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    • notabucsfan

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      http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10978595/2014-nfl-offseason-luke-kuechly-nfl-most-overrated-playersNFL's most overrated playersKuechly among top individuals earning more credit than they deserveUpdated: May 26, 2014, 11:16 AM ETBy Steve Palazzolo | Pro Football FocusEveryone loves a good list, particularly one ranking the NFL's best players, and the offseason generally finds quite a few to browse through. At PFF, we feel we're as qualified as anyone to put together a list of the league's best players, so we've continued with our traditional Top 101. Part of our uniqueness is the ability to view the entire league through virtually the same set of eyes and within the same system. It's for these reasons that we can minimize bias through our grades to provide a strong snapshot of a player's performance in a given year.As for the list, it's more than just a glance at the grades. We go back and forth internally discussing not only grades but also consistency, role, snap count, postseason work, competition and any other important factors that may go into separating the best players in the league. As with any list, the debate rages on.One thing to remember is that our list is based strictly on 2013 and that we have stuck to the mantra that all positions are created equally to give everyone a shot to make it, thereby avoiding the quarterback-heavy list that would most undoubtedly ensue. We also took the postseason into consideration when accumulating the list.Here's a look at the players many fans and media will be surprised to see at the bottom half of the PFF 101.Luke Kuechly, Carolina Panthers, No. 80The 2013 NFL Defensive Player of the Year at No. 80? Kuechly did have a strong season, but he wasn't even considered for PFF Defensive Player of the Year in what amounted to a two-horse race. Why the disconnect?To start, the success of the Panthers' defense was probably Kuechly's biggest ally. While the defensive player of the year is an individual award, Kuechly got a lot of publicity for being the leader of one of the league's best defenses. While that is a valuable role, there's a good argument to be made that Kuechly isn't even the best player on his defensive unit, never mind the league's best. Teammate Greg Hardy came in at No. 41 in the PFF 101, as he led the way for a Panthers defensive line that dominated up front to the tune of a league-leading 60 sacks as a team. Kuechly wasn't even the highest-ranked linebacker on his team, as Thomas Davis came in at 52nd in the 101. Carolina's defensive success had more to do with a dominant defensive line than anything Kuechly did individually.The second area where Kuechly is lauded is in his high tackle numbers. The NFL credited him with 156 total tackles, good for fourth in the league. The first issue with the stat is the NFL's acknowledgement that the tackle numbers are unofficial and often charted differently around the league. In addition, simply bringing down the ball carrier does not make a play successful, nor does it account for the times a player is beaten in coverage or blocked in the running game. It's not that making tackles is bad; it's just that with the rise in popularity of advanced numbers and statistics, as well as certain companies (PFF) actually grading each and every play in the NFL from a football standpoint, there's really no excuse to rely on primitive, uninformative numbers like total tackles to determine a player's worth.While it may sound like we're diminishing Kuechly's overall play, he does a lot of things well. He is one of the league's best run-stopping inside linebackers, and he may have been the best at shedding blocks at the second level. His plus-6.8 grade against the run ranked third among inside linebackers while picking up a stop on 12.0 percent of his run snaps, also good for third at the position. He also added strong work in coverage, as his plus-2.4 grade ranked 14th among inside linebackers and his 0.81 yards/cover snap came in 13th. The numbers are solid but certainly not the makings of a defensive player of the year candidate, nor a top-50 player in the league. His standing at No. 80 overall seems just about right for 2013.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1170

      Weakly as many of us like to call him. Best pile jumper in the league.

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    • shanesnyder

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      Post count: 42

      I agree.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2682

      I’d take him in a second.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8983

      Yeah, he’s overrated, but it’s more like “urlacher was overrated,” not, “freeman was overrated.”He's still a player I would like to have on my team, but he could not replace david. David is still better....now, if he could take foster's spot...madden up my buc brothers!

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2188

      Lavonte is better by a mile. Ranked #5 overall. I think that’s what they are trying to say.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      Kuechly is a cute little NFL player that is great for this era of football.  David is proving to be an all timer! God bless MD and his insight!

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    • Anonymous

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      Kuechly is a good player, but it is a disgrace he won DPOY. He is most definitely one of the most overrated players in the league, if not the most overrated.

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    • gobucs123

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      Post count: 569

      Weakly fans mad.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 4623

      Yeah, he's overrated, but it's more like "urlacher was overrated," not, "freeman was overrated."He's still a player I would like to have on my team, but he could not replace david. David is still better....now, if he could take foster's spot...madden up my buc brothers!

      Well said.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1271

      While agree with a lot of what is being said, especially that Hardy was the best player on Carolina’s D, I think you have to Kuechly a bit more credit than that. He is solid against the run, although no one is going to confuse him for Navarro Bowman.. His real strength though, is his ability to cover the middle of the field. Definitely the smartest MLB in the league, and only going to get better.

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    • jamesh

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      Post count: 43

      Yeah, he's overrated, but it's more like "urlacher was overrated," not, "freeman was overrated."He's still a player I would like to have on my team, but he could not replace david. David is still better....now, if he could take foster's spot...madden up my buc brothers!

      Well said.

      +2

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Well said except for the David part.  They don’t even play the same position and we we could of had both. 

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      Well said except for the David part.  They don't even play the same position and we we could of had both.

      Are you serious?  We could have had both David and Kuechly?  That would have been awesome!  Who would we have had to give up to get Kuechly? 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Baron. 

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      Baron?  Let’s make that trade right now!

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Oh the Panthers would never make that trade.  I meant we could have drafted Kuechly instead of Baron.  The Panthers were a little smarter than the Bucs that day.

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      That may be why that Beatles guy switched his loyalty from the Bucs to the Panthers.

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    • Anonymous

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      Beatles ain’t no dummy.  While us Buc fans had to suffer through 8 straight losses Panther fans got to enjoy 10 straight wins.

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      I am too loyal to my team to traitor out like that.

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    • Anonymous

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      Same here but Beatles wasn’t a Bucs fan for very long.  I think he became one back in 2010 when we went 10-6 so he didn’t have much vested in his fandom.  Plus he moved to NC. 

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    • brycen54

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      Post count: 636

      Beatles is still around? I thought he bet his life that we would make the playoffs just before we went on a ten game losing streak?

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      Same here but Beatles wasn't a Bucs fan for very long.  I think he became one back in 2010 so he didn't have much vested in his fandom.  Plus he moved to NC.

      That's understandable.  And the fact that he's trying to start a career as a youtube karoake singer may have altered his judgement.  It's probably easier to get youtube hits if you are a Panther fan.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 4623

      Oh the Panthers would never make that trade.  I meant we could have drafted Kuechly instead of Baron.  The Panthers were a little smarter than the Bucs that day.

      Remember, the Bucs NEEDED Barron to make Schiano's defense work. Safety is the most important position for Schiano.

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      Oh the Panthers would never make that trade.  I meant we could have drafted Kuechly instead of Baron.  The Panthers were a little smarter than the Bucs that day.

      Remember, the Bucs NEEDED Barron to make Schiano's defense work. Safety is the most important position for Schiano.

      If it's so important, why didn't he draft a good one instead of Barron?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Even though he is a Panthers fan now you got to respect the passion!5B5C649C-3FF9-42E9-82CE-56D809A1C710_zps6j1ruaco.jpg

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      That’s him?  I didn’t know he was into bling like that necklace.  So decadent.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      DA31D70F-FC7F-4442-9404-80A11F983D67_zpszaa8mldr.jpgLuke kind of reminds me of that guy who played Hot Rod.  Would be a good nickname for him. Hot Rod Luke Kuechly.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Weakly as many of us like to call him. Best pile jumper in the league.

      doesnt look weak to me275D7B1A-8357-4657-B08B-40ED95EEE522_zpsq4tbe73f.jpg

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Why are Buc fans so obsessed with Luke Kuechly?  Because he is the most interesting man in the world!8A255195-D4F0-4245-B115-E9F9DD7A3AF3_zpsqjhtnwa4.jpg

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 382

      This thread has descended into madness. I will continue to monitor for entertainment purposes.agJIP.gif

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2962

      Lol that’s the picture you choose, Skull? He’s pulling a Miley there. Anyhow, Kuechly can play and he’d be an upgrade over Foster for sure but him being DPOY was a travesty and a joke. There were many candidates that deserved it ahead of him, including our own Lavonte.I don't think many fans that actually watch football would argue that he's not a really good player but I think PFF got his ranking about right. He's very overrated by the media.

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    • bigbucsfan

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      Post count: 82

      Lol that's the picture you choose, Skull? He's pulling a Miley there. Anyhow, Kuechly can play and he'd be an upgrade over Foster for sure but him being DPOY was a travesty and a joke. There were many candidates that deserved it ahead of him, including our own Lavonte.I don't think many fans that actually watch football would argue that he's not a really good player but I think PFF got his ranking about right. He's very overrated by the media.

      Jets fans love Lavonte.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JS84BU_Bsekhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8jFQLru0Ls

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2962

      Really? We’re still coming back to that one play? I’d personally rather dwell on the rest of the season that was fairly historic. He made enough big time, game changing plays that it’s ridiculous to bring that play up. Sure, you can argue it cost us the game. But if our offense had gotten off the plane and played the game then it wouldn’t have come down to that play anyways. Give me a break.OR we can down on the best 4-3 WLB in the league for one play in a game that even if we had won wouldn't have meant a damn thing in the grand scheme of things. We were 4-12, remember?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      Lol that's the picture you choose, Skull? He's pulling a Miley there. Anyhow, Kuechly can play and he'd be an upgrade over Foster for sure but him being DPOY was a travesty and a joke. There were many candidates that deserved it ahead of him, including our own Lavonte.I don't think many fans that actually watch football would argue that he's not a really good player but I think PFF got his ranking about right. He's very overrated by the media.

      Jets fans love Lavonte.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JS84BU_Bsekhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8jFQLru0Ls

      Living up you your name there stoned one.  Kuechly would give his piss nut to have the talent that David does.  I dont give a crap if he plays a different position, Kuechly is so overhyped by the white trash/KKK loving football fan that it's rather nauseating. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SECBENCH PRESS: 19 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 36.5 INCHBROAD JUMP: 119.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 7.28 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.22 SEC40 YARD DASH: 4.58 SECBENCH PRESS: 27 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 38.0 INCHBROAD JUMP: 123.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 6.92 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.12 SEC60 YARD SHUTTLE: 11.43 SECOne of these is Kuechly's combine numbers and one is David's.  Who has the most talent?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Oh and the guy with the better athletic measurables is also 2 inches taller and 15 pounds heavier.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 11045

      40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SECBENCH PRESS: 19 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 36.5 INCHBROAD JUMP: 119.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 7.28 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.22 SEC40 YARD DASH: 4.58 SECBENCH PRESS: 27 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 38.0 INCHBROAD JUMP: 123.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 6.92 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.12 SEC60 YARD SHUTTLE: 11.43 SECOne of these is Kuechly's combine numbers and one is David's.  Who has the most talent?

      Ok so who is the better player?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      They play different positions in different schemes with different talent around them.  Who knows?  The NFL and fans seems to think Kuechly is though.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SECBENCH PRESS: 19 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 36.5 INCHBROAD JUMP: 119.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 7.28 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.22 SEC40 YARD DASH: 4.58 SECBENCH PRESS: 27 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 38.0 INCHBROAD JUMP: 123.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 6.92 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.12 SEC60 YARD SHUTTLE: 11.43 SECOne of these is Kuechly's combine numbers and one is David's.  Who has the most talent?

      Oh yeah, yet one of them has better game stats and is widely considered more intelligent than Kuechly.  Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 5572

      Java, you need to get a job or a hobby or something.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      I have never heard anyone say David is more intelligent than Kuechly.  Their  wonderlics and colleges proves that David isn’t. But just talking football intelligence Kuechly’s instincts are in an elite level.  David has excellent instincts as well.  Not saying he doesn’t.  But you have no valid argument there bass. Just like with your lie that David has more athletic talent.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      I have never heard anyone say David is more intelligent than Kuechly.  Their  wonderlics and colleges proves that David isn't. But just talking football intelligence Kuechly's instincts are in an elite level.  David has excellent instincts as well.  Not saying he doesn't.  But you have no valid argument there bass. Just like with your lie that David has more athletic talent.

      Look.  Very few if any LB's regardless of which LB position they play can do what David does.  He's an elite's elite and has instincts that are simply off the charts.  He is the best LB in the game right now and anyone paying attention to LB play the last season and a half would not disagree.  Couple that with the fact that he plays for the team you presumably root for and I wonder what you are trying to prove.  Kuechly makes some nice plays but is largely a benefactor of the talent around him.  He's a highlight/clean up guy.  David's football IQ is superior to Kuechly's.  Most GMs are only concerned with a players aptitude for the game.  Kuechly's game itself isn't in the same league.  I spit on my rivals!

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 9128

      40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SECBENCH PRESS: 19 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 36.5 INCHBROAD JUMP: 119.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 7.28 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.22 SEC40 YARD DASH: 4.58 SECBENCH PRESS: 27 REPSVERTICAL JUMP: 38.0 INCHBROAD JUMP: 123.0 INCH3 CONE DRILL: 6.92 SEC20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.12 SEC60 YARD SHUTTLE: 11.43 SECOne of these is Kuechly's combine numbers and one is David's.  Who has the most talent?

      1956924-you_ve_won_the_internet.jpg

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 499

      Rudd 2.0

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      Rudd 2.0

      Kuechly is definitely more of a Rudd/Brooking type. 

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    • jamesh

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      Post count: 43

      He is the best LB in the game right now and anyone paying attention to LB play the last season and a half would not disagree. 

      A little too much homerism in this post. Let's see him have one more year like the last before we crown him as "the best LB" in the league.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      Kuechly bashers mad!

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    • gobucs123

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      Post count: 569

      Ill bet none of you would say any of this to Weakly’s face .If you did , he'd wait until you turned around and slowly drag you down from behind.What would you have to say then ?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 6677

      David’s accomplishments after two years in the NFL:First Team All-Pro (2013)PFWA 2013 All-NFL Team/All-NFC TeamNot bad!Kuechly's:  AP NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013)Pro Bowl (2013)AP First-Team All-Pro (2013)AP NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFC Defensive Player of the Year (2013)PFW/PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFL Combined Tackles Leader (2012)PFW/PFWA All-Rookie Team (2012)USA Today All-Joe Team (2012)NFC Defensive Rookie of the Month (December, 2012)3× NFC Defensive Player of the Week (Week 14, 2012, Week 10, 2013, Week 16, 2013)NFL single game tackle record (24)

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      He is the best LB in the game right now and anyone paying attention to LB play the last season and a half would not disagree. 

      A little too much homerism in this post. Let's see him have one more year like the last before we crown him as "the best LB" in the league.

      so we could say hes been the best wlb for the past TWO years?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2967

      David's accomplishments after two years in the NFL:First Team All-Pro (2013)PFWA 2013 All-NFL Team/All-NFC TeamNot bad!Kuechly's:  AP NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013)Pro Bowl (2013)AP First-Team All-Pro (2013)AP NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFC Defensive Player of the Year (2013)PFW/PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFL Combined Tackles Leader (2012)PFW/PFWA All-Rookie Team (2012)USA Today All-Joe Team (2012)NFC Defensive Rookie of the Month (December, 2012)3× NFC Defensive Player of the Week (Week 14, 2012, Week 10, 2013, Week 16, 2013)NFL single game tackle record (24)

      You can keep all of that. Let's look at stuffs, solo tackles, tackles for loss, sacks, passes defensed, INTs and forced fumbles. Maybe someday, Luke will force a fumble.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8044

      David's accomplishments after two years in the NFL:First Team All-Pro (2013)PFWA 2013 All-NFL Team/All-NFC TeamNot bad!Kuechly's:  AP NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013)Pro Bowl (2013)AP First-Team All-Pro (2013)AP NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFC Defensive Player of the Year (2013)PFW/PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFL Combined Tackles Leader (2012)PFW/PFWA All-Rookie Team (2012)USA Today All-Joe Team (2012)NFC Defensive Rookie of the Month (December, 2012)3× NFC Defensive Player of the Week (Week 14, 2012, Week 10, 2013, Week 16, 2013)NFL single game tackle record (24)

      when is his enshrinement?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2967

      Just got off the phone with Denny. He said “he is who we thought he was” and ” if you want to crown his azz, crown his azz”. Soooo…..

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 1166

      Ill bet none of you would say any of this to Weakly's face .If you did , he'd wait until you turned around and slowly drag you down from behind.What would you have to say then ?

      well played sir 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 11045

      David's accomplishments after two years in the NFL:First Team All-Pro (2013)PFWA 2013 All-NFL Team/All-NFC TeamNot bad!Kuechly's:  AP NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013)Pro Bowl (2013)AP First-Team All-Pro (2013)AP NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFC Defensive Player of the Year (2013)PFW/PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFL Combined Tackles Leader (2012)PFW/PFWA All-Rookie Team (2012)USA Today All-Joe Team (2012)NFC Defensive Rookie of the Month (December, 2012)3× NFC Defensive Player of the Week (Week 14, 2012, Week 10, 2013, Week 16, 2013)NFL single game tackle record with a lot of pile jumpingMedia created clown. I don't see all of those accolades when he's getting knocked on his arse every time he plays us.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2775

      David's accomplishments after two years in the NFL:First Team All-Pro (2013)PFWA 2013 All-NFL Team/All-NFC TeamNot bad!Kuechly's:  AP NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013)Pro Bowl (2013)AP First-Team All-Pro (2013)AP NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFC Defensive Player of the Year (2013)PFW/PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012)NFL Combined Tackles Leader (2012)PFW/PFWA All-Rookie Team (2012)USA Today All-Joe Team (2012)NFC Defensive Rookie of the Month (December, 2012)3× NFC Defensive Player of the Week (Week 14, 2012, Week 10, 2013, Week 16, 2013)NFL single game tackle record with a lot of pile jumpingMedia created clown. I don't see all of those accolades when he's getting knocked on his arse every time he plays us.

      Exactly.  He's on the train so it will take an injury to derail him but all you have to do is look at the awards part of Kuechly's resume to realize they dont mean squat.  Give the media a somewhat talented white guy and they go bonkers. We know what we have, dont need anyone to validate his greatness.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2962

      I could give a crap about the Pro Bowl crap, Kuechly is a big name playing on a good team so he gets more media love than David does. David is widely regarded as a massive pro bowl snub the last two years and him not making it last year, considering what he did, shows how big of a joke the Pro Bowl is. He shouldn’t have won RDOY over David and he damn sure shouldn’t have won DPOY over David or numerous other candidates.And bringing COMBINE MEASURENTS into a discussion about guys who have been in the league for two years is ridiculous.

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    • brycen54

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      Post count: 636

      “Give the media a somewhat talented white guy and they go bonkers.”Isn't Glennon a somewhat talented white guy?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 929

      I don’t think nobody is saying Kueckly isn’t a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn’t on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn’t deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that’s not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that’s pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it’s hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2962

      Agreed ^ If Kuechly is a Brooking type and David is a Brooks type…. Yeaaaaaaah I’ll take David all day long.

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    • brycen54

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      Post count: 636

      Kuechly > Barron

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 698

      I don’t care what anyone says! I would not mind having that Over-Rated player in the middle bookend by Foster and David. Wouldn’t mind having Burfict there either!

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 4623

      Kuechly is better than Brooking and monumentally better than Ruud. Mentioning him is just a joke.

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    • Anonymous

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      It’s like calling David Geno Hayes 2.0. 

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    • Anonymous

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      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      +1

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 4623

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and MLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 929

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and WLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      I don't know where you want me to argue this. It's impossible for one game changed on defense to completely make the defense that better. Even with two game changers it's hard. With that said I hope you have watched Bucs games and if you have there have been plenty of times David has stopped plays behind the LOS on third down. Hell the guy did what no linebacker in the history of the league did last year. Like I said yes WLB is a different position but there were plenty of formations especially on third downs were David was the Mike and was more than productive.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4623

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and WLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      I don't know where you want me to argue this. It's impossible for one game changed on defense to completely make the defense that better. Even with two game changers it's hard. With that said I hope you have watched Bucs games and if you have there have been plenty of times David has stopped plays behind the LOS on third down. Hell the guy did what no linebacker in the history of the league did last year. Like I said yes WLB is a different position but there were plenty of formations especially on third downs were David was the Mike and was more than productive.

      Which is why I view it as pointless to compare David to Kuechly. They play different positions. Compare David to Thomas Davis and Kuechly to Mason Foster if you must. But for some reason Bucs fan cannot discuss Kuechly without comparing him to David.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and WLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      I don't know where you want me to argue this. It's impossible for one game changed on defense to completely make the defense that better. Even with two game changers it's hard. With that said I hope you have watched Bucs games and if you have there have been plenty of times David has stopped plays behind the LOS on third down. Hell the guy did what no linebacker in the history of the league did last year. Like I said yes WLB is a different position but there were plenty of formations especially on third downs were David was the Mike and was more than productive.

      If you have game changing, HoF players on defense, you don't lose games. That's why Sapp, Brooks, Nickerson and Selmon never played on losing teams.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1507

      I wish we’d taken Burfict in the 7th and put Foster at SSLB like everyone has been begging for for years. Keeeeekly is a better version of Ruud but still not the type of linebacker I’d ever want manning the middle on my team. A Bruiser who is a freak athlete when he’s in shape like Burfict next to Foster and David would have been AWWWWWEEESOMMMEEEE

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 929

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and WLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      I don't know where you want me to argue this. It's impossible for one game changed on defense to completely make the defense that better. Even with two game changers it's hard. With that said I hope you have watched Bucs games and if you have there have been plenty of times David has stopped plays behind the LOS on third down. Hell the guy did what no linebacker in the history of the league did last year. Like I said yes WLB is a different position but there were plenty of formations especially on third downs were David was the Mike and was more than productive.

      If you have game changing, HoF players on defense, you don't lose games. That's why Sapp, Brooks, Nickerson and Selmon never played on losing teams.

      Wait you just compared our current defense to a defense that had Sapp, Brooks, Barber, Rice, and Lynch.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      I don't think nobody is saying Kueckly isn't a good player here. Kuechly is a very good player and he would be an upgrade at MLB for just about any team including ours. But anybody who isn't on Kuecklys nuts knows that he didn't deserve DPOY of the year last year. Kueckly is the type of player who will put up stats every year but when it comes to the impact game changer that a JJ Watt or Lavonte David is that's not him. You can compare the two all you want but when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS David is superior and that's pretty much what seperates these two. Yes they do play seperate positions so it's hard to compare but David was basically our MLB in a lot of formations the last past couple years.

      I agree with your overall sentiment, but 1.) How much of a "game changer" is David? Just about every game he's played in the Bucs defense has been between mediocre and horrible. He's very good but doesn't change games. 2.) There's a big difference between WLB and WLB when it comes to taking on blocks, recognizing plays, and getting behind the LOS. WLB is naturally a more playmaking position. MLB is more about being extremely efficient and consistent rather than blowing up plays.

      I don't know where you want me to argue this. It's impossible for one game changed on defense to completely make the defense that better. Even with two game changers it's hard. With that said I hope you have watched Bucs games and if you have there have been plenty of times David has stopped plays behind the LOS on third down. Hell the guy did what no linebacker in the history of the league did last year. Like I said yes WLB is a different position but there were plenty of formations especially on third downs were David was the Mike and was more than productive.

      If you have game changing, HoF players on defense, you don't lose games. That's why Sapp, Brooks, Nickerson and Selmon never played on losing teams.

      Wait you just compared our current defense to a defense that had Sapp, Brooks, Barber, Rice, and Lynch.

      Well, I never mentioned Rice or Lynch, but the point still stands: you can have great players on your team and still lose a lot of games.

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    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      Look @ Weakly get worked by Davin Joesph , LOLzwArYZ.gif

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 824

      When Davin Joseph puts your ass out of a play….

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I wish we'd taken Burfict in the 7th and put Foster at SSLB like everyone has been begging for for years. Keeeeekly is a better version of Ruud but still not the type of linebacker I'd ever want manning the middle on my team. A Bruiser who is a freak athlete when he's in shape like Burfict next to Foster and David would have been AWWWWWEEESOMMMEEEE

      burfict might not cut it in lovies d.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 534

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn’t say that rates as overrated.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2775

      Kuechly > < Barron

      Fixed it for you chief.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 534

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

      A few years ago fans questioned GMACs effectiveness on the team, especially when he got hurt. For fans who paid attention, they realized the DL is completely different when he isn't on the field. Now this Kuechly get his a$$ handed to him a couple of times? Of course he did, just like all players in the league eventually gets. Bottom line, he makes Carolina's D better.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

      A few years ago fans questioned GMACs effectiveness on the team, especially when he got hurt. For fans who paid attention, they realized the DL is completely different when he isn't on the field. Now this Kuechly get his a$$ handed to him a couple of times? Of course he did, just like all players in the league eventually gets. Bottom line, he makes Carolina's D better.

      I'm not denying that he makes Carolina's defense better. He's a good player, but he shouldn't even have been in the conversation for DPOY last season. Robert Quinn, JJ Watt and Lavonte David all had seasons that blew Kuechly's out of the water. He wasn't even the best player on his own defense last year.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 534

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

      The original discussion is about him being overrated, not defensive player of the year. I could care less about that. Its no different than the league usually giving the QB MVP during the SB.A few years ago fans questioned GMACs effectiveness on the team, especially when he got hurt. For fans who paid attention, they realized the DL is completely different when he isn't on the field. Now this Kuechly get his a$$ handed to him a couple of times? Of course he did, just like all players in the league eventually gets. Bottom line, he makes Carolina's D better.

      I'm not denying that he makes Carolina's defense better. He's a good player, but he shouldn't even have been in the conversation for DPOY last season. Robert Quinn, JJ Watt and Lavonte David all had seasons that blew Kuechly's out of the water. He wasn't even the best player on his own defense last year.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      you believing he deserved defensive player of the year is why many believe he is overrated.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

      The original discussion is about him being overrated, not defensive player of the year. I could care less about that. Its no different than the league usually giving the QB MVP during the SB.A few years ago fans questioned GMACs effectiveness on the team, especially when he got hurt. For fans who paid attention, they realized the DL is completely different when he isn't on the field. Now this Kuechly get his a$$ handed to him a couple of times? Of course he did, just like all players in the league eventually gets. Bottom line, he makes Carolina's D better.

      I'm not denying that he makes Carolina's defense better. He's a good player, but he shouldn't even have been in the conversation for DPOY last season. Robert Quinn, JJ Watt and Lavonte David all had seasons that blew Kuechly's out of the water. He wasn't even the best player on his own defense last year.

      The fact that he won DPOY is why I think he's overrated. He shouldn't have gotten it, but he did. The reason he got it is because he is extremely overrated by the media.

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    • stonecoldbucsfan

      Participant
      Post count: 602

      The fans on this board are comical. I am not a fan of Kuechly but I do believe he deserved everything he earned. That defense gotten better when he was on the field. I wouldn't say that rates as overrated.

      If you think he deserved DPOY last season, you didn't watch many other teams.

      A few years ago fans questioned GMACs effectiveness on the team, especially when he got hurt. For fans who paid attention, they realized the DL is completely different when he isn't on the field. Now this Kuechly get his a$$ handed to him a couple of times? Of course he did, just like all players in the league eventually gets. Bottom line, he makes Carolina's D better.

      I'm not denying that he makes Carolina's defense better. He's a good player, but he shouldn't even have been in the conversation for DPOY last season. Robert Quinn, JJ Watt and Lavonte David all had seasons that blew Kuechly's out of the water. He wasn't even the best player on his own defense last year.

      +1 Agree with this completely.

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    • jamesh

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      He is overrated. There is no denying that….but the “Ruud 2.0” stuff is ridiculous. He is a lot better player than Ruud ever was.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      He is overrated. There is no denying that....but the "Ruud 2.0" stuff is ridiculous. He is a lot better player than Ruud ever was.

      Agreed

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    • bigbucsfan

      Participant
      Post count: 82

      Kuechly > < Barron

      Fixed it for you chief.

      Nice attempt at trolling.  But nobody will believe that even you believe that.Kuechly is so much better than Barron, it isn't even up for debate.    He's more intelligent and better looking as well.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 6677

      Very good looking. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 6677

      Keeeeekly is a better version of Ruud but still not the type of linebacker I'd ever want manning the middle on my team.

      yeah he really held that Carolina Defense back.  They were only ranked 2nd in the league.  Oh, I get it now…..you’re a racist. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 6677

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn’t have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2775

      Dude, go hold your poster of Kuechly up with one hand while David dominates the league, while sweeping the Panthers.  Sick.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2967

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn't have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

      He's trolling. That said, he still pines for Kuechly. Not going to change the fact that David is the better backer and the better player. He can keep posting the awards and man-crush montages all he wants. It doesn't change the truth. Feel kinda bad for S&B.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2697

      Barrett Ruud  Revision 2He will start getting trucked as soon as the Panther's DL tails off...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn't have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

      Must have been hard for Luke to do all of that work with your head in his lap.

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    • bigbucsfan

      Participant
      Post count: 82

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn't have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

      Damn, he looks like a bad ass.  If he was green, he could pass for the Incredible Hulk - he's so ripped.    Not only the best middle linebacker in the NFL, but also the best looking one.  Fine figure of a man.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I think you are confused who the Incredible Hulk is.  Maybe bruce banner?

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    • jamesh

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      cf108b48-0f91-4371-b1f2-9c6be1eb1962_PanthersDance1.gif

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    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      cf108b48-0f91-4371-b1f2-9c6be1eb1962_PanthersDance1.gif

      What a dork.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      cf108b48-0f91-4371-b1f2-9c6be1eb1962_PanthersDance1.gif

      I did that same dance every time I saw Lorig knock his dck in the dirt.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5188

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn't have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

      Not funny.  And while I see you are desperate for attention, it doesn't stop me from wondering why you get off on being an idiot at times?  Drugs have wrecked your life, huh?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1312

      Looks like Kuechly has put some time in the weight room since becoming a pro.  Too bad David doesn't have his dedication.  Still looks as scrawny as ever.  86861078-C402-4DCE-A98F-AF455680E874_zpsjtmyupgg.jpg

      Not funny.  And while I see you are desperate for attention, it doesn't stop me from wondering why you get off on being an idiot at timesDrugs have wrecked your life, huh?

      Truth!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      Who wouldn’t want us to redo that pick?  One of the better coverage MLB in the game already.  He and David would be such an amazing pair together.  Taking Barron also future cock blocked us on Jairus Byrd.  Foster/Kuechly/David with Byrd/Goldson behind.  We would be talking about playoffs in 2014. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      I don’t think Kuechly was worthy of DPOY honors last year, but he’s definitely done more for his team than I feel Barron has done for ours.

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    • jamesh

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      Who wouldn't want us to redo that pick?  One of the better coverage MLB in the game already.  He and David would be such an amazing pair together.  Taking Barron also future **CENSORED** blocked us on Jairus Byrd.  Foster/Kuechly/David with Byrd/Goldson behind.  We would be talking about playoffs in 2014.

      Hell, if we are doing a redo, then we should have passed on Goldson and doubled up on FA safeties with Byrd and TJ Ward this off season. Ward is a better player and makes a few million $ less.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      I don't think Kuechly was worthy of DPOY honors last year, but he's definitely done more for his team than I feel Barron has done for ours.

      I agree.  I also don't really dislike Barron.  I still believe he's going to be a quality starting caliber safety.  Maybe even Pro Bowl level player.  When you take a safety that high you kind of hope he comes in right away around that level, but we certainly could have drafted worse there.  Kuechly/Martin/David would have been an insane 1st 3 picks with the trade up and David falling to us.  No Revis trade (which I was completely in favor of) and Star in 2013 draft.  Lovie might take that team on a run right away. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      Who wouldn't want us to redo that pick?  One of the better coverage MLB in the game already.  He and David would be such an amazing pair together.  Taking Barron also future **CENSORED** blocked us on Jairus Byrd.  Foster/Kuechly/David with Byrd/Goldson behind.  We would be talking about playoffs in 2014.

      Hell, if we are doing a redo, then we should have passed on Goldson and doubled up on FA safeties with Byrd and TJ Ward this off season. Ward is a better player and makes a few million $ less.

      I am not sure there were many people against signing Goldson.  I remember some bitching in general on what position groups we were spending huge %'s of the cap on (I might have been in that chorus), but I don't think many saw Dashon coming in and playing like crap.  I was happy that we looked like we were trying again.  There were a healthy number of posters here who were, at the time, saying that Kuechly should be the pick. 

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    • jamesh

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      I would think that there were at least a few here who didn’t like the Goldson acquisition at the time. I remember at other spots that there were Bucs fans that weren’t too happy about it. Either way, he was fools gold…pun intended. He was a safety who was plagued by PF/UR penalties, missed tackles, and blown coverages…but the shininess of his big hits and the overall brilliance of that defense masked all that.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2775

      Let’s not steer this thread away from the topic.  Kuechly couldn’t be more overrated.  He’s the Gerry Cooney of LB’s.  Weak.

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    • brycen54

      Participant
      Post count: 636

      Sour grapes make the best whine.

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    • jamesh

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      Let's not steer this thread away from the topic.  Kuechly couldn't be more overrated.  He's the Gerry **CENSORED**ey of LB's.  Weak.

      He is overrated, but he is still a top tier ILB in the league. Just because a player is overrated, doesn't mean that they are "weak".

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    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      They don’t call him Weakly for no reason…

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 6677

      580DA01A-BD68-4D3A-8358-8BFC09951469_zpsaqfaejro.png

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      If it’s fantasy, it must be true!

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    • bigbucsfan

      Participant
      Post count: 82

      580DA01A-BD68-4D3A-8358-8BFC09951469_zpsaqfaejro.png

      100% for Kuechly and zero for David?    Wow.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2775

      Shows you how the emotions of others make me 100s of thousands of dollars every single year. Buc or no Buc, David is in a class above Kuechly and the emotions of the white loving LB community will always rate Kuechly higher despite being just an above average LB.  Really uninformed.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5572

      They play different positions, why are they even being compared? That poll makes no sense.

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    • brycen54

      Participant
      Post count: 636

      Wow, got so desperate he had to play the race card. Looks like 10lbbass is nearly done.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      Wow, got so desperate he had to play the race card. Looks like 10lbbass is nearly done.

      He can always just change his screen name.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2775

      Wow, got so desperate he had to play the race card. Looks like 10lbbass is nearly done.

      Look, I'm whiter than that fold of skin under your Mom's boobs.  However, in Tampa, there tends to be a fan base that hyper-exaggerates the accomplishments of any white player and the media is just feeding them what they want.  Kuechly is good, he's not elite and David is, regardless of what position they play.  Not the race card, the reality card. 

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    • brycen54

      Participant
      Post count: 636

      “However, in Tampa, there tends to be a fan base that hyper-exaggerates the accomplishments of any white player and the media is just feeding them what they want.”It's like two dudes, and they've been playing you like a cheap fiddle. Get a grip and man up.

      Please wait…

    • dzejms

      Participant
      Post count: 981

      "However, in Tampa, there tends to be a fan base that hyper-exaggerates the accomplishments of any white player and the media is just feeding them what they want."It's like two dudes, and they've been playing you like a cheap fiddle. Get a grip and man up.

      The Bucs don't even have any white starters except for McCown.  So what is that guy talking about?

      Please wait…

    • gobucs123

      Participant
      Post count: 569

      Dietrich-Smith and Brandon Myers are white.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3028

      Dietrich-Smith and Brandon Myers are white.

      Pretty sure our kickers are white too. lol

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 6677

      Dietrich-Smith and Brandon Myers are white.

      love those guys! 

      Please wait…

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