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    • SackedBySapp

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      Post count: 155

      I sure read a lot of stories this past off season talking about how Lovie was going to coach-up Winston.  I’m starting to wonder what would have happened if instead…..he just would have let Winston be Winston……as he seems very overloaded and at times, damn confused.why do you take a guy for the talent he has.....and then spend the next few months un-training him..and his instincts...and methods..which were originally the things you chose him for?  did they try to shove TOO MUCH onto his plate?and more important......did they train him to fit into a system.......or did lovie build a system around him?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      did lovie build a system for koetter?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 3420

      did lovie build a system for koetter?

      I don't think they have even opened up the entire playbook.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      .......or did lovie build a system around him?

      I think it's safe to say Lovie doesn't have a ****ing clue regarding offense so we can rule that out.  However I think what has happened is Lovie lowered the bar of expectations and let Winston know: "It's ok to be a loser.  It's expected.  Just let it soak into your veins now.  A few more losses and you're officially a Succaneer."Lovie is unintentionally ruining the kid (& team).

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      did lovie build a system for koetter?

      again.........reading comprehension is your friend.  see keywords: "and company" in the thread title.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 303

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn’t matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well…..Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      Spot on.But the kid does have redeeming qualities that Winston lacks and it would take a helluva lot of Lovie-hours to unhinge them from Mariota.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1110

      I’m no fan of Lovie as HC, but it’s just not that complicated.  Winston should not have been drafted so early.  And that’s on both Lovie and the Glazers.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      MM has nothing to do with my question.....  I do obviously agree that lovie and company are horrible...as is ownership for continuing to hire absolute losers....which quite frankly...is the bigger picture.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 303

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      MM has nothing to do with my question.....  I do obviously agree that lovie and company are horrible...as is ownership for continuing to hire absolute losers....which quite frankly...is the bigger picture.

      Agreed. My intention wasn't to assign draft selection ownership....just more of an overall observation.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3316

      This is the Winston that we drafted.  He is going on 3 years removed from Heisman Jameis.  That’s why you don’t draft 2 year college QBs.  It is a bad move.  You have no idea what you are getting.  Winson is making the mistakes as last year at FSU.  It’s a problem.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 883

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      MM has nothing to do with my question.....  I do obviously agree that lovie and company are horrible...as is ownership for continuing to hire absolute losers....which quite frankly...is the bigger picture.

      Pretty much.Lovie and co. are going to ruin any potential that Winston may have. On the bright side, IF (big if) Lovie is canned, there's a chance Licht stays and hopefully he's given the job to find the next HC. I am not sure how good of a job he would do, but I do know it would be better than anything the Glazer boys could muster up.But I am expecting more of the same. Status quo.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      MM has nothing to do with my question.....  I do obviously agree that lovie and company are horrible...as is ownership for continuing to hire absolute losers....which quite frankly...is the bigger picture.

      ....there's a chance Licht stays and hopefully he's given the job to find the next HC ...

      What has Licht done to make you excited at the prospect of him selecting the next HC?He picked the wrong QB, a tackle in the 2nd that should be playing guard, a TE that never sees the field, a 3rd down specialist in the 3rd that isn't that special, and bottom line just keeps consistently missing on proper talent eval.How many FA's, trades, and cuts did Licht end up on the right side of?Sorry but his hits have been few and the misses are many.Not excited at the prospect of Licht taking over at all.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Don’t sweat it……both of them are on their way out of here……sooner rather than later.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Don't sweat it......both of them are on their way out of here......sooner rather than later.

      Not if the fan-base doesn't light a fire.  The players won't and if the players won't, the media damn sure won't.  The fans need to call the radio shows, use social media and the few that go to the game need to let their voice be heard.The Glazers (much like the players) are happy collecting a check and will only make a move if forced.  Unlike Miami, our ownership couldn't care less about W/L.We - the fans - need to force the issue if we ever expect more than a participation trophy here in Tampa.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3169

      I stand by my line of rationale that it doesn't matter who we selected, MM or JW would suck worse here because, well.....Lovie. Anyone that thinks Mariota would be performing as well here as he has so far in Tennessee is officially loony tunes.

      I made this very point pre-draft as to why the Bucs should have traded down... so agreed.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 717

      I know Ill get flamed for this, but I kinda miss the nasty Schiano brought. Id kill to see some fire right now. Hell, maybe crashing a kneel down would do this team some good.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      This is the Winston that we drafted.  He is going on 3 years removed from Heisman Jameis.  That's why you don't draft 2 year college QBs.  It is a bad move.  You have no idea what you are getting.  Winson is making the mistakes as last year at FSU.  It's a problem.

      BINGO!!!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 318

      This is the same guy that played at FSU. His play is the same as he did in the Rose Bowl. Don’t blame the coaches for getting him ready, blame them for drafting him.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I sure read a lot of stories this past off season talking about how Lovie was going to coach-up Winston.  I'm starting to wonder what would have happened if instead.....he just would have let Winston be Winston......as he seems very overloaded and at times, damn confused.why do you take a guy for the talent he has.....and then spend the next few months un-training him..and his instincts...and methods..which were originally the things you chose him for?  did they try to shove TOO MUCH onto his plate?and more important......did they train him to fit into a system.......or did lovie build a system around him?

      direct quotes from you.  how do you believe lovie is “coaching” up winston?  how do you think Lovie is not letting winston be winston?  how do you think Lovie is confusing winston, overloading him?  what system did lovie build that is anywhere near the offense?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I know Ill get flamed for this, but I kinda miss the nasty Schiano brought. Id kill to see some fire right now. Hell, maybe crashing a kneel down would do this team some good.

      Schiano certainly had his flaws, but bottom line, I and many other Buc fans agree.  You're not alone in this thought.  I thought he was doing a good job instilling an attitude into this team that rubbed some guys the wrong way.  Those guys that didn't like it are exactly the guys I don't want on the team.  Guys that are looking to loaf it, not give 100% and that don't care enough about the details are guys that are losers and instill a losing mentality.  Unfortunately, those losers have plenty of connections to the media and ran Schiano out of town and replaced him with the new Director of Tampa Flag Football and SpaParticipation Trophies for everyone!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      can we stop it with schiano?  he was in over his head and was building his defense around mark barron.  he didnt know how to lead men.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      I sure read a lot of stories this past off season talking about how Lovie was going to coach-up Winston.  I'm starting to wonder what would have happened if instead.....he just would have let Winston be Winston......as he seems very overloaded and at times, damn confused.why do you take a guy for the talent he has.....and then spend the next few months un-training him..and his instincts...and methods..which were originally the things you chose him for?  did they try to shove TOO MUCH onto his plate?and more important......did they train him to fit into a system.......or did lovie build a system around him?

      direct quotes from you.  how do you believe lovie is "coaching" up winston?  how do you think Lovie is not letting winston be winston?  how do you think Lovie is confusing winston, overloading him?  what system did lovie build that is anywhere near the offense?

      this was the initial quote from me:  "Lovie and company"what's with you playing the "stupid guy" thing here?  or do you just like to hear yourself type?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 504

      I sure read a lot of stories this past off season talking about how Lovie was going to coach-up Winston.  I'm starting to wonder what would have happened if instead.....he just would have let Winston be Winston......as he seems very overloaded and at times, damn confused.why do you take a guy for the talent he has.....and then spend the next few months un-training him..and his instincts...and methods..which were originally the things you chose him for?  did they try to shove TOO MUCH onto his plate?and more important......did they train him to fit into a system.......or did lovie build a system around him?

      What are you talking about? Winston has played exactly like he did his sophomore year and unfortunately that is not good. The only thing we can do is hope Winston learns from his mistakes and gets better year after year. At best, he may turn out to be an average to good NFL QB.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1571

      I know Ill get flamed for this, but I kinda miss the nasty Schiano brought. Id kill to see some fire right now. Hell, maybe crashing a kneel down would do this team some good.

      Schiano certainly had his flaws, but bottom line, I and many other Buc fans agree.  You're not alone in this thought.  I thought he was doing a good job instilling an attitude into this team that rubbed some guys the wrong way.  Those guys that didn't like it are exactly the guys I don't want on the team.  Guys that are looking to loaf it, not give 100% and that don't care enough about the details are guys that are losers and instill a losing mentality.  Unfortunately, those losers have plenty of connections to the media and ran Schiano out of town and replaced him with the new Director of Tampa Flag Football and SpaParticipation Trophies for everyone!

      I said it before and I still believe it- Shiano got a raw deal and was blamed for a bunch of stuff that wasn't his fault.  I thought he had this team moving in the right direction (all things considered) and if we had kept him I'm certain we would have won the division last year.Oh well.  Let's move forward with The Tampa Flag Football and Spa.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 504

      I know Ill get flamed for this, but I kinda miss the nasty Schiano brought. Id kill to see some fire right now. Hell, maybe crashing a kneel down would do this team some good.

      Schiano certainly had his flaws, but bottom line, I and many other Buc fans agree.  You're not alone in this thought.  I thought he was doing a good job instilling an attitude into this team that rubbed some guys the wrong way.  Those guys that didn't like it are exactly the guys I don't want on the team.  Guys that are looking to loaf it, not give 100% and that don't care enough about the details are guys that are losers and instill a losing mentality.  Unfortunately, those losers have plenty of connections to the media and ran Schiano out of town and replaced him with the new Director of Tampa Flag Football and SpaParticipation Trophies for everyone!

      I said it before and I still believe it- Shiano got a raw deal and was blamed for a bunch of stuff that wasn't his fault.  I thought he had this team moving in the right direction (all things considered) and if we had kept him I'm certain we would have won the division last year.Oh well.  Let's move forward with The Tampa Flag Football and Spa.

      I never wanted Schiano fired and there is no doubt in my mind we'd be a much better football team right now. We never would have had the chance at the number one pick so we could blow it either.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2847

      This is the Winston that we drafted.  He is going on 3 years removed from Heisman Jameis.  That's why you don't draft 2 year college QBs.  It is a bad move.  You have no idea what you are getting.  Winson is making the mistakes as last year at FSU.  It's a problem.

        Agree. And yes, it could ultimately retard his growth as a legit NFL QB.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 369

      This thread title made me facepalm.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Winston being winston is NOT being bothered by lovie. This is winston being winston in the pros.They went out and got him one of the best OCs available, and currently have had a line who guarded up watt and co, and a defense who is statistically good at pass protection.He's over, and underthrowing, 6'5ft wideouts. His footwork is bad, ...for a rookie,...or for anyone really. He looks confused at times, and at times, feels pressure when there isnt any.Sure, brindza or whatever didnt help, anyone, but you have to figure, those could have been tds instead of fg attempts in the first place. At least half or a qtr of those anyway. A LOT of this stuff are things that were problems coming from his college days. He's slow and has a large range of motion before the throw. His footwork is bad, just bad. I think he can be groomed, but its going to take some time. I very seriously doubt that he becomes the qb we all hope he is. At least, not here, if anywhere. There are simply way too many issues to fix, and not much time.Fans are pissed, lovie sucks, glazers suck, our players turned into a collective bag of suck...something has GOT to give eventually. And THAT will probably stunt his growth more than anything.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      This thread title made me facepalm.

      This regime makes me facepalm.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1282

      Just a pathetic sect of the fanbase.Support the young man and hope for growth.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4755

      Winston is naturally a gunslinger. I think the correct approach at this stage in his career is to try to get him to become a better game manager. He is too much of a gunslinger for his own good.  You hope that if you take that approach that you will end up with a more balanced player in the long run. He is going to make his mistakes. It is good that he is getting them out of his system now. And you hope that he learns from them and doesn't end up like Brett Favre being a 40 year old gunslinger out there playing with reckless abandon.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Just a pathetic sect of the fanbase.Support the young man and hope for growth.

      Yup. Pathetic fans supporting a team who hasn't won d1ck in over a decade.Gj mr glazer.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      can we stop it with schiano?  he was in over his head and was building his defense around mark barron.  he didnt know how to lead men.

      That is absolutely correct.  And we know that now.  And in two or three years we will probably be saying something similar about Loive. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      Haven’t we been hoping for growth for a decade now?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      That is absolutely correct.  And we know that now.  And in two or three years we will probably be saying something similar about Loive.

      Two or three years? I'm hoping it's 2 or 3 weeks.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      Winston is naturally a gunslinger. I think the correct approach at this stage in his career is to try to get him to become a better game manager. He is too much of a gunslinger for his own good. 

      Just wow, I'm not comparing or even suggesting they are alike, but this was almost the exact same thing I remember hearing about Ryan Leaf.I never think its a good idea to take an athlete that has done something the same way his entire life and think you can convert him to a new style.  Isn't this the biggest slam against run option QB's?  You need to let Winston remain a gunslinger and find a way to make it work in your system.  If you try to change him, more than likely you will just break him. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Can’t change him, or he fails..Cannot let him throw pick sixes, or he fails...Hmmm..sounds like someone is a little f$cked. I wonder who warned us of that??Oh. Wait...everyone who wasnt an fsu homer. Thats right! I forgot.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      We didn’t draft Winston to be a game manager. We already have one on the roster. He needs to let the #crabcannon loose. Koetter needs to help him cut down on the #YOLOballs and the #skrongbombs. We need more #swagdimes.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 943

      Par for the course with the past couple of coaches we have had. Ultra conservative. Doesn’t work anymore. Did you see Mike Shula keep Carolina aggressive with the lead? Blitzing, throwing it downfield. You cannot go into a shell like Lovie does. Sends a message to the team, I think you are going to blow it and dont want you to.This is example #1 why Lovie needs to go if this season continues at this pace. I have zero faith in Lovie to adequately develop Jameis Winston. We need an offensive minded head coach, that is aggressive and plays to Winston's strengths. They are bringing in jumbo packages and focusing too much on play action. Spread the receivers out, let Winston operate in the shotgun and use runs out of the gun. IMO that is a path to success here. Let him run a hurry up, dude looks MUCH more comfortable closing out a half in a fast pace offense. Lovie is going to play conservative football and run run run play action pass. Then bring out a kicker with 6 seconds left, a rookie QB with an arm, and two 6'5" receivers, only to have the kicker miss the field goal. Because he doesnt want something bad to happen. Foolish coaching IMO. Dude is burying himself and I dont think he makes it out of this season with his job.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      This is example #1 why Lovie needs to go if this season continues at this pace. I have zero faith in Lovie to adequately develop Jameis Winston. We need an offensive minded head coach, that is aggressive and plays to Winston's strengths. They are bringing in jumbo packages and focusing too much on play action. Spread the receivers out, let Winston operate in the shotgun and use runs out of the gun. IMO that is a path to success here. Let him run a hurry up, dude looks MUCH more comfortable closing out a half in a fast pace offense. Lovie is going to play conservative football and run run run play action pass. Then bring out a kicker with 6 seconds left, a rookie QB with an arm, and two 6'5" receivers, only to have the kicker miss the field goal. Because he doesnt want something bad to happen. Foolish coaching IMO. Dude is burying himself and I dont think he makes it out of this season with his job.

      Which is why I think Koetter deserves serious consideration! Everyone screams stability, well Koetter provides that and gets rid of St. Lovie!. Koetter is one of the most respected OCs in the game and his play calling has been pretty damn good this year...IMHO.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3169

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

      you said that.....not me.I say..they need to man up and show Winston they trust him...and let him do what he needs to do.....he's already shot.......so this is a last ditch effort to allow him to gain back some confidence.  smart coaches understand this...and can craft it onto a motivational tool.  it this doesn't work.......it's over.whatever we're doing now.......isn't working.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1875

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

      you said that.....not me.I say..they need to man up and show Winston they trust him...and let him do what he needs to do.....he's already shot.......so this is a last ditch effort to allow him to gain back some confidence.  smart coaches understand this...and can craft it onto a motivational tool.  it this doesn't work.......it's over.whatever we're doing now.......isn't working.

      4 games into a rookie season?  He’s shot and this is a last ditch effort?  Here’s hoping you’re wrong, and thinking you’re premature.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Lol.The jag fans think of bortles as being suspect after 6tds and 3 ints.I wonder what they think about winston?Also. What horrible fans they are!

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      He’s been cloistered behind the walls of OBP since we picked him…..and he’s been over-coached.  He needs the coaches to show they’re confident in him….and loosen up the ropes.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3169

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

      you said that.....not me.I say..they need to man up and show Winston they trust him...and let him do what he needs to do.....he's already shot.......so this is a last ditch effort to allow him to gain back some confidence.  smart coaches understand this...and can craft it onto a motivational tool.  it this doesn't work.......it's over.whatever we're doing now.......isn't working.

      Yeah, you actually did.  Your last sentence confirms it.  As I emboldened from your last post, you said... and I quote "do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching..."    How much more obvious is it?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      He's been cloistered behind the walls of OBP since we picked him.....and he's been over-coached.  He needs the coaches to show they're confident in him....and loosen up the ropes.

      I don't know if "loosen up the ropes" is the answer...my main question is this: When does any of the blame on fall on Winston's shoulders? Seems to me that it is always somebody else's fault. When the threw 18 picks at FSU his second season, it was the Olines fault and the receiver's fault...not it's the coach's fault because they have "overcoached" him.  I just tend to see a pattern here...

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

      you said that.....not me.I say..they need to man up and show Winston they trust him...and let him do what he needs to do.....he's already shot.......so this is a last ditch effort to allow him to gain back some confidence.  smart coaches understand this...and can craft it onto a motivational tool.  it this doesn't work.......it's over.whatever we're doing now.......isn't working.

      Yeah, you actually did.  Your last sentence confirms it.  As I emboldened from your last post, you said... and I quote "do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching..."    How much more obvious is it?

      that's your "take" on it.  and once again.....you're dead wrong.it's obvious you know nothing about motivating employees our you would have understood what I was talking about...... I never said they did not know what they are doing.......I suggested they try a different path to motivate this kid.....and in doing so....swallow their pride and say they are going to let him do things his way the next few weeks before he turns into another JaMarcus Russell.  business leaders and critical thinkers understood what I said......ham and eggers and cats who get paid hourly.........not so much.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2862

      Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""

      peanut-butter-jelly-time.gif  Sapp wants to sell YOU a T-shirt.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""

        Sapp wants to sell YOU a T-shirt.

      that game is over babe.........I already ran your boy boid off this site when he could not produce a shred of evidence to support his fake claim.....

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2862

      Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""

        Sapp wants to sell YOU a T-shirt.

      that game is over babe........

      Translation: Being the head of an online T-shirt empire ain't easy.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1571

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      I see where you're going with this.  Get him into a situation where he stops thinking too much and just acts and reacts.  At that point we will see how much of the coaching has actually sunk in and what areas need to be focused on more.I agree with the theory, I just think its a bit too soon.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Translation: Being the head of an online T-shirt empire ain't easy.

      I'm stunned you're even a bucs fan.....what with a team owned by a jewish family and all...considering all the anti-Semitic bigoted comments you make in the cove.oy vey

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      that's your "take" on it.  and once again.....you're dead wrong.it's obvious you know nothing about motivating employees our you would have understood what I was talking about...... I never said they did not know what they are doing.......I suggested they try a different path to motivate this kid.....and in doing so....swallow their pride and say they are going to let him do things his way the next few weeks before he turns into another JaMarcus Russell.  business leaders and critical thinkers understood what I said......ham and eggers and cats who get paid hourly.........not so much.

      is motivation a factor?  i dont think thats correct.as for "letting him do things his way" - that is the problem.  he is still doing the same things he was doing his last season at fsu.  he is throwing poor passes at the start of games, careless passes.  its not talent, its not thinking too much imo.  its a concentration issue.  its being sloppy.  if it was pushing the ball down the field, great.  but its short outs, stops, screens.its got nothing to do with pride.  or being a business leader.  or jamarcuss russell.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      its got nothing to do with pride.  or being a business leader.  or jamarcuss russell.

      bk_eggs_ham.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      you are real good at pulling stock photos.  let me know when you take one yourself.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      you are real good at pulling stock photos.  let me know when you take one yourself.

      married..........sorry pal

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3169

      this is no different than any other business.what we are doing now with Winston.......is NOT working.Lovie literally needs to tell his handling crew to tell Winston......""do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching......it isn't working the way we had hoped..... we just would like to see you.... be you....""that's what business leaders do.  that's also the quickest way to find out if this thing can be turned around...or if it's best to walk away....as far as Winston goes anyway.

      So what you're saying is that the entire coaching staff knows less how to develop a QB than a 21 year old rookie?  If that's the case, then everyone needs to be fired today.

      you said that.....not me.I say..they need to man up and show Winston they trust him...and let him do what he needs to do.....he's already shot.......so this is a last ditch effort to allow him to gain back some confidence.  smart coaches understand this...and can craft it onto a motivational tool.  it this doesn't work.......it's over.whatever we're doing now.......isn't working.

      Yeah, you actually did.  Your last sentence confirms it.  As I emboldened from your last post, you said... and I quote "do what you want.......trust your gut...forget about what we were preaching..."    How much more obvious is it?

      that's your "take" on it.  and once again.....you're dead wrong.it's obvious you know nothing about motivating employees our you would have understood what I was talking about...... I never said they did not know what they are doing.......I suggested they try a different path to motivate this kid.....and in doing so....swallow their pride and say they are going to let him do things his way the next few weeks before he turns into another JaMarcus Russell.  business leaders and critical thinkers understood what I said......ham and eggers and cats who get paid hourly.........not so much.

      No, I get it just fine.  The answer isn't to tell the kid to ignore their coaching and do his own thing.  The answer is, to use a different approach to teach him.  If they can't teach him, then they need to be let go.  It really is that simple.Everyone understood what you said, I was just being polite and responding to you.  Everyone else is laughing too hard at your stupidity to respond.  As I said, I'm just being polite.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      you are real good at pulling stock photos.  let me know when you take one yourself.

      married..........sorry pal

      wheres the reading comprehension now?  not OF yourself, just take one yourself.  im still waiting to see these amazing gameday meals you are creating.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You people don’t get it.The point is they are telling Winston to be too conservative which is against his instincts.  This makes him second guess and slow down his decision making process on the field which leads to tentative delayed throws and interceptions.The no-huddle offense that Koetter said they will use more of this week is an example of them taking the reigns off a bit and letting the kid do his thing.Granted, given his history I wouldn't be surprised to see just as many ints, but hopefully a few more TDs to give us a shot at winning.FTR I was on board the draft-Mariota-and-hold-him-ransom-unless-Kelly-gave-up-the-farm,-roll-with-him boat.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      you are real good at pulling stock photos.  let me know when you take one yourself.

      married..........sorry pal

      wheres the reading comprehension now?  not OF yourself, just take one yourself.  im still waiting to see these amazing gameday meals you are creating.

      got it.......you weren't hitting on me.  thank you for that.so you're saying, in effect, that all the other meal pics I've already posted are stock photos?  this will be fun......let's make a wager here.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      You people don't get it.The point is they are telling Winston to be too conservative which is against his instincts.  This makes him second guess and slow down his decision making process on the field which leads to tentative delayed throws and interceptions.The no-huddle offense that Koetter said they will use more of this week is an example of them taking the reigns off a bit and letting the kid do his thing.Granted, given his history I wouldn't be surprised to see just as many ints, but hopefully a few more TDs to give us a shot at winning.FTR I was on board the draft-Mariota-and-hold-him-ransom-unless-Kelly-gave-up-the-farm,-roll-with-him boat.

      this is completely not true.  its just a made up myth because you dont like the coach or the QB or whatever.  Winston is doing the exact same thing he did last season at fsu – early game lazy and careless throws.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      got it.......you weren't hitting on me.  thank you for that.so you're saying, in effect, that all the other meal pics I've already posted are stock photos?  this will be fun......let's make a wager here.

      who comes to PR to hit on old men?  dont flatter yourself.my bad on the stock photos.  i just assumed that with all your bigbusiness persona, the way you talk down to us ham n' eggers, the trips to the caribbean, the mocking of hourly wage workers, i just thought your table wouldnt look like my Grandmas.  more power to you for living beneath your means.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You people don't get it.The point is they are telling Winston to be too conservative which is against his instincts.  This makes him second guess and slow down his decision making process on the field which leads to tentative delayed throws and interceptions.The no-huddle offense that Koetter said they will use more of this week is an example of them taking the reigns off a bit and letting the kid do his thing.Granted, given his history I wouldn't be surprised to see just as many ints, but hopefully a few more TDs to give us a shot at winning.FTR I was on board the draft-Mariota-and-hold-him-ransom-unless-Kelly-gave-up-the-farm,-roll-with-him boat.

      this is completely not true.  its just a made up myth because you dont like the coach or the QB or whatever.  Winston is doing the exact same thing he did last season at fsu - early game lazy and careless throws.

      I don't think Winston would have chose the flat in both of his pick sixes if he didn't have coaches in his ear telling him to check it down.Which BTW isn't even a good 2nd or 3rd read .. still can't believe he made those throws ... ****ing horrible./rant

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I don't think Winston would have chose the flat in both of his pick sixes if he didn't have coaches in his ear telling him to check it down.Which BTW isn't even a good 2nd or 3rd read .. still can't believe he made those throws ... ****ing horrible./rant

      i dont think koetter told winston to target humphries or myers to start either game.  its the same careless throws he made ALL of last season.you think that koetter is telling him NOT to throw to evan/vjax if he thinks they are open?

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      my bad on the stock photos.  i just assumed that with all your bigbusiness persona, the way you talk down to us ham n' eggers, the trips to the caribbean, the mocking of hourly wage workers, i just thought your table wouldnt look like my Grandmas.  more power to you for living beneath your means.

      sounds like I struck more than a few of your nerves ...... I proudly live beneath my means....that's actually what people should do.....heck...I drive a Hyundai.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      sounds like I stuck more than a few of your nerves ...... I proudly live beneath my means....that's actually what people should do.....heck...I drive a Hyundai.

      i pegged you for an American vehicle.  do you drive the sonata?  my friends have been relatively happy with those.  this is a great feature from hyundai – https://autoservice.hyundaiusa.com/CampaignHome/Campaign/VINPageIndexat your age though, and with all the wealth you have assumably acquired, you should treat yourself to something a tad more well built.  cant take it with you once your are gone, you know?anyways, sorry about the doubt with the food pics, looking forward to more.  just the food though, okay?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 337

      Just a pathetic sect of the fanbase.Support the young man and hope for growth.

      He's a multimillionaire who has been told how awesome he is since he was a kid. He doesn't need my support -- he needs to do the job he was drafted to do and stop talking about it.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      sounds like I stuck more than a few of your nerves ...... I proudly live beneath my means....that's actually what people should do.....heck...I drive a Hyundai.

      i pegged you for an American vehicle.  do you drive the sonata?  my friends have been relatively happy with those.  this is a great feature from hyundai - https://autoservice.hyundaiusa.com/CampaignHome/Campaign/VINPageIndexat your age though, and with all the wealth you have assumably acquired, you should treat yourself to something a tad more well built.  cant take it with you once your are gone, you know?anyways, sorry about the doubt with the food pics, looking forward to more.  just the food though, okay?

      The wife drives a limited turbo sonata.......I have a genesis.  better than any BMW I ever owned from back in the day....with the exception of handling of course.  you can't beat the 5/60 bumper to bumper warranty...I'm stunned at anyone who buys a new car these days and only gets a 3 year 36 bumper to bumper........they're morons.as far as acquiring wealth.... anyone can do what I did.  the earlier you do it the better.  at 23, I started paying myself 10% on everything I had to pay for...and banking it.  food, gas, rent, utilities, car.... everything...and if I could not do that...I didn't buy it.  you have no idea how much wealth you can build with even a menial job if you implement that strategy early enough and stick to it. 

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