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    • spartan

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      Post count: 822

      A couple of finger fudges and I totally screwed that one up.What I was going to say is does anyone really care that Sam was dratted. Look at all the websites and it is a monumental event.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      How was that a monumental event?Jonathan Martin was drafted by the Dolphins already.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1523

      How was that a monumental event?Jonathan Martin was drafted by the Dolphins already.

      and so ws Josh Freeman in the first round  :-X

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 517

      Be careful… the thought police are out in full force on this one. I could see it in Mayock's eyes as Rich Eisen droned on and on at the end of the NFLN coverage. "Please, can we keep the social commentary separate from our draft coverage". Instead of hearing about back end prospects it was "why isn't he getting drafted when a guy from Marist is...". The sports media has latched onto this as some major social event and are in full on crusade mode. To me the kid has handled it well and has basically asked to be looked at as a football player, which to me is the true definition of equality. His orientation doesn't mean anything to most people. Unfortunately we're going to be deluged with this like it's the second coming of Jackie Robinson breaking the color barrier...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      It’s all fun and games until someone drops the soap..er… football.Seriously, it's not monumental news. They act like he was the first gay player, when clearly that title belongs to dante wesley.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 122

      How was that a monumental event?Jonathan Martin was drafted by the Dolphins already.

      and so ws Josh Freeman in the first round  :-X

      All joking aside, I know for a FACT that Josh Freeman has been entertained in the company of men and is into guys. Best friend of mine is a club promoter and has had many first hand accounts with Josh. So he is gay. His brother is openly gay and I have met him, very VERY flamboyant. Is a near spitting image of Josh. They were all out at The Lodge one night, Dougie was with him as well and few others that I could tell were football players just didn't recognize them. But anyways, Michael Sam. Who gives a flying flip he's gay!? I mean really, this is the 21st Century. Get over it! I wouldn't be surprised if at least a 1/3 of the NFL or hell, maybe even half, have had some kind of homosexual thoughts or interactions.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2275

      You could tell the nfln cast was annoyed with Eisen and his Sam talk. He tried to spin everything into about him lol.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      You could tell the nfln cast was annoyed with Eisen and his Sam talk. He tried to spin everything into about him lol.

      Well, the producers kept playing that promotional piece about Sam so Eisen was probably following the direction of those same producers and asked to talk about it. Eisen is just the host, he reads the teleprompter and does what he's supposed to.Look, it is a fairly monumental thing. He's the first openly gay athlete to play in any of the major, American sports. That's big. We live in a very conservative-minded nation and there are a lot of people in our society who believe that homosexuality is wrong because of their religious ideals.The fact that an openly homosexual man is about to be welcomed into a place that is seen as very macho and manly is an important social hurdle for our society to get over. It doesn't matter how you or I feel about Sam or his sexuality, this is an important moment in America's sociological history.I think he's a prototypical, hand in the dirt, 4-3 end who can have a good, long career in this league. I don't know if he's ever going to be a 15-20 sack per year kind of guy, but I think he has the ability to be an 8-12 sack per year kind of guy, I think he can make some plays in the back field against the run, and I think he has the work ethic and obviously a HUGE chip on his shoulder. All 32 teams passed on him multiple times and he was drafted with a compensatory pick 8 spots before Mr. Irrelevant. Now he's going to learn under a great DL coach, prove himself as a special teamer and will be part of an organization that is well-run and has a good history.I'm rooting for him just like I root for every kid that's drafted. Now it's time to see if he can get to work and get it done.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1455

      You could tell the nfln cast was annoyed with Eisen and his Sam talk. He tried to spin everything into about him lol.

      Well, the producers kept playing that promotional piece about Sam so Eisen was probably following the direction of those same producers and asked to talk about it. Eisen is just the host, he reads the teleprompter and does what he's supposed to.Look, it is a fairly monumental thing. He's the first openly gay athlete to play in any of the major, American sports. That's big. We live in a very conservative-minded nation and there are a lot of people in our society who believe that homosexuality is wrong because of their religious ideals.The fact that an openly homosexual man is about to be welcomed into a place that is seen as very macho and manly is an important social hurdle for our society to get over. It doesn't matter how you or I feel about Sam or his sexuality, this is an important moment in America's sociological history.I think he's a prototypical, hand in the dirt, 4-3 end who can have a good, long career in this league. I don't know if he's ever going to be a 15-20 sack per year kind of guy, but I think he has the ability to be an 8-12 sack per year kind of guy, I think he can make some plays in the back field against the run, and I think he has the work ethic and obviously a HUGE chip on his shoulder. All 32 teams passed on him multiple times and he was drafted with a compensatory pick 8 spots before Mr. Irrelevant. Now he's going to learn under a great DL coach, prove himself as a special teamer and will be part of an organization that is well-run and has a good history.I'm rooting for him just like I root for every kid that's drafted. Now it's time to see if he can get to work and get it done.

      Did the NBA suddenly not count as part of one of the big 4?Jason Collins???

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      The fact that an openly homosexual man is about to be welcomed into a place that is seen as very macho and manly is an important social hurdle for our society to get over. It doesn't matter how you or I feel about Sam or his sexuality, this is an important moment in America's sociological history.

      Yep. Amazing how some don't see this. Leave it to Spartan to start a thread like this.Collins was a big deal but this is bigger as it's a draft pick and a guy who could play for a long time if he does well. Collins is a sub who doesn't play much and will retire soon.This is a big deal.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      To some maybe, but the fact is that most people don’t care. Which is pretty much the idea behind equality isn’t it? That was my point.What's more it belies the denial that whoever picked him will stir up a media circus and cause a distraction. It already has and it is still making the headlines.And, if it such a big deal, then we SHOULD be talking about it right? So why complain that it was "left to me" to start.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1271

      I was a fan of Sam after watching his tape, and don’t care at all that he’s gay, but after watching his shaky chin, pink shirt, and weak, creepy looking boyfriend, I”m really glad the Bucs didn’t take him.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5188

      I was a fan of Sam after watching his tape, and don't care at all that he's gay, but after watching his shaky chin, pink shirt, and weak looking boyfriend, I"m really glad the Bucs didn't take him.

      What about Clowney blubbering like some spoiled kid told no?Honestly, it sounds like you like your men to be square jawed, dark leather biker coat wearers who prefers men who hit the gym...llooll. Now that is a gay defensive end worthy of the YMCA.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1271

      To be honest, it was his choice of a boyfriend that made him undraftable IMO

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5188

      LMAO!How gay of you.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      To be honest, it was his choice of a boyfriend that made him undraftable IMO

      lmao!!!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      To some maybe, but the fact is that most people don't care. Which is pretty much the idea behind equality isn't it? That was my point.What's more it belies the denial that whoever picked him will stir up a media circus and cause a distraction. It already has and it is still making the headlines.And, if it such a big deal, then we SHOULD be talking about it right? So why complain that it was "left to me" to start.

      Most people care. They see why it's big deal.Some people were bothered by it. Some macho football fans were REALLY bothered by it.Media circus? I don't think so. There was yesterday and there will be coverage of how he does on his fist day/week and how the team does, but I doubt it will be a circus. Jason Collins coming out, which was a big story at the time, didn't distract/hurt his team. And after the initial stories, not much else was written about it that caused any problems for the them.At the time he first came out, some conservatives got it...Charles C. W. Cooke        @charlescwcookeIn a perfect world, nobody would care. But we don't live in one, and conservatives recognize that better than most. Good for Michael Sam.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 369

      I thought it was FABULOUS!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      Historic. Yep.http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Sports/2014/0511/Michael-Sam-Is-emotional-kiss-exactly-what-some-NFL-teams-were-afraid-ofRams coach Jeff Fisher is an old-school coach who will likely be able to keep "distractions" to a minimum. And Sam appears to be Fisher's type of player, writes Jeffri Chadiha of ESPN."Sam is a player who thrives because of his heart and will, a desire to outwork the competition. Fisher has long had affection for such players, and that's probably how Sam won him over."Back in 1946, the Rams signed Kenny Washington, the first African-American football player in the modern era of the NFL. Fisher was aware of the historical resonance Saturday."This is the second historic moment in the history of this franchise," he said. "From that standpoint, from a historic standpoint, I'm honored to be a part of that."

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      My point which I probably communicated pretty badly is that when we had the conversation about him POSSIBLY being drafter was that the point of the media circus was brought up and shot down in quite a derogative manner by some. Now that it has happened and the media goes beserk.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      Wow, I don’t remember anyone denying there would be a lot of media focused in on him.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 369

      I’ve never seen ESPN repeatedly showing a draftee kissing his girlfriend.  It’s a little a lot over the top.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1571

      I see no point in making a spectacle of the kid.  Michael Sam gets from me what he wants and deserves- my indifference.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I see no point in making a spectacle of the kid.  Michael Sam gets from me what he wants and deserves- my indifference.

      IMO, it's not about Sam. It's about a moment that will have an effect on the NFL and society. Hopefully, Sam will be left alone to focus on football.I'm sure there will be be some circus atmosphere but considering the historic nature of this, Fisher thought it was worth it. Plus, I think the "circus" will die out quickly.I wonder how much of a media circus took place when Jackie Robinson came to the Dodgers?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 13

      I hope Michael Sam is a player than can contribute to the Rams. That said, there’s been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum ) Sam deliberately created any and all distractions to promote his lifestyle as a spokesman for the LGBT community. He created a no win scenario for the Rams to deal with. If he’s cut at anytime, the LGBT mouthpieces will be on the airwaves screaming discrimination because he’s gay. So that leaves the Rams likely forced to keep him on roster not because of talent but for his lifestyle. Even if he’s just on the practice squad, the team still gets slammed with apologists and pro gay talking heads ready to pounce on this.Just makes me wonder if the same media outlets, comedians, etc that mocked Tim Tebow for wearing his faith on his sleeve will use the same venom on Sam for his lifestyle?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I hope Michael Sam is a player than can contribute to the Rams. That said, there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum ) Sam deliberately created any and all distractions to promote his lifestyle as a spokesman for the LGBT community. He created a no win scenario for the Rams to deal with. If he's cut at anytime, the LGBT mouthpieces will be on the airwaves screaming discrimination because he's gay. So that leaves the Rams likely forced to keep him on roster not because of talent but for his lifestyle. Even if he's just on the practice squad, the team still gets slammed with apologists and pro gay talking heads ready to pounce on this.Just makes me wonder if the same media outlets, comedians, etc that mocked Tim Tebow for wearing his faith on his sleeve will use the same venom on Sam for his lifestyle?

      OK, let's say Sam kept his sexual orientation to himself and was expected to be a first or second round pick.Certain players have cameras on them as the picks are announced. What would happen if he hadn't come but had his boyfriend with him and kissed him after he was picked? You think that wouldn't have created a firestorm? Or, are you saying he should hide who he is?* * * * *As far as others complaining about the kiss? He's far from the only one who had his significant other with him when he was picked.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N3bMOSfJng

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2169

      So what happens when he gets cut?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      Remember this one?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08rirsA8YaM

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 369

      I hope Michael Sam is a player than can contribute to the Rams. That said, there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum ) Sam deliberately created any and all distractions to promote his lifestyle as a spokesman for the LGBT community. He created a no win scenario for the Rams to deal with. If he's cut at anytime, the LGBT mouthpieces will be on the airwaves screaming discrimination because he's gay. So that leaves the Rams likely forced to keep him on roster not because of talent but for his lifestyle. Even if he's just on the practice squad, the team still gets slammed with apologists and pro gay talking heads ready to pounce on this.Just makes me wonder if the same media outlets, comedians, etc that mocked Tim Tebow for wearing his faith on his sleeve will use the same venom on Sam for his lifestyle?

      OK, let's say Sam kept his sexual orientation to himself and was expected to be a first or second round pick.Certain players have cameras on them as the picks are announced. What would happen if he hadn't come but had his boyfriend with him and kissed him after he was picked? You think that wouldn't have created a firestorm? Or, are you saying he should hide who he is?* * * * *As far as others complaining about the kiss? He's far from the only one who had his significant other with him when he was picked.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N3bMOSfJng

      Listen, I understand that you're excited that you finally have a gay guy in the NFL.  I'm happy for you and the rest of the LGBT community, but it's not like ESPN kept replying them kissing over and over like they did with Michael Tham.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2169

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      Listen, I understand that you're excited that you finally have a gay guy in the NFL.  I'm happy for you and the rest of the LGBT community, but it's not like ESPN kept replying them kissing over and over like they did with Michael Tham.

      Yeah, I think the Michael Sam thing was just a little bit more important.As far as your first comment? Time to grow up.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 13

      I hope Michael Sam is a player than can contribute to the Rams. That said, there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum ) Sam deliberately created any and all distractions to promote his lifestyle as a spokesman for the LGBT community. He created a no win scenario for the Rams to deal with. If he's cut at anytime, the LGBT mouthpieces will be on the airwaves screaming discrimination because he's gay. So that leaves the Rams likely forced to keep him on roster not because of talent but for his lifestyle. Even if he's just on the practice squad, the team still gets slammed with apologists and pro gay talking heads ready to pounce on this.Just makes me wonder if the same media outlets, comedians, etc that mocked Tim Tebow for wearing his faith on his sleeve will use the same venom on Sam for his lifestyle?

      OK, let's say Sam kept his sexual orientation to himself and was expected to be a first or second round pick.Certain players have cameras on them as the picks are announced. What would happen if he hadn't come but had his boyfriend with him and kissed him after he was picked? You think that wouldn't have created a firestorm? Or, are you saying he should hide who he is?* * * * *As far as others complaining about the kiss? He's far from the only one who had his significant other with him when he was picked.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N3bMOSfJng

      The jury is out on how well Sam maymay not make it as a pro. As far as his preference, I object out of my faith. I'll agree to disagree with those who support that lifestyle. To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics. There are scientists on both sides of the aisle to that. There's also scientists and geneticists that would support the likes of a Jerry Sandusky as well. To BucDaFackUp's question, if Sam gets cut, you can bet there'll be no mention of talent ( or lack thereof) but " he was let go because he's gay" blah blah blah

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2169

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

      Because this whole thing is NOT about football....

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      The jury is out on how well Sam maymay not make it as a pro. As far as his preference, I object out of my faith. I'll agree to disagree with those who support that lifestyle. To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics. There are scientists on both sides of the aisle to that. There's also scientists and geneticists that would support the likes of a Jerry Sandusky as well.

      The jury isn't out except for religious people who can't accept people for who they are.And you just connected homosexuality with child molestation. Brilliant.

      To BucDaFackUp's question, if Sam gets cut, you can bet there'll be no mention of talent ( or lack thereof) but " he was let go because he's gay" blah blah blah

      His "lack of talent" or the fact that many see him as a tweener has already been discussed. So, I'd bet you are wrong.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

      Because this whole thing is NOT about football....

      There's definitely more than football in play here. Fisher's comments make that obvious.But the SEC's co-defensive player of the year obviously has some talent. So, yes, football is the main thing here.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3420

      How was that a monumental event?Jonathan Martin was drafted by the Dolphins already.

      and so ws Josh Freeman in the first round  :-X

      All joking aside, I know for a FACT that Josh Freeman has been entertained in the company of men and is into guys. Best friend of mine is a club promoter and has had many first hand accounts with Josh. So he is gay. His brother is openly gay and I have met him, very VERY flamboyant. Is a near spitting image of Josh. They were all out at The Lodge one night, Dougie was with him as well and few others that I could tell were football players just didn't recognize them. But anyways, Michael Sam. Who gives a flying flip he's gay!? I mean really, this is the 21st Century. Get over it! I wouldn't be surprised if at least a 1/3 of the NFL or hell, maybe even half, have had some kind of homosexual thoughts or interactions.

      I know someone who went out with Josh who is female. She said when they went back to his place he was all about talking about his snakes. He has a bedroom just for his reptiles. She was creeped out by the snakes and never went out with him after that.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 369

      Listen, I understand that you're excited that you finally have a gay guy in the NFL.  I'm happy for you and the rest of the LGBT community, but it's not like ESPN kept replying them kissing over and over like they did with Michael Tham.

      Yeah, I think the Michael Sam thing was just a little bit more important.As far as your first comment? Time to grow up.

      What's the importance in showing them kissing over and over?  We already know he's gay.And I don't know what was juvenile about my first comment.  I really am happy for you.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2169

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

      Because this whole thing is NOT about football....

      There's definitely more than football in play here. Fisher's comments make that obvious.But the SEC's co-defensive player of the year obviously has some talent. So, yes, football is the main thing here.

      Expanding the convo: with the amount of fundamentalist Christians on the Bucs, would he survive in Tampa?samuel-l-jackson-as-jules2.jpg"...and I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger..."

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 13

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

      Because this whole thing is NOT about football....

      There's definitely more than football in play here. Fisher's comments make that obvious.But the SEC's co-defensive player of the year obviously has some talent. So, yes, football is the main thing here.

      True Joe, but remember, both Danny Wuerffel and Tim Tebow both won Heismans for their great collegiate play that didn't carry over in the pros. Sam, as a defensive player, should do better. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      So what happens when he gets cut?

      I don't know. What happens? He gets picked up by somebody else?Fisher will cut him if he isn't good enough. And after Fisher said what he said about this being historic, I don't think too many people will accuse him of cutting Sam because he's gay.

      Just expecting an entire legion of LGBT'ers converging on St Louis to troll Fisher is all...

      Even if they did, so what? Why would you care?

      Because this whole thing is NOT about football....

      There's definitely more than football in play here. Fisher's comments make that obvious.But the SEC's co-defensive player of the year obviously has some talent. So, yes, football is the main thing here.

      Get real. AJ McCarron who is a 3x National champion/Maxwell award winner/ BCS MVP fell to the 5th round. Is it because he is straight?Obviously being undersized and overachieving, Sam should consider himself lucky he was even drafted at all, no matter to a team with a stud DL to begin with.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      The libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC. Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      Just to clarify: if someone is supportive of Michael Sam, or indifferent to him, it’s because they are hiding their true feelings about homosexuality is wrong and they are obviously gay themselves. If someone is against Michael Sam it’s because they are expressing their actual feelings. Do I have that about right?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      True Joe, but remember, both Danny Wuerffel and Tim Tebow both won Heismans for their great collegiate play that didn't carry over in the pros. Sam, as a defensive player, should do better.

      And he may not make it. But if he IS cut, i don't see why there would be a big uproar over it being because he is gay. As I said, he was chosen and Fisher didn't shy away from the historic aspect of it.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      The libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC.Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.

      What are your real feelings, Stan?And some people are hesitant to express their real feelings on such a subject because they know if they say something stupid, there could be consequences with their jobs.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      Fisher didn’t shy away from the historic aspect of it.

      And why should Fisher shy away?  You guys are so shallow.  Who gives a crap if a guy is gay or not?    If he can play ball, he can play ball.  (as long as he doesn't try to play with his teammate's balls)

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1507

      The kiss isn’t a big deal. Lots of athletes are shown doing that.What I didn't need to see was two human beings feeding cake to each other like they were birds.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      The libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC.Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.

      What are your real feelings, Stan?And some people are hesitant to express their real feelings on such a subject because they know if they say something stupid, there could be consequences with their jobs.

      Define stupid as written in your comment.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1571

      OK I retract my vote of indifference.  He is annoying me now.  I flat out do not care that he is gay and I’m tired of hearing about him.  On NFL.com 9 of the front page links are about him and I can’t turn on NFLnetwork without seeing his face.  This is a lot of song and dance for the 249th pick.  I bet very few people could tell you the names of guy 248 and guy 250 without looking it up.  He is a football player that got drafted late due to very poor measurables and being a tweener in stature- nothing more, nothing less.I honestly think things like this hurt the gay community more than it helps.  Overexposure with things like this can push people away from indifference (which is what equality is at the base level).  Talking about it when it happened was fine.  Showing his reaction was cute the first couple times.  Its 2 days later now and most people (myself included) just want to talk about football.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      The libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC.Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.

      What are your real feelings, Stan?And some people are hesitant to express their real feelings on such a subject because they know if they say something stupid, there could be consequences with their jobs.

      Define stupid as written in your comment.

      People using the N word (or another derogatory word about a race) on a public message board , Facebook or Twitter. And they're not anonymous. Using derogatory words to describe gay people.Posting photos of yourself doing something stupid like posing in a German uniform and doing the Seig heil sign. I personally know somebody who got fired for that stupidity.It all depends what's written in your employee handbook and where you work. You boss is the one who can define "stupid."

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 9276

      To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      For those that believe it's a choice, i'd ask.....at what age(assuming you're a male) did you 'decide' that you like females? And assuming you're straight, do you think it's possible that you could one day wake up and 'decide' to be attracted to males?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      For those that believe it's a choice, i'd ask.....at what age(assuming you're a male) did you 'decide' that you like females? And assuming you're straight, do you think it's possible that you could one day wake up and 'decide' to be attracted to males?

      Due to your personal life experience, you would be the best one to answer this yourself.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOo18w3ydEE

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      For those that believe it's a choice, i'd ask.....at what age(assuming you're a male) did you 'decide' that you like females? And assuming you're straight, do you think it's possible that you could one day wake up and 'decide' to be attracted to males?

      Due to your personal life experience, you would be the best one to answer this yourself.

      Coming from the guy who loves the ladyboys.  ::)

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      The libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC. Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.

      Not everyone honestly believes a man took two of every animal onto a boat before some flood either. Was that you thinking for yourself? People are becoming more and more accepting, despite their own beliefs, and you're being left behind. You have the right to believe what you want, just letting you know that most of the people with that thinking will be embarrassed (hopefully) when gay marriage is as regular as interracial marriage.All that being said, I am glad that the moment was recognized, but I hope that the coverage begins to focus on him as a football player, which I believe it will.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I am curious how one reconciles this statement:

      there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum )

      with this one:

      the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      If it was a "choice" then who would choose to be gay in a world where "there's been many players in the NFL that are gay" but they have all presumably felt the need to hide it?Curious whether you see the logical disconnect?The "it's a choice" argument often comes around when a gay person comes out of the closet, but if people just choose homosexuality why would their be a closet anyway? There's a closet because homosexuality comes with a STIGMA, so who would choose to be gay when for years gay people have been subject of overt discrimination that ranges from failure to provide equal protection under the law to harassment and even murder? So gay people in Uganda just decide one day "hey, I want to risk being executed so I am going to 'choose' to be gay"? Does that mean that across the world heterosexual people just wake up one day and say "hey, I know I could get killed, or denied a job, or tortured, or treated like an outcast . . .  but today is the day to choose to be gay?" Those "many players in the NFL that are gay" did make a choice . .  it was a choice to stay silent about their true identity, right?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      To me, the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      For those that believe it's a choice, i'd ask.....at what age(assuming you're a male) did you 'decide' that you like females? And assuming you're straight, do you think it's possible that you could one day wake up and 'decide' to be attracted to males?

      About 11 I think. Before that they were a colossal pain in the ass (no pun intended).

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      The "it's a choice" argument often comes around when a gay person comes out of the closet, but if people just choose homosexuality why would their be a closet anyway?

      Because they are desperate for the friendship they have not been able to get in other situations. Loneliness and rejection are powerful incentives.For the record I don't think all gays "choose". That does not however mean I have to accept all their demands. But now we are getting off topic.My main driver in creating this thread was to highlight the distraction that drafting Sam could, and is proving to be.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      The "it's a choice" argument often comes around when a gay person comes out of the closet, but if people just choose homosexuality why would their be a closet anyway?

      Because they are desperate for the friendship they have not been able to get in other situations. Loneliness and rejection are powerful incentives.For the record I don't think all gays "choose". That does not however mean I have to accept all their demands. But now we are getting off topic.My main driver in creating this thread was to highlight the distraction that drafting Sam could, and is proving to be.

      And why is he a distraction? Because it's unusual right? A change from the norm? And yet we have a poster acknowledging that there have been gay players for a long time while, along with you, simultaneously saying homosexuality is a choice? And you're even saying a choice for friendship?Spartan, if you got into the nfl chances are you were the best player in your high school, best player in your youth league, maybe the best or near the best player in your state. At a minimum growing up you were surrounded by a team where you were the star. You were popular in high school and then in college. I am not saying that applies to every player, but that would be the norm. Why would that person choose to be gay?You can't say in a thread titled "history" that people make a choice to be gay. Do you see the disconnect?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I am curious how one reconciles this statement:

      there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum )

      with this one:

      the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      If it was a "choice" then who would choose to be gay in a world where "there's been many players in the NFL that are gay" but they have all presumably felt the need to hide it?Curious whether you see the logical disconnect?The "it's a choice" argument often comes around when a gay person comes out of the closet, but if people just choose homosexuality why would their be a closet anyway? There's a closet because homosexuality comes with a STIGMA, so who would choose to be gay when for years gay people have been subject of overt discrimination that ranges from failure to provide equal protection under the law to harassment and even murder? So gay people in Uganda just decide one day "hey, I want to risk being executed so I am going to 'choose' to be gay"? Does that mean that across the world heterosexual people just wake up one day and say "hey, I know I could get killed, or denied a job, or tortured, or treated like an outcast . . .  but today is the day to choose to be gay?" Those "many players in the NFL that are gay" did make a choice . .  it was a choice to stay silent about their true identity, right?

      Very well said. Where the hell is JohnGalt? Is he still around?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

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    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      I don’t care he is gay. I just hate the big deal made about. Stop shoving his sexuality in my face. It makes me want to hate him even though I didn’t before.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I am curious how one reconciles this statement:

      there's been many players in the NFL that are gay ( as stated by GMs and players on ESPN, NFL Network ad nauseum )

      with this one:

      the jury is out as to if homosexuality is caused by choice or genetics.

      If it was a "choice" then who would choose to be gay in a world where "there's been many players in the NFL that are gay" but they have all presumably felt the need to hide it?Curious whether you see the logical disconnect?The "it's a choice" argument often comes around when a gay person comes out of the closet, but if people just choose homosexuality why would their be a closet anyway? There's a closet because homosexuality comes with a STIGMA, so who would choose to be gay when for years gay people have been subject of overt discrimination that ranges from failure to provide equal protection under the law to harassment and even murder? So gay people in Uganda just decide one day "hey, I want to risk being executed so I am going to 'choose' to be gay"? Does that mean that across the world heterosexual people just wake up one day and say "hey, I know I could get killed, or denied a job, or tortured, or treated like an outcast . . .  but today is the day to choose to be gay?" Those "many players in the NFL that are gay" did make a choice . .  it was a choice to stay silent about their true identity, right?

      Very well said. Where the hell is JohnGalt? Is he still around?

      sporadically. He's a very good poster

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I don’t care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all.  I do care that this has become such a media issue, complete with thought police in tow.I do care that his boyfriend has MAJOR mob ties, including his dad pleading guilty in 2011 to running a sports betting ring, and it seems that sites like Profootball Talk that did nothing but wall to wall pro only coverage of Sam, hasn't addressed this big time no no in sports.  http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/michael-sam-boyfriend-mobster-grandpa-father-article-1.1789491

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      I don't care at all that he is gay.

      What if you were in the locker room shower with him and he was checking out your junk and smiling, then offered you a cake?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I don't care at all that he is gay.

      What if you were in the locker room shower with him and he was checking out your junk and smiling, then offered you a cake?

      I can't say Im a fan of the "kiss", its not my thing, and I wish the whole thing would go away.  Im 100% sure that his being drafted at all was a home town mercy draft pick at the begging of Goodell.  He wont make it in the NFL due to his combine numbers.  At best he will be put on IR the next few seasons. But lets not act like gays have never been in pro sports. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all.  I do care that this has become such a media issue,

      no doubt there is a lot of agenda-driven coverage and that part is unfortunate for sure.  We just need the season to start!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all.  I do care that this has become such a media issue,

      no doubt there is a lot of agenda-driven coverage and that part is unfortunate for sure.  We just need the season to start!

      Sam ran a 4.91 40 and benched 17X and was "drafted" by a team loaded at DL.  He is an award winning non prospect along the lines of Crouch and Torretta.  Let's see if the media treats him on his lack of NFL merits alone when he is either cut or mercifully put on IR with some magical injury.  And Im shocked his bf's mob ties - a major no no in the NFL - aren't a huge issue with a press that has acted so self righteous in covering this story from every angle. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all.  I do care that this has become such a media issue,

      no doubt there is a lot of agenda-driven coverage and that part is unfortunate for sure.  We just need the season to start!

      Sam ran a 4.91 40 and benched 17X and was "drafted" by a team loaded at DL.  He is an award winning non prospect along the lines of Crouch and Torretta.  Let's see if the media treats him on his lack of NFL merits alone when he is either cut or mercifully put on IR with some magical injury.  And Im shocked his bf's mob ties - a major no no in the NFL - aren't a huge issue with a press that has acted so self righteous in covering this story from every angle.

      shocked? Really?  Just kidding. I get the point.The football stuff and the negative personal stuff will probably get less coverage because it doesn't really fit the narrative.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all.  I do care that this has become such a media issue,

      no doubt there is a lot of agenda-driven coverage and that part is unfortunate for sure.  We just need the season to start!

      Sam ran a 4.91 40 and benched 17X and was "drafted" by a team loaded at DL.  He is an award winning non prospect along the lines of Crouch and Torretta.  Let's see if the media treats him on his lack of NFL merits alone when he is either cut or mercifully put on IR with some magical injury.  And Im shocked his bf's mob ties - a major no no in the NFL - aren't a huge issue with a press that has acted so self righteous in covering this story from every angle.

      shocked? Really?  Just kidding. I get the point.The football stuff and the negative personal stuff will probably get less coverage because it doesn't really fit the narrative.

      That's the key statement.  Narrative trumps his lack of NFL ability and serious mob ties that would get most potential draft picks excluded long before the gay angle (which is a non issue).  NFL teams know if players are gay or not and have for years.  They don't care. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      They don’t care.

      I don't know about that.  Scott Brantley was being interviewed and the media guy interviewing him said "I'm sure every team in the NFL has at least one gay player".  Brantley got angry and said "I played a good number of years and I NEVER played on a team that had a gay on the team!"    He was pretty adamant about it. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      They don't care.

      I don't know about that.  Scott Brantley was being interviewed and the media guy interviewing him said "I'm sure every team in the NFL has at least one gay player".  Brantley got angry and said "I played a good number of years and I NEVER played on a team that had a gay on the team!"    He was pretty adamant about it.

      Well, Im sure some players, especially those with highly religious players do care.  I do think front offices know exactly who is gay and who isn't.  They interview family, coaches, team mates, friends, girl friends, etc.  Its up to them to determine if the roster will be distracted.As for Brantley, I don't recall if he is a very religious man? 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      Haha, and someone questioned why an openly gay player in the NFL would be “history”Java pulling a Morgan with a post and delete? lol

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2ExVsMopMc

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2ExVsMopMc

      weak effort to troll Java, but good luck

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      Sorry if that hits home for you Vin.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2169

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      Truth!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      As far as "accepting" something? A lot of people didn't want to accept interracial marriage for the longest time. "It's unnatural, and the Bible says it's wrong!In fact, as we all know, it was illegal in most states until the Loving case put an end to that. Unfotunately, some people still don't accept it. As far as free speech? Some people may criticize what you say but you have every right to say it. What I was addressing is saying or writing something and expecting your boss/job to not care. Most jobs DO care. And that's not a freedom of speech issue.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      No one cares what you accept or don't accept personally. It's when those preferences effect other people that it becomes a problem. That is the issue here. The fact that you're uncomfortable is the reason they can't marry who they want, and it's honestly one of the main reasons that this is such a media magnet. You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.But you're right, that stupid media telling me I have to "accept" people with autism or albinos. Git outta my business media! Free speech!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      They don't care.

      I don't know about that.  Scott Brantley was being interviewed and the media guy interviewing him said "I'm sure every team in the NFL has at least one gay player".  Brantley got angry and said "I played a good number of years and I NEVER played on a team that had a gay on the team!"    He was pretty adamant about it.

      If he believes that, then maybe he should be checked for early onset of CTE.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      Spartan, if you got into the nfl chances are you were the best player in your high school, best player in your youth league, maybe the best or near the best player in your state. At a minimum growing up you were surrounded by a team where you were the star. You were popular in high school and then in college. I am not saying that applies to every player, but that would be the norm. Why would that person choose to be gay?

      My daughter sings like a champ. She is in all the school plays and had one of the leading roles in 7th grade. She was THE star in the 8th. She was also the subject of a vicious bullying campaign which took YEARS to sort out. She has more friends now, but not a huge number and back then we could count them on 1 hand. She was VERY lonely and fragile. Even now we have to be careful as she is often over eager to make new friends and fit in. We are, for example,  in the process of detaching her from a good friendship she has had with a girl for a couple of years. At first this girl was great but has been leading her down some unsavory roads related to Homestuck and Anime. This despite us talking to them both about it. Don't presume.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you. Sure you can express it, but you will look ignorant. ("lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated." - the literal meaning BTW)No one is telling you what to think, accept, or decide. We're just educating you on today's society; and the intolerance that existed back when you and dirt were born is no longer acceptable. And the fact that you think that the highlight of this thread is me (maybe) calling you ignorant in regards to this subject just further proves how shallow you are.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you. Sure you can express it, but you will look ignorant. ("lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated." - the literal meaning BTW)No one is telling you what to think, accept, or decide. We're just educating you on today's society; and the intolerance that existed back when you and dirt were born is no longer acceptable. And the fact that you think that the highlight of this thread is me (maybe) calling you ignorant in regards to this subject just further proves how shallow you are.

      As someone who knows Unc, your comments about him are way off base and I agree with him odd in a thread (or at least a discussion) about tolerance and free speech. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you. Sure you can express it, but you will look ignorant. ("lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated." - the literal meaning BTW)No one is telling you what to think, accept, or decide. We're just educating you on today's society; and the intolerance that existed back when you and dirt were born is no longer acceptable. And the fact that you think that the highlight of this thread is me (maybe) calling you ignorant in regards to this subject just further proves how shallow you are.

      As someone who knows Unc, your comments about him are way off base and I agree with him odd in a thread about tolerance and free speech.

      I don't know Stan personally, I'm just basing it off of what I'm reading in this discussion.Quote from: Uncle Stan on May 11, 2014, 05:43:15 PMThe libs are happy so the rest of the community has to shut up and be PC.Never did and won't start now. Am quite surprised how many people seemingly no longer think for themselves and/or express their real feelings because of the onslaught of those being PC, instead of publicly standing up for what they honestly believe.It's a tough world.^ IgnoranceThe majority of people are not pretending to be more accepting or just becoming more accepting because the media tells them to. They are (slowly) beginning to understand the fact that we're not all the same is ok. Stand up for what you believe, but make sure you're standing in the right place.6a0128775d5666970c016305660c4c970d.png

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    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you.

      Isn't that what you are doing to Uncle Stan right now ? Expressing your intolerance for his view ?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you.

      Isn't that what you are doing to Uncle Stan right now ? Expressing your intolerance for his view ?

      I think that was sort of Stan's point . . .

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you.

      Isn't that what you are doing to Uncle Stan right now ? Expressing your intolerance for his view ?

      Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.But no, I am tolerant of his views. If he's Christian and doesn't believe that's right, fine. However, I am not tolerant when those views infringe on other's freedoms. Other than that, I just refuted the ridiculous notion that the media is making everyone accept homosexuality. Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.

      i am HATE....and i fully agree with this statement.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.

      i am HATE....and i fully agree with this statement.

      Obviously from my prior posts I agree too

      Please wait…

    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      Hate:When are you going to change that statement in your sig ? Glennon clearly isn't going any where . He's been named the future by Lovie.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Hate:When are you going to change that statement in your sig ? Glennon clearly isn't going any where . He's been named the future by Lovie.

      you're right, it's time for me to change it. However, i'll hold out hope that the only time we see him on the field as a Buccaneer QB is in preseason.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1125

      Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.

      i am HATE....and i fully agree with this statement.

      I think for men that is true, but for women it is not.    I think women can be conditioned to be lesbians after they have a bad experience with a man.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      I think women can be conditioned to be lesbians after they have a bad experience with a man.

      I am HATE.....and i fully endorse this post, especially if i get to watch!!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 612

      Hate:When are you going to change that statement in your sig ? Glennon clearly isn't going any where . He's been named the future by Lovie.

      As long as Glennon is fast at grabbing the clipboard, that's about as much speed as we'll need out of him this year.

      Please wait…

    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      I think men can be conditioned to be gay also. Just like at how some of this board’s posters acted over Aaron Donald and Johnny Manziel these past 3 months. Pretty sure some turned gay over those two guys.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      I don't care at all that he is gay.  Its 2014 after all. 

      Very interesting you mentioning the year.Trying to go back in my lifetime (I'm almost older than dirt) to try and determine when it became politically correct to "accept" so many things that we as humans usually decided for ourselves in our own minds previously, whether something was acceptable to me ( meaning each of us individually) before the media "told" us what to say and what we can no longer say.My guess is somewhere in the 1980 and it got worse in the new millennium.At this rate in the next decade we will literally be "told" what to say and there will be legislation to support it.Freedom of speech - what's that. Give that up, you might as well be a robot.

      You've always been able to say what you want, and can continue to do so, you will just look as ignorant as dirt, too.

      Its those type of comments that gets people riled. Talk about an ignorant (in its literal sense) comment! This takes the cake after everything that has been said in this thread.

      I'll take your cake and apologize if you were "riled" by me letting you know that it's never been alright to express intolerance to someone different than you.

      Isn't that what you are doing to Uncle Stan right now ? Expressing your intolerance for his view ?

      Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.

      I actually agree with you on the substance, but I am not sure you make a compelling case for tolerance by calling someone else ignorant

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.

      i am HATE....and i fully agree with this statement.

      Obviously from my prior posts I agree too

      Btw, if any one cares, consider how the absence of an easily identifiable immutable trait impacts equal protection under the laws for homosexuals

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      From alstottupthegut"Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.But no, I am tolerant of his views. If he's Christian and doesn't believe that's right, fine.However, I am not tolerant when those views infringe on other's freedoms.Other than that, I just refuted the ridiculous notion that the media is making everyone accept homosexuality.Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.Stand up for what you believe, but make sure you're standing in the right place.".......................................You mirror exactly what I have a problem with.Who are you to tell me or anyone where I should stand on any issue?  The mainstream liberal media is doing that very clearly. I prefer to make up my own mind based on my own education and values, not by any living person telling me what or how to think.  You are always 100% right and anyone who has the audacity  to disagree with you is ignorant, by your definition and therefore you will not be tolerant of their thinking. Now how ignorant and no tolerant is that?.My point of view on this topic had nothing to do with skin color. That really riled me, if anything I am an extremely strong supporter of MLK and his beliefs in equality for a person of a different skin color. Ask anyone who knows me. The two topics aren't even close. How do you compare a race issue with sexual orientation? You can'tWe used to have someone like you on these boards who every time he started losing his point of view to others, he stirred up the pot with other issues non relevant.I don't and won't deny I am a strong Christian. I am also a little educated on the Koran and the Torah, on some issues..What I say and what I believe has nothing to do with your freedoms. All I was doing rightfully expressing my opinion. You don't agree with it, so I'm the one who is ignorant?This happens to be the United States and a republic not an autocracy, like you are are supporting with your comments.Do I agree with your viewpoint, absolutely not.  Do I respect your right to express it, yes - which is more than you will do about others.Got to get back to work.Later-if need be..

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      Stan, where has anybody told you you don't have the right to express your viewpoint?You can say whatever you want. But don't be surprised if certain people judge you based on your words.What if you had a black friend who married a white woman and another friend of yours came up to you and said, "That's unnatural. The races shouldn't mix. It's disgusting."Would you say...A) I disagree with you but I respect your opinion.Or...B) You're an ignorant fool. Please keep your distance from me. I don't want to associate with people like you.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I have zero tolerance for intolerance.

      I might have to put that on a t-shirt.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      I think women can be conditioned to be lesbians after they have a bad experience with a man.

      I am HATE.....and i fully endorse this post, especially if i get to watch!!

      You beat me to the punch!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 312

      From alstottupthegut"Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.But no, I am tolerant of his views. If he's Christian and doesn't believe that's right, fine.However, I am not tolerant when those views infringe on other's freedoms.Other than that, I just refuted the ridiculous notion that the media is making everyone accept homosexuality.Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.Stand up for what you believe, but make sure you're standing in the right place.".......................................You mirror exactly what I have a problem with.Who are you to tell me or anyone where I should stand on any issue?  The mainstream liberal media is doing that very clearly. I prefer to make up my own mind based on my own education and values, not by any living person telling me what or how to think.  You are always 100% right and anyone who has the audacity  to disagree with you is ignorant, by your definition and therefore you will not be tolerant of their thinking. Now how ignorant and no tolerant is that?.My point of view on this topic had nothing to do with skin color. That really riled me, if anything I am an extremely strong supporter of MLK and his beliefs in equality for a person of a different skin color. Ask anyone who knows me. The two topics aren't even close. How do you compare a race issue with sexual orientation? You can'tWe used to have someone like you on these boards who every time he started losing his point of view to others, he stirred up the pot with other issues non relevant.I don't and won't deny I am a strong Christian. I am also a little educated on the Koran and the Torah, on some issues..What I say and what I believe has nothing to do with your freedoms. All I was doing rightfully expressing my opinion. You don't agree with it, so I'm the one who is ignorant?This happens to be the United States and a republic not an autocracy, like you are are supporting with your comments.Do I agree with your viewpoint, absolutely not.  Do I respect your right to express it, yes - which is more than you will do about others.Got to get back to work.Later-if need be..

      Ok we need to back up. I think I have a differing view on the severity of the word "ignorant" than the rest of you. I mean it only as the lack of information. I wasn't calling you dumb or stupid - I made sure not to - just uninformed. Which I think may be true based on where you went next. Yes, the two can certainly be compared. Sexual orientation is like skin color in the sense that neither are something you can control. The two are very comparable in that regard. Neither is something you can change. You are born with it; it is embedded into your genes. Choosing to be gay is like choosing to change your skin color, you can fake it but its not who you truly are.  I never questioned your stance on racial equality, only used it as a parallel. I appreciate that you support that equality (a fight that mirrors the one going on today), but I wonder why you seemingly don't feel the same when it comes to sexual orientation. If you've ever been alienated, you would understand that no one likes negative attention, especially at a young age when kids are trying to fit in. You think they enjoy feeling different than their friends? Can you imagine - have you imagined going through that? The confusion and frustration that comes from living in a society that constantly tells you your feelings go against their beliefs and values and you shouldn't have the right to act on them. Now, who is telling who how to act and think?  If you are a Christian then you know a fundamental teaching is to accept all of God's children no matter how they came. This concept seems to be lost in the shuffle of everyone's beliefs, or people interpreting it differently.I have a very firm grasp on my message and it's not about race. Race was only used as an example in our very recent history that we can look back on a learn from.I believe that barring gay people from marrying each other is an ignorant viewpoint, but I am not impeding you in expressing that view. I believe it to be as ignorant as slavery, or African-Americans and women being unable to vote, but it just hasn't been fully realized by the majority yet as those issues weren't then either.But that's all I have. Again, I think it's great that Sam did what he did, appreciate the moment, and applaud his courage, but like most I hope that coverage returns focus to football. I most likely will not change your views since we are just strangers on a message board, but I hope that I at least have convinced you to approach the issue with a more open mind.I'll leave you with this pretty powerful video and encourage you to watch. It captures how you might have felt if the world were reversed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ROXTFfkcfoNo hard feelings at all, Stan.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1419

      just want to stop in and give a big ol +1 to all your posts, AlstottUpTheGut

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 861

      From alstottupthegut"Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.But no, I am tolerant of his views. If he's Christian and doesn't believe that's right, fine.However, I am not tolerant when those views infringe on other's freedoms.Other than that, I just refuted the ridiculous notion that the media is making everyone accept homosexuality.Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.Stand up for what you believe, but make sure you're standing in the right place.".......................................You mirror exactly what I have a problem with.Who are you to tell me or anyone where I should stand on any issue?  The mainstream liberal media is doing that very clearly. I prefer to make up my own mind based on my own education and values, not by any living person telling me what or how to think.  You are always 100% right and anyone who has the audacity  to disagree with you is ignorant, by your definition and therefore you will not be tolerant of their thinking. Now how ignorant and no tolerant is that?.My point of view on this topic had nothing to do with skin color. That really riled me, if anything I am an extremely strong supporter of MLK and his beliefs in equality for a person of a different skin color. Ask anyone who knows me. The two topics aren't even close. How do you compare a race issue with sexual orientation? You can'tWe used to have someone like you on these boards who every time he started losing his point of view to others, he stirred up the pot with other issues non relevant.I don't and won't deny I am a strong Christian. I am also a little educated on the Koran and the Torah, on some issues..What I say and what I believe has nothing to do with your freedoms. All I was doing rightfully expressing my opinion. You don't agree with it, so I'm the one who is ignorant?This happens to be the United States and a republic not an autocracy, like you are are supporting with your comments.Do I agree with your viewpoint, absolutely not.  Do I respect your right to express it, yes - which is more than you will do about others.Got to get back to work.Later-if need be..

      Ok we need to back up. I think I have a differing view on the severity of the word "ignorant" than the rest of you. I mean it only as the lack of information. I wasn't calling you dumb or stupid - I made sure not to - just uninformed. Which I think may be true based on where you went next. Yes, the two can certainly be compared. Sexual orientation is like skin color in the sense that neither are something you can control. The two are very comparable in that regard. Neither is something you can change. You are born with it; it is embedded into your genes. Choosing to be gay is like choosing to change your skin color, you can fake it but its not who you truly are.  I never questioned your stance on racial equality, only used it as a parallel. I appreciate that you support that equality (a fight that mirrors the one going on today), but I wonder why you seemingly don't feel the same when it comes to sexual orientation. If you've ever been alienated, you would understand that no one likes negative attention, especially at a young age when kids are trying to fit in. You think they enjoy feeling different than their friends? Can you imagine - have you imagined going through that? The confusion and frustration that comes from living in a society that constantly tells you your feelings go against their beliefs and values and you shouldn't have the right to act on them. Now, who is telling who how to act and think?  If you are a Christian then you know a fundamental teaching is to accept all of God's children no matter how they came. This concept seems to be lost in the shuffle of everyone's beliefs, or people interpreting it differently.I have a very firm grasp on my message and it's not about race. Race was only used as an example in our very recent history that we can look back on a learn from.I believe that barring gay people from marrying each other is an ignorant viewpoint, but I am not impeding you in expressing that view. I believe it to be as ignorant as slavery, or African-Americans and women being unable to vote, but it just hasn't been fully realized by the majority yet as those issues weren't then either.But that's all I have. Again, I think it's great that Sam did what he did, appreciate the moment, and applaud his courage, but like most I hope that coverage returns focus to football. I most likely will not change your views since we are just strangers on a message board, but I hope that I at least have convinced you to approach the issue with a more open mind.I'll leave you with this pretty powerful video and encourage you to watch. It captures how you might have felt if the world were reversed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ROXTFfkcfoNo hard feelings at all, Stan.

      I have no hard feelings towards anyone.My beliefs are heavily based in the 3 main books of the majority of the religious world-the Bible, the Koran and the Torah. They don;'t agree with you and neither do I, but I respect your right to say/write, which you do not in return with your tolerance or ignorant jabs as part of almost every commentary.So many of the people of this world get caught up in the now and don't take time to think of the long term. If it makes them feel good now and many agree, then  it has to be the right thing. Religious history teaches you differently.. If you have no background in the 3 major religions, I have no ability to relate to your viewpoint., because any quotation from any of them to support what I believe and not your belief, you will not be able to comprehend. Your response very well may be, as other people have stated," I don't believe in any of the 3. That puts you clearly in the minority and therefore your arguments don't hold water because you believe the majority agrees with you ,they apparently  do not.. The media is not the majority and the last place to get a realistic point of view. They have an agenda, Sales-nothing else matters.Think this topic has been beaten to death and for the most part has been great!Also no hard feelings.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1419

      From alstottupthegut"Lol yes, I have zero tolerance for intolerance.But no, I am tolerant of his views. If he's Christian and doesn't believe that's right, fine.However, I am not tolerant when those views infringe on other's freedoms.Other than that, I just refuted the ridiculous notion that the media is making everyone accept homosexuality.Hopefully, Stan will soon realize that you have as much choice in your sexual orientation as you do your skin color.Stand up for what you believe, but make sure you're standing in the right place.".......................................You mirror exactly what I have a problem with.Who are you to tell me or anyone where I should stand on any issue?  The mainstream liberal media is doing that very clearly. I prefer to make up my own mind based on my own education and values, not by any living person telling me what or how to think.  You are always 100% right and anyone who has the audacity  to disagree with you is ignorant, by your definition and therefore you will not be tolerant of their thinking. Now how ignorant and no tolerant is that?.My point of view on this topic had nothing to do with skin color. That really riled me, if anything I am an extremely strong supporter of MLK and his beliefs in equality for a person of a different skin color. Ask anyone who knows me. The two topics aren't even close. How do you compare a race issue with sexual orientation? You can'tWe used to have someone like you on these boards who every time he started losing his point of view to others, he stirred up the pot with other issues non relevant.I don't and won't deny I am a strong Christian. I am also a little educated on the Koran and the Torah, on some issues..What I say and what I believe has nothing to do with your freedoms. All I was doing rightfully expressing my opinion. You don't agree with it, so I'm the one who is ignorant?This happens to be the United States and a republic not an autocracy, like you are are supporting with your comments.Do I agree with your viewpoint, absolutely not.  Do I respect your right to express it, yes - which is more than you will do about others.Got to get back to work.Later-if need be..

      Ok we need to back up. I think I have a differing view on the severity of the word "ignorant" than the rest of you. I mean it only as the lack of information. I wasn't calling you dumb or stupid - I made sure not to - just uninformed. Which I think may be true based on where you went next. Yes, the two can certainly be compared. Sexual orientation is like skin color in the sense that neither are something you can control. The two are very comparable in that regard. Neither is something you can change. You are born with it; it is embedded into your genes. Choosing to be gay is like choosing to change your skin color, you can fake it but its not who you truly are.  I never questioned your stance on racial equality, only used it as a parallel. I appreciate that you support that equality (a fight that mirrors the one going on today), but I wonder why you seemingly don't feel the same when it comes to sexual orientation. If you've ever been alienated, you would understand that no one likes negative attention, especially at a young age when kids are trying to fit in. You think they enjoy feeling different than their friends? Can you imagine - have you imagined going through that? The confusion and frustration that comes from living in a society that constantly tells you your feelings go against their beliefs and values and you shouldn't have the right to act on them. Now, who is telling who how to act and think?  If you are a Christian then you know a fundamental teaching is to accept all of God's children no matter how they came. This concept seems to be lost in the shuffle of everyone's beliefs, or people interpreting it differently.I have a very firm grasp on my message and it's not about race. Race was only used as an example in our very recent history that we can look back on a learn from.I believe that barring gay people from marrying each other is an ignorant viewpoint, but I am not impeding you in expressing that view. I believe it to be as ignorant as slavery, or African-Americans and women being unable to vote, but it just hasn't been fully realized by the majority yet as those issues weren't then either.But that's all I have. Again, I think it's great that Sam did what he did, appreciate the moment, and applaud his courage, but like most I hope that coverage returns focus to football. I most likely will not change your views since we are just strangers on a message board, but I hope that I at least have convinced you to approach the issue with a more open mind.I'll leave you with this pretty powerful video and encourage you to watch. It captures how you might have felt if the world were reversed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ROXTFfkcfoNo hard feelings at all, Stan.

      I have no hard feelings towards anyone.My beliefs are heavily based in the 3 main books of the majority of the religious world-the Bible, the Koran and the Torah. They don;'t agree with you and neither do I, but I respect your right to say/write, which you do not in return with your tolerance or ignorant jabs as part of almost every commentary.So many of the people of this world get caught up in the now and don't take time to think of the long term. If it makes them feel good now and many agree, then  it has to be the right thing. Religious history teaches you differently.. If you have no background in the 3 major religions, I have no ability to relate to your viewpoint., because any quotation from any of them to support what I believe and not your belief, you will not be able to comprehend. Your response very well may be, as other people have stated," I don't believe in any of the 3. That puts you clearly in the minority and therefore your arguments don't hold water because you believe the majority agrees with you ,they apparently  do not.. The media is not the majority and the last place to get a realistic point of view. They have an agenda, Sales-nothing else matters.Think this topic has been beaten to death and for the most part has been great!Also no hard feelings.

      I know those are 3 really big books that cover a lot of topics.  But they are only 3 books, written by only a handful of authors, during a relatively narrow window of human history.  How can one base their entire world view on only 3 books?  There's a lot of really interesting books out there that have a lot of really great information about life and other things that you won't necessarily find in those 3 books.  I would find it rather hard to narrow my understanding of life and the universe that I have gained to just 3 books.  Maybe that's me

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      My beliefs are heavily based in the 3 main books of the majority of the religious world-the Bible, the Koran and the Torah. They don;'t agree with you and neither do I

      Many of us base our beliefs/opinions on real life, things we've experienced and people we have met. Not on books.

      but I respect your right to say/write, which you do not in return with your tolerance or ignorant jabs as part of almost every commentary.

      I think his posts were well thought out and respectful. Amazing that you took it that way. I'm not going to be as nice.

      So many of the people of this world get caught up in the now and don't take time to think of the long term.

      What's the long term affect on somebody falling in love with somebody of the same sex? You're not making any sense now. Or are you going to tell us that every relationship/marriage should be about procreation? If so, the ignorant label fits you.

      If it makes them feel good now and many agree, then it has to be the right thing.

      You keep ignoring that it's not a choice. They're with the same sex because that's who they are. You would like them to be something they are not. Makes them feel good? Is that a bad thing between two consenting adults? And I'm not even talking about the sex.You do plenty of things because they make you feel good.

      Religious history teaches you differently.. If you have no background in the 3 major religions, I have no ability to relate to your viewpoint., because any quotation from any of them to support what I believe and not your belief, you will not be able to comprehend.

      Like I said, his beliefs are based on real life experiences. Not being a robot and blindly believing what is written in a book or books.Your views are antiquated and people who believe like you do are slowly disappearing. Once day, people will look back and laugh how intolerant certain people were during this time period.

      Your response very well may be, as other people have stated," I don't believe in any of the 3. That puts you clearly in the minority and therefore your arguments don't hold water because you believe the majority agrees with you ,they apparently  do not.

      What the hell does that mean?Who cares if he or anybody else is in the minority with their beliefs/opinions. Most of the United States supported slavery at one point in our history. Was the majority right? His arguments hold water for people who are able to think for themselves and evolve their opinions over time.This is something you have not been able to do. As as a wise person once said, I have zero tolerance, for intolerance.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2682

      And since you ignored this, I'll post it again,...* * * * * * * * * *Stan, where has anybody told you you don't have the right to express your viewpoint?You can say whatever you want. But don't be surprised if certain people judge you based on your words.What if you had a black friend who married a white woman and another friend of yours came up to you and said, "That's unnatural. The races shouldn't mix. It's disgusting."Would you say...A) I disagree with you but I respect your opinion.Or...B) You're an ignorant fool. Please keep your distance from me. I don't want to associate with people like you.

      Please wait…

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