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    • pmbarber

      Participant
      Post count: 44

      It will be interesting when someone posts a break down of the film to see what all Jamies mis-read.http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/esiason-i-didnt-realize-how-far-away-winstonhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h400F0GVoWshttp://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/8_players_who_will_bounce_back_in_week_2_of_2015_nfl_season/s1_12680_19537360

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      Boomer is clearly part of the seedy underbelly!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      That seedly underbelly has family too. Just look in the comments section.

      Please wait…

    • SoberInSac

      Participant
      Post count: 43

      So, he admits that Mariota won’t play that well all season, but says basically Winston has no chance of improving…. right….

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      So, he admits that Mariota won't play that well all season, but says basically Winston has no chance of improving.... right....

      He's saying winston has to improve, and mariota might have had a good time against a pitiful bucs defense and just level off.Winston wont improve. He was who he has always been.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      They really shit the bed on this one.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      They really (censored) the bed on this one.

      Yup. 50/50 chance, w/interviews, and still managed to get the wrong guy.Its un f$$king believable that the product comes out looking like this.I feel like i went to selmons, ordered their best burger to go, got home, opened it up, ..and there's a pile of sh1t.Way to go lovie, you f##ker.

      I dont believe for a second that the football side of the Bucs wanted Winston.  They couldn't have.  No one that knows anything about football would have wanted him at 1.  The guy was terrible in 2014, at least in terms of a Pro skill set.  I am convinced this was the business side due to the FSU thing.  I agree Lovie has done a horrible job, but no way did he want Winston.  Hasn't it come out that Dirk wanted MM instead of Winston?

      Please wait…

    • papalopes

      Participant
      Post count: 33

      it’s crazy how much jameis watches film but yet still he “can’t read defenses.” what the hell is he learning when watching game tape?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      They really (censored) the bed on this one.

      Yup. 50/50 chance, w/interviews, and still managed to get the wrong guy.Its un f$$king believable that the product comes out looking like this.I feel like i went to selmons, ordered their best burger to go, got home, opened it up, ..and there's a pile of sh1t.Way to go lovie, you f##ker.

      I dont believe for a second that the football side of the Bucs wanted Winston.  They couldn't have.  No one that knows anything about football would have wanted him at 1.  The guy was terrible in 2014, at least in terms of a Pro skill set.  I am convinced this was the business side due to the FSU thing.  I agree Lovie has done a horrible job, but no way did he want Winston.  Hasn't it come out that Dirk wanted MM instead of Winston?

      When you draft players to sell tickets instead of win football games...you had better get ready to take a huge bite out of that shit sandwich!!Great...you boosted ticket sales with all the FSU homers...how long do you think they will stick around? They don't give two shits about the Bucs...only their boy. IF the Glazers forced the Jaboo pick...they reaping the rewards of what they sowed...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It’s a Bucs life!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      He was too humble.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      He was too humble.

      He has no fire.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      I agree Lovie has done a horrible job, but no way did he want Winston.  Hasn't it come out that Dirk wanted MM instead of Winston?

      You continue to preach this. Do you have a link to back this up?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1250

      It’s one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, “Relax”.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I agree Lovie has done a horrible job, but no way did he want Winston.  Hasn't it come out that Dirk wanted MM instead of Winston?

      You continue to preach this. Do you have a link to back this up?

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      He was too humble.

      He has no fire.

      He doesn't grab you by the throat.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2847

          Probably the most humble guy in the HOF is QB Bart Starr, who won 5 NFL championships in 7 years. His backup at Green Bay for most of those years, Zeke Bratkowski, out of college was a far more highly regarded Pro prospect. He had a great line about Starr: “Off the field, he was a complete gentleman, but on the football field he’d cut your heart out and show it to you”…

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2847

          Interesting about Koetter. I have read when we interviewed Marc Trestman for the OC job, he insisted on Mariota.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 337

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 206

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      BUT, in this one particular game, Winston showed all the concerns SOME of us had with him in 2014. -He is one of the slowest and least athletic QB's in the league. Glennon bested him in the 40... -His release is slow. -His footwork and agility are abysmal and both of which are very difficult to correct.-He apparently has no idea what defense's are doing judging by the picks he threw. Not to mention the 3-4 dropped picks.-His accuracy is poor.Sure, he can play better than he did this week but his first game showed us a truckload of concerns.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

          Probably the most humble guy in the HOF is QB Bart Starr, who won 5 NFL championships in 7 years. His backup at Green Bay for most of those years, Zeke Bratkowski, out of college was a far more highly regarded Pro prospect. He had a great line about Starr: "Off the field, he was a complete gentleman, but on the football field he'd cut your heart out and show it to you"...

      Eerily similar to what happened Sunday.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's not playing against Duke this week either.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's been consistently mediocre for a while.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's been consistently mediocre for a while.

      Stop it! He is a football savant!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's been consistently mediocre for a while.

      Stop it! He is a football savant!

      Someone should pass that rebuttal on to Boomer.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8096

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's been consistently mediocre for a while.

      Stop it! He is a football savant!

      I think he misses baseball...

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      And they say we are bad fans?..I say. sit and watch this incompetent bullsh1t for ten years freaking years, then tell me you want to be a "fan" of this type of consistantly sucky sh1t.Every fan in tampa should hate the glazers. They have earned it. Their daddy was respectable, they aren't. People see that. And we see the hole they left in the team, while saving up for manu through the funding of nfl revenue that they were supposed to use for cap. It takes little to believe that is exactly what happened. Fans SEE that. We dont care if they moonlight, just don't make this team into the redheaded stepchild of AP. Which is what happened.We are still playing catch-up because of it. It set waves in motion that i haven't yet witnessed being broken. Being cheap helped gruden to be fired, being a little less cheap helped raheem fail as well, and spending a whole lot of dough on schiano and lovie (two guys you should probably not do that with) was even dumber, in an effort to look better in the public eye and somewhat apologise(when actually, in the schiano era, they HAD to reach certain point in capspace, or be fined).To make up for this mess, and to backtrack all the failures they set in motion, i think its safe to say, they should be filling capspace yearly, and provide a at least competitive team, just as a start. Think nicks, vj, whomever type signings yearly until they get it right.Idgaf if they are wrong about things. As a fan, the last thing i want to see is apathy or disingenuous "interest." Because THOSE guys are the head, the top, the big cheese, the big kahuna, the starting of it all. They set the example. They are the unquestionable "leaders" of the whole endeavor. I want to see genuine effort. Yes, ..from them! Omg.Fans are limited by any team's ownership. If they cannot trust or believe in them, it kinda throws the whole relationship into alienation. Add to that taxpayer money, and then top that off with constantly losing, well, ...then it boils into straight up hate.I dont hate them, but they sure should sell the team. They dont know what they are doing, and i dont think they give a sh1t anywhere near as much as some claim.We are an investment to them. No more no less, and for the most part, most folks are starting to wake up to it.I dont blame a single person for stopping being a fan. If any team deserves the loss of your fanhood, this team has earned it. You can only poke the bear so many times before it chews your ass up.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 337

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      It's 1 game, plus the entire preseason and his 2014 season at FSU. He's been mediocre for quite some time now.

      He's been consistently mediocre for a while.

      Stop it! He is a football savant!

      It's OK. He was up watching tape of himself late on Sunday night so that he can go out next week and have the same sloppy footwork, same poor mechanics, same long throwing motion, and make the same mistakes reading LBs in coverage.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      Yup, he said he thought THIS defense was tough...Yikes.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      Winston ranked as one of the least athletic QBs in the draft.  Scary that he was ever in the discussion for first pick in the draft talk.  http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/2/22/8084841/nfl-combine-2015-results-quarterbacks-marcus-mariota-jameis-winston

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      How would you qualify Tenn's defense? They don't exactly have many stars and in fact I remember in the days leading up to the game articles saying how bad the Tenn secondary is.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8096

      Winston ranked as one of the least athletic QBs in the draft.  Scary that he was ever in the discussion for first pick in the draft talk.  http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/2/22/8084841/nfl-combine-2015-results-quarterbacks-marcus-mariota-jameis-winston

      But... you see... we had a clip of him throwing a block!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      I don't think our defense is any good but I don't think they will be this bad. Mariota with his quick and accurate throws threw our defense off. Much like he did in college. Meanwhile Jameious throws a pick six, a lot like he did in college. The funny thing is we saw this before. Mariota has shown up Winston twice in a row! The two games looked exactly the same. Shouldn't that tell us something about the two prospects? And we still pick Winston because he's got the swag and has "it" while Mariota is the quiet humble kid. Like that's going to work with grown men....

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1324

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      And they say we are bad fans?..I say. sit and watch this incompetent bullsh1t for ten years freaking years, then tell me you want to be a "fan" of this type of consistantly sucky sh1t.Every fan in tampa should hate the glazers. They have earned it. Their daddy was respectable, they aren't. People see that. And we see the hole they left in the team, while saving up for manu through the funding of nfl revenue that they were supposed to use for cap. It takes little to believe that is exactly what happened. Fans SEE that. We dont care if they moonlight, just don't make this team into the redheaded stepchild of AP. Which is what happened.We are still playing catch-up because of it. It set waves in motion that i haven't yet witnessed being broken. Being cheap helped gruden to be fired, being a little less cheap helped raheem fail as well, and spending a whole lot of dough on schiano and lovie (two guys you should probably not do that with) was even dumber, in an effort to look better in the public eye and somewhat apologise(when actually, in the schiano era, they HAD to reach certain point in capspace, or be fined).To make up for this mess, and to backtrack all the failures they set in motion, i think its safe to say, they should be filling capspace yearly, and provide a at least competitive team, just as a start. Think nicks, vj, whomever type signings yearly until they get it right.Idgaf if they are wrong about things. As a fan, the last thing i want to see is apathy or disingenuous "interest." Because THOSE guys are the head, the top, the big cheese, the big kahuna, the starting of it all. They set the example. They are the unquestionable "leaders" of the whole endeavor. I want to see genuine effort. Yes, ..from them! Omg.Fans are limited by any team's ownership. If they cannot trust or believe in them, it kinda throws the whole relationship into alienation. Add to that taxpayer money, and then top that off with constantly losing, well, ...then it boils into straight up hate.I dont hate them, but they sure should sell the team. They dont know what they are doing, and i dont think they give a sh1t anywhere near as much as some claim.We are an investment to them. No more no less, and for the most part, most folks are starting to wake up to it.I dont blame a single person for stopping being a fan. If any team deserves the loss of your fanhood, this team has earned it. You can only poke the bear so many times before it chews your ass up.

      REALLY solid vent, a good post that pretty much sums it up. I believe the boos coming down at half time and from the three people in the stands at the end of the game were really menat for the Glazers. THEY are responsible for all the key hires and have final say in the draft as well. The Buccaneers are symtomatic of THEIR "leadership" and for that, yes, we are taking it in the...

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      Why is it so difficult for some folks to give credit to Mariota?  The QB took snaps from under center, correctly identified where to throw the ball, and delivered accurate footballs for 4 frickin' touchdowns.  Give their rookie QB playing in his first NFL game the credit he deserves.  He made all of the right decisions and accurate throws, which is something we can't say about our rookie QB playing in his first game.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      Why is it so difficult for some folks to give credit to Mariota?  The QB took snaps from under center, correctly identified where to throw the ball, and delivered accurate footballs for 4 frickin' touchdowns.  Give their rookie QB playing in his first NFL game the credit he deserves.  He made all of the right decisions and accurate throws, which is something we can't say about our rookie QB playing in his first game.

      Agreed. All the bashing that took place about Mariota not being man enough to be a leader of a NFL team and then seeing what happened Sunday is a blow to an ego.

      Please wait…

    • CWeberUSN

      Participant
      Post count: 22

      It was a complete disaster and failure involving all phases of the game. I am a Buccaneers fan from Tennessee and it was the most embarrassing moment for me as a fan. I was one of the ones that wanted either Mariota or to trade the first pick to Chip Kelly who wanted to sell the farm to us. I will always be behind this team 100 percent but everything that worried me about Winston was displayed on the field yesterday( he was only a problem among problems on the field). Everything about his play looked too slow yesterday ranging from feet to pass delivery. I’m sincerely hoping that this team behind Winston can make a turn around but after a loss like that one it is hard to see at this point. Before I get verbally flogged for saying anything negative about Winston(like I have since expressing on this board that I didn’t find him capable of quarterbacking at this level) I certainly know that the whole team and not just him looked terrible. Cheers to a better game two!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8096

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      Why is it so difficult for some folks to give credit to Mariota?  The QB took snaps from under center, correctly identified where to throw the ball, and delivered accurate footballs for 4 frickin' touchdowns.  Give their rookie QB playing in his first NFL game the credit he deserves.  He made all of the right decisions and accurate throws, which is something we can't say about our rookie QB playing in his first game.

      Given that the Shaun Hills and Derek Anderson level QBs have sliced through our defense... I'll wait to see how Mariota does against other defenses before sending too much credit his way.  He does have a very quick release, tho'...

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses “speculation”.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      And they say we are bad fans?..I say. sit and watch this incompetent bullsh1t for ten years freaking years, then tell me you want to be a "fan" of this type of consistantly sucky sh1t.Every fan in tampa should hate the glazers. They have earned it. Their daddy was respectable, they aren't. People see that. And we see the hole they left in the team, while saving up for manu through the funding of nfl revenue that they were supposed to use for cap. It takes little to believe that is exactly what happened. Fans SEE that. We dont care if they moonlight, just don't make this team into the redheaded stepchild of AP. Which is what happened.We are still playing catch-up because of it. It set waves in motion that i haven't yet witnessed being broken. Being cheap helped gruden to be fired, being a little less cheap helped raheem fail as well, and spending a whole lot of dough on schiano and lovie (two guys you should probably not do that with) was even dumber, in an effort to look better in the public eye and somewhat apologise(when actually, in the schiano era, they HAD to reach certain point in capspace, or be fined).To make up for this mess, and to backtrack all the failures they set in motion, i think its safe to say, they should be filling capspace yearly, and provide a at least competitive team, just as a start. Think nicks, vj, whomever type signings yearly until they get it right. if they are wrong about things. As a fan, the last thing i want to see is apathy or disingenuous "interest." Because THOSE guys are the head, the top, the big cheese, the big kahuna, the starting of it all. They set the example. They are the unquestionable "leaders" of the whole endeavor. I want to see genuine effort. Yes, ..from them! Omg.Fans are limited by any team's ownership. If they cannot trust or believe in them, it kinda throws the whole relationship into alienation. Add to that taxpayer money, and then top that off with constantly losing, well, ...then it boils into straight up hate.I dont hate them, but they sure should sell the team. They dont know what they are doing, and i dont think they give a sh1t anywhere near as much as some claim.We are an investment to them. No more no less, and for the most part, most folks are starting to wake up to it.I dont blame a single person for stopping being a fan. If any team deserves the loss of your fanhood, this team has earned it. You can only poke the bear so many times before it chews your ass up.

      i think most of this is just ignorant or made up bs, but as long as you feel better.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses "speculation".

      That's just one of several links.  Just google it.  BTW JBF has been as big a pimp for Winston as PR has been. 

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1198

      It's one game. Like Aaron  Rodgers said, "Relax".

      Aaron can say relax cus of his track record and Super Bowl ring. NO ONE on the Bucs can say relax with any credibility.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1198

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses "speculation".

      That's the basis of all their "articles"

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses "speculation".

      http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2342580-qb-marcus-mariota-is-obvious-no-1-choice-for-bucs-after-koetter-bajakian-hires

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3392

      I agree Lovie has done a horrible job, but no way did he want Winston.  Hasn't it come out that Dirk wanted MM instead of Winston?

      You continue to preach this. Do you have a link to back this up?

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      I actually heard Benoit mention this before - there's a lot less there than you think. He doesn't say that he was told that DK wanted MM, he says that he knows people who think that DK might have preferred MM.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 212

      WOW  1 game  fire everybody  owners sell the team  send JW OUT OF TOWN  REALLY !!!

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 3392

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses "speculation".

      http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2342580-qb-marcus-mariota-is-obvious-no-1-choice-for-bucs-after-koetter-bajakian-hires

      And then you throw produce another even more speculative item as proof? C'mon. This stuff was talked about frequently prior to the draft as an indication that we would take Mariota over Winston. This article was written to try and predict who we'd take. And guess what - we took Winston. The case for Mariota was always based on DK's friendship with Helfrich -- nothing more. I'd be stunned based on what we learned during the offseason about the strong early preference Licht and Lovie had for Winston that DK wasn't fully cognizant of who the pick would be when he took the job.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 177

      It will be interesting when someone posts a break down of the film to see what all Jamies mis-read.http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/esiason-i-didnt-realize-how-far-away-winstonhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h400F0GVoWs

      Thanks for posting these.  I could not agree more with the "First Take" video.  Spot on, IMO.  Horrible coaching by Smith. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 8983

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2847

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      How would you qualify Tenn's defense? They don't exactly have many stars and in fact I remember in the days leading up to the game articles saying how bad the Tenn secondary is.

          Very good point. Titans best CB (McCourty) didn’t dress, and the other CB, Cox, played with a hip injury. And their Safeties are nothing special either.   What happens in the NFL that doesn't happen much in college is DCs giving opposing QBs one look, then totally CHANGING the coverage once the ball is snapped. DCs generally know what a QBs keys are. It's a real chess game. Remember our road to the Super Bowl when Ronde baited McNabb into that checkdown pass Ronde returned for a TD? He knew EXACTLY what McNabb would do once McNabb sensed a blitz, and was literally standing where McNabb threw the ball.Mr. Winston has a whole lot more NFL lessons waiting for him, which will be challenging due to his lack of physical quickness in both hands and feet...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 177

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2847

      Just google it.  It comes up often.  http://www.620wdae.com/onair/joe-bucs-fan-52126/report-dirk-koetter-wanted-marcus-mariota-13835181

      you do realize this is a JBF report that uses "speculation".

      http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2342580-qb-marcus-mariota-is-obvious-no-1-choice-for-bucs-after-koetter-bajakian-hires

      And then you throw produce another even more speculative item as proof? C'mon. This stuff was talked about frequently prior to the draft as an indication that we would take Mariota over Winston. This article was written to try and predict who we'd take. And guess what - we took Winston. The case for Mariota was always based on DK's friendship with Helfrich -- nothing more. I'd be stunned based on what we learned during the offseason about the strong early preference Licht and Lovie had for Winston that DK wasn't fully cognizant of who the pick would be when he took the job.

      Agree. Not even sure if Koetter ever actually evaluated Mariota. From what I’ve read, Lovie had his mind made up well before the Combine he wanted Winston. All the “private workouts” and such were probably just formalities…

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical.

      They used 2 read option type plays. The rest is what you'll see from the other teams like NE, DEN, and such. We wouldn't know if we had some quick hitting concepts to our offense because Winston is moving like he's playing underwater.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      How would you qualify Tenn's defense?

      I don't really have an answer to that as i haven't had the heart to re-watch it. They definite made more plays than we did. Maybe our D isn't that bad and Mariota is the 2nd coming of Aaron Rodgers. Wouldn't that be a Bucs' life?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9276

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical.

      They used 2 read option type plays. The rest is what you'll see from the other teams like NE, DEN, and such. We wouldn't know if we had some quick hitting concepts to our offense because Winston is moving like he's playing underwater.

      wearing concrete cleats

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2188

      That First take video clip was a good watch. Fair and honest view of both QBs from Skip and Stephen A. — and a shot at Lovie Smith. Better get it together Lovie.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h400F0GVoWs

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical.

      Its plenty sensical if you understand:Jameis got owned by a defense that was supposed to be worse than tampas.Their team was 2st worst last year, and they STOMPED this tampa team like it was a vacay with suh.Winston, at almost every snap that he dropped back, looked like hammered sh1t. Not once did he really have an nfl level dropback, and it wasnt all because of the oline.Watch mariota pass from the pocket, then winston. Winston does a ton of unneeded crap that doesnt help, only slows his delivery and vision.That shoulder drop is the worst. He angles his pads toward the line, not straight a vertical to it. Thats almost inexcusable and wastes another 2/3rds of a second. It also doesnt help him set up for the throw one bit.His footwork and knees are horrid, every game. That isnt ever going to stop.And umm, ..hes throwing to the wrong guys. Thats kind of a biggie. There where actually 4 to 6 almost picks that could have been made by better players or a better defense.Btw, their defense is EASY by nfl standards. A team like the jags are going to stand on winstons head and plant a flag.He looked like crap most of the PS too.I mean, you can be positive all you want. Wont attempt to stop you, but i will say, winston isnt as good as mariota.And yes, that upsets me to say so.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2445

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      Why is it so difficult for some folks to give credit to Mariota?  The QB took snaps from under center, correctly identified where to throw the ball, and delivered accurate footballs for 4 frickin' touchdowns.  Give their rookie QB playing in his first NFL game the credit he deserves.  He made all of the right decisions and accurate throws, which is something we can't say about our rookie QB playing in his first game.

      yesterday I gave him the credit he deserves, gave him props for a great game and congrats to titans fans. but while we're at it lets stop and give them all the credit they deserve for the tough feat that theyve accomplished last year. Im talking about the guys that have had near career days. Anderson a backup QB with no weapons threw 34 times against last year with 70% completion rating. fantastic accuracy, gotta give it up to him. Austin David(?) Im not sure who he is but he was playing QB one day and he looked like Brett Favre against us, really gotta give it up to that guy. Matt Ryan nearly had the Falcons breaking an NFL scoring record on us last season. I think if they wanted to they could have put up 70 points, that is down right impressive. Pedestrian Joe Flacco had the best football game of his career against us. How many TDs did he throw in just one half against us? I know he made a dude win 2 million dollars on draftkings, thats pretty exciting. It is literally the next man up against this defense. Way to go Mariota. Who's Next? By the way, any remember what Josh McCown even looked like against us just 2 weeks ago in preseason? Some people need to wake up. We have a monumental problem on this team. Winston and his rookie struggles are minuscule compared to what is happening on defense. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 583

      Id say they are equal.  The Defense is a sick joke, especially after how they finished the last half of last season playing reasonably well.  Winston isnt a "minuscule" problem.  He was drafted to be our Andrew Luck and based on all of 2014 and all of camp, he will be our Bruce Gradkowski.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 11045

      His problems aren’t miniscule if our D is already bad and he’s scoring points for the other team and trying his hardest to turn the ball over.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 141

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical.

      We all know Winston is our QB for now, it's just disappointing and frustrating for some folks on this board who had qualms about picking him due to his footwork, slow release and bad decisions on the field (at least in 2014) only to be more or less shouted down about how it wasn't his fault cause his teammates weren't that good, that his throwing motion was being worked on and was a result of playing baseball in the offseason and that he was leaps and bounds above the alternative because of his 'football IQ', leadership qualities and great arm. Cue preseason, Winston exhibits the same problems but we're told it's a good thing, he's playing against a good defense and learning by making mistakes. Cue opening day and we see the same thing but apparently now we're supposed to blame the defense and we should have patience with Winston while he learns the speed of the game and gets comfortable. I'm all good with having patience, but it'd be nice if we could see some progress in the areas that folks had concerns with about his abilities on the field. And good lord, regardless of how bad the defense was can some of you people give just a smidgen of credit to Mariota for the game he played? Do you honestly think Mettenberger would have done that well?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2445

      Id say they are equal.  The Defense is a sick joke, especially after how they finished the last half of last season playing reasonably well.  Winston isnt a "minuscule" problem.  He was drafted to be our Andrew Luck and based on all of 2014 and all of camp, he will be our Bruce Gradkowski.

      when a team drafts a QB to be their future, they mean just that, "future". you have to grab the dictionary or learn to work google. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/futureWe didnt draft him on a one year rental deal where its one shot, now or never. if that were how it works, then andrew luck himself would have been a bust. If you want to base the projection of a rookie QBs career off a up and down rookie camp and preseason then you've got your own problems. but right now, the biggest problems for the bucs is by far, leading by miles, is this defense.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2445

      His problems aren't miniscule if our D is already bad and he's scoring points for the other team and trying his hardest to turn the ball over.

      our defense isnt supposed to be already bad, and some of you still are not quite grasping the magnitude of how bad the bucs are getting blown out. The titans could have very easily scored 50 points on us. another 50 point game inside of 16 games. a winston pick 6 as a rookie, who cares? if winston is throwing a pick 6s every game then we got problems but right now that crap is expected. You guys are shrugging off what is a historically bad defense right now. hell at worst you if you really wanted you could throw glennon in at QB, you can put a game manager it, whatever. QB isnt relevent in the face of whats going on with the defense. Teams are scoring homeruns on quick slants like at will, running the ball up the gut on out prized DT group. our all start LBs are missing tackles and leaving people open all over the place. Everyone is wide open, and QBs are un pressured.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 141

      yesterday I gave him the credit he deserves, gave him props for a great game and congrats to titans fans. but while we're at it lets stop and give them all the credit they deserve for the tough feat that theyve accomplished last year. Im talking about the guys that have had near career days. Anderson a backup QB with no weapons threw 34 times against last year with 70% completion rating. fantastic accuracy, gotta give it up to him. Austin David(?) Im not sure who he is but he was playing QB one day and he looked like Brett Favre against us, really gotta give it up to that guy. Matt Ryan nearly had the Falcons breaking an NFL scoring record on us last season. I think if they wanted to they could have put up 70 points, that is down right impressive. Pedestrian Joe Flacco had the best football game of his career against us. How many TDs did he throw in just one half against us? I know he made a dude win 2 million dollars on draftkings, thats pretty exciting. It is literally the next man up against this defense. Way to go Mariota. Who's Next? By the way, any remember what Josh McCown even looked like against us just 2 weeks ago in preseason? Some people need to wake up. We have a monumental problem on this team. Winston and his rookie struggles are minuscule compared to what is happening on defense.

      Quick question for you Pepsi: If all of these guys are doing so well against our admittedly bad defense, why is Winston doing so poorly against them in practice and do you think that should be a concern going forward?

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    • JonMott

      Participant
      Post count: 319

      What exactly did Stephen A about Lovie? I assume they said we suck.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1250

      Id say they are equal.  The Defense is a sick joke, especially after how they finished the last half of last season playing reasonably well.  Winston isnt a "minuscule" problem.  He was drafted to be our Andrew Luck and based on all of 2014 and all of camp, he will be our Bruce Gradkowski.

      when a team drafts a QB to be their future, they mean just that, "future". you have to grab the dictionary or learn to work google. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/futureWe didnt draft him on a one year rental deal where its one shot, now or never. if that were how it works, then andrew luck himself would have been a bust. If you want to base the projection of a rookie QBs career off a up and down rookie camp and preseason then you've got your own problems. but right now, the biggest problems for the bucs is by far, leading by miles, is this defense.

      Finally someone who gets it. People need to calm down and understand that we were a 2-14 team last year with a rookie QB at the helm. The defense looked worse than Winston when the defense was supposed to be improved.Give Winston some time to develop.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 11045

      yesterday I gave him the credit he deserves, gave him props for a great game and congrats to titans fans. but while we're at it lets stop and give them all the credit they deserve for the tough feat that theyve accomplished last year. Im talking about the guys that have had near career days. Anderson a backup QB with no weapons threw 34 times against last year with 70% completion rating. fantastic accuracy, gotta give it up to him. Austin David(?) Im not sure who he is but he was playing QB one day and he looked like Brett Favre against us, really gotta give it up to that guy. Matt Ryan nearly had the Falcons breaking an NFL scoring record on us last season. I think if they wanted to they could have put up 70 points, that is down right impressive. Pedestrian Joe Flacco had the best football game of his career against us. How many TDs did he throw in just one half against us? I know he made a dude win 2 million dollars on draftkings, thats pretty exciting. It is literally the next man up against this defense. Way to go Mariota. Who's Next? By the way, any remember what Josh McCown even looked like against us just 2 weeks ago in preseason? Some people need to wake up. We have a monumental problem on this team. Winston and his rookie struggles are minuscule compared to what is happening on defense.

      Quick question for you Pepsi: If all of these guys are doing so well against our admittedly bad defense, why is Winston doing so poorly against them in practice and do you think that should be a concern going forward?

      Good question.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      You guys are shrugging off what is a historically bad defense right now.

      Who is shrugging it off?  The vast majority are wanting the HC, who runs the defense, fired on the spot because of the defensive showing on Sunday.

      QB isnt relevent in the face of whats going on with the defense.

      The QB is always relevant.  Always.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 177

      yesterday I gave him the credit he deserves, gave him props for a great game and congrats to titans fans. but while we're at it lets stop and give them all the credit they deserve for the tough feat that theyve accomplished last year. Im talking about the guys that have had near career days. Anderson a backup QB with no weapons threw 34 times against last year with 70% completion rating. fantastic accuracy, gotta give it up to him. Austin David(?) Im not sure who he is but he was playing QB one day and he looked like Brett Favre against us, really gotta give it up to that guy. Matt Ryan nearly had the Falcons breaking an NFL scoring record on us last season. I think if they wanted to they could have put up 70 points, that is down right impressive. Pedestrian Joe Flacco had the best football game of his career against us. How many TDs did he throw in just one half against us? I know he made a dude win 2 million dollars on draftkings, thats pretty exciting. It is literally the next man up against this defense. Way to go Mariota. Who's Next? By the way, any remember what Josh McCown even looked like against us just 2 weeks ago in preseason? Some people need to wake up. We have a monumental problem on this team. Winston and his rookie struggles are minuscule compared to what is happening on defense.

      Quick question for you Pepsi: If all of these guys are doing so well against our admittedly bad defense, why is Winston doing so poorly against them in practice and do you think that should be a concern going forward?

      Good question.

      It is the difference in schemes.  First, was Winston bad against our defense, or was he throwing picks?  There is a difference.  He will have picks, just like Brees, Manning, Luck, et al have plenty of picks, and he will have more than them while he learns.  Get used to it.  The Bucs didn't draft Winston to be a caretaker.  Glennon is perfect for that role.  They drafted him to be aggressive, and that usually comes with its fair share of interceptions.  But, the difference in the two is what they are being asked to do.  Mariota picked apart our defense with short passes run off read option.  The Bucs defense had no response to it.  But, that is not even part of our playbook.  Winston is being asked to stretch the defense vertically.   

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 177

      What exactly did Stephen A about Lovie? I assume they said we suck.

      In summary, he and Bayless both commented on the fact that Lovie was outcoached and did not have his defense prepared, and failed miserably to put his rookie QB in position to succeed.  Both voiced support for Winston, and opined that he would be a great pro - better than Mariota according to Bayless - but thought Tennessee was doing a much better job developing Mariota for success at this stage of his career.  Message to Lovie was to fix it in a hurry because it was awful in every possible way.  It is a quick watch, and worth the 2-3 minutes if you are able to access it. 

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2169

      Mariota looked like the pro ready guy and Winston looked like the project. Great! So not only did we skip out on the guy who is the better athlete but the guy who is more pro ready too. It's a Bucs life!

      Winston looked like sh*t to be sure but Mariota got the benefit of playing vs a craptastic defense.

      And he had our craptastic defense sounding like the #LOB, so how far away is he really?

      That went over my head, youngin'

      In training camp, Winston threw a boatload of INTs to our craptastic defense. The same defense that couldn't sniff a Mariota pass all day. The Dick LeBeau Titans couldn't pick their rookie QB off and people disregarded that as babying and horrible defense. That same defense could have had 5 INT's on Sunday. Makes me believe that these guys are far apart from the other.

      Yup. That puts the story together nicely. And it's a sad one.

      Yup, when hes throwning picks to this defense in practice, and mariota can torch it in a regular season game. How is that supposed to be argued exactly?This is the part you cant spin, and young hit the nail on the head. Tampas defense got manhandled and laughed at by mariota, while winston has been throwing picks to to them in practice.There is no real way to spin that in favor of winston.

      The difference is that Mariota picked the team apart with read option, quick strike passes to unmolested underneath routes.  Winston, since day one, has been asked to spread the field with multiple reads to deep and intermediate routes to receivers that rely on size and physicality, rather than separation, for success.  Could Winston thrive in a quick hitting scheme?  Could Mariota thrive in a multiple read, vertical attack?  I don't know the answer to either of those questions, because neither is being asked to do what the other is doing.  That is why it is utterly idiotic to rush to judgment at this point.  Criticize the "plan" for preparing Winston all you want, or espouse the benefits of the Mariota "plan" all day, or by all means debate the schemes, but to crown or crucify a rookie QB  - especially our own rookie QB - based on his first NFL game is nonsensical.

      What gives you the gall to use measured and sober logic here?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2026

      Damn some of you are a little to quick to Shit on Winston this early no? I understand your pissed and the other rookie qb did good going against are poo defense and garbage coaching/schemes. It's 1 game. And this is coming from someone who had liked mariota.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 141

      yesterday I gave him the credit he deserves, gave him props for a great game and congrats to titans fans. but while we're at it lets stop and give them all the credit they deserve for the tough feat that theyve accomplished last year. Im talking about the guys that have had near career days. Anderson a backup QB with no weapons threw 34 times against last year with 70% completion rating. fantastic accuracy, gotta give it up to him. Austin David(?) Im not sure who he is but he was playing QB one day and he looked like Brett Favre against us, really gotta give it up to that guy. Matt Ryan nearly had the Falcons breaking an NFL scoring record on us last season. I think if they wanted to they could have put up 70 points, that is down right impressive. Pedestrian Joe Flacco had the best football game of his career against us. How many TDs did he throw in just one half against us? I know he made a dude win 2 million dollars on draftkings, thats pretty exciting. It is literally the next man up against this defense. Way to go Mariota. Who's Next? By the way, any remember what Josh McCown even looked like against us just 2 weeks ago in preseason? Some people need to wake up. We have a monumental problem on this team. Winston and his rookie struggles are minuscule compared to what is happening on defense.

      Quick question for you Pepsi: If all of these guys are doing so well against our admittedly bad defense, why is Winston doing so poorly against them in practice and do you think that should be a concern going forward?

      Good question.

      It is the difference in schemes.  First, was Winston bad against our defense, or was he throwing picks?  There is a difference.  He will have picks, just like Brees, Manning, Luck, et al have plenty of picks, and he will have more than them while he learns.  Get used to it.  The Bucs didn't draft Winston to be a caretaker.  Glennon is perfect for that role.  They drafted him to be aggressive, and that usually comes with its fair share of interceptions.  But, the difference in the two is what they are being asked to do.  Mariota picked apart our defense with short passes run off read option.  The Bucs defense had no response to it.  But, that is not even part of our playbook.  Winston is being asked to stretch the defense vertically. 

      Tennessee didn't use that much read option honestly and it's not like Mariota only threw short passes on the day, from the play-by-play five of his throws were deep (through the air, not catch and run like the 52 yard TD). Anyone who looked at more than a few moments of Mariota's college film would know he can stretch the field vertically - hell, he led all power 5 QBs in college football last year in  vertical pass attempts (183), completions (109), yards (2,840), touchdowns (27), and Total QBR (98.0). And he did that with an abysmal offensive line. Yeah, sure, it's one game. Both will have better and worse games, but seriously what is there that Winston has shown so far in pre-season and his first game to build on? Even if he's essentially being thrown to the wolves as you seem to imply, shouldn't there be something, anything we can point to in his game/skill set to indicate he's going to get better? He's not exactly lighting up the Buc's defense in practice from the reports we've seen, certainly not at the same level as all of the supposed bad/average QBs Pepsi mentions in his post earlier, and certainly not at the same level that Mariota did against the Bucs (not to mention how Mariota did against his own defense in practice where LeBeau said he threw every coverage disguise and blitz at Mariota to prepare him for TB). And so now we're supposed to give Winston time to 'get it' when he was supposed to be the most pro-ready QB since Jesus. How long do we give him? More time than we gave Freeman to 'get it' or less? Or perhaps the time we gave to Chris Simms (since some here will no doubt try to say I'm being racist for being critical of Winston and Freeman). If he needs the time to adjust to the speed of the game or whatnot, why oh why would you not narrow the scope of the game for him some? Why does it seem no one is working with Winston on his mechanics that were questionable even during his Heisman season?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 2169

      One thing I find interesting is the amount of new accounts that have suddenly started spitting hellfire at Lovie, Jameis etc…I mean…couldn’t you guys at least use your regular RB handles to do that?

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    • Anonymous

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      Tennessee didn't use that much read option honestly and it's not like Mariota only threw short passes on the day, from the play-by-play five of his throws were deep (through the air, not catch and run like the 52 yard TD). Anyone who looked at more than a few moments of Mariota's college film would know he can stretch the field vertically - hell, he led all power 5 QBs in college football last year in  vertical pass attempts (183), completions (109), yards (2,840), touchdowns (27), and Total QBR (98.0). And he did that with an abysmal offensive line. Yeah, sure, it's one game. Both will have better and worse games, but seriously what is there that Winston has shown so far in pre-season and his first game to build on? Even if he's essentially being thrown to the wolves as you seem to imply, shouldn't there be something, anything we can point to in his game/skill set to indicate he's going to get better? He's not exactly lighting up the Buc's defense in practice from the reports we've seen, certainly not at the same level as all of the supposed bad/average QBs Pepsi mentions in his post earlier, and certainly not at the same level that Mariota did against the Bucs (not to mention how Mariota did against his own defense in practice where LeBeau said he threw every coverage disguise and blitz at Mariota to prepare him for TB). And so now we're supposed to give Winston time to 'get it' when he was supposed to be the most pro-ready QB since Jesus. How long do we give him? More time than we gave Freeman to 'get it' or less? Or perhaps the time we gave to Chris Simms (since some here will no doubt try to say I'm being racist for being critical of Winston and Freeman). If he needs the time to adjust to the speed of the game or whatnot, why oh why would you not narrow the scope of the game for him some? Why does it seem no one is working with Winston on his mechanics that were questionable even during his Heisman season?

      I don't know how much time to give him, but he was too good in college to simply dismiss him as lacking talent.  He didn't forget how to throw a football - something he did as well as anyone in college in the past decade, and, if he did, then who's to blame?  That said, I am in COMPLETE agreement with your last sentence [highlighted above].  His mechanics, while quirky, don't bother me as much as the game plan.  Phillip Rivers has as quirky a motion as anyone, and he gets it done fine.  Jameis, despite his motion, historically has gotten rid of the ball on time and with accuracy to spare.  I don't want to mess with his motion too much, though a bit of a fine tuning is justified.  I am MOST concerned about the manner in which he is being groomed.  Get the guy some success to build on.  Give him some easy reads.  Give him some short completions to build a rhythm for the offense.  And, for goodness sakes, keep running the football!  Guy was the best player in college football as a 19 year old freshman, and doing what many knowledgeable commentators called "graduate level" QB stuff then.  But, he had the benefit of a redshirt year to learn the offense and get acclimated to college.  Not only are the Bucs not giving him a redshirt year, they don't appear to be giving him much of a chance to get acclimated to the NFL.  It appears to be pure "sink or swim."  That scares the heck out of me.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 337

      Id say they are equal.  The Defense is a sick joke, especially after how they finished the last half of last season playing reasonably well.  Winston isnt a "minuscule" problem.  He was drafted to be our Andrew Luck and based on all of 2014 and all of camp, he will be our Bruce Gradkowski.

      when a team drafts a QB to be their future, they mean just that, "future". you have to grab the dictionary or learn to work google. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/futureWe didnt draft him on a one year rental deal where its one shot, now or never. if that were how it works, then andrew luck himself would have been a bust. If you want to base the projection of a rookie QBs career off a up and down rookie camp and preseason then you've got your own problems. but right now, the biggest problems for the bucs is by far, leading by miles, is this defense.

      He looks like a 7th round pick out there, and he's improved absolutely none of the areas of concern many had going into the draft -- his footwork is nightmarish, his throwing motion is sloppy and long, his accuracy is poor, and he misread coverages multiple times.I get that he's a rookie, but he hasn't improved an iota from college and the things he is doing wrong are things he should have fixed with proper coaching and attention. He looks slow, his balls lack any zip or authority, and he looks confused as hell. I expect that out of a Mike Glennon or Bruce Gradkowski, I sure as hell don't expect it out of the #1 overall pick.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 690

      Id say they are equal.  The Defense is a sick joke, especially after how they finished the last half of last season playing reasonably well.  Winston isnt a "minuscule" problem.  He was drafted to be our Andrew Luck and based on all of 2014 and all of camp, he will be our Bruce Gradkowski.

      when a team drafts a QB to be their future, they mean just that, "future". you have to grab the dictionary or learn to work google. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/futureWe didnt draft him on a one year rental deal where its one shot, now or never. if that were how it works, then andrew luck himself would have been a bust. If you want to base the projection of a rookie QBs career off a up and down rookie camp and preseason then you've got your own problems. but right now, the biggest problems for the bucs is by far, leading by miles, is this defense.

      It's a fair point, but it's also part of the problem now as well. Winston wasn't really sold as the future as much as someone who was Pro Ready enough to save Lovie's job and help the team win now. Mariota was sold as the guy we would need to wait on. That might still be the case, it was only one game and maybe Winston showed his worst early, but unfortunately the pressure is going to continue to grow until Winston looks like an NFL QB. It's what happens when the guy being so pro ready is given as his best trait. And if Mariota lights it up again on Sunday and Winston suffers? God help this board.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 456

      WOW  1 game  fire everybody  owners sell the team  send JW OUT OF TOWN  REALLY !!!

      Do you remember last years first game?They were able to top that bad performance this year.And you wonder?

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 303

      Does the Mariota crowd really believe that our coaching staff would have figured out a gameplan that would make Mariota look equally as good if the Bucs drafted him? Ha! That’s funniest shit I’ve read all day!The biggest joke of all is if Winston went to Tennessee all the JW fans would ripping the organization saying we took the wrong guy. Who on our team can run quick slants? Louis Murphy? Humphries? Ha! It's not the QB that's the problem.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 11045

      Does the Mariota crowd really believe that our coaching staff would have figured out a gameplan that would make Mariota look equally as good if the Bucs drafted him? Ha! That's funniest (censored) I've read all day!The biggest joke of all is if Winston went to Tennessee all the JW fans would ripping the organization saying we took the wrong guy. Who on our team can run quick slants? Louis Murphy? Humphries? Ha! It's not the QB that's the problem.

      I'm sure Mariota wouldn't be looking he has 2 left feet out there. We haven't seen anything to inspire any confidence in the guy. It's not only that Mariota looked so much better, its that Winston looks so damn bad at everything so far.

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    • Anonymous

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      Post count: 10626

      Not a fan of the show, since whats her name left. She was worth watching. But they are right, its all on Lovie. Sure Winston stunk, but that was not totally unexpected.  What was shocking was how unprepared they were. And that all falls on one guy.

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