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    • ISLAND BUCS

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      Post count: 3195

      Link:  https://www.prageru.com/courses/political-science/black-fathers-matter#.V3BOndoZBcx.mailtoMore Fathers Present:  Maybe less Police confrontations; Maybe less gang violence.

      Remain intimately at the heart of experience.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2862

      73% of African- American births in 2010 are born out of wedlock. 67% of AA children are in single parent families. The welfare system incentivises single parent households which results in higher crime rates and incarceration. Now we see the formation of BLM an inherently racist group that stokes the flames of racial animus, destroy's its own neighborhoods and shirks personal responsibility.Which prompts the question, how long do members of this group and other similar groups get to use their enslaved ancestors as an excuse for their own personal behavior?

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 655

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      wanna make a few grand real quick?  reserve “Black Fathers Matter.com”

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Which prompts the question, how long do members of this group and other similar groups get to use their enslaved ancestors as an excuse for their own personal behavior?

      literally said the exact same thing at dinner a few nights agoexcuses are kind of running out......there's no more hiding......BLM members need to either look inside themselves for the answer.......or just go crazy and kill people.........        wait.......

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      Which prompts the question, how long do members of this group and other similar groups get to use their enslaved ancestors as an excuse for their own personal behavior?

      til the end of time.

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 228

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      I agree, or at least hope, that progress will eventually happen but it's made a lot tougher with the Al Sharptons on one side and the posters chiming in on this thread on the other.

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 655

      Col:The real key to progress is education.  Ben Carson, Sowell are accepted everywhere.The ladder to success has its footing in the schoolhouse.The Jews and the Chinese are great examples. Father and Mother came to US with little money and worked hard to send their children to college, and the children studies very hard and became doctors and engineers etc.In the black culture there is a disparagement of education, but with the passage of time, it will become more accepted among blacks that education truly can provide more happiness in life.To all who have glossed over the video in the OP, it is truly worth while taking the time to view.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 5954

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      I get your point, but how have African American's harmed the United States of America?  What wrongs against our country by the black community does the nation have to forget?  Seems to me like a one way street in that regard.  Also, it's a lot easier to tell someone else to forget how they have been wronged. This is such a stupid argument, on virtually every level. Start with the premise that blacks are not integrated into our society. Of course they are well integrated, in spite of actual programs to prevent that over long periods of time, namely segregation. You may be asking about how those other groups have prospered more in our society. Which anyone of any intelligence should expect. Only one group was brought here as slaves and kept in that status for 100+ years.  Only one group was systematically stripped of their culture in every regard. History, religion, customs, and community. Only one group once freed were ushered toward urban seats of government where they would be protected by federal authority (the only one that showed any concern for them).  Only one group was legally segregated from society for generations even after being freed from slavery.  Only one group started with all members at the bottom of society.  Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place. That is active in helping new immigrants become established. The newly freed black southerner couldn't move into an enclave of established blacks already prosperous in Indiana.That is ridiculous. Most minority groups have group specific leaders. None of the other groups have had to struggle against even comparable societal impediments. So it is natural that we have seen more of black leaders championing black issues over time.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 655

      Thread:Watts, Drive-by gang shootingsFergusonBaltimoreDallasFrom a 2011 Justice Dept Report initiated by Obama:Black men between 14 and 24 are 1% of the population but are 27% of the murderers:Blacks of any age are 8 times more likely to murder than whites:Blacks are 13% of the population and are responsible for 53% of murders:Whites are twice as likely to be murdered by Blacks than visa verseBoth sides can find reason to mistrust, and if you cling to your hatreds and injustices, (the bads against me are worse than the wrongs my side has done) progress towards equality goes slower.

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      I get your point, but how have African American's harmed the United States of America?  What wrongs against our country by the black community does the nation have to forget?  Seems to me like a one way street in that regard.  Also, it's a lot easier to tell someone else to forget how they have been wronged. This is such a stupid argument, on virtually every level. Start with the premise that blacks are not integrated into our society. Of course they are well integrated, in spite of actual programs to prevent that over long periods of time, namely segregation. You may be asking about how those other groups have prospered more in our society. Which anyone of any intelligence should expect. Only one group was brought here as slaves and kept in that status for 100+ years.  Only one group was systematically stripped of their culture in every regard. History, religion, customs, and community. Only one group once freed were ushered toward urban seats of government where they would be protected by federal authority (the only one that showed any concern for them).  Only one group was legally segregated from society for generations even after being freed from slavery.  Only one group started with all members at the bottom of society.  Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place. That is active in helping new immigrants become established. The newly freed black southerner couldn't move into an enclave of established blacks already prosperous in Indiana.That is ridiculous. Most minority groups have group specific leaders. None of the other groups have had to struggle against even comparable societal impediments. So it is natural that we have seen more of black leaders championing black issues over time.

      While I dont feel like taking 20 minutes to tear apart your post line by line, the abbreviated version boils down to the ultimate fallback to the AA community is slavery. As horrible as that was, it might be time to start living in the present, thinking about the future, and how to advance yourself in the current world. You then go on to state " Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place". I wasn't aware African Americans didnt have an established community currently, can you elaborate on that?By your logic, the Jewish should still be demonstrating against Germany. If you want to hold a 50+ year grudge, against something you probably didnt live through or experience, thats your prerogative, but don't be surprised if nothing is changed.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1151

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2862

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      Fair points and as much as I'm loath to compare one demographic to another, just to followup on your point. One would be hard pressed to find a group more discriminated against throughout recorded history than the Jews. Kicked out of one country after the other, starting over after persecution and working their way to the top. When it comes to overcoming oppression they consistently win the gold medal.Anyway, the black experience in America. I think we can all acknowledge going back it is a horrendous one. It was not that long ago when blacks were not taught how to read and write and segregation caused an entire group of people to be put in the back of the bus for generations. Remnants of that still exist.  Watch the video on the teams official site featuring J Winston and his family as they talk about his early years. The house he grew up in, the neighborhood he lived in, even the way his older family members speak. For me it was a reminder that those oppressive years, especially in the deep south were really not that long ago.My own daughter (white) as part of her university experience just spent the past several months working with at-risk kids, all black, that literally come from the other side of the tracks. Kids 5-6 years old that were born into poverty, few clothes, ill- fitting shoes. Nonetheless one of her little mentees actually has a photograph of her taped to the wall above her bed, representing someone she looks up to, someone she feels loves her, someone that makes her feel special. That little girl lives with her "Aunt". Shows tell-tale signs of possible abuse. Hardly ever sees her mother, never sees her father. More than once my daughter has told me stories and showed me photos that have brought this "jaded old man" to tears. It's very sad when I think about what the future might hold for those little innocent kids. So the "bad" truly is still there. But, it's time to stop blaming others.So what do we see? Certain aspects of black society and the Liberal mindset that invariably accompanies it, a lack of self discipline and embracing of the type of negative stereotype that values the worst aspects of society. Drugs, crime , incarceration, gangs, fatherless children, welfare abuse, the whole gambit. Groups like BLM have the temerity to in essence say "it's the white man that's always trying to keep us down".  What was once a valid a reason has now become an excuse. Unfortunately, it is long past time "the black community" took a hard look in the mirror and make a decision irrespective of who or what group that they feel may be at fault for their circumstance and embrace their responsibility, set aside whatever they feel is holding them back and make the change they want see in their community. Positive change. Because what I'm seeing now, especially of late, is very little but a ratcheting up of racial bigotry from that side of the fence and a lot of finger pointing that should be directed in the opposite direction.

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      I get your point, but how have African American's harmed the United States of America?  What wrongs against our country by the black community does the nation have to forget?  Seems to me like a one way street in that regard.  Also, it's a lot easier to tell someone else to forget how they have been wronged. This is such a stupid argument, on virtually every level. Start with the premise that blacks are not integrated into our society. Of course they are well integrated, in spite of actual programs to prevent that over long periods of time, namely segregation. You may be asking about how those other groups have prospered more in our society. Which anyone of any intelligence should expect. Only one group was brought here as slaves and kept in that status for 100+ years.  Only one group was systematically stripped of their culture in every regard. History, religion, customs, and community. Only one group once freed were ushered toward urban seats of government where they would be protected by federal authority (the only one that showed any concern for them).  Only one group was legally segregated from society for generations even after being freed from slavery.  Only one group started with all members at the bottom of society.  Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place. That is active in helping new immigrants become established. The newly freed black southerner couldn't move into an enclave of established blacks already prosperous in Indiana.That is ridiculous. Most minority groups have group specific leaders. None of the other groups have had to struggle against even comparable societal impediments. So it is natural that we have seen more of black leaders championing black issues over time.

      While I dont feel like taking 20 minutes to tear apart your post line by line, the abbreviated version boils down to the ultimate fallback to the AA community is slavery. As horrible as that was, it might be time to start living in the present, thinking about the future, and how to advance yourself in the current world. You then go on to state " Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place". I wasn't aware African Americans didnt have an established community currently, can you elaborate on that?By your logic, the Jewish should still be demonstrating against Germany. If you want to hold a 50+ year grudge, against something you probably didnt live through or experience, thats your prerogative, but don't be surprised if nothing is changed.

      Do you honestly believe black people in general don't want to live in the present and look to the future?  Their present includes disproportionate arrest and incarceration, for disproportionate sentences, while being born disproportionally into poverty and failed school systems. I'm sure you would say all that present is on them and their community. Yes of course. The urban areas blacks were compelled to settle into are disproportionately impoverished.  I'm sure you would say those areas became that way because of how they act and not the death of American urban industry. I'm sure our inner cities would be thriving today if they were all white and Hispanic. If German Jews had been segregated and treated post WWII the way American blacks were post slavery, I'm guessing there would continue to be Jewish protest of Germany.  I don't think German Jews have had to deal with significantly higher rates of arrest/incarceration, segregation, and institutional racism post WWII however.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 655

      Thread:You make justifiable arguments, but in all gentleness, I would say to put the past behind you and do the best you can with what life brings your way in the present.To have "bads" from the past in your mind is counter-productive to your present day happiness.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 5954

      What I’m saying is it’s still hard to put the past behind you when you are born in certain neighborhoods in many of our cities.  Negative behaviors are fostered, regardless of race, in abject poverty. At least if you grew up poor in the places I grew up, you went to school with all rich and middle income kids. In the slums of our cities, the kids don't even get that.  They get the shitty home life and they are going to crappy schools with nothing else but other poor kids.  Your attitude suggests that blacks made the slums into the slums and now should just turn them back into regular neighborhoods. Because, again, my opinion is that population was herded into our cities and has really only in the last generation or two really broken out into living in "America".  Hell, there are stiil several states, or areas of states, where there is no where close to a representative population of black folks. But maybe a better mind set is really what is holding the race back as a whole.

    • mike25315

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      Post count: 1874

      Thread:You make justifiable arguments, but in all gentleness, I would say to put the past behind you and do the best you can with what life brings your way in the present.To have "bads" from the past in your mind is counter-productive to your present day happiness.

      It's not the bads from the past that are our greatest hindrance--it's the present bads. In another thread I asked a simple question that no one responded to. I posted a quote that basically said " Jameis was not intelligent enough to be a successful NFL QB.  We all now know Jameis is extremely intelligent. So what gave the poster the idea that Jameis was not intelligent enough without knowing anything about that kid's mental ability. There were many posters on here who felt the same way. Why? It's preconceived prejudices. Prejudices that affect so much of how we are viewed,judged and treated. Forget about slavery or Jim Crow, the most destructive thing you can do to a people is destroy their history. My last name is Scottish and means barrel makers. But that's not my history. We are the only group in this country whose name does not link them to their history. Do a study on the importance of history and maybe you can catch a clue about how it affects a people.I keep hearing how we are not progressing like other groups. That's plain ignorant. In the last 40 years, no other subgroup in this country has progressed more in terms of business ownerships, advanced degrees and climbing economically than black women.Look it up.Yes 70 % of blacks are born out of wedlock and that's our greatest problem no question about it-- but look up what group is closing the gap the fastest.I keep reading about the high% of blacks being killed in the inner cities--but more of a certain group will die this year from drug over doses than blacks are murdered. And dead is dead. And all you want to talk about is what we need to do.Clean your own house before you point fingers. The 1% understand divide and conquer. As long the 99% keep seeing each others as  the enemy and the problem and keep warring against each other, we're all going to continue getting screwed with out a lubricant. See the George Carlin thread.

    • mike25315

      Participant
      Post count: 1874

      Thread:You make justifiable arguments, but in all gentleness, I would say to put the past behind you and do the best you can with what life brings your way in the present.To have "bads" from the past in your mind is counter-productive to your present day happiness.

      It's not the bads from the past that are our greatest hindrance--it's the present bads. In another thread I asked a simple question that no one responded to. I posted a quote that basically said " Jameis was not intelligent enough to be a successful NFL QB.  We all now know Jameis is extremely intelligent. So what gave the poster the idea that Jameis was not intelligent enough without knowing anything about that kid's mental ability. There were many posters on here who felt the same way. Why? It's preconceived prejudices. Prejudices that affect so much of how we are viewed,judged and treated. Forget about slavery or Jim Crow, the most destructive thing you can do to a people is destroy their history. My last name is Scottish and means barrel makers. But that's not my history. We are the only group in this country whose name does not link them to their history. Do a study on the importance of history and maybe you can catch a clue about how it affects a people.I keep hearing how we are not progressing like other groups. That's plain ignorant. In the last 40 years, no other subgroup in this country has progressed more in terms of business ownerships, advanced degrees and climbing economically than black women.Look it up.Yes 70 % of blacks are born out of wedlock and that's our greatest problem no question about it-- but look up what group is closing the gap the fastest.I keep reading about the high% of blacks being killed in the inner cities--but more of a certain group will die this year from drug over doses than blacks are murdered. And dead is dead. And all you want to talk about is what we need to do.Clean your own house before you point fingers. The 1% understand divide and conquer. As long the 99% keep seeing each others as  the enemy and the problem and keep warring against each other, we're all going to continue getting screwed with out a lubricant. See the George Carlin thread.

      From an article called What is Implicit Bias.http://www.vox.com/2014/12/26/7443979/racism-implicit-racial-biasThere's a word for why we're all probably at least a little bit racist, even if we really don't want to be: Implicit bias. It's a term that describes what's happening when, despite our best intentions and without our awareness, racial stereotypes and assumptions creep into our minds and affect our actions.It seeps into just about every aspect of life, including areas like criminal justice that can have deadly consequences. Thirty years of neurology and cognitive psychology studies show that it influences the way we see and treat others, even when we're absolutely determined to be, and believe we are being, fair and objective.That's why implicit racial bias has been called "the new diversity paradigm — one that recognizes the role that bias plays in the day-to-day functioning of all human beings."Here's what you need to know about how it works, how it permeates American life from education to health to policing, and why, as Obama suggested, it can be even more insidious than the kinds of racism that are most familiar to us

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2862

      Much of your “black community”is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

    • mike25315

      Participant
      Post count: 1874

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      "Much of your black community is an absolute disgrace. "You have more of your community on welfare than we do.You have more people dying senseless deaths--mine from murder--yours from drug overdoses.You have more trailer trash than we have ghetto thugs.Over that last two decades no segment of the population has a greater increase in out of wedlock births than your community.Is that not an absolute disgrace.People are tired of your condescending attitudes and finger pointing when you have just as many problems as we do.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 5954

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      It is my opinion  that the other side of this debate far too often boils down to the above sentiment. Much of the conversation here is the above in slightly more polite terminology, imo.  I consider the above sentiment racist to it's core and want to separate myself from it as far as possible.

    • mike25315

      Participant
      Post count: 1874

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      I hate being antagonistic, but just do me a favor and read this article then come back and comment.  http://www.vox.com/2014/12/26/7443979/racism-implicit-racial-bias

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2862

      What’s a discussion without TK and his penchant for drama.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2862

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      I hate being antagonistic, but just do me a favor and read this article then come back and comment.  http://www.vox.com/2014/12/26/7443979/racism-implicit-racial-bias

      I'll be happy to do it a little later in the day.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      Harry – why you gotta play the race card again?  We all know why Winston had questions.  And it wasn’t because of race.

    • mike25315

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      Post count: 1874

      Harry - why you gotta play the race card again?  We all know why Winston had questions.  And it wasn't because of race.

      Not talking about the questions that are well known. Why is it so difficult to get that one question answered.Harry why you gotta play the race card again? Isn't that what this thread is all about and I didn't start it. I've been trying so hard to just read what's on the board and keep my opinions to myself, but this one demanded a reply.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 5954

      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      Not talking about the questions that are well known. Why is it so difficult to get that one question answered. Isn't that what this thread is all about and I didn't start it. I've been trying so hard to just read what's on the board and keep my opinions to myself, but this one demanded a reply.

      ive answered that question for you 100x.  You just don’t like the truth.  It wasn’t a racial issue with Winston.  It was his off the field issues.  Now the fsuAdvocate can defend each one, but there were still many that made the news.  I don’t know the exact quotes, but I believe that Winston on multiple occasions said he needed to make better decisions.  He’s referenced it when speaking about his suspension.Nothing should ever be about picking sides or racism will continue to stay relevant.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      you consider that picking sides or stating facts?  Much of the “white community” needs to take responsibility also.  But the America we have trys to spin every little quote into hatred and discrimination.

    • Anonymous

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      If you consider those to be facts, there is honestly no point for us to continue discussion on the topic.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 655

      ‘But the America we have tries to spin every little quote into hatred and discrimination.”Unfortunately the media does this far too often.  Controversy makes for viewers, and if a statement can be construed to show a racial bias, the media seems far too eager to do so.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      I certainly consider these to be facts. 

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1419

      Lol 2 beer Cyrus:

      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      Fair points and as much as I'm loath to compare one demographic to another, just to followup on your point. One would be hard pressed to find a group more discriminated against throughout recorded history than the Jews. Kicked out of one country after the other, starting over after persecution and working their way to the top. When it comes to overcoming oppression they consistently win the gold medal.Anyway, the black experience in America. I think we can all acknowledge going back it is a horrendous one. It was not that long ago when blacks were not taught how to read and write and segregation caused an entire group of people to be put in the back of the bus for generations. Remnants of that still exist.  Watch the video on the teams official site featuring J Winston and his family as they talk about his early years. The house he grew up in, the neighborhood he lived in, even the way his older family members speak. For me it was a reminder that those oppressive years, especially in the deep south were really not that long ago.My own daughter (white) as part of her university experience just spent the past several months working with at-risk kids, all black, that literally come from the other side of the tracks. Kids 5-6 years old that were born into poverty, few clothes, ill- fitting shoes. Nonetheless one of her little mentees actually has a photograph of her taped to the wall above her bed, representing someone she looks up to, someone she feels loves her, someone that makes her feel special. That little girl lives with her "Aunt". Shows tell-tale signs of possible abuse. Hardly ever sees her mother, never sees her father. More than once my daughter has told me stories and showed me photos that have brought this "jaded old man" to tears. It's very sad when I think about what the future might hold for those little innocent kids. So the "bad" truly is still there. But, it's time to stop blaming others.So what do we see? Certain aspects of black society and the Liberal mindset that invariably accompanies it, a lack of self discipline and embracing of the type of negative stereotype that values the worst aspects of society. Drugs, crime , incarceration, gangs, fatherless children, welfare abuse, the whole gambit. Groups like BLM have the temerity to in essence say "it's the white man that's always trying to keep us down".  What was once a valid a reason has now become an excuse. Unfortunately, it is long past time "the black community" took a hard look in the mirror and make a decision irrespective of who or what group that they feel may be at fault for their circumstance and embrace their responsibility, set aside whatever they feel is holding them back and make the change they want see in their community. Positive change. Because what I'm seeing now, especially of late, is very little but a ratcheting up of racial bigotry from that side of the fence and a lot of finger pointing that should be directed in the opposite direction.

      vs 2 cups of coffee Cyrus:

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      Lol!Entirely agree with your first post, bud, half agree with your second.  The other half agreeing with Harry; in reality, every culture has their lazy, two-bit f*cks, who need to get their sh*t together and foster better communities/families.I will say, however, to Harry:One version of "senseless deaths" comes from an inward pursuit of an altered reality within ones mind, and only physically afflicts themselves.The other version comes from an external pursuit of respect, power, capital gains, revenge, or violence for the sake of violence, and physically afflicts other members of society.In white culture, the worst of us are ridiculed by normal citizens.  We put them on display and make fun of them until they're no longer useful to us, and we move on to making fun of somebody newer and worse off than us, and we get better that way (see: Honey Boo Boo)In black culture, it seems the worst of you are put on a pedestal, presented to the kids as something to be emulated. No white people WANT to be honey boo boo, or be the guys from Trailer Park Boys; we laugh AT them.  But if u "beez in the trap", that's somehow cool.  Like being on the corner doing sh*t with your life is presented as something cool.  It's glorified.  Then they go and watch Freddie Gibbs making crack in his latest rap video, and instead of saying to themselves "Jesus what a (censored)ty and scary life", like I do, they say "hey! Cool! That could be me! Look how cool his life seems!"  It's like there's strength and validation coming from that idea that "you're in the sh*t". And I get that, but at some point, don't you think black people need to become a little less "cool" for their own good? It's a from the bottom and from the top kind of thing, across the board, just stop trying to be so f*ckin cool and edgy, you know what I mean?  It's like that interlude on Kendricks first album that is so powerful, his dad telling him: "'real' is responsibility, 'real' is takin care of your muhf*ckin family, 'real' is God...."

    • Anonymous

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      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      "Much of your black community is an absolute disgrace. "You have more of your community on welfare than we do.You have more people dying senseless deaths--mine from murder--yours from drug overdoses.You have more trailer trash than we have ghetto thugs.Over that last two decades no segment of the population has a greater increase in out of wedlock births than your community.Is that not an absolute disgrace.People are tired of your condescending attitudes and finger pointing when you have just as many problems as we do.

      why does it matter which community is worse?  How about both communities work on cleaning up their own houses?

    • Anonymous

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      Harry - why you gotta play the race card again?  We all know why Winston had questions.  And it wasn't because of race.

      Not talking about the questions that are well known. Why is it so difficult to get that one question answered.Harry why you gotta play the race card again? Isn't that what this thread is all about and I didn't start it. I've been trying so hard to just read what's on the board and keep my opinions to myself, but this one demanded a reply.

      I refuse to be sucked in. Having a rational conversation on this topic under the cloak of anonymity that the internet provides, is futile.

    • Anonymous

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      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      you consider that picking sides or stating facts?  Much of the "white community" needs to take responsibility also.  But the America we have trys to spin every little quote into hatred and discrimination.

      It was stating facts ..... and picking sides, which is what this thread is all about. The BLM's and Al Sharptons saying the "white community" needs to take responsibility is stating facts and picking sides also. The radicals on both sides need to just stfu and work from within to help this thing continue to work itself out organically .... and that's going to take time. It, it being race relations, is tons better than it was in the 60's but still a long way to goAs far as this thread's concerned, it took 350 years to get where it was in the 60's and to expect the Blacks to just get over it in 50 years seems pretty much unreasonable  The majority of the previous generations suffered policies designed to destroy the family structure of an enslaved population. The family structure is the backbone of most Communities. To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

    • Anonymous

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      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      you consider that picking sides or stating facts?  Much of the "white community" needs to take responsibility also.  But the America we have trys to spin every little quote into hatred and discrimination.

      It was stating facts ..... and picking sides, which is what this thread is all about. The BLM's and Al Sharptons saying the "white community" needs to take responsibility is stating facts and picking sides also. The radicals on both sides need to just stfu and work from within to help this thing continue to work itself out organically .... and that's going to take time. It, it being race relations, is tons better than it was in the 60's but still a long way to goAs far as this thread's concerned, it took 350 years to get where it was in the 60's and to expect the Blacks to just get over it in 50 years seems pretty much unreasonable  The majority of the previous generations suffered policies designed to destroy the family structure of an enslaved population. The family structure is the backbone of most Communities. To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      Also, this.Dumbass white people be like "black people are STILL rioting and complaining!?" every two weeks - like it hasn't JUST BEEN TWO WEEKS.  Gonna take yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaars people.... So buckle up and maybe stop being dicks to eachother in the meantime, that might help

    • Anonymous

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      When the Black Community embraces education it will start to go much faster.

    • Anonymous

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      I certainly consider these to be facts. 

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      So you have a love for over-generalizations?

    • Anonymous

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      When the Black Community embraces education it will start to go much faster.

      You do realize that Black Men and Women enroll in higher education at higher rates than their White counterparts, right?There is no basis in 2016 to state that the White Community values education more than the Black Community.

    • vlagatta

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      Post count: 2638

      As far as this thread's concerned, it took 350 years to get where it was in the 60's and to expect the Blacks to just get over it in 50 years seems pretty much unreasonable  The majority of the previous generations suffered policies designed to destroy the family structure of an enslaved population. The family structure is the backbone of most Communities. To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      slavery was horrendous....we all know that.  that said......we did far worse things to others......and they got over it in about 15 years.  Keep reading...because this ties in nicely with "Fathers matter"....specifically, what we did to the Vietnamese is mind numbing.  we did not simply enslave them.  we dropped ridiculous amounts of munitions on them for well over a decade...... everything from cluster bombs and daisy cutters to phosphorous and  napalm.........meant to stick to whatever it touched......and burn for hours.  we literally incinerated children daily.......  we destroyed cities and babies and children......families.....farmers......everything we could destroy we did.......even their fields and crops. and for good measure we dropped land mines..... insane amounts of deaths......to people who had no beef with us.....yet the war ended.and when it did....many of them came here.many of them.as a family unit.....because that is their culture.and because of that........most thrived wonderfully.they were given no hand outs.they "got over it" and are grateful to be here.they expect no reparations or apologies.they just want to protect their family...and extended family....and live the American Dream.and that right there supports the thread title.......and the reason why the two groups turned out so radically different.one group wants more and more.the other wants only to be left to lead their lives and not only survive, but prosper.

    • Anonymous

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      Cyrus:You raise an important issue.When there has been a "bad" in the past like slavery, it is so important that it be forgotten-- That the present moment be dealt with and the past be left to die naturally. There are situations like the Palestinians and the Jew, where both side can point to "bads" done by the other side.  If these bads are clung to there can never be any peaceful integration.The US has had Jews, and Irish, and Chinese and Cubans and Latins come to the US and thought they might not have been liked in the beginning, they have more or less integrated into the US society.The only group that have leaders who champion their cause are the Blacks--civil rights leaders--- but for the most part all these leaders do is highlight the "bads" from the past (often for their own economic gain) and integration into society goes at a slower pace. Progress will inevitably be made and the sooner the focus is on legally improving my present situation without reference to the past, the faster the progress will be.

      I get your point, but how have African American's harmed the United States of America?  What wrongs against our country by the black community does the nation have to forget?  Seems to me like a one way street in that regard.  Also, it's a lot easier to tell someone else to forget how they have been wronged. This is such a stupid argument, on virtually every level. Start with the premise that blacks are not integrated into our society. Of course they are well integrated, in spite of actual programs to prevent that over long periods of time, namely segregation. You may be asking about how those other groups have prospered more in our society. Which anyone of any intelligence should expect. Only one group was brought here as slaves and kept in that status for 100+ years.  Only one group was systematically stripped of their culture in every regard. History, religion, customs, and community. Only one group once freed were ushered toward urban seats of government where they would be protected by federal authority (the only one that showed any concern for them).  Only one group was legally segregated from society for generations even after being freed from slavery.  Only one group started with all members at the bottom of society.  Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place. That is active in helping new immigrants become established. The newly freed black southerner couldn't move into an enclave of established blacks already prosperous in Indiana.That is ridiculous. Most minority groups have group specific leaders. None of the other groups have had to struggle against even comparable societal impediments. So it is natural that we have seen more of black leaders championing black issues over time.

      While I dont feel like taking 20 minutes to tear apart your post line by line, the abbreviated version boils down to the ultimate fallback to the AA community is slavery. As horrible as that was, it might be time to start living in the present, thinking about the future, and how to advance yourself in the current world. You then go on to state " Many specific Asian groups prosper quickly because they have an established community already in place". I wasn't aware African Americans didnt have an established community currently, can you elaborate on that?By your logic, the Jewish should still be demonstrating against Germany. If you want to hold a 50+ year grudge, against something you probably didnt live through or experience, thats your prerogative, but don't be surprised if nothing is changed.

      Do you honestly believe black people in general don't want to live in the present and look to the future?  Their present includes disproportionate arrest and incarceration, for disproportionate sentences, while being born disproportionally into poverty and failed school systems. I'm sure you would say all that present is on them and their community. Yes of course. The urban areas blacks were compelled to settle into are disproportionately impoverished.  I'm sure you would say those areas became that way because of how they act and not the death of American urban industry. I'm sure our inner cities would be thriving today if they were all white and Hispanic. If German Jews had been segregated and treated post WWII the way American blacks were post slavery, I'm guessing there would continue to be Jewish protest of Germany.  I don't think German Jews have had to deal with significantly higher rates of arrest/incarceration, segregation, and institutional racism post WWII however.

      All black people? Certainly not. But there is a decent subsection that do feel that way, I have spoken to them. The good Reverend and Mr. Jackson hurt the cause more than they help, at times. The sad part about the arrest and incarceration rate is that your community is trying to elect the wife of person who headed that bill. As to the born to poverty issue, I'm not sure how you can blame it on anything other than the community. I guess you can cop out and blame the government but I would like to see the argument otherwise. To your next point, Im not sure what an "American urban industry" exactly is, quick google search turned up some store in the UK.And onto the last, Japanese were held in camps on US soil, but strangely they don't hold the same views.

    • Anonymous

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      So you have a love for over-generalizations?

      i have a love for simplicity.

    • vlagatta

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      Post count: 2638

      And onto the last, Japanese were held in camps on US soil, but strangely they don't hold the same views.

      Internment camps -vs- the bataan death march.  are you kidding me?

    • Anonymous

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      To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      Dumbass white people be like "black people are STILL rioting and complaining!?" every two weeks - like it hasn't JUST BEEN TWO WEEKS.  Gonna take yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaars people.... So buckle up and maybe stop being dicks to eachother in the meantime, that might help

      just to be on the same page – is there a timeline for recovery?  How many more generations?

    • Anonymous

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      So you have a love for over-generalizations?

      i have a love for simplicity.

      So, to simply put it, you view most Black Americans as being "disgraceful"?

    • Anonymous

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      So, to simply put it, you view most Black Americans as being "disgraceful"?

      lets not go changing words.  “Much of” was the original statement.  I actually thought about changing that – but much of the black community is a “disgrace”.  Much of the black community is not.  Much of the white community is a disgrace.  Much of the white community is not.I do not view "most" black Americans as being disgraceful.

    • Anonymous

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      So, to simply put it, you view most Black Americans as being "disgraceful"?

      lets not go changing words.  "Much of" was the original statement.  I actually thought about changing that - but much of the black community is a "disgrace".  Much of the black community is not.  Much of the white community is a disgrace.  Much of the white community is not.I do not view "most" black Americans as being disgraceful.

      I'm not changing any words. I asked. "Much of" does leave an opening to interpretation regarding the amount, and I asked if your interpretation was of "most", which seemed to be the implication there with "much of".I'd agree, plenty of disgraceful behavior from humanity in general, regardless of color/culture/etc.

    • Anonymous

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      To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      Dumbass white people be like "black people are STILL rioting and complaining!?" every two weeks - like it hasn't JUST BEEN TWO WEEKS.  Gonna take yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaars people.... So buckle up and maybe stop being dicks to eachother in the meantime, that might help

      just to be on the same page - is there a timeline for recovery?  How many more generations?

      If you are talking about those why still play the slavery card, which is something else in this thread that seems to be an overstatement, then the answer is 0 generations. There is no need to point to slavery when talking about the some of the issues Black people face in this country regarding the criminal justice system. You can make your point with out it. As far as the subject of police brutality or LEO overreach goes, that is a problem for citizens of all colors, and isn't an exclusive problem for Black people. Police Reform in general could fix most of the major issues for all citizens, Black Lives included.

    • Anonymous

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      I'm not changing any words. I asked. "Much of" does leave an opening to interpretation regarding the amount, and I asked if your interpretation was of "most", which seemed to be the implication there with "much of".I'd agree, plenty of disgraceful behavior from humanity in general, regardless of color/culture/etc.

      gotcha, apologize for taking it the wrong way.I think there are good people and bad people.  Responsible ones and ones looking for excuses.  But the answers just seem to simple for me.  Be a good person.  Is that easy?  Of course not.  Is it more difficult for some?  Definitely.  But everyone has a choice.  We need everyone to start making better choices.

    • Anonymous

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      As far as this thread's concerned, it took 350 years to get where it was in the 60's and to expect the Blacks to just get over it in 50 years seems pretty much unreasonable  The majority of the previous generations suffered policies designed to destroy the family structure of an enslaved population. The family structure is the backbone of most Communities. To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      slavery was horrendous....we all know that.  that said......we did far worse things to others......and they got over it in about 15 years.  Keep reading...because this ties in nicely with "Fathers matter"....specifically, what we did to the Vietnamese is mind numbing.  we did not simply enslave them.  we dropped ridiculous amounts of munitions on them for well over a decade...... everything from cluster bombs and daisy cutters to phosphorous and  napalm.........meant to stick to whatever it touched......and burn for hours.  we literally incinerated children daily.......  we destroyed cities and babies and children......families.....farmers......everything we could destroy we did.......even their fields and crops. and for good measure we dropped land mines..... insane amounts of deaths......to people who had no beef with us.....yet the war ended.and when it did....many of them came here.many of them.as a family unit.....because that is their culture.and because of that........most thrived wonderfully.they were given no hand outs.they "got over it" and are grateful to be here.they expect no reparations or apologies.they just want to protect their family...and extended family....and live the American Dream.and that right there supports the thread title.......and the reason why the two groups turned out so radically different.one group wants more and more.the other wants only to be left to lead their lives and not only survive, but prosper.

      This whole comparing the Black history in the United States to Asians, Jews, etc is one of the dumbest arguments I've seen in this discussion and this is just the icing on the cake ...

    • Anonymous

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      Darnit, should have read this thread before the Target one!With that said, I'm with Cyrus.  Not many want to take real responsibility.  It's not about picking sides.  It's not us vs you.  It's our country.  There's good people and there's bad people.  And too many excuses.

      Much of your "black community"is an absolute disgrace. Take some responsibility and stop rationalizing. Tell your male population to start being fathers to their kids. People are tired of the excuse making.

      you consider that picking sides or stating facts?  Much of the "white community" needs to take responsibility also.  But the America we have trys to spin every little quote into hatred and discrimination.

      It was stating facts ..... and picking sides, which is what this thread is all about. The BLM's and Al Sharptons saying the "white community" needs to take responsibility is stating facts and picking sides also. The radicals on both sides need to just stfu and work from within to help this thing continue to work itself out organically .... and that's going to take time. It, it being race relations, is tons better than it was in the 60's but still a long way to goAs far as this thread's concerned, it took 350 years to get where it was in the 60's and to expect the Blacks to just get over it in 50 years seems pretty much unreasonable  The majority of the previous generations suffered policies designed to destroy the family structure of an enslaved population. The family structure is the backbone of most Communities. To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      Also, this.Dumbass white people be like "black people are STILL rioting and complaining!?" every two weeks - like it hasn't JUST BEEN TWO WEEKS.  Gonna take yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaars people.... So buckle up and maybe stop being dicks to eachother in the meantime, that might help

      on the other side of the coin, dumbass black people be like "all dem cops r murderes fuk u pigs oink oink fry like bacon"all cops = murderersusing that same logicall muslims = terrorists

    • Anonymous

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      Chance:You are right to say that black enrollment, especially in the 2 year programs have increase markedly:This from "The Atlantic"Since 1994, black enrollment has doubled at institutions that primarily grant associate degrees, including community colleges. In 2013, black students accounted for 16 percent of the student body there, versus 11 percent in 1994.Universities focusing on bachelor’s, master’s, and doctoral degrees also broadly saw gains, with blacks making up 14 percent of the population, compared to 11 percent in 1994.But at top-tier universities, black undergraduate populations average 6 percent, a statistic that has remained largely flat for 20 years. (It’s less than half of what their share of the population might suggest; the Census reports that 15 percent of Americans between the ages of 20 and 24 are black.) While some schools have had success—the University of Missouri’s main campus has actually increased its black share by 3 percentage points since 1994—the median school barely budged.(At Harvard, for example, 6.5 percent of undergraduates were black in 2013, down from 7.4 percent in 1994.)Definitely a step in the right direction, with the promise of better things to come in the future.

    • Anonymous

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      To expect them to magically recover from all the damage done during the previous 14 generations in just 2 is a ******* joke.

      Dumbass white people be like "black people are STILL rioting and complaining!?" every two weeks - like it hasn't JUST BEEN TWO WEEKS.  Gonna take yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaars people.... So buckle up and maybe stop being dicks to eachother in the meantime, that might help

      just to be on the same page - is there a timeline for recovery?  How many more generations?

      More than 2 and less than 16 ...

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      This whole comparing the Black history in the United States to Asians, Jews, etc is one of the dumbest arguments I've seen in this discussion and this is just the icing on the cake ...

      right back atcha' babe

    • Anonymous

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      So you have a love for over-generalizations?

      i have a love for simplicity.

      Inigo-Montoya-WORD-MEANS.jpgj/kwho doesn't love a little PB?

    • Anonymous

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      Simplicity – the quality or condition of being easy to understand or do.

    • Anonymous

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      Blah

      Blah blah

      Blah blah blah

      Do you honestly believe black people in general don't want to live in the present and look to the future?  Their present includes disproportionate arrest and incarceration, for disproportionate sentences, while being born disproportionally into poverty and failed school systems. I'm sure you would say all that present is on them and their community. Yes of course. The urban areas blacks were compelled to settle into are disproportionately impoverished.  I'm sure you would say those areas became that way because of how they act and not the death of American urban industry. I'm sure our inner cities would be thriving today if they were all white and Hispanic. If German Jews had been segregated and treated post WWII the way American blacks were post slavery, I'm guessing there would continue to be Jewish protest of Germany.  I don't think German Jews have had to deal with significantly higher rates of arrest/incarceration, segregation, and institutional racism post WWII however.

      All black people? Certainly not. But there is a decent subsection that do feel that way, I have spoken to them. The good Reverend and Mr. Jackson hurt the cause more than they help, at times. The sad part about the arrest and incarceration rate is that your community is trying to elect the wife of person who headed that bill. As to the born to poverty issue, I'm not sure how you can blame it on anything other than the community. I guess you can cop out and blame the government but I would like to see the argument otherwise. To your next point, Im not sure what an "American urban industry" exactly is, quick google search turned up some store in the UK.And onto the last, Japanese were held in camps on US soil, but strangely they don't hold the same views.

      You've spoken to a decent subsection of black Americans?  Listen to yourself.  You use the "your community" incorrectly in the way you mean. I do feel possession of it in the way I do every American community.  As a part of us. I told you how blacks in the ghettos of our countries came to be, concisely, in the "blah blah" post in this tree. It's overwhelming environment, and despite your racist views, blacks didn't make our inner cities into slums.  I guess if you don't understand what I mean by the death of American urban industry, you wouldn't understand what happened in many of our largest cities over the 20th century. So you probably also aren't very knowledgeable on "sun down" laws/communities or the migration patterns of the post slavery black population in our country.  Don't let that stop you from strong opinions on the matter. Are you fucking kidding me with a few years of internment?  You do realize we paid reparations to that community/descendants along with formal apology by Reagan in 88?  I'd swear I've even heard of efforts for further compensation since.

    • Anonymous

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      this thread is an example of our problem

    • Anonymous

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      Lol

    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1151

      Blah

      Blah blah

      Blah blah blah

      Do you honestly believe black people in general don't want to live in the present and look to the future?  Their present includes disproportionate arrest and incarceration, for disproportionate sentences, while being born disproportionally into poverty and failed school systems. I'm sure you would say all that present is on them and their community. Yes of course. The urban areas blacks were compelled to settle into are disproportionately impoverished.  I'm sure you would say those areas became that way because of how they act and not the death of American urban industry. I'm sure our inner cities would be thriving today if they were all white and Hispanic. If German Jews had been segregated and treated post WWII the way American blacks were post slavery, I'm guessing there would continue to be Jewish protest of Germany.  I don't think German Jews have had to deal with significantly higher rates of arrest/incarceration, segregation, and institutional racism post WWII however.

      All black people? Certainly not. But there is a decent subsection that do feel that way, I have spoken to them. The good Reverend and Mr. Jackson hurt the cause more than they help, at times. The sad part about the arrest and incarceration rate is that your community is trying to elect the wife of person who headed that bill. As to the born to poverty issue, I'm not sure how you can blame it on anything other than the community. I guess you can cop out and blame the government but I would like to see the argument otherwise. To your next point, Im not sure what an "American urban industry" exactly is, quick google search turned up some store in the UK.And onto the last, Japanese were held in camps on US soil, but strangely they don't hold the same views.

      You've spoken to a decent subsection of black Americans?  Listen to yourself.  You use the "your community" incorrectly in the way you mean. I do feel possession of it in the way I do every American community.  As a part of us. I told you how blacks in the ghettos of our countries came to be, concisely, in the "blah blah" post in this tree. It's overwhelming environment, and despite your racist views, blacks didn't make our inner cities into slums.  I guess if you don't understand what I mean by the death of American urban industry, you wouldn't understand what happened in many of our largest cities over the 20th century. So you probably also aren't very knowledgeable on "sun down" laws/communities or the migration patterns of the post slavery black population in our country.  Don't let that stop you from strong opinions on the matter. Are you (censored)ing kidding me with a few years of internment?  You do realize we paid reparations to that community/descendants along with formal apology by Reagan in 88?  I'd swear I've even heard of efforts for further compensation since.

      You sure spew many words that dont say much in the end. Start with the "American Urban industry", since you seem to be a self proclaimed guru on the subject.

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2015

      Harry - why you gotta play the race card again?  We all know why Winston had questions.  And it wasn't because of race.

      Not talking about the questions that are well known. Why is it so difficult to get that one question answered.Harry why you gotta play the race card again? Isn't that what this thread is all about and I didn't start it. I've been trying so hard to just read what's on the board and keep my opinions to myself, but this one demanded a reply.

      I refuse to be sucked in. Having a rational conversation on this topic under the cloak of anonymity that the internet provides, is futile.

      Amen.  I began to read this thread, with the absolute intention of not responding to anything posted, no matter how dumb; I just didn't expect to run into something this rational that I needed to agree with...

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 228

      This whole comparing the Black history in the United States to Asians, Jews, etc is one of the dumbest arguments I've seen in this discussion and this is just the icing on the cake ...

      right back atcha' babe

      I do owe you an apology. I had missed the one about the interred Japanese comparison. You've been bumped to second place.

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