s good because Trump is no longer the President

      I am sure that total BS multiple part claim is all over THE COCOON, so show me the FIRST person government statement that backs up any of those 4 things?

      It should be easy if its true, especially because OBVIOUSLY the science evolved over the two years a POINT SPARTAN HIMSELF CONCEDES by phrasing it as he did . . . SO BING IT HERE TO THE COVE . .. show us all the government (CDC/Fauci) saying those things AND I WILL ADDRESS ANY RESPONSE DIRECTLY

      LOOK FORWARD TO THE RESPONSES.

      THERES 5 OF YOU, SO PUT YOUR HEADS TOGETHER lol

      Just so Kermit can can get some back-up . . . if it exists LOL

      Come on @Spartan . . and the rest

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @Kermit56 . . thanks buddy for erasing ANY doubt about the Cocoon. This thread and the ‘espousing” abortion one . . HILARIOUS

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      one that turned me against Fauci

      yesterday:

      “Dr.” Sebastian Gorka (he’s not a medical doctor, but plays one on Twitter), tweeted a clip of Anthony Fauci on CNN, claiming, “Fauci finally admits it, it’s masks FOREVER!” Like a high percentage of Gorka’s claims, this one was bunk, too. (Fauci actually said, “One of the things that’s very clear is that if you have to be in an indoor congregate setting in which you’re unsure of what the vaccination status is of the people around you, wear a mask.” )

      weird

      LOL not what I was referring to, nor does it reflect any opinion that I have regarding the orange man or that doctor you just mentioned who I’ve barely even heard of. You’re a real nut.

      From Business insider in June of 2020

      Dr. Anthony Fauci said Friday the reason the public was advised not to wear masks at the beginning of the coronavirus pandemic was that there were too few to go around.

      In an interview with the financial-news site TheStreet, Fauci, the US government’s foremost infectious-diseases expert, was asked about the changing government advice on wearing masks.

      In January through March, as the spread of the disease became more and more serious, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention actively discouraged the use of masks among the general public.

      By early April, simple cloth face coverings were recommended for the general public, instead of protective personal equipment such as surgical and N95 masks, The New York Times reported.

      I already mentioned that I know you don’t get it but this is a HUGE deal to a person like me who believes the Government is beholden to it’s citizens to be truthful about life and death situations. People like me are already skeptical of the government and situations like this are proof that you just can’t trust them. If you’re like me, for the individual first then these type of decisions that place the collective above the individual are already bad but when you take it to outright manipulation of the public. I mean the government was saying you don’t need something that they knew would help. How many people died who might have otherwise worn a mask but didn’t because the benevolent government told them not to worry about it?

      You can’t mock people for not listening when shit like this is in the record. If you are concerned about your kids, your wife, yourself, then how can you only get your information from an entity that you know doesn’t care about you the individual person who wants to protect yourself but cares only about the big picture.

      I don’t know if that will help you “get it” but I’m trying.

    • Donkey_Hunter

      Participant
      Post count: 2904

      I already mentioned that I know you don’t get it but this is a HUGE deal to a person like me who believes the Government is beholden to it’s citizens to be truthful about life and death situations

      What led you to getting the vaccine?

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @JBear — if this was actually true

      a HUGE deal to a person like me who believes the Government is beholden to it’s citizens to be truthful about life and death situations

      then where is your outrage over this:

      “You know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April.” – Trump in February 2020

      “China is working very, very hard. I have spoken to President Xi, and they’re working very hard. And if you know anything about him, I think he’ll be in pretty good shape. They’re — they’ve had a rough patch, and I think right now they have it — it looks like they’re getting it under control more and more. They’re getting it more and more under control. So I think that’s a problem that’s going to go away.” also February 2020

      “when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.”

      I don’t think people are panicking. I said last night — we did an interview on Fox last night, a town hall. I think it was very good. And I said, ‘Calm. You have to be calm.’ It’ll go away.

      “President Donald Trump stood on a White House balcony on October 10 and made a grand declaration about the coronavirus: “It’s going to disappear. It is disappearing.”

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      I just remembered you mocking Rand Paul who was the guy who first brought up the FACT that the CDC when they finally did say maybe you should wear masks said that a simple cloth mask was fine when they knew that a cloth mask did almost nothing to prevent anything.

      Rand Paul quoted the statistics of how little cloth masks did to stop the spread of covid 19 and you laughed about it because by that time they were no longer recommending cloth masks. I clearly haven’t been successful in making you see why this is important which hurts a little. It was important because of why the CDC was telling people that it was OK to wear a cloth mask….. because they didn’t want them to try to get a real one because they were afraid of a shortage.

      Your hypocrisy has been mind boggling over the last several years but what makes it worse is that you compound it with threads like this. You clearly haven’t learned anything. If the last few years have taught us anything it’s that we should do our own research instead of just relying on whatever the CDC says.

      And I’m not even one of the extremists who you try to paint everyone as. I know that the CDC is giving us some good information. The thing is that you have to look at it through a lens and do your own DD to come up with whatever works best for you as an individual. For some people what works best for them is to be a lemming. Some not so much. In my case I believe a lot of what the CDC says. I believe in the vaccine and the boosters in that they will hopefully make it less likely that I will die from covid so I go along but I take what they’re saying with a grain of salt and look for other information when possible. I think that’s called trying to be objective.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @JBear — if this was actually true

      a HUGE deal to a person like me who believes the Government is beholden to it’s citizens to be truthful about life and death situations

      then where is your outrage over this:

      “You know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April.” – Trump in February 2020

      “China is working very, very hard. I have spoken to President Xi, and they’re working very hard. And if you know anything about him, I think he’ll be in pretty good shape. They’re — they’ve had a rough patch, and I think right now they have it — it looks like they’re getting it under control more and more. They’re getting it more and more under control. So I think that’s a problem that’s going to go away.” also February 2020

      “when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.”

      I don’t think people are panicking. I said last night — we did an interview on Fox last night, a town hall. I think it was very good. And I said, ‘Calm. You have to be calm.’ It’ll go away.

      “President Donald Trump stood on a White House balcony on October 10 and made a grand declaration about the coronavirus: “It’s going to disappear. It is disappearing.”

      I mention those quotes BECAUSE

      The Fauci thing is March 8th and by April 3rd 2020 the CDC announced that all should wear masks

      so I call total BULLSHIT an anti-mask and anti-vaccine Trumpers now claiming Fauci when Trump lied to them and everyone lese all the way into the fall . . . INCLUDING CONCEALING HIS OWN VACCINATION

      come on man, that’s bullshit

      By the way, this is the March 8th conversation with Fauci (just so the record is clear)

      LaPook, March 8: There’s a lot of confusion among people, and misinformation, surrounding face masks. Can you discuss that?

      Fauci: The masks are important for someone who’s infected to prevent them from infecting someone else… Right now in the United States, people should not be walking around with masks.

      LaPook: You’re sure of it? Because people are listening really closely to this.

      Fauci: …There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you’re in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is. And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face.

      LaPook: And can you get some schmutz, sort of staying inside there?

      Fauci: Of course, of course. But, when you think masks, you should think of health care providers needing them and people who are ill. The people who, when you look at the films of foreign countries and you see 85% of the people wearing masks — that’s fine, that’s fine. I’m not against it. If you want to do it, that’s fine.

      LaPook: But it can lead to a shortage of masks?

      Fauci: Exactly, that’s the point. It could lead to a shortage of masks for the people who really need it.

      That was reverses by April 3rd

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Rand Paul

      the cocoon

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      then where is your outrage over this:

      “You know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April.” – Trump in February 2020

      “China is working very, very hard. I have spoken to President Xi, and they’re working very hard. And if you know anything about him, I think he’ll be in pretty good shape. They’re — they’ve had a rough patch, and I think right now they have it — it looks like they’re getting it under control more and more. They’re getting it more and more under control. So I think that’s a problem that’s going to go away.” also February 2020

      “when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.”

      I don’t think people are panicking. I said last night — we did an interview on Fox last night, a town hall. I think it was very good. And I said, ‘Calm. You have to be calm.’ It’ll go away.

      “President Donald Trump stood on a White House balcony on October 10 and made a grand declaration about the coronavirus: “It’s going to disappear. It is disappearing.”

      We are supposed to listen to the experts and Trump has no medical background whatsoever. In a way I do understand why you can’t let go of this stuff but the President and the head of the Government response to a pandemic have two completely different responsibilities. Nobody is looking to Joe Biden for medical advise and nobody should be looking at Trump for it. One thing you do look for in a President is someone to lead. Someone to calm fears and manage a government response and I know that you can certainly find plenty of problems with the Trump administration response but nobody thinks Trump is a scientist. Even his whacky followers know this.

      Also I never said any of this stuff was good.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @JBear — I am not saying you are doing this here, but the key TOOL of conspiracy theorists and hyper-political people .. LIKE THOSE TRUMPERS HAVING THIS DISCUSSION ABOUT FAUCI AND VACCINES IN THIS THREAD AND THE OTHER . .

      . . . is REVISING HISTORY, AFTER THE FACT

      That’s why the full context – on this specific topic, Fauci’s actual March 8th comment, the CDC April 3rd announcement, and all of Trumps lies into the fall — COMPLETELY OBLITERATES THE CLAIM

      By the way, not single person making the Fauci claim now here actually listened on March 8th to the Dr Jon Lapook show, right?

      So, every person making that claim is making it based on the REPACKAGED version . .,you attribute tour view to Rand Paul, as one example.

      That is the POINT.

      Its easy to lead people astray with disinformation because most don’t have the time or the inclination to FACT CHECK the people (like Rand Paul) they already trust

      The weird part, logically speaking, is people still sticking to the LIE after its been debunked. That’s weird from a logic perspective, but not from a human perspective.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      We are supposed to listen to the experts and Trump has no medical background whatsoever

      come on, man . . . no Trumper can actually post that ^^^^^^^ with a straight face

      I say that because saying that NOW . . after posting or supporting posts about HYDRO and horse pills and NEVER . . NEVER .. (did I say NEVER?) objecting to Trumps lies and IN MANY CASES (eg Runole, Buggsy, Spartan) . . PROMOTING THEM . or promoting the opinions offered by guys like Tucker Carlson

      That’s exactly the type of revisionist history I am talking about.

      HERE’s THE PROOF @JBear:

      IF YOU TAKE YOUR OWN CLAIM – “We are supposed to listen to the experts” – to its LOGICAL CONCLUSION:

      You did not wear a mask from March 8th to April 3rd, but then wore one every day after AND

      you were vaccinated as soon as the vaccine came out

      right?

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Rand Paul

      the cocoon

      That cocoon you speak of seems to be encompassing more and more of the people you disagree with which is really weird.

      Just as an exercise in objectivity lets expand on this a little. I’ve hear you refer to this cocoon in circumstances ranging from anything on Fox news to Alex Jones and more recently to any political figure with an R before their name except Liz Cheney and Mitt Romney. At one point I thought this cocoon was all about “extreme” right wing sources giving people biased information that ignored the truth as seen by people who instead listened to or watched CNN or PBS or MSNBC.

      But now, it looks like a cocoon can encompass even original opinions of actual people who aren’t just pulling shit off their twitter feed like all the good people. I’m not listening to Matt Gatz or that blonde woman you all hate I’m listening to a guy who pushes a distinctly narrow and nuanced view that is in no way reflective of any of the stuff you previously threw into your little cocoon definition.

      Rand’s view is a minority view in his own party and the motivations and the arguments he’s making are misconstrued by everyone because they don’t understand the core beliefs that are driving the whole thing. The views I’m expressing in this thread are completely different from the typical fox news viewer which is why we get people like Trump or Mitt Romney as the Republican nominee. Because there is little if any principal in the majority of voters.

      To say that your use of the term has become a bit hollow would be putting it mildly. You ought to be embarrassed that you are at this point saying that everyone you disagree with is the product of the cocoon. It’s lazy and it’s dishonest and worse it paints you as a partisan. The only person who could chalk seemingly close to half of all people into this little box of shame…. ignorance or whatever would be a person who has lost all bearing on objectivity.

      If you think I’m on you like a fly on shit because you’re against me you again have lost all bearings. I’m on you because you’re a radical nutcase who thinks he’s the sane person in the room. There are still reasonable democrats, you just aren’t one of them.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      That cocoon you speak of seems to be encompassing more

      Jbear

      in one post you said “we are supposed to trust the medical experts

      in another post you cited Rand Paul.. an ophthalmologist

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      That cocoon you speak of seems to be encompassing more

      Jbear

      in one post you said “we are supposed to trust the medical experts

      in another post you cited Rand Paul.. an ophthalmologist

      So you are actually arguing now . . that a single comment by Fauci ruined you of experts . . even though it was reversed less than a month later BY THE EXPERT of disease . . but then you still went with . an ophthalmologist . .

      I am saying that you cannot possibly believe that (you’re trolling) or yes you are a member of the cocoon too . . meaning you CREDIT what Paul has been selling you OVER actual experts

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You ought to be embarrassed that you are at this point saying that everyone you disagree with is the product of the cocoon. It’s lazy and it’s dishonest and worse it paints you as a partisan. The only person who could chalk seemingly close to half of all people into this little box of shame…. ignorance or whatever would be a person who has lost all bearing on objectivity.

      Like a guy who says Andy Ngo is as journalist, perhaps?

      Or, do you mean like a guy who says that a random Christian preacher was attacked by “antifa” in Portland and Proud Boys just happened to be there?

      By the way, I posted a complete SWORN UNDER OATH take down of your claims about white supremacists being “victims” of antifa . . YOU NEVER EVEN HAD THE BALLS TO ADDRESS IT, right?

      is that the kind of objectivity you mean?

      Like I said, I am content to chalk most of your BS up to trolling

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @Jbear .. your “expert” ophthalmologist is the kind of “performative artist” grifter Dan Crenshaw spoke about

      “YouTube has suspended Republican Sen. Rand Paul of Kentucky”

      he called this a “badge of honor”

      OR THIS ONE, called out by his own paper:

      “There’s no evidence people are immune from COVID-19 after they’re first infected, but U.S. Sen. Rand Paul says they are.

      The Kentucky Republican on Thursday night again advocated against COVID-19 experts’ advice when discussing people who have already had the potentially deadly disease.

      “We should tell them to celebrate,” Paul told Fox News. “We should tell them to throw away their masks, go to restaurants, live again — because these people are now immune.”

      (He made this claim because he got infected — and didn’t tell his colleagues)

      or this one, on the election

      “Paul has suggested — without proof — that there may have been major fraud problems with the absentee ballots registered voters throughout the country mailed in for the presidential election.

      there’s more but you get Crenshaw’s point

      :-)

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      I mention those quotes BECAUSE

      The Fauci thing is March 8th and by April 3rd 2020 the CDC announced that all should wear masks

      so I call total BULLSHIT an anti-mask and anti-vaccine Trumpers now claiming Fauci when Trump lied to them and everyone lese all the way into the fall . . . INCLUDING CONCEALING HIS OWN VACCINATION

      come on man, that’s bullshit

      You’re missing my point again. I’m not talking about a march 8th conversation I’m talking about a June 12th interview with Katherine Ross of The Street. I’m not trying to mock you but I feel like you just don’t understand my complaint. Here is the question and the quote. It’s still available on the interwebs by searching “Why weren’t we wearing masks from the beginning? Dr. Fauci explains”.

      Here is the pertinent quote:

      So, why weren’t we told to wear masks in the beginning?

      Well, the reason for that is that we were concerned the public health community, and many people were saying this, were concerned that it was at a time when personal protective equipment, including the N95 masks and the surgical masks, were in very short supply. And we wanted to make sure that the people namely, the health care workers, who were brave enough to put themselves in a harm way, to take care of people who you know were infected with the coronavirus and the danger of them getting infected.”

      This is Dr. Fauci’s own words. And it’s logically obvious that it’s true. It’s also obvious that people like you don’t care that he said that and that is probably a big part of the reason you still don’t understand my point. I do care because I’m more concerned with individuals rights than I am with some collective good. I bought cloth masks and wore them. I was duped as were many others. He admitted that he knew that he didn’t give the public the best advice. He knew and lied for the greater good.

      I know that for you it’s not much of a problem…. for me it’s a big problem. All I want from government is the truth as they see it using the best possible information. To someone like me the fact that the decision to recommend or not recommend the public to mask up with the proper mask was based on some communal decision about what’s best for the country.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      We are supposed to listen to the experts and Trump has no medical background whatsoever

      come on, man . . . no Trumper can actually post that ^^^^^^^ with a straight face

      I say that because saying that NOW . . after posting or supporting posts about HYDRO and horse pills and NEVER . . NEVER .. (did I say NEVER?) objecting to Trumps lies and IN MANY CASES (eg Runole, Buggsy, Spartan) . . PROMOTING THEM . or promoting the opinions offered by guys like Tucker Carlson

      That’s exactly the type of revisionist history I am talking about.

      HERE’s THE PROOF @JBear:

      IF YOU TAKE YOUR OWN CLAIM – “We are supposed to listen to the experts” – to its LOGICAL CONCLUSION:

      You did not wear a mask from March 8th to April 3rd, but then wore one every day after AND

      you were vaccinated as soon as the vaccine came out

      right?

      And this is just you trying successfully to again be a jerk.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Jbear

      in one post you said “we are supposed to trust the medical experts

      in another post you cited Rand Paul.. an ophthalmologist

      Jesus you are disingenuous. I’m citing Rand Paul from a congressional hearing about the Govenment’s response to Covid 19. Rand raised questions and complaints about the govenrment’s handling of the pandemic and one of those was the one I mention here.

      This is like saying that nobody can question the government’s response to covid because Fauci is a doctor? Rand being an ophthalmologist has almost no bearing on his ability to question King Fauci. I’m not saying that Rand is a medical expert I’m saying that the public has a right to question and criticize the actions taken by the government and whether they were the correct actions to take.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      I bought cloth masks and wore them. I was duped as were many others.

      Rand Paul

      lol

      All I want from government is the truth

      Hunter Biden’s laptop.

      Trump — the head of the government – lying nonstop



      @JBear
      — I am not DEFENDING Fauci’s MASK COMMENT . . I am saying its complete, dishonest bullshit to claim NOW that he is the reason for antivaccine, anti mask nonsense and the promotion of bullshit remedies — A POINT YOU MAKE YOURSELF BY ATTRIBUTING YOUR OWN BELIEFS TO RAND PAUL

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      This is like saying that nobody can question the government’s response to covid because Fauci is a doctor? Rand being an ophthalmologist has almost no bearing on his ability to question King Fauci. I’m not saying that Rand is a medical expert I’m saying that the public has a right to question and criticize the actions taken by the government and whether they were the correct actions to take.

      that’s (in bold) is a separate issue

      and yes you are crediting Paul AS AN INFECTIOUS DISEASE EXPERT .. you’re crediting his YouTube lie, specifically

      I bought cloth masks and wore them. I was duped as were many others

      THIS IS THE CDC:

      “Multi-layer cloth masks help reduce transmission of virus from an infected person, They block up to 50-70% of fine droplets and particles, and can slow those particles that were not captured. Cloth mask also reduce the wearers’ exposure to infectious droplets by filtering fine droplets and particles. Masks with high thread counts work best.

      While a cloth face mask won’t totally block the coronavirus, it’s an added layer of protection for you and the people around you. you should use it along with regular handwashing and social distancing measures like staying 6 feet away from others.”

      and by the way . . IT MAKES SENSE to protect health care workers first as they are needed to provide the care

      that’s BASIC . . very basic . . Public health

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      Jesus you are disingenuous.

      That piece of shit is disingenuous personified, but you should already know that.

      Honest question – why do you waste your time on the elitist, condescending asshole? The guy has no friends or life. He craves that attention you’re giving him. Do you like doing charity work for the mentally handicapped or something?

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      So you are actually arguing now . . that a single comment by Fauci ruined you of experts . . even though it was reversed less than a month later BY THE EXPERT of disease . . but then you still went with . an ophthalmologist . .

      I am saying that you cannot possibly believe that (you’re trolling) or yes you are a member of the cocoon too . . meaning you CREDIT what Paul has been selling you OVER actual experts

      It’s almost unbelievable that you are actually typing this shit out. Paul isn’t telling me anything except what Fauci actually said about his motivations for public advisories on mask wearing.

      You keep talking about Paul being an eye doctor as if it matters at all. Rand Paul is a member of congress inquiring about how and why decisions were made during the Pandemic.

      Regarding mask wearing Rand Paul was suspended from Youtube for a week for saying that cloth masks don’t work back in August. What he said has turned out to be mostly true. The fact is the N-95 masks are proven to be effective which is what he said in the video that got him censored.

      I can only imagine that you must be referring to this incident when mocking me about listening to Rand Paul and not Fauci. It’s just so disingenuous. One of the things brought up durring Fauci’s testimony was that Fauci knew that cloth masks weren’t effective against covid and yet he still waited to change CDC recommendations and later admitted that it was because he feared a run on masks. That’s exactly what I have a problem with…. that is exactly what Rand has a problem with. It isn’t about overruling Fauci’s recommendations it’s about asking why decisions were made and pointing out that the motivations were not necessarily to protect individuals but were to protect the communal we.

      For the tenth time, I understand that you and many others won’t care about this because it’s not a big deal to you since overall it was probably for the best. I’m not like you.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      By the way, I posted a complete SWORN UNDER OATH take down of your claims about white supremacists being “victims” of antifa . . YOU NEVER EVEN HAD THE BALLS TO ADDRESS IT, right?

      LOL you really take the cake. Just yesterday in San Diego 10 self proclaimed Antifa members were charged with assault after violently assaulting Trump supporters earlier this year.

      It wouldn’t even be worth mentioning except in a world where people like you deny the existence of violent left wing groups who espouse anti-fascism using the moral grounds of anti-racism. The same anti-racism that you claim is saving the country. lol

      I mean you’re ridiculous. Why would you even drag this in here? Just weak dude.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      @JBear — I am not DEFENDING Fauci’s MASK COMMENT . . I am saying its complete, dishonest bullshit to claim NOW that he is the reason for antivaccine, anti mask nonsense and the promotion of bullshit remedies — A POINT YOU MAKE YOURSELF BY ATTRIBUTING YOUR OWN BELIEFS TO RAND PAUL

      You’re comments are so funny. Once in a while when I dig deep enough I can on rare occasions find a sliver of honesty.

      Look, again you’re confusing me for some other posters…. or maybe people you know in real life? No idea. I don’t believe that this Fauci comment is the reason for antivaccine, anti mask or whacky covid remedies. One clue that might tip you off to that is that I’m not for any of those things. Hello reason!

      But yes I admit that there are a large number of people on both sides who just want to stick it to the other side. Down here in Florida I saw plenty of people who I’ve spoken with before and know their political slant, seem to flaunt the no mask, no vaccine thing. And it seemed to me to be purely political. Yet I also saw people who I know to be progressive Democrats who seemed to take mask wearing to a comical extreme and I think again because they were trying to show their political views.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You keep talking about Paul being an eye doctor as if it matters at all. Rand Paul is a member of congress inquiring about how and why decisions were made during the Pandemic.



      @JBear
      you credit Paul’s opinion on paper masks over the CDC, so saying he’s a member of Congress (as opposed to an optho)is worse lol. Marjorie Green is a member of Congress who says vaccines don’t work (she’s basically Runole and Buggsy)

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Look, again you’re confusing me for some other posters…. or maybe people you know in real life? No idea. I don’t believe that this Fauci comment is the reason for antivaccine, anti mask or whacky covid remedies. One clue that might tip you off to that is that I’m not for any of those things. Hello reason!

      You should read a little mor

      By the way, I posted a complete SWORN UNDER OATH take down of your claims about white supremacists being “victims” of antifa . . YOU NEVER EVEN HAD THE BALLS TO ADDRESS IT, right?

      LOL you really take the cake. Just yesterday in San Diego 10 self proclaimed Antifa members were charged with assault after violently assaulting Trump supporters earlier this year.

      It wouldn’t even be worth mentioning except in a world where people like you deny the existence of violent left wing groups who espouse anti-fascism using the moral grounds of anti-racism. The same anti-racism that you claim is saving the country. lol

      I mean you’re ridiculous. Why would you even drag this in here? Just weak dude.



      @JBear
      – did you post in the thread about the testimony from the Charlottesville trial … ya know, the thread that HAD YOUR SCREEN NAME IN THE TITLE?

      Haha

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Look, again you’re confusing me for some other posters…. or maybe people you know in real life? No idea. I don’t believe that this Fauci comment is the reason for antivaccine, anti mask or whacky covid remedies.

      My fault. I tried to make it clear I knew that right here below (where I added the bold now)

      I am not saying you are doing this here, but the key TOOL of conspiracy theorists and hyper-political people .. LIKE THOSE TRUMPERS HAVING THIS DISCUSSION ABOUT FAUCI AND VACCINES IN THIS THREAD AND THE OTHER . .

      . . . is REVISING HISTORY, AFTER THE FACT

      That’s why the full context – on this specific topic, Fauci’s actual March 8th comment, the CDC April 3rd announcement, and all of Trumps lies into the fall — COMPLETELY OBLITERATES THE CLAIM

      By the way, not single person making the Fauci claim now here actually listened on March 8th to the Dr Jon Lapook show, right?

      So, every person making that claim is making it based on the REPACKAGED version . .,you attribute tour view to Rand Paul, as one example.

      But muddied up that point with the last line ^^^^

      apologies

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      “Multi-layer cloth masks help reduce transmission of virus from an infected person, They block up to 50-70% of fine droplets and particles, and can slow those particles that were not captured. Cloth mask also reduce the wearers’ exposure to infectious droplets by filtering fine droplets and particles. Masks with high thread counts work best.

      While a cloth face mask won’t totally block the coronavirus, it’s an added layer of protection for you and the people around you. you should use it along with regular handwashing and social distancing measures like staying 6 feet away from others.”

      and by the way . . IT MAKES SENSE to protect health care workers first as they are needed to provide the care

      that’s BASIC . . very basic . . Public health

      I don’t think that anyone disputes that cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask. That fact coupled with the Fauci quote where he admits that they held off on changing guidance because of supply constraints and not because of science is damning.

      You can’t go on an airplane with a cloth mask, you can’t go out in public in much of Europe with a cloth mask. There are plenty of good news items about switching to a surgical mask even from twitter feed approved sources.

      And it may make sense but it’s lying to the public when you don’t tell the public the full truth about a disease that can kill you because of supply chain issues.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      But muddied up that point with the last line ^^^^

      apologies

      I know that I used to do this with you and Fire a lot. It’s easy to do in the heat of the moment.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      I don’t think that anyone disputes that cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask.

      so this ^^^ is intellectual dishonesty

      its trying to re-frame information from the CDC in way that comports with your own view

      RAND PAUL — WHO YOU CREDITED – said this to get banned off of YouTube

      ““Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.”

      HE DID NOT say “cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask”

      In fact . . .

      “YouTube removed from his channel an eight-minute Newsmax interview in which the senator said that “there’s no value” in wearing masks

      COME

      ON

      JBEAR

      DONT BE . .. BUGGSY or RUNOLE

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      But muddied up that point with the last line ^^^^

      apologies

      I know that I used to do this with you and Fire a lot. It’s easy to do in the heat of the moment.

      haha, well no heat – sincerely — all just joking around but easy to do with multiple topics etc

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      I don’t think that anyone disputes that cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask.

      so this ^^^ is intellectual dishonesty

      its trying to re-frame information from the CDC in way that comports with your own view

      RAND PAUL — WHO YOU CREDITED – said this to get banned off of YouTube

      ““Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.”

      HE DID NOT say “cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask”

      In fact . . .

      “YouTube removed from his channel an eight-minute Newsmax interview in which the senator said that “there’s no value” in wearing masks

      COME

      ON

      JBEAR

      DONT BE . .. BUGGSY or RUNOLE

      just so its clear

      I bought cloth masks and wore them. I was duped as were many others.

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/fact-check-coronavirus-vaccine-could-come-year-trump-says-experts-n1207411

      “Vaccine work is looking VERY promising, before end of year,” Trump tweeted on Thursday.

      Good numbers coming out of States that are opening. America is getting its life back! Vaccine work is looking VERY promising, before end of year. Likewise, other solutions!

      — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 14, 2020
      “I think we’re going to have a vaccine by the end of the year,” he told reporters later in the day.

      But experts say that the development, testing and production of a vaccine for the public is still at least 12 to 18 months off, and that anything less would be a medical miracle.

      Dr. Walter Orenstein, a professor at Emory University and the associate director of the Emory Vaccine Center, said a vaccine in less than a year would be “miracle.”

      http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/03/18/what-andrew-cuomo-kamala-harris-said-about-vaccine-skepticism/

      In September, Harris, then the Democratic Party’s vice-presidential candidate, hesitated when asked if she would take a vaccine that was approved before the election.

      “I will say that I would not trust Donald Trump,” Harris said, “and it would have to be a credible source of information that talks about the efficacy and the reliability of whatever he’s talking about. I will not take his word for it.”

      Cuomo went further, suggesting he mistrusted not just President Donald Trump, but also the Food and Drug Administration under Trump. Asked about his confidence in the FDA, Cuomo indicated he didn’t have much.

      “I’m not that confident,” Cuomo said, adding: “You’re going to say to the American people now, ‘Here’s a vaccine, it was new, it was done quickly, but trust this federal administration and their health administration that it’s safe? And we’re not 100 percent sure of the consequences.’ I think it’s going to be a very skeptical American public about taking the vaccine, and they should be.”

      http://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/12/21/biden-some-democrats-say-trump-administration-deserves-credit-for-vaccine-rollout/?sh=16a3dd9643f6

      Biden, Newsom and Durbin all said this week the Trump administration deserves credit for Operation Warp Speed, the monthslong federal effort to develop and distribute a Covid-19 vaccine.

      Earlier this year, both Biden and Durbin expressed doubt about vaccines developed under the Trump Administration because the president consistently clashed with the government’s own scientists about a timeline, creating concerns he was pressuring officials and pharmaceutical companies to rush the process.

      Newsom for his part has avoided criticizing Trump directly about the issue, but he created a task force with other western states to independently review a vaccine themselves before distribution.

      Other Democrats— including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-M.A.) and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D. N.Y.)—have also gotten the vaccine this week to show the public it’s safe and effective, but stopped short of praising Trump.

      So summarize, while Trump is President, vaccine bad, as soon as Biden wins election, vaccine good.

      Need any more evidence?

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      And on masks:

      http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/do-you-need-mask-science-hasn-t-changed-public-guidance-n1173006

      While the science behind whether masks can prevent a person from catching the coronavirus hasn’t changed (a mask does not help a healthy person avoid infection), public guidance may be shifting.

      Officially, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says that wearing a mask is unnecessary for healthy individuals, but Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said federal health officials are actively discussing changing that guidance.

      http://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/27/science/face-mask-guidelines-timeline.html

      On May 13, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said that Americans who are fully vaccinated against the coronavirus may stop wearing masks or maintaining social distance in most indoor and outdoor settings, regardless of size.

      Timeline

      “Seriously people — STOP BUYING MASKS!” the surgeon general at the time, Dr. Jerome M. Adams, wrote on Twitter in February 2020. “They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus

      On March 15 2020, the C.D.C. made no mention of masks when it recommended that gatherings in the United States — including weddings, festivals, parades, concerts, sporting events and conferences — be limited to 50 people.

      In April, officials reversed course, with the C.D.C. urging all Americans to wear a mask outside their homes

      JANUARY 2021

      President Biden imposes some masking rules
      President Biden in January used his executive authority to impose mask requirements where he could — including on federal property and in interstate travel.

      MARCH 2021
      In March, almost exactly a year since the pandemic first gripped Americans in fear, the C.D.C. said that people who had been fully vaccinated against the coronavirus could gather in small groups indoors without masks or social distancing.

      The C.D.C. announced on May 13 that people who are fully vaccinated can stop wearing masks or maintaining social distance in most indoor and outdoor settings.

      “The science is clear: If you are fully vaccinated, you are protected, and you can start doing the things that you stopped doing because of the pandemic,” the C.D.C. said in a statement.

      The rest we know. This shows the “science” is an evolving, changing element. So to say you unambiguously trust the “science” would point to naivete at best.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/fact-check-coronavirus-vaccine-could-come-year-trump-says-experts-n1207411

      “Vaccine work is looking VERY promising, before end of year,” Trump tweeted on Thursday.

      Good numbers coming out of States that are opening. America is getting its life back! Vaccine work is looking VERY promising, before end of year. Likewise, other solutions!

      — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 14, 2020
      “I think we’re going to have a vaccine by the end of the year,” he told reporters later in the day.

      But experts say that the development, testing and production of a vaccine for the public is still at least 12 to 18 months off, and that anything less would be a medical miracle.

      Dr. Walter Orenstein, a professor at Emory University and the associate director of the Emory Vaccine Center, said a vaccine in less than a year would be “miracle.”

      http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/03/18/what-andrew-cuomo-kamala-harris-said-about-vaccine-skepticism/

      In September, Harris, then the Democratic Party’s vice-presidential candidate, hesitated when asked if she would take a vaccine that was approved before the election.

      “I will say that I would not trust Donald Trump,” Harris said, “and it would have to be a credible source of information that talks about the efficacy and the reliability of whatever he’s talking about. I will not take his word for it.”

      Cuomo went further, suggesting he mistrusted not just President Donald Trump, but also the Food and Drug Administration under Trump. Asked about his confidence in the FDA, Cuomo indicated he didn’t have much.

      “I’m not that confident,” Cuomo said, adding: “You’re going to say to the American people now, ‘Here’s a vaccine, it was new, it was done quickly, but trust this federal administration and their health administration that it’s safe? And we’re not 100 percent sure of the consequences.’ I think it’s going to be a very skeptical American public about taking the vaccine, and they should be.”

      http://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/12/21/biden-some-democrats-say-trump-administration-deserves-credit-for-vaccine-rollout/?sh=16a3dd9643f6

      Biden, Newsom and Durbin all said this week the Trump administration deserves credit for Operation Warp Speed, the monthslong federal effort to develop and distribute a Covid-19 vaccine.

      Earlier this year, both Biden and Durbin expressed doubt about vaccines developed under the Trump Administration because the president consistently clashed with the government’s own scientists about a timeline, creating concerns he was pressuring officials and pharmaceutical companies to rush the process.

      Newsom for his part has avoided criticizing Trump directly about the issue, but he created a task force with other western states to independently review a vaccine themselves before distribution.

      Other Democrats— including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-M.A.) and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D. N.Y.)—have also gotten the vaccine this week to show the public it’s safe and effective, but stopped short of praising Trump.

      So summarize, while Trump is President, vaccine bad, as soon as Biden wins election, vaccine good.

      Need any more evidence?

      What is that supposed to be? The vaccine was developed in record time. People like you turned that into a reason not to take it?

      I see Trumps political opponent saying she wouldn’t trust Trump. I think Trump said she wasn’t American?

      Where the CDC?

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Officially, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says that wearing a mask is unnecessary for healthy individuals, but Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said federal health officials are actively discussing changing that guidance.

      This is the perfect example thanks for posting. Look at the date it’s March 2020

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @Spartan – this is the part of your post that will sink you. It’s EXACTLY the point I made earlier about people like you trying to find support for your own bad choices

      Seriously people — STOP BUYING MASKS!” the surgeon general at the time, Dr. Jerome M. Adams, wrote on Twitter in February 2020. “They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus

      More to follow

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      What is that supposed to be? The vaccine was developed in record time. People like you turned that into a reason not to take it?

      Yes, and it was in response to your “show me where the advice has changed”

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      This is the perfect example thanks for posting. Look at the date it’s March 2020

      Yes, and it was in response to your “show me where the advice has changed”

    • spartan

      Participant
      Post count: 1765

      @Spartan – this is the part of your post that will sink you. It’s EXACTLY the point I made earlier about people like you trying to find support for your own bad choices

      Obviously you don’t get the point of the posts.

      a desperate Trump GOP mainlining anti-vaxx stuff for political gain

      I demonstrated that the “science” and the Democrats changed their viewpoint as time and circumstance progressed. Frequently. So to point out that Republicans and “Trumpers” are all of a sudden dumb as rocks for ignoring the “science”, and Dems are smart as f*ck for following it is disengenuous as best. Both sides have used the “science” and winds of politics as they saw best favored them.

      Basically I call BS on your OP for that reason.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      the “science” and the Democrats changed their viewpoint as time and circumstance progressed. Frequently. So to point out that Republicans and “Trumpers” are all of a sudden dumb as rocks for ignoring the “science”, and Dems are smart as f*ck for following it is disengenuous as best.

      You call BS because you’re an idiot

      Have someone else read those words back to you. Wtf? You’re ACKNOWLEDGING the science changed so the advice changed BUT people like you did not. You used it as a totally contrived, bullshit reason to result.

      You’re fucking ADMITING the point and even worse trying to cloak it IN POLTICS …which is the root of the problem

      Spartan, your lot in life is of your own making. Mine too. Everyone’s. There’s no conspiracy working against you.

      Science is science. It evolves. Medicine evolves. Every year the flu vaccine is adjusted to account for modifications in variants. Cancer treatment today is not the cancer treatment of 4 decades ago.

      Most of your posts here (save the one about the FIRED Surgeon General are about political people, as if you’re trying to say “I am an anti-mask, anti-vaxx loon because the Democrats said bad things (about Trump)”

      That is literally insane… and the very point

    • Kermit56

      Participant
      Post count: 588

      You call BS because you’re an idiot

      Spartan, this is why I would not take the time. You did an excellent job of posting what he asked for and still…name calling, “you proved my point you just don’t realize it…”

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Obviously you don’t get the point of the posts

      I get that your post are NOT to back up your BS claims becasue this was the challenge (and you know it):

      show us all the government (CDC/Fauci)

      The closest you came to that is THIS

      ““Seriously people — STOP BUYING MASKS!” the surgeon general at the time, Dr. Jerome M. Adams, wrote on Twitter in February 2020. “They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus”

      BUT YOUR USE OF THAT IS HILARIOUS IN A THREAD ABOUT COCOON DISINFORMATION . . . because

      1. Trump’s guy, later “fired” by Biden
      2. Very early on . . immediately deleted and then explained by him (“before asymptomatic spread”)
      3. BUT THE BEST PART is you raising that DELETED tweet om December 2021

      Why is #3 the best part?

      BECAUSE ITS PROOF OF MY POINT:

      “But adding more kindle to the fire is an Instagram post portraying former U.S. Surgeon General Dr. Jerome Adams as against masks.

      “Seriously people- STOP BUYING MASKS!” Adams purportedly tweeted on Feb. 29, 2020.

      “They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can’t get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!”

      The Instagram user ragingpatrioticbabe, whose content ranges from COVID-19 skepticism to pro-Trump memes, positions Adams’ tweet as compelling evidence against mask-wearing, urging its audience to “NEVER FORGET this tweet from the US Surgeon General, which was deleted.”

      LLLLLMMMMMMMMAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOO

      INSTAGRAM

      “ragingpatrioticbabe” (is this your screen name on Instagram, Spartan?)

      “content ranges from COVID-19 skepticism to pro-Trump memes”

      ” urging its audience to “NEVER FORGET this tweet . . . which was deleted.”



      @Spartan
      THANK YOU. Thank you for being so predictable. Thank you for putting an “!” on the very point I was making.

      Wow.

      AND YOU WENT EVEN FURTHER WITH THIS:

      I demonstrated that the “science” and the Democrats changed their viewpoint as time and circumstance progressed.

      Congrats, you demonstrated RATIONAL and undisputed human that you yourself (weirdly) label as only from ONE SIDE of the country.

      The post is about the BS claims of YOUR SIDE though, which makes this ironic

      Obviously you don’t get the point of the posts

      LOOK, Spartan I said that there’s no way to CREDIBLY CLAIM that the collective BS stance on CV19 of all you Trumpers – from Runole and Buggsy’s early BS about the flu, to Island Bucs posting every alternate remedy, to you just a week of so ago amplifying Tucker Carlson — is the result of the official position of the US government’s medical team. Its not. It is the result of the TRUTH that you all have exactly what Dan Crenshaw just said about the “Trump Caucus,”

      “they tell lie after lie after lie because they know something psychologically about the conservative heart. We’re worried about what people are going to do to us, what they’re going to infringe on us.”

      That fear — which manifests itself here at many different doses – is precisely the BIAS that is used against all of you.

      Find me ONE . . . just one . . ONE hardcore Trumper here who is NOT a conspiracy theorist? who does not ALMOST ROUTINELY quote someone like Tucker Carlson or even Trump (as truth)? All of you are pawns. Many of you it seems (based on Red State CV19 statistics) don’t care or are too embarrassed to admit it now? who knows

      At least . . at least .. you, Spartan, have a personal moral/religious underpinning to your stance one one issue, VACCINES, and that is something I think most people can respect even if they disagree. That is NOT the case with every other Trumper here. And it IS the case that all of you have been conned, at some level, and you are all part of the CV19 problem as a result

      That’s why Runole is creating threads likening me to Smollett (lmao). The truth hurts .. but it is still the truth. That’s why Runole has gone from from claiming CV19 was “like the flu” to now “the vaccine does not work.” He’s wrong, he knows he’s been wrong, but (psychologically) no turning back now

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      You call BS because you’re an idiot

      Spartan, this is why I would not take the time. You did an excellent job of posting what he asked for and still…name calling, “you proved my point you just don’t realize it…”

      you would n take the time because youre part of the problem

      A couple weeks back you created that thread about DeSantis “trolling”

      That is exactly the point about you Trumpers. You’re all “aggrieved” by the world so you want someone to “troll” the people you disagree with (“owning the libs”)

      WHEN YOU HAVE THAT MINDSET you elect absolutely insane people like Trump . . who contribute to the 800K deaths because they cant be “owned by the libs” (ie ADMIT THEY WERE WRONG ABOUT THE VURUS)

      Kermit, in two of these threads you have basically lied/squirmed rather than just admit you got something wrong. That is the Trumpian mindset that has the country currently going over a cliff.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      That is exactly the point about you Trumpers. You’re all “aggrieved” by the world so you want someone to “troll” the people you disagree with (“owning the libs”)

      right from the news TODAY, proving this point:

      Trump Jr responding to news that HRC has a “master class” session (as do many many many famous people from al walks of life)

      “I would say that the only masterclass Hillary Clinton is qualified to teach is one on how to never become President of the United States, but she’s probably qualified to teach one on how Epstein totally “killed himself” too”

      LMAO

      Its NOT coincidence that he a) personally insults her and b0 then offers a conspiracy theory.

      HE KNOWS HIS TARGET MARKET

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      That piece of shit is disingenuous personified, but you should already know that.

      Honest question – why do you waste your time on the elitist, condescending asshole? The guy has no friends or life. He craves that attention you’re giving him. Do you like doing charity work for the mentally handicapped or something?

      Good one. It most likely is due to my undeniable altruistic streak. Some people think to care about humanity you have to always look at the bigger picture but without people like me, people like Verge would be doomed to living out their lives in ignorance. because I feel bad for this poor dumb guy. Shameless individualism at it’s worst. ;)

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      I don’t think that anyone disputes that cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask.

      so this ^^^ is intellectual dishonesty

      its trying to re-frame information from the CDC in way that comports with your own view

      RAND PAUL — WHO YOU CREDITED – said this to get banned off of YouTube

      ““Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.”

      HE DID NOT say “cloth masks are much less effective than a surgical mask”

      In fact . . .

      “YouTube removed from his channel an eight-minute Newsmax interview in which the senator said that “there’s no value” in wearing masks

      COME

      ON

      JBEAR

      DONT BE . .. BUGGSY or RUNOLE

      I watched the video and it’s clear that Rand was talking about cloth masks when he made that comment.

      I’ll give you half a point and admit that I think it’s more than likely that there may be some small benefit to wearing a cloth mask as opposed to no mask. But that doesn’t change the fact that Fauci knew that perfectly well when he didn’t recommend masks and then said ok wear a cloth mask. He knew that because it’s basic stuff even an ophthamologist would learn at med school. Surgical masks are designed to stop much smaller particles than a cloth mask could.

      The idea that he didn’t know that when he pulled the whole don’t wear masks do wear masks…. well you already said you don’t defend the comments. To me it’s a big deal, to you not so much. I get it.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Right from Today’s news

      “JUST NOW: Ron Johnson, on a Wisconsin tele-town hall, pushes mouthwash as a COVID treatment.

      “By the way, standard gargle, mouthwash, has been proven to kill the coronavirus. If you get it, you may reduce viral replication. Why not try all these things?”

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      hat I think it’s more than likely that there may be some small benefit to wearing a cloth mask as opposed to no mask

      I posted the CDC position.

      The point I was making is that you CREDIT Rand Paul’s opinion over the CDC. Rand Paul is arguably no More qualified that you BUT EVEN WORSE . . has a POLITICAL MOTIVW TO SAY WHAT HE DOES

      Its the political motive that none of you seem to recognize

      On this topic Rand Paul is Tucker Carlson, meaning PLAYING to an audience and if you doubt that ask why he immediately turned the YouTube ban in to a “badge of honor” LMAO

      Its all a con. In fact, its a HILARIOUS con because its directed at people like you with this hilarious attempt to thread the needle between what is POLITICALLY GOOD FOR HIM (Trumpism) and his SO-CALLED adherence to Libertarianism:

      “”As a libertarian-leaning Senator, I think private companies have the right to ban me if they want to, so in this case I’ll just channel that frustration into ensuring the public knows YouTube is acting as an arm of government and censoring their users for contradicting the government,

      The last part (in bold) is EXACTLY the point you keep making, right?

      This is the exact “freedom” think I often tease you about, it selectively applied. Paul admits it right here

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      @Spartan

      My first comment would have to be, are the links working again? Great.

      I disagree with Verge that your argument is dumb. It’s a big picture look at some of the reasons of how we got here. It’s easy for Verge to sit back and put everything on Trumpers but the attitude of distrust has not been limited only to Trumpers as you pointed out.

      Anyone who sits back and insists that the cocoon only works in one direction and starts a thread about it is doing nothing but trolling. Trolls gonna troll. I get it.

      Keeping it to one simple point here…. Where did Kamala get her information when she questioned taking the vaccine because Trump had been the President? It’s pretty self evident that the cocoon isn’t only a right wing problem. She got that nonsense from somewhere and she said it to play to a certain crowd who would gobble it up at the time. Verge may have been one of those people but I’ll let him speak for himself.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      That piece of shit is disingenuous personified, but you should already know that.

      Honest question – why do you waste your time on the elitist, condescending asshole? The guy has no friends or life. He craves that attention you’re giving him. Do you like doing charity work for the mentally handicapped or something?

      Good one. It most likely is due to my undeniable altruistic streak. Some people think to care about humanity you have to always look at the bigger picture but without people like me, people like Verge would be doomed to living out their lives in ignorance. because I feel bad for this poor dumb guy. Shameless individualism at it’s worst. ;)

      So, comments like Buggsy’s that you’re responding to are the truly disingenuous ones AND BUGGSY IS THE POSTER CHILD FOR THIS ISSUE

      people like Buggsy continue to post in these threads because the words make their blood boil. That alone is insane, and frankly sad, but its true

      If it wasn’t, you’d all just ignore. These threads would have as low a traffic as KKKChrons “BaRYY killed STEINers dog with Hilerskanks vibrator” threads LOL

      Buggsy tries to deny that truth by claiming to mock. . . The FALSEST claim posted here. Buggsy posts are about as meaningful as KKKChrons, but they are undeniably laced with insane anger (all kinds of personal stuff) because he cant get out of his own way.

      Its the point of view and I agree the way its delivered plays a part, but ask yourself if there would be the same response to football posts or post on music or celebrity deaths?

      Come on now? There would not be.

      Just a week ago Spartan said “done” when I told him he should just ignore . . .and yet here he is . . Look the anger is a shame and a BIG part of the problem in the country AND the reason Tromp came to power (to settle all your scores!). I just posted a quote in another thread from 2017 that explains the dynamic here perfectly

      ““Trump’s basic approach — speaking the unspeakable — is expressive, not substantive. His inflammatory, aggressive language captures and channels the grievances of red America, but the specific grievances often feel less important than the primordial, mocking incivility with which they are expressed. In this way, Trump does not necessarily need to deliver concrete goods because he is saying with electric intensity what his supporters have long wanted to say themselves.

      “electric intensity”

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      This is the exact “freedom” think I often tease you about, it selectively applied. Paul admits it right here

      Selectively applied or not, I agree with it’s generous application.

      Rand Paul is not God…. that would be his dad which would make him…

      Look I can’t and won’t defend every comment the guy ever made. And that doesn’t exclude me from thinking what he’s doing is a lot more good than bad. I dare you to pick any single politician and then defend every position or comment they ever make. It’s impossible because inevitably you aren’t going to agree with them on every point no matter how similar your ideology. I personally do know what you mean about some of his comments going a little farther than I would like but to me, he’s trying to make a larger point so I support him and as much of the comments as I can.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      So @Jbear . . you’re admitting the key part, just claiming that its bigger than Trumpers

      but the attitude of distrust

      Look at that! Common ground

      The COCOON is filled with people playing to the “attitude of distrust. The “attitude of distrust” is the BIAS in “conformation bias.”

      It exists on both side of the political spectrum, for sure, BUT IT IS THE DEFINING CHARCATERISTIC OF TRUMPISM

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      And that doesn’t exclude me from thinking what he’s doing is a lot more good than bad. I dare you to pick any single politician and then defend every position or comment they ever make.



      @Jbear

      RESPECTFULLY, I THINK YOUR LOVE OF HIS FATHER BLINDS YOU BECAUSE Rand Paul is perhaps the MOST DISAPPOINTING of all politicians because he so OBVIOUSLY threw aside his Libertarian’s views for HIS OWN POLITICAL SUCCESS . . which here clearly links to Trumpism.

      He is the whore of all whores and I say that because I did actually value his input BEFORE the Trump era

      simply contrast him to Amash and it should be obvious

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      There is right now a hashtag trending on twitter that is #DONOTcomplyEVER

      the premise of the tag is that a BOOSTER now is “proof” . . “we were lied to”

      That is Runole lol

      That is Spartan’s paragraph of BS, defended by Kermit as truth

      That is Rand Paul and paper masks (he’s playing to that PRE-EXISTING sentiment)

      and worst of all . . . that is the circular, self-fulfilling nonsense that got us to this place to begin with

      COCOON

      The very nature of social media

    • Biggs3535

      Participant
      Post count: 7236

      If it wasn’t, you’d all just ignore. These threads would have as low a traffic as KKKChrons “BaRYY killed STEINers dog with Hilerskanks vibrator” threads LOL

      Most of your voluminous posts/thread are ignored, as you’re psychotic. But then you whine and beg for people to respond to you, after they are ignored. It’s really, really sad and comical at the same time.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      The very nature of social media

      So the cocoon is the result of social media? What are you going to do about your twitter feed? lol

      And Rand…. I liked his father a lot more. I like Justin Amash more but he’s out of politics. I like Thomas Massie a lot too but he just made some Christmas cards where his whole family held guns so I doubt you like him either. I still don’t think you fully appreciate where Rand is comming from in every situation. He’s way more pragmatic than his father who was referred to as Dr No during his time in the house. I also don’t think you remember the bad blood between him and Trump durring the Republican primaries. It was nasty and I can assure you that I hated Trump with a passion at that time and was one reason why I voted for Gary Johnson. I barely hated him any less than Hillary Clinton which is really saying something.

      But Rand was in his ear on day one. He’s the guy who made up the term “Orange faced windbag”. yet somehow finagled a tee time with the sitting President who he spent six months openly mocking. And he did this to push a libertarian…ish agenda. You’ve even admitted in the past some of Rand’s influence on Trump regarding foreign policy. Rand was a big part of pushing some neocons out of the administration. I don’t know if you know, but Neocons are just as big an enemy of the Ron Paul revolution as are progressive democrats. That is why I strongly dislike people like Liz Cheney and John McCain. Nothing to do with Trump at all. If not For Rand Paul the Trump administration would likely have been even more disasterous. Rand did not succeed all the time but he did advance libertarian ideals where he could.

      So I completely disagree with your take on Rand Paul.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      So, comments like Buggsy’s that you’re responding to are the truly disingenuous ones AND BUGGSY IS THE POSTER CHILD FOR THIS ISSUE

      But then you whine and beg for people to respond to you

      LMAO

      BB is the “great and powerful OZ!”

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      So the cocoon is the result of social media

      No the coocn is faciliates by social media

      simple example

      PAST:

      event happens, peolpe learn about it three THREE news channels and a day or tow later their newspaper — all journalists guarded by editors and less corrupoted by money (Not perfect by any means, but much more narrow flow of information)

      PRESENT

      event happens. Competing sides DISTRUBUTE their spin on the information to an entire network (some created specifically to echo), WITH EACH FOR PROFIT level of the network TWEEKING the “news” more and more because outrage sells. The end result — with a NAIVE electorate (per the head of the FBI) – is DISINFORMATION.

      MY POINT: its an easy system to abius and many AMERICANS — and especially those who for three decades have bene told the media is bad — dont distinguish between Tucker Carlson and actual journalism.

      Tucker Carlson — who says UNDER OATH he is a liar – and actual journalism or even FIRST HAND like the CDC.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      I like Thomas Massie a lot too but he just made some Christmas cards where his whole family held guns so I doubt you like him either.

      Not because of the guns but because he is a “performative artist,” just like Boebert who posted the same type photo. I think the photo is just dumb (as should most responsible gun owners) but he tales it AND CIRCULATES IT . . because that is the Trumpian “own the libs” things that Crenshaw spoke about.

      we need those kinds of people OUT of government because they are not doing to country’s work, they are just performing. They are feathering their nest by DIVIDING

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      And he did this to push a libertarian…ish agenda.

      this is where we part ways

      Lindsey Graham called Trump all kinds of things too

      Lindsey Graham is a 100% SELF-INTERESTED WHORE. He completely flipped, just like Rand

      The difference is this . . from Goldwater and the John Birch loons to Nixon and the so-called “silent majority” to at least Reagan, Bush etc,. the so-called ALT-RIGHT was contained. The moderately educated, mostly white, racist, nationalistic, xenophobic alt-right . . was kept in a corner. They were flirted with for votes and money (Reagan’s first campaign stop), but NOT empowered (Reagan openly rejected John Birch)

      Trump empowered them. With Bannon’s help he played to the “aggrieved” white man and woman.

      Paul, Graham, etc . . were to be a bulwark. They crumbled. Worse, they joined.

      Not all GOP did that. All those people you call RINOs . . and people like Amash

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Tucker Carlson — who says UNDER OATH he is a liar – and actual journalism or even FIRST HAND like the CDC.

      You already know that Racheal Maddow used the exact same defense but you’d never hear about either one on the same “news” channel.

      But I get your point.

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Tucker Carlson — who says UNDER OATH he is a liar – and actual journalism or even FIRST HAND like the CDC.

      You already know that Racheal Maddow used the exact same defense but you’d never hear about either one on the same “news” channel.

      But I get your point.

      She did?

      I am not a fan. Would love to see that if true

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Tucker Carlson — who says UNDER OATH he is a liar – and actual journalism or even FIRST HAND like the CDC.

      You already know that Racheal Maddow used the exact same defense but you’d never hear about either one on the same “news” channel.

      But I get your point.

      Simple point. If you think professionally wrestling is real you’re weird. If you think it’s real after the wrestlers have said it’s not … you’re insane

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Tucker Carlson — who says UNDER OATH he is a liar – and actual journalism or even FIRST HAND like the CDC.

      You already know that Racheal Maddow used the exact same defense but you’d never hear about either one on the same “news” channel.

      But I get your point.

      She did?

      I am not a fan. Would love to see that if true

      I still can’t post links.

      Anyway since I can’t post links it’s too difficult to give you a truly objective take with various opinions but you can find a Greenwald substack article by searching: A Court Ruled Rachel Maddow’s Viewers Know She Offers Exaggeration and Opinion, Not Facts

      The cases are similar. Not exactly the same but close enough for me to feel the Carlson takedowns should at least be taken with the understanding that it isn’t just him saying a bunch of ridiculous and inflammatory shit to get ratings. In this case Rachael got sued by a right wing news outlet, OAN for proudly proclaiming on air that OAN “Was literally paid Russian propaganda”.

      Obviously that wasn’t true and I don’t think it’s all that dissimilar from the Carlson case. Not trying to argue but you asked.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      Edit: Sorry I know I quoted it but I feel I need to say that she actually used the word “literally” on air when saying the news outlet was “literally paid Russian propaganda”. I can see why they sued and I can see why they lost but just dang it does stretch the imagination a little bit to think that a pundit can use actual air quotation marks and say directly the word literally and still have a court rule that everyone knows she’s joking around. lol

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      isn’t just him saying a bunch of ridiculous and inflammatory shit to get ratings.

      yes, it is. LOL

      All he does – and there are countelss examples of this – is shade the truth, twist somethingout of context etc.

      BUT . . his defense UNDER OATH to a defamation claim was NOT a response to that ONE claim, it was to claim the whole show was bogus. Here’s the judge mocking the defense:

      “Just read U.S. District Judge Mary Kay Vyskocil’s opinion, leaning heavily on the arguments of Fox’s lawyers: The “‘general tenor’ of the show should then inform a viewer that [Carlson] is not ‘stating actual facts’ about the topics he discusses and is instead engaging in ‘exaggeration’ and ‘non-literal commentary.’”

      Again, I am not a Maddow fan but I will look

      BTW, I know you love him by Grenwald is an outrage seller too, very often leaving out context. It was the presence of EDITORS that made him leave his last stop. he disagreed with them

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Edit: Sorry I know I quoted it but I feel I need to say that she actually used the word “literally” on air when saying the news outlet was “literally paid Russian propaganda”. I can see why they sued and I can see why they lost but just dang it does stretch the imagination a little bit to think that a pundit can use actual air quotation marks and say directly the word literally and still have a court rule that everyone knows she’s joking around. lol

      and since I just looked, one big . . BIG . . big distinction.

      Well. Several actually

      1. Fox SETTLED the Carlson claim AFTER making the defense that the SHOW was not factual

      2. MSNBC/Maddow WON . . three times and even won $250K in fees

      3. Maddow did NOT claim her show was bogus (like Carlson did), she said she was MOCKING the crazy nature of OANN on the one SEGMENT. One Segment

      4. Three courts agreed with her

      So even if you discount the winning (lol), it was OANN suing here over ONE segment from one show and they lost.

      Carlson had Fox roll over even AFTER asserting that his SHOW should not be taken seriously

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      @JBear . . my point though is you and your Trump buddies still watch Carlson AS NEWS

      the Carlson takedowns should at least be taken with the understanding that it isn’t just him saying a bunch of ridiculous and inflammatory shit to get ratings

      Carlson says its not

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      All he does – and there are countelss examples of this – is shade the truth, twist somethingout of context etc.

      “On Monday Carlson, a long-time critic of President Joe Biden, said a government whistle-blower had told him the NSA was monitoring him for “political reasons”.”

      :-)

      Or this one, amplified rights here by Spartan

      “”Most Americans probably assume the chaos on Jan. 6 was the result of intelligence failures or of simple government incompetence. But direct incitement by federal agents? The intentional entrapment of American citizens? No decent person wants to believe that. But increasingly there’s evidence it is true

      EXACTLY what Dan Crenshaw said . . playing to “conservative psychology.”

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      BTW, I know you love him by Grenwald is an outrage seller too, very often leaving out context. It was the presence of EDITORS that made him leave his last stop. he disagreed with them

      I’d still put his objectivity up against Carlson and Maddow any day of the week. But I know you don’t care for him which is why I was trying to find another source before I wasn’t because they were like Fox news anyway. lol I did find a Reddit blog called AskALiberal that looked at the claim that the two cases were similar. A few of the people there seemed to say that they were different because, they said, Maddow’s judge decided that it was obvious that Maddow was just kidding while Carlson actually said something to the effect of “You shouldn’t take me seriously”

      The fact is nobody should take either of them seriously when they’re talking about their political enemies. It’s more than just those two people.

    • jbear

      Participant
      Post count: 5000

      JBear . . my point though is you and your Trump buddies still watch Carlson AS NEWS

      jbear wrote:
      the Carlson takedowns should at least be taken with the understanding that it isn’t just him saying a bunch of ridiculous and inflammatory shit to get ratings

      Carlson says its not

      I’m going out of my way to be objective here and it seems like, if you aren’t joking, that you are making your own case for being trapped in your own cocoon. I don’t think I’ve ever watched Carlson. I don’t even have cable.

      And then you seem to be harping on the one thing all the extreme left wing sites harp on…. that Carlson is different because of some minute difference in the case. Like it’s very important to you that Carlson is worse than Rachael Maddow. So to be clear you are actually defending Rachael Maddow here. I’m not surprised you feel this way but being open about it could hurt your case to being the most reasonable poster in the cove.

    • Kermit56

      Participant
      Post count: 588

      being the most reasonable poster in the cove.

      Bwahahahaha!!

    • BucsBits

      Participant
      Post count: 2038

      Carlson is different because of some minute difference in the case. Like it’s very important to you that Carlson is worse than Rachael Maddow. So to be clear you are actually defending Rachael Maddow here. I’m not surprised you feel this way but being open about it could hurt your case to being the most reasonable poster in the cove

      LOL

      So the truth doesnt match your claim. I point that out — your claim, not mine. So, it becomes “some minute difference in the case,” which is the first clue of the troll. Because thats weak, a second swipe “you are actually defending Rachael Maddow here.”

      The “let me post the opposite of what he posted” troll . . pretty blah in terms of creativity

      You dont watch Carlson? Oh wait, youre the Andy Ngo fan . . .

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