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    • Alldaway 2.0

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      Post count: 4394

      *Alldaway turns on light switch, little critters scatter to the dark corners of the room once more for the next two weeks*Lovie and Licht deserve credit for cleaning up the cap situation of the team to be balanced for both sides of the ball.  They missed on young, free agents in their prime in their first year, but they did not overpay for mediocre unproven talent or banged up talent that other teams did not want.  For example, signing of Wright or trading a first round draft pick and hand over $16 million to an old CB with a gimpy knee (Revis).  Or even handing top dollar money to an OG (Nicks) with lingering injuries. The MRSA was the final nail in the coffin but it wasn’t the only one.LiLo realizing the mistakes they made in their first off season, and looking at how their predecessors were jettisoned because of their unorthodox spending sprees (Schiano and Dominik), went back to the drawing board:1. LiLo ditched the failed FA’s they brought in, and went back to what Licht was brought in to do.  Find FA’s at bargain deals that could help this team. This is a proven formula as Bruce Allen showed with his signing of Bolden, Hovan, Hilliard, Bryant, etc.  McKay did a similar thing with bargain free agents of Pittman, Dilger, McCardell, etc. Licht is not doing anything different with McDonald, Jennings, Conte, Wright, Carter, Myers, Murphy, etc.  It is a proven formula because even for rebuilding/young teams you still need some veteran guidance (eg Kevin Carter with Raheem’s supremely young Bucs or Lomas Brown with Gruden’s more veteran laden Bucs).2. Licht was brought in to restructure the Bucs organization with the departures of Dominick and Hickey.  New scouts have been brought in and the emphasis on finding players that fit the Bucs respective offensive and defensive system has commenced since then and has been ongoing.  The pro player personnel side as well as the collegiate overview of scouting has been transformed in a short window of time.3. Tedford’s unexpected leave of the team was a bigger impediment to the team than most want to admit.  It set back the newly put in place scouting department, installing systems for players to learn and also for growth in continuity of playing in a system. This is no surprise why the defense is ahead, and why the defense also boasts more veteran players familiar with Lovie’s defense.  However, there are players familiar with Koetter’s offense and it is paying off (Hawley).4. Bucs have re-signed their core home grown players (McCoy and David), which has been and will always be, a top priority of the Glazer family.  To build a sense of continuity, familiarity. In addition, to also build home-grown pride for the Bucs fans to root and cheer for these players in the present and the future.5. The 2015 Bucs are one of the youngest teams in all of football currently.  The 2015 Bucs are also starting the most rookies in all of football, and all at integral positions of this team.  The QB of the offense (Winston), the “QB” of the defense (Alexander). The blindside protector for the QB (Smith).  The run blocking guard on the strong side of formations (Marpet). Not to mention the large roles that 2nd, 3rd and 4th year  Bucs players are being asked to do which other teams have 6th, 7th and 8th year veterans doing the same roles.6. Bucs will have about $22 million available next off season freed up from the dead money alone. Johnson and Collins are obvious dead money hits from LiLo’s mistake from last season.  But Goldshon, Barron, and Nicks all left a parting gifts for the Bucs organization to clean up in 2015 too. How Mark Dominik escapes criticism from this I do not understand.  I will not mention which dynamic duo thought it was a good idea to draft a box safety in the top ten, sign a box safety in free agency and then sign an injury riddled OG. Forgot to mention surrendering a first round pick and $16 million for a CB that was exclusively used in zone coverage in 2013. I will let your imagination fill in the blanks.  7. Doug Martin is the only noteworthy Bucs free agent the Bucs must mull over to re-sign this coming off season. The rest of the list of UFA is as follows: Melton, Rainey, Moore, McDaniel, Conte, Johnson, English, Jennings, Jenkins, Barth, Lemon, and Tandy.  The remainder not mentioned are RFA or ERFA for 2016.8. Heading into the bye week with a 2-3 record is something Bucs fans should be proud of.  No one was predicting this team to be anywhere close to that heading into the bye.  Most were projecting this team max 4-5 wins after a 16 game season.  I projected this team as a 6-10 in the off season based on talent on the squad and circumstances (eg young team, starting a rookie QB).  Right now, the young, upstart Bucs are ahead of schedule. We will see if they can keep momentum going.9. This team will become a lot younger real quick by next off season.  Mankins doesn’t have much of a future with this team just as an obvious example, but he fills the veteran knowledge niche needed to guide young OL for the time being.  VJAX is playing out probably his last contract with the Bucs and Evans will eventually slide in and take over his role.10. On a final note, the much maligned Bucs defense (surprisingly from Bucs fans exclusively) is currently ranked highly in multiple categories.  I still don’t understand why Bucs fans don’t understand how the Bucs defense works and why they don’t see how their play has been better than average from the rest of the NFL. The most exciting thing is the Bucs may have the trio they need on defense at RDE, UT, and WILL.  They still need to find a rangy FS to compliment Kwon Alexander up the middle.  And some young blood on the outside CB spot to eventually start opposite of Banks. The Bucs defense is obviously a work in progress and they are well ahead of schedule despite not as many resources have been devoted to that side of the ball thus far. Overall, I want to see this transformation of this team play out without the knee jerk belly aching some are clamoring for.  I want to see LiLo rebuild this team into having a solid base again. When you draft a QB #1 overall, and release free agents you signed a year ago, that is a clear concession this is a rebuilding team and are starting over from the root of the foundation.  Maybe LiLo fall short in the long term, but right now based on what I am seeing I agree with their approach 100%.  Draft & develop, re-sign homegrown talent, bring in bargain free agents, and have continuity in offensive/defensive systems.  This team has needed a solid base from a coaching staff, and scouting perspective for a long time.  People pointing to the quick success stories like Quinn in Atlanta, for example, (Sorry Scott Reynolds I had to go there) are drinking too much of the kool-aid on the other side of the grass.  First, that Falcons team has a fully mature and experienced veteran QB in Matt Ryan coupled with a finally healthy OL unlike last year.  That defense is very overrated, but they have been opportunistic, but not that much better than other top 15 defenses in the league though.  What Quinn is doing is not anything different than Fox with Denver or Gruden with the Bucs year 1.  A team that is fully fleshed out and needs a little push is not the same as a team that needs to be built from the ground up.  The 2014 Bucs are not the team Dungy left behind by any measure. But what Gruden, Morris, Dominik, and Schiano left behind for Lovie and Licht to clean up. With over a decade of inconsistent drafting and letting home grow players seek paydays elsewhere this is the result.  Most NFL teams are still starting players on their respective rosters from the time Gruden was the head coach of the Bucs in 2008!  You can’t have such misses in the draft over such a period of time, and not expect an experienced void at the top of the team.  That is why having a player like Vincent Jackson has been truly a blessing, but it is rare when you hire free agents for top dollar to do such a task.  The misses in the draft from the McKay era heavily influenced how the Bucs approached the draft under Gruden/Allen as they had (special teams emphasis).  But Gruden/Allen over compensated looking for special team aces which led to even more failed draft choices as the pool of young starters on their team started to dwindle.  It wasn’t until Dominik came into the fold that team started to draft players again that showed NFL potential to play and start in this league again.  He had mixed results, but at least he started to reverse the trend.  Gruden’s lack of emphasis on drafting D-linemen (other than G. Adams) and Dominik’s lack of emphasis on drafting O-linemen has put the team in precarious situation.  Moving on, outside observers are quick to point to me that Evans is only in his second season and many of the important pieces on offense are very young and have yet to hit their potential ceiling thus far.  Mankins and VJAX are going to be out of the picture soon enough with younger players stepping into their shoes.  Even the younger veterans like McCoy and David have still less collective experience than many NFL defenders still playing in the NFL.  The much maligned Banks is actually slowly but surely becoming a credible NFL defender.  But like all cornerbacks, it takes time (eg Barber, Kelly, etc).  So, the key is patience and not looking at the grass that appears to be greener on the other side with some “quick fix”.  The quick fix failed Gruden/Allen year 1, it failed Schiano/Dominik year 1, and surprise!.... it also failed Lovie/Licht year 1.  Have some respect for the Bucs organization for what they are trying to accomplish, because there is no such thing as a “quick fix”.  The organization has had to be restructured fairly frequently just as much as the coaching staff has been the last ten years.  So, it is unrealistic and unfair to expect Licht, the new front office, new scouts, and Lovie and his coaching staff to put everything together in less than three years.  Rebuilding takes three years to be fully realized and the Bucs have just started year 1.Gruden and Allen started their rebuilding in 2005 (year 1) and actually saw a reversal of fortunes for the team. That is a big reason why the 2006 season was not held against a proven coach like Gruden.  Gruden followed 2007 with a comeback season but the 2008 season showed that Gruden and Allen were starting to deviate from the rebuilding structure put forth to them by 2008. Draft picks were not panning out and the Gruden/Allen tandem wanted to go back to the 2004 approach of doing business.  That type of approach is not the Buccaneer way the Glazer family has outlined.  The Glazers want quality players to be drafted and retained by the team and not go head hunting every off season for hired mercs and guns at top dollar prices.  It doesn’t make sense from a long term salary cap perspective and it doesn’t build the Buccaneer brand.Glazers #1 priority is to provide a product on the field that is about stability, familiarity and pride.  If you want to say they are trying to copy the Baltimore Ravens and Pittsburgh Steeler model, then yes that is exactly what they are aiming for.  They chose Morris and Schiano because they wanted either coach to grow into the job and breed familiarity and pride for the Bucs brand over a long period of time.  Ownership views the Bucs as a brand and to build that you need familiar faces not a revolving door with an empty chair at OBP.  The Glazer family has a long term vision of the team, because the Glazer family is about long term business ventures. They liked the idea of Morris molding a young team of upstarts and for a while it was actually working.  The problem with Morris was he simply lacked the maturity. Schiano had a reputation of building a program from the ground up.  The problem was he didn’t have a vision that was compatible with the reality of the NFL.  The Glazers have clearly made efforts to bring in head coaches they feel they can build such a brand with.  They are not interested in a coaching carousel but these extreme circumstances have forced their hand twice.Some fans and in the media are clamoring for the Bucs to be like the other big city teams with a carousel of coaching changes, but the Tampa Bay Bucs are not like that and do not have the same draw for the big name coaches some people have mentioned.  The Bucs do not have the same fan base that the Cowboys or the Raiders have as an example or a big metropolitan city to draw from (eg Giants/Jets).  Even the uniform changes the Bucs have undergone has made it questionable if they have grown the brand. But what is clear is that the Glazers want growth of the Bucs brand.  And to do that you start with the root and let it sprout which will take time.  Complaints about the little tree not providing shade are short-sighted and miss the point. 

      Please wait…

      Build the trenches!

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3316

      Get your own website with that 4 page article.2-3 projects 6-10How is that ahead of schedule?  You're on crack.Jameis looks good in a limited role.

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    • rmslpn

      Participant
      Post count: 1384

      6 wins is what I expected this year, that is 3 times the wins from last yearshow improvement is what I have to see.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      The regime’s 4-17 is ahead of schedule?I didn't read the wall of text because the title is so funny. Well played OP.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 950

      Melton is also a free agent of ours that is worthy of being re-signed.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2967

      Sorry, can’t give up 31 points to friggin Jacksonville in your house. We’re fortunate we got a TO/TD. Other than that, the defense couldn’t stop Bortles. Think about that.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 704

      One win against the only team that has been worse than the Bucs for the past 5 years is not something to get too excited about. If Lovie puts together a win streak then we can start talking.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 141

      Well, if winning the first home game of the regime on the 11th try is ahead of schedule, can we get a new schedule?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      Sorry, can't give up 31 points to friggin Jacksonville in your house. We're fortunate we got a TO/TD. Other than that, the defense couldn't stop Bortles. Think about that.

      Well, if winning the first home game of the regime on the 11th try is ahead of schedule, can we get a new schedule?

      These guys about covered it.Beat the worst team in NFL down to the wire, OP writes a 6 page article about how he knew this was the plan all alonglol

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1385

      AD, I’m usually on your side, but this is rampant optimism at it’s best. Hayseed and NovaBuc are right, a win today proves nothing and doesn’t necessarily herald better things to come. The defense didn’t perform well today and we were lucky that we got a win. Let's see what the Bucs can do after the break before we anoint the plan a success. Franky, today Lovie just got a stay of execution as far as I'm concerned, not a reprieve.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      The regime's 4-17 is ahead of schedule?I didn't read the wall of text because the title is so funny. Well played OP.

      Hear, hear.Still, good thread OP

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 975

      10. On a final note, the much maligned Bucs defense (surprisingly from Bucs fans exclusively) is currently ranked highly in multiple categories.  I still don’t understand why Bucs fans don’t understand how the Bucs defense works and why they don’t see how their play has been better than average from the rest of the NFL.

      We gave up 31 points to a sh*t team. If this is how it is supposed to work then I would advocate for a different system.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8096

      2-3 against 5 one-win teams… two wins by one score…Who is the schedule maker?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2601

      #6 +1000Schiano was worse than Rah. Could not stand him as our HC.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3420

      Sorry, can't give up 31 points to friggin Jacksonville in your house. We're fortunate we got a TO/TD. Other than that, the defense couldn't stop Bortles. Think about that.

      Well, if winning the first home game of the regime on the 11th try is ahead of schedule, can we get a new schedule?

      These guys about covered it.Beat the worst team in NFL down to the wire, OP writes a 6 page article about how he knew this was the plan all alonglol

      In fairness, they have to beat these bad teams before they can move up to the next level of teams. If not, they are still one of the bad teams.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      Sorry, can't give up 31 points to friggin Jacksonville in your house. We're fortunate we got a TO/TD. Other than that, the defense couldn't stop Bortles. Think about that.

      Well, if winning the first home game of the regime on the 11th try is ahead of schedule, can we get a new schedule?

      These guys about covered it.Beat the worst team in NFL down to the wire, OP writes a 6 page article about how he knew this was the plan all alonglol

      In fairness, they have to beat these bad teams before they can move up to the next level of teams. If not, they are still one of the bad teams.

      I agree with you, but OP is going off like we just blew out the Patriots at Foxboro or something.I'll be more impressed if we beat the redskins after the bye.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1507

      Blake Bortles just went for 300-4TDs against us….

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 680

      *Alldaway turns on light switch, little critters scatter to the dark corners of the room once more for the next two weeks*Lovie and Licht deserve credit for cleaning up the cap situation of the team to be balanced for both sides of the ball.  They missed on young, free agents in their prime in their first year, but they did not overpay for mediocre unproven talent or banged up talent that other teams did not want.  For example, signing of Wright or trading a first round draft pick and hand over $16 million to an old CB with a gimpy knee (Revis).  Or even handing top dollar money to an OG (Nicks) with lingering injuries. The MRSA was the final nail in the coffin but it wasn’t the only one.LiLo realizing the mistakes they made in their first off season, and looking at how their predecessors were jettisoned because of their unorthodox spending sprees (Schiano and Dominik), went back to the drawing board:1. LiLo ditched the failed FA’s they brought in, and went back to what Licht was brought in to do.  Find FA’s at bargain deals that could help this team. This is a proven formula as Bruce Allen showed with his signing of Bolden, Hovan, Hilliard, Bryant, etc.  McKay did a similar thing with bargain free agents of Pittman, Dilger, McCardell, etc. Licht is not doing anything different with McDonald, Jennings, Conte, Wright, Carter, Myers, Murphy, etc.  It is a proven formula because even for rebuilding/young teams you still need some veteran guidance (eg Kevin Carter with Raheem’s supremely young Bucs or Lomas Brown with Gruden’s more veteran laden Bucs).2. Licht was brought in to restructure the Bucs organization with the departures of Dominick and Hickey.  New scouts have been brought in and the emphasis on finding players that fit the Bucs respective offensive and defensive system has commenced since then and has been ongoing.  The pro player personnel side as well as the collegiate overview of scouting has been transformed in a short window of time.3. Tedford’s unexpected leave of the team was a bigger impediment to the team than most want to admit.  It set back the newly put in place scouting department, installing systems for players to learn and also for growth in continuity of playing in a system. This is no surprise why the defense is ahead, and why the defense also boasts more veteran players familiar with Lovie’s defense.  However, there are players familiar with Koetter’s offense and it is paying off (Hawley).4. Bucs have re-signed their core home grown players (McCoy and David), which has been and will always be, a top priority of the Glazer family.  To build a sense of continuity, familiarity. In addition, to also build home-grown pride for the Bucs fans to root and cheer for these players in the present and the future.5. The 2015 Bucs are one of the youngest teams in all of football currently.  The 2015 Bucs are also starting the most rookies in all of football, and all at integral positions of this team.  The QB of the offense (Winston), the “QB” of the defense (Alexander). The blindside protector for the QB (Smith).  The run blocking guard on the strong side of formations (Marpet). Not to mention the large roles that 2nd, 3rd and 4th year  Bucs players are being asked to do which other teams have 6th, 7th and 8th year veterans doing the same roles.6. Bucs will have about $22 million available next off season freed up from the dead money alone. Johnson and Collins are obvious dead money hits from LiLo’s mistake from last season.  But Goldshon, Barron, and Nicks all left a parting gifts for the Bucs organization to clean up in 2015 too. How Mark Dominik escapes criticism from this I do not understand.  I will not mention which dynamic duo thought it was a good idea to draft a box safety in the top ten, sign a box safety in free agency and then sign an injury riddled OG. Forgot to mention surrendering a first round pick and $16 million for a CB that was exclusively used in zone coverage in 2013. I will let your imagination fill in the blanks.  7. Doug Martin is the only noteworthy Bucs free agent the Bucs must mull over to re-sign this coming off season. The rest of the list of UFA is as follows: Melton, Rainey, Moore, McDaniel, Conte, Johnson, English, Jennings, Jenkins, Barth, Lemon, and Tandy.  The remainder not mentioned are RFA or ERFA for 2016.8. Heading into the bye week with a 2-3 record is something Bucs fans should be proud of.  No one was predicting this team to be anywhere close to that heading into the bye.  Most were projecting this team max 4-5 wins after a 16 game season.  I projected this team as a 6-10 in the off season based on talent on the squad and circumstances (eg young team, starting a rookie QB).  Right now, the young, upstart Bucs are ahead of schedule. We will see if they can keep momentum going.9. This team will become a lot younger real quick by next off season.  Mankins doesn’t have much of a future with this team just as an obvious example, but he fills the veteran knowledge niche needed to guide young OL for the time being.  VJAX is playing out probably his last contract with the Bucs and Evans will eventually slide in and take over his role.10. On a final note, the much maligned Bucs defense (surprisingly from Bucs fans exclusively) is currently ranked highly in multiple categories.  I still don’t understand why Bucs fans don’t understand how the Bucs defense works and why they don’t see how their play has been better than average from the rest of the NFL. The most exciting thing is the Bucs may have the trio they need on defense at RDE, UT, and WILL.  They still need to find a rangy FS to compliment Kwon Alexander up the middle.  And some young blood on the outside CB spot to eventually start opposite of Banks. The Bucs defense is obviously a work in progress and they are well ahead of schedule despite not as many resources have been devoted to that side of the ball thus far. Overall, I want to see this transformation of this team play out without the knee jerk belly aching some are clamoring for.  I want to see LiLo rebuild this team into having a solid base again. When you draft a QB #1 overall, and release free agents you signed a year ago, that is a clear concession this is a rebuilding team and are starting over from the root of the foundation.  Maybe LiLo fall short in the long term, but right now based on what I am seeing I agree with their approach 100%.  Draft & develop, re-sign homegrown talent, bring in bargain free agents, and have continuity in offensive/defensive systems.  This team has needed a solid base from a coaching staff, and scouting perspective for a long time.  People pointing to the quick success stories like Quinn in Atlanta, for example, (Sorry Scott Reynolds I had to go there) are drinking too much of the kool-aid on the other side of the grass.  First, that Falcons team has a fully mature and experienced veteran QB in Matt Ryan coupled with a finally healthy OL unlike last year.  That defense is very overrated, but they have been opportunistic, but not that much better than other top 15 defenses in the league though.  What Quinn is doing is not anything different than Fox with Denver or Gruden with the Bucs year 1.  A team that is fully fleshed out and needs a little push is not the same as a team that needs to be built from the ground up.  The 2014 Bucs are not the team Dungy left behind by any measure. But what Gruden, Morris, Dominik, and Schiano left behind for Lovie and Licht to clean up. With over a decade of inconsistent drafting and letting home grow players seek paydays elsewhere this is the result.  Most NFL teams are still starting players on their respective rosters from the time Gruden was the head coach of the Bucs in 2008!  You can’t have such misses in the draft over such a period of time, and not expect an experienced void at the top of the team.  That is why having a player like Vincent Jackson has been truly a blessing, but it is rare when you hire free agents for top dollar to do such a task.  The misses in the draft from the McKay era heavily influenced how the Bucs approached the draft under Gruden/Allen as they had (special teams emphasis).  But Gruden/Allen over compensated looking for special team aces which led to even more failed draft choices as the pool of young starters on their team started to dwindle.  It wasn’t until Dominik came into the fold that team started to draft players again that showed NFL potential to play and start in this league again.  He had mixed results, but at least he started to reverse the trend.  Gruden’s lack of emphasis on drafting D-linemen (other than G. Adams) and Dominik’s lack of emphasis on drafting O-linemen has put the team in precarious situation.  Moving on, outside observers are quick to point to me that Evans is only in his second season and many of the important pieces on offense are very young and have yet to hit their potential ceiling thus far.  Mankins and VJAX are going to be out of the picture soon enough with younger players stepping into their shoes.  Even the younger veterans like McCoy and David have still less collective experience than many NFL defenders still playing in the NFL.  The much maligned Banks is actually slowly but surely becoming a credible NFL defender.  But like all cornerbacks, it takes time (eg Barber, Kelly, etc).  So, the key is patience and not looking at the grass that appears to be greener on the other side with some “quick fix”.  The quick fix failed Gruden/Allen year 1, it failed Schiano/Dominik year 1, and surprise!.... it also failed Lovie/Licht year 1.  Have some respect for the Bucs organization for what they are trying to accomplish, because there is no such thing as a “quick fix”.  The organization has had to be restructured fairly frequently just as much as the coaching staff has been the last ten years.  So, it is unrealistic and unfair to expect Licht, the new front office, new scouts, and Lovie and his coaching staff to put everything together in less than three years.  Rebuilding takes three years to be fully realized and the Bucs have just started year 1.Gruden and Allen started their rebuilding in 2005 (year 1) and actually saw a reversal of fortunes for the team. That is a big reason why the 2006 season was not held against a proven coach like Gruden.  Gruden followed 2007 with a comeback season but the 2008 season showed that Gruden and Allen were starting to deviate from the rebuilding structure put forth to them by 2008. Draft picks were not panning out and the Gruden/Allen tandem wanted to go back to the 2004 approach of doing business.  That type of approach is not the Buccaneer way the Glazer family has outlined.  The Glazers want quality players to be drafted and retained by the team and not go head hunting every off season for hired mercs and guns at top dollar prices.  It doesn’t make sense from a long term salary cap perspective and it doesn’t build the Buccaneer brand.Glazers #1 priority is to provide a product on the field that is about stability, familiarity and pride.  If you want to say they are trying to copy the Baltimore Ravens and Pittsburgh Steeler model, then yes that is exactly what they are aiming for.  They chose Morris and Schiano because they wanted either coach to grow into the job and breed familiarity and pride for the Bucs brand over a long period of time.  Ownership views the Bucs as a brand and to build that you need familiar faces not a revolving door with an empty chair at OBP.  The Glazer family has a long term vision of the team, because the Glazer family is about long term business ventures. They liked the idea of Morris molding a young team of upstarts and for a while it was actually working.  The problem with Morris was he simply lacked the maturity. Schiano had a reputation of building a program from the ground up.  The problem was he didn’t have a vision that was compatible with the reality of the NFL.  The Glazers have clearly made efforts to bring in head coaches they feel they can build such a brand with.  They are not interested in a coaching carousel but these extreme circumstances have forced their hand twice.Some fans and in the media are clamoring for the Bucs to be like the other big city teams with a carousel of coaching changes, but the Tampa Bay Bucs are not like that and do not have the same draw for the big name coaches some people have mentioned.  The Bucs do not have the same fan base that the Cowboys or the Raiders have as an example or a big metropolitan city to draw from (eg Giants/Jets).  Even the uniform changes the Bucs have undergone has made it questionable if they have grown the brand. But what is clear is that the Glazers want growth of the Bucs brand.  And to do that you start with the root and let it sprout which will take time.  Complaints about the little tree not providing shade are short-sighted and miss the point.

      Dude they won against the JAGS! seriously, slow down a bit...keep things in perspective, yes it was good to get a the second win of the year but it was against a bad football team, much like us...do that against the Falcons or Panthers at home then I'll be a little more excited and buy into what you are trying to sell

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1198

      Ahead of schedule would’ve been not going 2-14. Or bad personnel choices. Develop some of these young players and don't be a defensive guru with a bad d. But this team is NOT ahead of schedule

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 297

      Well they aren’t the worst team in the league, consider it ahead of schedule.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4140

      How is it so hard for people to see the team didn’t beat themselves for the first time this year and take some positive from it?  Oh, wait - never mind.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      How is it so hard for people to see the team didn't beat themselves for the first time this year and take some positive from it?  Oh, wait - never mind.

      Bucs were missing three offensive line starters and still had a productive day on offense.  Koetter and Warhop deserve praise when they can kick Pamphille on the inside and have Fragel as the extra blocker.I still want to see a clean game (little to no penalties) and also some more consistency from the defense in the red zone defense.But overall, it is clear that Koetter and Lovie are starting to have a good feel with the personnel they have. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      How is it so hard for people to see the team didn't beat themselves for the first time this year and take some positive from it?  Oh, wait - never mind.

      you're right, oh blind melon speaking of vision.CROWN US!!!!!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8096

      I’m gonna give Luke McCown’s commercial some props, too…

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Sorry, can't give up 31 points to friggin Jacksonville in your house. We're fortunate we got a TO/TD. Other than that, the defense couldn't stop Bortles. Think about that.

      Well, if winning the first home game of the regime on the 11th try is ahead of schedule, can we get a new schedule?

      These guys about covered it.Beat the worst team in NFL down to the wire, OP writes a 6 page article about how he knew this was the plan all alonglol

      In fairness, they have to beat these bad teams before they can move up to the next level of teams. If not, they are still one of the bad teams.

      This makes logical sense.Good post. +1

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 293

      lol I swear this board…We won a close game against a REALLY BAD FOOTBALL TEAM and all the sudden there are posts about coaching staff being ahead of schedule lol have you watched this season at all? 4 wins in 21 games? If that's "Ahead" of schedule, I'd hate to see the schedule...  players being GAMECHANGERS after being quiet for most of the season, "omg is a stud" posts.It's ridiculous. This team still sucks and we aren't going anywhere, anytime soon.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      AD, I'm usually on your side, but this is rampant optimism at it's best. Hayseed and NovaBuc are right, a win today proves nothing and doesn't necessarily herald better things to come. The defense didn't perform well today and we were lucky that we got a win. Let's see what the Bucs can do after the break before we anoint the plan a success. Franky, today Lovie just got a stay of execution as far as I'm concerned, not a reprieve.

      There is no such thing as luck.  You either win or lose.Bucs could have won another game or two with the help of Barth this season.  I guess I will call it luck that he is back on the team?  8)

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      I want consistency. I want to see nearly mistake free football consistently. I want to see a team that is consistently getting better every week. I realize Rome wasn’t built in a day but 11 games without a home win is asking for a little too much patience. It’s not a good time. However after a win I’m cautiously optimistic and that is a step up from that hopeless feeling I get the buc losses lately. And lately I mean by the last few years.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2673

      The next two games should be very telling. We will likely have Stocker, ASJ, Smith, Mankins, Banks and Dotson back and will have had a couple weeks to prep for the ‘Skins. If we can string a couple more wins together, I’ll be convinced the current regime has us headed in he right direction. But until then, I'm going to enjoy this win. Anyone that was at RJS & had to deal with "The Bold Brigade" (or other groups of overly obnoxious Jags fans) knows this victory was extra sweet.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      Bucs were missing three offensive line starters and still had a productive day on offense.  Koetter and Warhop deserve praise when they can kick Pamphille on the inside and have Fragel as the extra blocker.But overall, it is clear that Koetter and Lovie are starting to have a good feel with the personnel they have.

      are the bucs missing 3 OL starters – or are the bucs just starting the wrong guys?as for the defense, something still is way off when bortles shreds you as easily as he did.  whether its the CBs not getting a bump, the LBs not dropping, or the Ss being out of position, hurns and robinson made it look easy.and before we talk about ahead of schedule, look at the schedule.  titans-saints-texans-jags.  we legitimately should be 4-1 and be talking about fools gold.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2847

            Sometimes necessity (Fragel for Stocker, Pamphile for Mankins, Hawley for Smith) breeds discovery and leads to newfound success… And, the KRAKEN KOETTER has been released...Now that we know the lowly Jaguars can shred the Tampa 2 with virtually no run game, maybe Lovie will at least tweak the D? Nah.... not Lovie...

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      Koetter was the key yesterday.  His masterful handling of the online and correctly realizing Winston is a liability in the passing game set the team on the right course.  The game was featured around what may just be the most productive 1-2 RB tandem in football in Martin and Sims.  Getting the ball in their hands and out of Winstons hands won the game.  Big screens to Sims and red zone plays centered around Martin is the future of the team.  I don't know if that is sustainable but I think putting a 6th online man in so often is good clue of the identity of the team.  I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key to this team against real teams will be if the back end of the D can improve with the return of Banks and they can sort out the safety situation.  I like what I'm seeing in the pass rush.  I'd like to see improved play out the LBs but the talent is there.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      The next two games should be very telling. We will likely have Stocker, ASJ, Smith, Mankins, Banks and Dotson back and will have had a couple weeks to prep for the 'Skins. If we can string a couple more wins together, I'll be convinced the current regime has us headed in he right direction. But until then, I'm going to enjoy this win. Anyone that was at RJS & had to deal with "The Bold Brigade" (or other groups of overly obnoxious Jags fans) knows this victory was extra sweet.

      The Bucs haven't even reached the midway point in the season yet.  There is no way to gauge how they will do the next 11 games.  That is a lot of football left to be played.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1385

      Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.

      Reasonably sure that wasn't Koetter's idea, that was a patented Lovie Smith move if I've ever seen one. My Brother In Law in Chicago said that Smith would do that often when he was coach there.While I *do* think Koetter called a great game yesterday, I don't think the lack of passing was and indication of what he feels about Winston at all. Winston was constantly pushing the ball down field yesterday and not always just checking down to his backs. There were several over of the middle and deep slants that he hit on. The lack of passing attempts was just a result of the run game being so successful and yes, that may have been due to adding Fragel in as another blocker. But I don't necessarily think that will be successful against the Skins. All in all, the offense 'did their job' against the Jags, the defense did not. Mostly the secondary was the weak link. Maybe that was because of the additional injuries to Conte and Tandy or perhaps it was just a couple of good plays by Jacksonville, but Jenkins and Jennings looked bad out there yesterday. After the bye, I'd be fine going back to Banks and Verner.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1271

      This game had some positives, but let’s beat a good team before we start handing out praise. Bucs still need to play well against some tough teams in November for Lovie to keep his job imo, and that’s not even considering a Washington team that has our same record but has looked good in their losses too.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.

      Reasonably sure that wasn't Koetter's idea, that was a patented Lovie Smith move if I've ever seen one. My Brother In Law in Chicago said that Smith would do that often when he was coach there.While I *do* think Koetter called a great game yesterday, I don't think the lack of passing was and indication of what he feels about Winston at all. Winston was constantly pushing the ball down field yesterday and not always just checking down to his backs. There were several over of the middle and deep slants that he hit on. The lack of passing attempts was just a result of the run game being so successful and yes, that may have been due to adding Fragel in as another blocker. But I don't necessarily think that will be successful against the Skins. All in all, the offense 'did their job' against the Jags, the defense did not. Mostly the secondary was the weak link. Maybe that was because of the additional injuries to Conte and Tandy or perhaps it was just a couple of good plays by Jacksonville, but Jenkins and Jennings looked bad out there yesterday. After the bye, I'd be fine going back to Banks and Verner.

      The passes to the backs weren't check downs.  They were designed plays. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Bucs were missing three offensive line starters and still had a productive day on offense.  Koetter and Warhop deserve praise when they can kick Pamphille on the inside and have Fragel as the extra blocker.But overall, it is clear that Koetter and Lovie are starting to have a good feel with the personnel they have.

      are the bucs missing 3 OL starters - or are the bucs just starting the wrong guys?as for the defense, something still is way off when bortles shreds you as easily as he did.  whether its the CBs not getting a bump, the LBs not dropping, or the Ss being out of position, hurns and robinson made it look easy.and before we talk about ahead of schedule, look at the schedule.  titans-saints-texans-jags.  we legitimately should be 4-1 and be talking about fools gold.

      1. They are starters until stated otherwise.  With that said Dotson is still heads and shoulders better than Cherilus.  Not sure why PR staff feels there will be a battle for the RT spot.  Cherilus has been a decent spot starter. Pamphille on the inside is intriguing but also is just one game.  But I have to admit I liked him pulling out in space and creaming defenders.  Mankins who?  Hawley knows Koetter's offense which is plus, but Smith hasn't been the train wreck that the red board insists.  Maybe the subtraction of Mankins shows the team will be moving on next year? Maybe.2. Defense has been rotating safties all season, because they do not have a starter they can play opposite of McDougald with confidence.  Teams don't rotate guys they feel are good starters.  This was evident early in the season and expect the team to find a safety to play opposite of McDougald next off season.3. Bucs could very easily be win less or 1-4.  You are what you are record wise.Bucs should be above .500 if they cut out the penalties and missed field goals.  Missed field goals seems to have been addressed.  Cutting down penalties in the main issue at the moment.They put the ball in Winston's hands on several third down situations in the 4th quarter and he made plays to convert. Also, it was Lovie's idea to pull up after a penalty negated a good gain with time to spare at the end of the half. That was the right decision by Lovie at that point.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1271

      There is a battle at RT because it is a reason not to give Dotson the raise he’s looking for.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      There is a battle at RT because it is a reason not to give Dotson the raise he's looking for.

      That would be an ideal scenario for the team to save money. Reality is Dotson is an upgrade when he returns. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      Koetter was the key yesterday.  His masterful handling of the online and correctly realizing Winston is a liability in the passing game set the team on the right course.  The game was featured around what may just be the most productive 1-2 RB tandem in football in Martin and Sims.  Getting the ball in their hands and out of Winstons hands won the game.  Big screens to Sims and red zone plays centered around Martin is the future of the team.  I don't know if that is sustainable but I think putting a 6th online man in so often is good clue of the identity of the team.  I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key to this team against real teams will be if the back end of the D can improve with the return of Banks and they can sort out the safety situation.  I like what I'm seeing in the pass rush.  I'd like to see improved play out the LBs but the talent is there.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      Not being able to dump your shit predictions and move on with the reality of what is happening makes you look clueless.    Weak attempt to fit the play yesterday into your ongoing narrative. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Koetter was the key yesterday.  His masterful handling of the online and correctly realizing Winston is a liability in the passing game set the team on the right course.  The game was featured around what may just be the most productive 1-2 RB tandem in football in Martin and Sims.  Getting the ball in their hands and out of Winstons hands won the game.  Big screens to Sims and red zone plays centered around Martin is the future of the team.  I don't know if that is sustainable but I think putting a 6th online man in so often is good clue of the identity of the team.  I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key to this team against real teams will be if the back end of the D can improve with the return of Banks and they can sort out the safety situation.  I like what I'm seeing in the pass rush.  I'd like to see improved play out the LBs but the talent is there.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      Not being able to dump your (censored) predictions and move on with the reality of what is happening makes you look clueless.    Weak attempt to fit the play yesterday into your ongoing narrative.

      According to game logs Winston attempted passes on the final Bucs drive of the game.  But since most of us watched the game unlike Curt we do not need to look at the game logs to know this anyways.  8)

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      agree on the STs.  i was ready to run odea out of town, but maybe it was a player issue?  we did make a lot of STs moves, maybe thats paying off?  rainey aint doing it by himself – he is getting great blocking.the end of the half shouldnt tell you anything about koetters opinion.  maybe lovie dropped the hammer?  maybe they were worried about the OL?  maybe evans and vjax are more injured than we know?  i wouldnt go all assuming.the key stat?  dont force  your rookie QB into a shootout.  pretty smart thinking.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      This game had some positives, but let's beat a good team before we start handing out praise. Bucs still need to play well against some tough teams in November for Lovie to keep his job imo, and that's not even considering a Washington team that has our same record but has looked good in their losses too.

      The Bucs must first beat the bad teams first  to climb out of the hole  So far, they have done it twice.  Beating a good team will be nice and a big boost of confidence for this young team but I do not think they are there yet.  But they might be able to do it this season.With eleven games of football left that is a lot of football ladies and gentlemen.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3392

      are the bucs missing 3 OL starters - or are the bucs just starting the wrong guys?

      Yeah, wondered that as well. Definitely like Hawley over EDS. Mankins is joe average on his good days (couldn't believe how much love the announcers gave him), and while I didn't zone in on Pamphile all game, he looked ok to me when I did.I don't think Gosder is better than Dotson though. He can thump in the run game, but too many turnstile plays on passing downs for me.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      agree on the STs.  i was ready to run odea out of town, but maybe it was a player issue?  we did make a lot of STs moves, maybe thats paying off?  rainey aint doing it by himself - he is getting great blocking.the end of the half shouldnt tell you anything about koetters opinion.  maybe lovie dropped the hammer?  maybe they were worried about the OL?  maybe evans and vjax are more injured than we know?  i wouldnt go all assuming.the key stat?  dont force  your rookie QB into a shootout.  pretty smart thinking.

      I will eat crow on O'Dea.  I think he has improved his unit the most (special teams) compared to the defense or offense thus far.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3392

      I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      agree on the STs.  i was ready to run odea out of town, but maybe it was a player issue?  we did make a lot of STs moves, maybe thats paying off?  rainey aint doing it by himself - he is getting great blocking.the end of the half shouldnt tell you anything about koetters opinion.  maybe lovie dropped the hammer?  maybe they were worried about the OL?  maybe evans and vjax are more injured than we know?  i wouldnt go all assuming.the key stat?  dont force  your rookie QB into a shootout.  pretty smart thinking.

      I'm a big believer that ST is largely a function of....1) focus/importance the HC coach puts on it.2) overall athleticism of the roster. Until Brindzda crapped the bed, we were top 5 at Football Outsiders for ST. Coverage, returns have been great all year.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      I'm a big believer that ST is largely a function of....1) focus/importance the HC coach puts on it.2) overall athleticism of the roster. Until Brindzda crapped the bed, we were top 5 at Football Outsiders for ST. Coverage, returns have been great all year.

      agree.  i think PuntReturner is an overrated position – gimme a guy that can catch a ball in traffic EVERYtime.  a guy witih no fear.  then block a bit for the guy and no matter how shiny he is, he will be a great returner.we are blocking PRs much much better this season.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 253

      *Alldaway turns on light switch, little critters scatter to the dark corners of the room once more for the next two weeks*

      Hehe...Don't look... I said don't look.  They're returned already. They brought friends.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      *Alldaway turns on light switch, little critters scatter to the dark corners of the room once more for the next two weeks*

      Hehe...Don't look... I said don't look.  They're returned already. They brought friends.

      Yeah it is always entertaining to see them double down on the stupid.  With the bye week it will be entertaining that is for sure.  Or really, really quiet.  8)

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I need to praise the special teams who gave us a lot of short fields and Barth was fantastic.  Winston attempted 19 passes (most going to RB and TE) and Koetter didn't even think about using him with 30 seconds left and 3 time outs to move 30 yards at the end of the half for a much needed FG.  That should tell you everything you need to know about Koetters opinion of Winston.  The key stat before the bye: in our two wins, we attempted 40 passes total in the pass happy year 2015.  Discuss.

      agree on the STs.  i was ready to run odea out of town, but maybe it was a player issue?  we did make a lot of STs moves, maybe thats paying off?  rainey aint doing it by himself - he is getting great blocking.the end of the half shouldnt tell you anything about koetters opinion.  maybe lovie dropped the hammer?  maybe they were worried about the OL?  maybe evans and vjax are more injured than we know?  i wouldnt go all assuming.the key stat?  dont force  your rookie QB into a shootout.  pretty smart thinking.

      The ST's looked great across the board.  Rainey is a top returner and of course he is getting help. Barth has ended the drama that was the 40 yard FG.  You don't think a QB should be able to move 30 yards in 30 seconds with 3 TO's?  You think Lovie and Dirk are in some major disagreement there?  With the way Barth is kicking, it seems pretty curious that even an ultra conservative HC wouldn't try for points.  Lovie seems to trust Dirk as the personnel moves in the OLine alone are pretty compelling.  I believe they are both very much on the same page.The WR's are an issue.  On one hand VJax isn't getting younger and Evans has really regressed or is really hurt.  On the other, this is NOT a drop back and sling it type of offense.  This is a 6 Olinemen RB centered Offense that will do everything it can to limit the mistakes of Winston.  Unlike say with Dilfer/Alstott/Dunn, Koetter is getting his guys in space and utilizing the RB's skill set that Shula/Clyde never could.   

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      You don't think a QB should be able to move 30 yards in 30 seconds with 3 TO's?  You think Lovie and Dirk are in some major disagreement there?  With the way Barth is kicking, it seems pretty curious that even an ultra conservative HC wouldn't try for points.  Lovie seems to trust Dirk as the personnel moves in the OLine alone are pretty compelling.  I believe they are both very much on the same page.

      is it that easy?  with a rookie QB?i can understand not putting your QB in a position where the defense knows you are passing, and probably for big chunks.  our offensive gameplan was working, we all would have liked to attack at the end of the half, but i certainly understand it also being a dangerous situation for a QB who head still appears to be spinning.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 96

      Nice read if it weren’t for our crap ass kicker we could be 3-2 easily.  And you can’t blame the defensein that Carolina loss.  There are so many negative posters and I get it.  But the schedule is quite easy if we get to 8-8 I would be happy going into 2016.. BTW Jacksonville has had 3 years now working with Bortles.  They are ahead of us a bit.  I still would  takeour defense  over them. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 103

      Nice read if it weren't for our crap ass kicker we could be 3-2 easily.  And you can't blame the defensein that Carolina loss.  There are so many negative posters and I get it.  But the schedule is quite easy if we get to 8-8 I would be happy going into 2016.. BTW Jacksonville has had 3 years now working with Bortles.  They are ahead of us a bit.  I still would  takeour defense  over them.

      Agreed with the Carolina game they didn't have to march far to score on many of their drives, as they were put into good field position by interceptions and turnovers. Also its been 2 years with Bortles he was a rookie last year. He is not a bad QB though and has actually produced decent numbers behind a not so great line.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

            Sometimes necessity (Fragel for Stocker, Pamphile for Mankins, Hawley for Smith) breeds discovery and leads to newfound success... And, the KRAKEN KOETTER has been released...Now that we know the lowly Jaguars can shred the Tampa 2 with virtually no run game, maybe Lovie will at least tweak the D? Nah.... not Lovie...

      Three different coaching staffs have been using an extra OL to block because Stocker is in the tub.  Dude is a waste of a roster spot.  At least Myers and Brate are actually contributing to the team's success.Pamphille was the surprise!  He was beat on some plays, but overall he was good blocking in space and in pass pro.I do not see the hatred for Smith but Hawley has been a decent sub.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I do not see the hatred for Smith ...

      On track for the worst pass defense in franchise history and you don't see the hate ...http://www.webmd.com/eye-health/vision-testsVision_Test_2.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I do not see the hatred for Smith ...

      On track for the worst pass defense in franchise history and you don't see the hate ...http://www.webmd.com/eye-health/vision-testsVision_Test_2.jpg

      You have gone full retard again.1. I was talking about EDS(mith) being replaced by Hawley2. Your premise about the pass defense is built upon a series of logical fallacies.Your lack of reading comprehension or your unwavering support for Schiano leave me undecided if I should feel sorry for you or maybe try to educate you.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

      If you want to fold your arms like Tony Dungy and show no emotion that is fine.  Don't try to dictate your passive aggressive behavior on other Bucs fans though.Thanks.

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    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

      If you want to fold your arms like Tony Dungy (or Lovie Smith) and show no emotion that is fine.  Don't try to dictate your passive aggressive behavior on other Bucs fans though.Thanks.

      look ........I know you're a fan......and I respect it........but when you create a thread calling for us to praise those two hammerheads, you're gonna get slapped around a bit.  I do enjoy your posts and most of what you say.......but this one had to be called out.lovie and jase have a LONG way to go before any fan owes them praise.......

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 14

      I don’t understand why everyone says V Jax will be gone or wants to trade him.  Even if he’s not the number option he’s still 6’5 and the best hands on the team.  Who’s gonna take his place with better value? It’s not like he was ever a speed receiver.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      This game had some positives, but let's beat a good team before we start handing out praise. Bucs still need to play well against some tough teams in November for Lovie to keep his job imo, and that's not even considering a Washington team that has our same record but has looked good in their losses too.

      The Bucs must first beat the bad teams first  to climb out of the hole  So far, they have done it twice.  Beating a good team will be nice and a big boost of confidence for this young team but I do not think they are there yet.  But they might be able to do it this season.With eleven games of football left that is a lot of football ladies and gentlemen.

      they also lost to 2 bad teams, looks like someone else is doubling down on stupid now.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You have gone full retard again.

      Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule: Lovie and Licht deserve some praiseStarted by alldaway

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      You have gone full retard again.

      Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule: Lovie and Licht deserve some praiseStarted by alldaway

      LOL, the irony is rich for sure.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      You have gone full retard again.

      Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule: Lovie and Licht deserve some praiseStarted by alldaway

      Your very first post on this board:https://www.pewterreport.com/forum/index.php/topic,1291022.msg1576394.html#msg1576394

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You have gone full retard again.

      Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule: Lovie and Licht deserve some praiseStarted by alldaway

      Your very first post on this board:https://www.pewterreport.com/forum/index.php/topic,1291022.msg1576394.html#msg1576394

      Nice investigative work, Jr.Now go dig up the thread I created stating that the coach in his 2nd year with 4 wins under his belt deserves praise for the rebuild that's ahead of schedule.I'll wait.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

      If you want to fold your arms like Tony Dungy (or Lovie Smith) and show no emotion that is fine.  Don't try to dictate your passive aggressive behavior on other Bucs fans though.Thanks.

      look ........I know you're a fan......and I respect it........but when you create a thread calling for us to praise those two hammerheads, you're gonna get slapped around a bit.  I do enjoy your posts and most of what you say.......but this one had to be called out.lovie and jase have a LONG way to go before any fan owes them praise.......

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      6c4b855c1f9022cf927635c37583e53fc8095054_m.gif5.gif

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      6c4b855c1f9022cf927635c37583e53fc8095054_m.gif5.gif

      Ahhh man you're killing me!"I'll teach these fools to talk trash on Lilo!  My boy already matched his win total from last year by week 6!  Booyaa!"

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

      If you want to fold your arms like Tony Dungy (or Lovie Smith) and show no emotion that is fine.  Don't try to dictate your passive aggressive behavior on other Bucs fans though.Thanks.

      look ........I know you're a fan......and I respect it........but when you create a thread calling for us to praise those two hammerheads, you're gonna get slapped around a bit.  I do enjoy your posts and most of what you say.......but this one had to be called out.lovie and jase have a LONG way to go before any fan owes them praise.......

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      the only thing being slapped around is you, what a thread backfire/epic faildefense improving means the worst in team history at giving up points? lmaojustlmao

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Praise lovie and licht?I remember years ago reading that the "up and coming millennials" will be needy when it comes desiring ridiculous amounts of praise.Lovie and Jase do not deserve praise until their collective wins are more than their defeats......and then at that time.......the praise will be from the Glazers......on top of their high salaries......for simply starting to be marginal winners for the first time here.fans owe them nothing....praise them when they win us another Lombardi.

      If you want to fold your arms like Tony Dungy (or Lovie Smith) and show no emotion that is fine.  Don't try to dictate your passive aggressive behavior on other Bucs fans though.Thanks.

      look ........I know you're a fan......and I respect it........but when you create a thread calling for us to praise those two hammerheads, you're gonna get slapped around a bit.  I do enjoy your posts and most of what you say.......but this one had to be called out.lovie and jase have a LONG way to go before any fan owes them praise.......

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      the only thing being slapped around is you, what a thread backfire/epic faildefense improving means the worst in team history at giving up points? lmaojustlmao

      Lmfao!I wonder if in his mind, he really nailed this one....  homerun-spike-the-ball-in-your-face-KO thread...Curious.Enough beating up on adw tho .. I really wish this team and FO had something to be proud of and deserving of praise.The worst pass defense in franchise history isn't it though.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      building-fail.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      This game had some positives, but let's beat a good team before we start handing out praise. Bucs still need to play well against some tough teams in November for Lovie to keep his job imo, and that's not even considering a Washington team that has our same record but has looked good in their losses too.

      November has been a house of horrors for the Bucs all the way back to the year 2008.  You can't have success in this league if you can't even go .500 in the month of November. This indeed has to change moving forward IMO.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      It’s still preseason until November.Lucky for us, we are in good hands with a master architect well ahead of schedule.Construction-FAIL.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2697

      It's still preseason until November.Lucky for us, we are in good hands with a master architect well ahead of schedule.Construction-FAIL.jpg

      Your stupidity is boundless...

      Please wait…

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      This thread is designed to slap around red board losers and also to show that a rebuilding team is improving.  And yes LiLo deserve some praise up to this point.

      InDaWay.....for the love of God, thread lock this bish.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      hilarious_construction_fails_640_20.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 106

      at least we are the best team in Florida.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      We beat Jacksonville and will be lucky to get to 5 wins….How low has the bar been set that this is considered "ahead of schedule"?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      BuildingCollapse1.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      This game had some positives, but let's beat a good team before we start handing out praise. Bucs still need to play well against some tough teams in November for Lovie to keep his job imo, and that's not even considering a Washington team that has our same record but has looked good in their losses too.

      The Bucs must first beat the bad teams first  to climb out of the hole  So far, they have done it twice.  Beating a good team will be nice and a big boost of confidence for this young team but I do not think they are there yet.  But they might be able to do it this season.With eleven games of football left that is a lot of football ladies and gentlemen.

      they also lost to 2 bad teams, looks like someone else is doubling down on stupid now.

      A rebuilding team can't win them all.  What you hope to see is competitive play from the Bucs. Thus far, they have been doing that the last few weeks.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      post-8197-Crumbling-domino-pyramid-gif-XejG.gif

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      Lol

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1427

      Pathetic, only thing Lovie deserves is to be Fired.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston. 

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1312

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      Does Lovie have pictures of you and a transvestite midget in an airport bathroom or are you just on drugs.  Or is your alt account name Runole?  Any credibility that you may have had is now gone. What happened to you?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      Does Lovie have pictures of you and a transvestite midget in an airport bathroom or are you just on drugs.  Or is your alt account name Runole?  Any credibility that you may have had is now gone. What happened to you?

      Winston had an amazing game and you lack the dignity and humbleness to admit this.  How sad is it that you pose as a Bucs fans and you can't acknowledge that Winston is the real deal?Are you going to go Skull and Bones on us and root for another team?  That ladies and gentlemen is a melt down and lost of credibility.Your credibility was lost when actively root against Jameis Winston before a single snap was played.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3420

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      It's good to have ADW point out some of the good things.  :)I felt like crying after the game. I was watching the last Washington drive and had little faith in our defense to close it out.  :'(

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1312

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1312

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      It's good to have ADW point out some of the good things.  :)I felt like crying after the game. I was watching the last Washington drive and had little faith in our defense to close it out.  :'(

      Is there any single person that watched the game today that thought for one second that Wash wasnt going to drive and score on that last drive? Where was the "fight" in the D there? I readily admit it is becoming fun to watch the O work... sadly, the D is destroying it all.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1686

      Sorry ADW but the arrow is pointing down for the defense. McCoy and David were nothing today

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      I do not think the defense is putrid.  The front seven is playing some of the better football compared to around the league.  The issues are the back four. That is why they are rotating safties so much because no one has won a starting spot or locked it down.JC receives a lot of hate on these boards, but he is on point that the defense needs a RDE and a FS to take off.  Those are clearly two big need areas heading into the off season for the Bucs.  A young CB opposite of Banks would be nice as well.And I expect the offense to be ahead as most of the resources have been devoted there the last two drafts.  That is an indicator that LiLo have a long term plan in place. 

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      if-you-are-not-shooting-rainbows-out-of-your-ass-then-please-stay-away-2015-is-all-about-positive-energies-and-attitudes--98b5e.png

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      Does Lovie have pictures of you and a transvestite midget in an airport bathroom or are you just on drugs.  Or is your alt account name Runole?  Any credibility that you may have had is now gone. What happened to you?

      Winston had an amazing game and you lack the dignity and humbleness to admit this.  How sad is it that you pose as a Bucs fans and you can't acknowledge that Winston is the real deal?Are you going to go Skull and Bones on us and root for another team?  That ladies and gentlemen is a melt down and lost of credibility.Your credibility was lost when actively root against Jameis Winston before a single snap was played.

      WTF are you talking about?  Winston played great.  Said that a couple times already.  Been saying for weeks Winston looks the real deal.  You either are seriously confused or you are just making (censored) up since you don't have anything real to stand on.Oh and go (censored) yourself with the high and mighty you're a better fan crap.  I've been a fan since day one and always will be despite some dumb ass fans like you. You really should seek seek some professional help.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3420

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      Maybe it's like how a parent always has faith in their child. We all say here comes the kid to bat who never hits and his parents are yelling "come on little Johnny get those runs home". Everyone else is saying here is the 3rd out, game over. Lovie's D was little Johnny again today.  :(

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      Does Lovie have pictures of you and a transvestite midget in an airport bathroom or are you just on drugs.  Or is your alt account name Runole?  Any credibility that you may have had is now gone. What happened to you?

      Winston had an amazing game and you lack the dignity and humbleness to admit this.  How sad is it that you pose as a Bucs fans and you can't acknowledge that Winston is the real deal?Are you going to go Skull and Bones on us and root for another team?  That ladies and gentlemen is a melt down and lost of credibility.Your credibility was lost when actively root against Jameis Winston before a single snap was played.

      WTF are you talking about?  Winston played great.  Said that a couple times already.  Been saying for weeks Winston looks the real deal.  You either are seriously confused or you are just making (censored) up since you don't have anything real to stand on.Oh and go (censored) yourself with the high and mighty you're a better fan crap.  I've been a fan since day one and always will be despite some dumb ass fans like you. You really should seek seek some professional help.

      You can nerd rage all you want, but your inability to accept reality has been your undoing.  This is why had the Bucs traded down they would have lost out the chance to draft a player of Winston's caliber.You have been educated and I hope you have a good night madam or sir.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1312

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      I do not think the defense is putrid.  The front seven is playing some of the better football compared to around the league.  The issues are the back four. That is why they are rotating safties so much because no one has won a starting spot or locked it down.JC receives a lot of hate on these boards, but he is on point that the defense needs a RDE and a FS to take off.  Those are clearly two big need areas heading into the off season for the Bucs.  A young CB opposite of Banks would be nice as well.And I expect the offense to be ahead as most of the resources have been devoted there the last two drafts.  That is an indicator that LiLo have a long term plan in place.

      I wish I had your positive mojo tonight.. really do. It aint easy right now. Its hard to see a positive  future long term with this coach right now. I am excited as hell re the future of the O though.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      Does Lovie have pictures of you and a transvestite midget in an airport bathroom or are you just on drugs.  Or is your alt account name Runole?  Any credibility that you may have had is now gone. What happened to you?

      Winston had an amazing game and you lack the dignity and humbleness to admit this.  How sad is it that you pose as a Bucs fans and you can't acknowledge that Winston is the real deal?Are you going to go Skull and Bones on us and root for another team?  That ladies and gentlemen is a melt down and lost of credibility.Your credibility was lost when actively root against Jameis Winston before a single snap was played.

      WTF are you talking about?  Winston played great.  Said that a couple times already.  Been saying for weeks Winston looks the real deal.  You either are seriously confused or you are just making (censored) up since you don't have anything real to stand on.Oh and go (censored) yourself with the high and mighty you're a better fan crap.  I've been a fan since day one and always will be despite some dumb ass fans like you. You really should seek seek some professional help.

      You can nerd rage all you want, but your inability to accept reality has been your undoing.  This is why had the Bucs traded down they would have lost out the chance to draft a player of Winston's caliber.You have been educated and I hope you have a good night madam or sir.

      Educated? How's that?  You have done nothing but show how stupid you are.  Once again, show us all where I refuse to accept reality.  Please show me all my posts today saying all those negative things about Winston.  Go on. We'll wait.  Although we both know you won't find any. It is a well known tactic to throw out false accusations when they don't know what they are talking about.  You have crossed over from desperate to just plain sad.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      I do not think the defense is putrid.  The front seven is playing some of the better football compared to around the league.  The issues are the back four. That is why they are rotating safties so much because no one has won a starting spot or locked it down.JC receives a lot of hate on these boards, but he is on point that the defense needs a RDE and a FS to take off.  Those are clearly two big need areas heading into the off season for the Bucs.  A young CB opposite of Banks would be nice as well.And I expect the offense to be ahead as most of the resources have been devoted there the last two drafts.  That is an indicator that LiLo have a long term plan in place.

      I wish I had your positive mojo tonight.. really do. It aint easy right now. Its hard to see a positive  future long term with this coach right now. I am excited as hell re the future of the O though.

      It is not about positive or negative. It is about realizing that this is a process.  Right now the Bucs are having a lot of stop gaps on defense because that side of the ball hasn't been addressed yet in the draft.  Kwon Alexander wasn't slated to even start.Offense looks like it is shaping up to be a formidable unit with some young players. 

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      I do not think the defense is putrid.  The front seven is playing some of the better football compared to around the league.  The issues are the back four. That is why they are rotating safties so much because no one has won a starting spot or locked it down.JC receives a lot of hate on these boards, but he is on point that the defense needs a RDE and a FS to take off.  Those are clearly two big need areas heading into the off season for the Bucs.  A young CB opposite of Banks would be nice as well.And I expect the offense to be ahead as most of the resources have been devoted there the last two drafts.  That is an indicator that LiLo have a long term plan in place.

      I wish I had your positive mojo tonight.. really do. It aint easy right now. Its hard to see a positive  future long term with this coach right now. I am excited as hell re the future of the O though.

      It is not about positive or negative. It is about realizing that this is a process.  Right now the Bucs are having a lot of stop gaps on defense because that side of the ball hasn't been addressed yet in the draft.  Kwon Alexander wasn't slated to even start.Offense looks like it is shaping up to be a formidable unit with some young players.

      Why can't you just admit that this defense, in its current form simply blows. Sure it could get better. Certainly can't get much worse.  But right now it sucks and even worse the coaching sucks too.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I think you have officially lost your sh1t.

      I am just stating the opinion and facts.This is one of the youngest squads in the league and it is a rebuilding year.  Being competitive in the vast majority of contests this year is a sharp departure from the last four seasons arguably.  The arrow is pointing up for these young Bucs.

      The only part of this team that is pointing up is the O (ya know, the part Lovie doesnt do). The defense is putrid. Please look at what they have allowed all year. That is Lovie's deal.. its his D and its stinking garbage.

      Maybe it's like how a parent always has faith in their child. We all say here comes the kid to bat who never hits and his parents are yelling "come on little Johnny get those runs home". Everyone else is saying here is the 3rd out, game over. Lovie's D was little Johnny again today.  :(

      Good post and analogy.For a young rebuilding team like the Bucs this is what it is exactly like.  In fact, this is expected to see highs and lows with such a young team.  Moments of brilliance and moments of heart ache.  These young, upstart Bucs are still learning the ropes and the tricks of the trade.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      ADW just f*cking nailed this.

      Agreed.I am extremely proud of this young squad and what they showed today.  On offense, they were blocking and sealing edges.  Marpet was a terror in space and Smith was finally using his hands to finish plays off.  Winston looked like a seasoned vet with precision strikes downfield looking for large chunks of real estate.  Winston's pre snap reads were phenominal and he was taking what the Redskins were giving him. Hawley looks legit pulling and blocking out on the peremiter.  Doug and Sims are showing that they will be a 1-2 punch we hoped could have materialized last season under Tedford.  Dye is looking like a legit gadget player that Koetter can utilize in short yardage and goal line situations.  And Koetter called a good of a game as I have seen.  Arguably better than against the Jags two weeks ago.Defensively, the front seven is blossoming into a terrific unit.  David was on point in this game and looks to be returning to form.  Alexander deserves the green dot as he is on point with his analysis of offensive schemes which is also impressive for a rookie.  He is essentially the QB of the defense and he is passing with flying colors.  Banks is looking like the stud we all envisioned him to be as he is playing at a level we hoped he could play.  He has flaws due to lack of footspeed but his tools are off the charts.  Conte continues to be the underdog and a very underrated player on defense.  He has been consistent throughout the year.  Not even Lavonte David has had such consistency this year and that is a testament to Conte's elevated play.The youngest team in the league like the Bucs must learn to close out games like the Campell's Fins and to not inflict damaging penalties or pointless penalties.  Lovie Smith is up to the task to do this and this can be addressed.  Lovie Smith has benched player for poor performances and replaced starters if they are loafing like Jennings and Verner.  This will be no different.  I have all the confidence in the world of Lovie addressing this.Overall, I am impressed how the young Bucs have been competitive in 5 of 6 contests this year and the potential is staggering.  They have yet to hit their ceiling or even pull off a complete game.  The sky is the limit ladies and gentlmen.Very impressed by the fight by these young Bucs in today's game.  Especially the leader of this franchise heading into the future, Jameis Winston.

      You may have missed the sarcasm...so there is no confusion, you did quite the opposite of nail this. Now, keep doing your thing while we all choke on the homerism that wafts in the air.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      ADW – I admit it.You nailed this.This is a young team that is experiencing growing pains but a lot of upside promise.The problem is the upside and promise IS ALL ON THE ****ING OFFENSE WHICH LOVIE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH!!His defense is softer than baby ****.  And these aren't a bunch of ****ing rookies that have no idea how to play in his scheme.  These are HIS GUYS!  Get the **** out of here with this "they just need more time" BS!Give me any DC in the League right now and I guarantee you they take this same exact squad and don't allow Kirk ****ing Cousins to come back from down 24pts in the 1st half.PoR - give me Schiano or Morris and plug them in as DC AT HALFTIME and I guarantee they don't give up that lead.LOVIE ****ing SUCKS and deserves ZERO credit for the only positive we have on this team which is a young offense with promise.tumblr_m2zpupg3ar1r6gk4zo1_400.gif

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      ADW - I admit it.You nailed this.This is a young team that is experiencing growing pains but a lot of upside promise.The problem is the upside and promise IS ALL ON THE ****ING OFFENSE WHICH LOVIE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH!!His defense is softer than baby ****.  And these aren't a bunch of ****ing rookies that have no idea how to play in his scheme.  These are HIS GUYS!  Get the **** out of here with this "they just need more time" BS!Give me any DC in the League right now and I guarantee you they take this same exact squad and don't allow Kirk ****ing Cousins to come back from down 24pts in the 1st half.PoR - give me Schiano or Morris and plug them in as DC AT HALFTIME and I guarantee they don't give up that lead.LOVIE ****ing SUCKS and deserves ZERO credit for the only positive we have on this team which is a young offense with promise.tumblr_m2zpupg3ar1r6gk4zo1_400.gif

      Thank you Mrs. Schiano for finally agreeing with me.LiLo deserve some love though for H. Jones, K. Alexander and J. Smith

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      You don't need a squad full of all-pros to keep Kirk Cousins from scoring 24points in the 2nd half ...Just a half competent DC.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      You don't need a squad full of all-pros to keep Kirk Cousins from scoring 24points in the 2nd half ...Just a half competent DC.

      Who said a full squad?Bucs needs haven't changed since the pre season: RDE, S, CBI think some people are in denial about a rebuilding process because the Bucs are fresh off of one from the Dominik/Raheem era.I have no clue what Schiano was trying to do. That dude was straight crazy and probably took too many blows to the head as a fullback or something.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3027

      I don’t think we should fire Lovie Smith, I could honestly care less about him as a coach. The reasons I don’t want Lovie Smith fired are as follows:1. No more turnover of players.2. I like Koetter and Licht way more than I dislike Lovie and Frazier, don't want to lose Koetter and Licht.3. We have a young QB and don't want him learning a new scheme, want him to master the one he has.4. Firing coaches bi-yearly scares potential candidates away as they believe they'll get the same treatment.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I don't think we should fire Lovie Smith, I could honestly care less about him as a coach. The reasons I don't want Lovie Smith fired are as follows:1. No more turnover of players.2. I like Koetter and Licht way more than I dislike Lovie and Frazier, don't want to lose Koetter and Licht.3. We have a young QB and don't want him learning a new scheme, want him to master the one he has.4. Firing coaches bi-yearly scares potential candidates away as they believe they'll get the same treatment.

      1. Hire a zone expert DC ... or any DC that doesn't have their head in their ***.2. Promote Koetter to HC.3. Promote Koetter to HC.4. Promote Koetter to HC.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first....

      You don't get it.When you're plugging practice squad guys into the lineup over guys you brought in, you have effectively lost the team.  At least on Defense.These guys are NOT buying in.They have lost faith in Lovie and he needs to be shown the door ASAP.

      Please wait…

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      I do not think the defense is putrid. 

      OK ADW..... you're making some positive moves here that no longer make you look bat sheet crazy, or that you are in denial.Keep going this route...... and for God sake refrain from making any more comments like you did earlier in this horrible idea for a thread.  you were close to making message board critical mass...which means never being taken seriously here again....... but with the above quote....we're going to work with you and help you get back to realityville....... deep, slow breaths...we can do this.  we're here to help.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I don't think we should fire Lovie Smith, I could honestly care less about him as a coach. The reasons I don't want Lovie Smith fired are as follows:1. No more turnover of players.2. I like Koetter and Licht way more than I dislike Lovie and Frazier, don't want to lose Koetter and Licht.3. We have a young QB and don't want him learning a new scheme, want him to master the one he has.4. Firing coaches bi-yearly scares potential candidates away as they believe they'll get the same treatment.

      Good post.Bucs are clearly trying to build something and that is the process of rebuilding.  It take patience and a long term vision to see it all play out.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Please wait…

    • vlagatta

      Member
      Post count: 2638

      You are living in a house of denial.

      ......aaaaaannnd......... we're back

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I do not think the defense is putrid. 

      OK ADW..... you're making some positive moves here that no longer make you look bat sheet crazy, or that you are in denial.Keep going this route...... and for God sake refrain from making any more comments like you did earlier in this horrible idea for a thread.  you were close to making message board critical mass...which means never being taken seriously here again....... but with the above quote....we're going to work with you and help you get back to realityville....... deep, slow breaths...we can do this.  we're here to help.

      ADW must be on commission ticket sales ...This D just gave up 7 TDs to Blake ****ing Bortles and Kirk Cousins."Putrid" would be a kind complement in describing Lovie's "rebuilt D".

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4407

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      Bailed?  They you go lying again!  Anyone watching Winston yesterday with an ounce of integrity and honesty can see why the Bucs picked him number #1.That was something the "Mariota sycophants" and "false narrative lovers" railed against from the time Winston declared for the draft trying to ignore that Winston would be the choice and the RIGHT one!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      Bailed?  They you go lying again!  Anyone watching Winston yesterday with an ounce of integrity and honesty can see why the Bucs picked him number #1.That was something the "Mariota sycophants" and "false narrative lovers" railed against from the time Winston declared for the draft trying to ignore that Winston would be the choice and the RIGHT one!

      Ahh, welcome back!  You've been missed.  Amazing how you pop up like that when your name is called.  Almost like you have more than one account.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 215

      As big as getting Koetter this offseason has been. I do wonder how huge it was to not get Marinelli over here from the Cowboys to be DC. What could have been….I dont think it is 100% personnel on our D, mostly coaching.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      You asked why the Bucs used draft resources on offense and I showed you why.You have no argument at this point.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4407

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      Bailed?  They you go lying again!  Anyone watching Winston yesterday with an ounce of integrity and honesty can see why the Bucs picked him number #1.That was something the "Mariota sycophants" and "false narrative lovers" railed against from the time Winston declared for the draft trying to ignore that Winston would be the choice and the RIGHT one!

      Ahh, welcome back!  You've been missed.  Amazing how you pop up like that when your name is called.  Almost like you have more than one account.

      Nope ( only one account that I have had forever).  I have no need to constantly rag on Mariota and False Narrative sycophants like yourself.  The Bucs picked the player I wanted and I am enjoying the progress I see with this team.  Last year was most a most unfortunate series of events way beyond the control of the Smith and the Glazers.  I see good things in the future for the Bucs.  Since I have been a Bucs fan before the franchise was even awarded I have seen peaks and valleys. The firing of Gruden was the beginning of the valley The hiring of Smith appears to be the beginning of a climb upward.  It is a work in progress and I like what I am seeing despite the heart breaking loss yesterday.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.

      More than half of the defense, and the players doing the worst, were brought in by Lovie himself.  Waster 10's of millions of dollars on FA's that play like garbage.  Oh, and it was Lovie's choice not to draft defense because he thought his FA's would do the job.  So the no drafting defense is also his fault.  No way around that.

      Defensive players that were brought in are clearly stop gaps because the offense had to be addressed first. Did you want to see Glennon start again and lead an offense near dead last in yards per game in 2015?This is what happened in 2013 and 2014.  Bucs ownership made the smart move by giving the green light to draft a QB when given an opportunity.Bucs brand has also been slowly repaired as the casual fans are tuning in to watch this team, because they finally look competitive again. Many were disappointed with the loss but they still were wearing their Bucs gear, because there is a building sense of pride on the Tampa Bay community for these young Bucs.  If the casual fans sees the arrow pointing up for the rebuilding Bucs then I would assume the analysts of the seasoned red boarders would see it the same way.

      Would you care to back up some of your wild claims?  I know, that's a stretch for you, but lets try it just this one time.The vast majority of Buc's fans I know are not wearing their gear with more pride then ever before.  Quite the opposite in fact.  I know many who have put their jerseys back in the closet.  Most only wear it on game days now.  The only fans left in fact are the die hards.  All the band wagon fans have left.  Heck, even Runole has bailed and he was Winston homer #1.  And just look at this and every other Buc's forum. The majority opinion, and by a clear majority, is to fire Lovie and the Buc's are in very bad shape.  Most agree the product the Buc's are putting on the field is an embarrassment and not getting any better.But hey, ADW said it all peaches and cream.  Ticket sales must be through the roof? TV ratings are astronomical! Apparel sales must be breaking records! And ADW have the proof to show this to be true.  Just waiting on him to post it now.

      You are living in a house of denial.2013: #32 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Offense2014:#30 overall in yards per game: Tampa Bay Buccaneers OffenseWhy do you think ownership gave the green light to draft a QB with a top pick if Glennon was doing a bang up job?  You are coming off as a casual Bucs fan if you can't see why the team has devoted so many resources on the offensive side of the ball the last two drafts.

      Again, just making stuff up huh?  Show me where I said Glennon was doing a bang up job.  Come on ADW, I know it's hard to try and defend your position but there is no need to lie when you can't.

      Bailed?  They you go lying again!  Anyone watching Winston yesterday with an ounce of integrity and honesty can see why the Bucs picked him number #1.That was something the "Mariota sycophants" and "false narrative lovers" railed against from the time Winston declared for the draft trying to ignore that Winston would be the choice and the RIGHT one!

      Ahh, welcome back!  You've been missed.  Amazing how you pop up like that when your name is called.  Almost like you have more than one account.

      Nope ( only one account that I have had forever).  I have no need to constantly rag on Mariota and False Narrative sycophants like yourself.  The Bucs picked the player I wanted and I am enjoying the progress I see with this team.  Last year was most a most unfortunate series of events way beyond the control of the Smith and the Glazers.  I see good things in the future for the Bucs.  Since I have been a Bucs fan before the franchise was even awarded I have seen peaks and valleys. The firing of Gruden was the beginning of the valley The hiring of Smith appears to be the beginning of a climb upward.  It is a work in progress and I like what I am seeing despite the heart breaking loss yesterday.

      Agreed.The arrow is pointing upwards with one of the youngest teams in the league starting also the most rookies in the league.Young Bucs are showing signs of progress which is what ownership has wanted to see for a while.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      You are living in a house of denial.

      Bwahahahahahahahaha!

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      It is not rocket science people.  You need decent coaching to win in this league consistently.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      It is not rocket science people.  You need decent coaching to win in this league consistently.

      It is all about talent.Gruden took a 2007 team as far as he could with duct tape and bubble gum. But the Bucs lacked the horses (talent) to compete against the Gmen in the playoffs.Are the Ravens, 49ers, and Seahawks poorly coached or is the talent drain starting to catch up for these teams?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You are living in a house of denial.

      Bwahahahahahahahaha!

      LMAO!  I missed this gem!Rebuild is ahead of schedule guys!building-collapse-o.gif

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      It is not rocket science people.  You need decent coaching to win in this league consistently.

      It is all about talent.Gruden took a 2007 team as far as he could with duct tape and bubble gum. But the Bucs lacked the horses (talent) to compete against the Gmen in the playoffs.Are the Ravens, 49ers, and Seahawks poorly coached or is the talent drain starting to catch up for these teams?

      Considering those teams lost key coaches and coordinators, I'm going to go with coaching being the issue.Exhibit A: Miami Dolphins.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      It is not rocket science people.  You need decent coaching to win in this league consistently.

      It is all about talent.Gruden took a 2007 team as far as he could with duct tape and bubble gum. But the Bucs lacked the horses (talent) to compete against the Gmen in the playoffs.Are the Ravens, 49ers, and Seahawks poorly coached or is the talent drain starting to catch up for these teams?

      Considering those teams lost key coaches and coordinators, I'm going to go with coaching being the issue.Exhibit A: Miami Dolphins.

      Mrs. Schiano you are misleading if you ignore the sheer amount of talent lost by those teams. It wasn't just the lost of coordinators.  The Dolphins are a unique case where they are loaded with talent.  They didn't have a talent drain like the 49eers for example. They heavily added talent in the off season.But thanks for making my point.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2630

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      The Bucs have 3 former All Pro's on their defense. McCoy and David are two excellent pieces to build around, and we have many other quality players such as Banks, Kwon, McDonald, Gholston, Verner (he was an All-Pro before he came here), etc. Take a look at the Eagles roster. Don't think there's a single All Pro on that team, although Fletcher Cox and Malcom Jenkins (don't know how he got so good) are playing at a very high level. Is there a single position where they have better players than us other than Safety? Give me our CB's and LB's over there's any day, and I'd say our D-line is a push. Both teams have very good DT's, but not the best outside rushers. The Steelers secondary definitely has less talent than ours and their front 7 is probably about equal. How are they getting so much more out of their guys than we are?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      The Dolphins are a unique case where they are loaded with talent.  They didn't have a talent drain like the 49eers for example. They heavily added talent in the off season.But thanks for making my point.

      LMFAO!  Damn you're right ADW!  I missed all those blockbuster trades that happened after Miami started the season 1-4 and fired their HC!!!What's that?  Oh they won 2 straight WITHOUT adding blockbuster talent?How the **** did that happen?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      I love the optimism ADW, but the defense is a huge disappointment. If the offense was struggling, that would be one thing as most of our starters are very young and growing pains are expected.However, seeing the defense get torched every week is the problem. There are some young guys on the defense too, but this is the second year in Lovie's system and there is simply too much talent for this unit to be playing as bad as it is. Yes, we are missing a few pieces but Lovie should be getting more out of this defense, especially considering he is a defensive minded coach.

      I don't see a lot of defensive talent on that side of the ball.  And that is expected when you spend the majority of draft resources on offense the last two drafts.I think you are overrating the total collection of talent on the team. This is a rebuilding team that is still trying to put it all together.

      Sorry, I disagree. I think we have enough talent to be close to a top 10 defense in the NFL. Look at some of the other defenses that rank in the top half of the league. Eagles, Titans, Steelers, etc. There's no way that those teams have more talent than we do on the defensive side of the ball, yet their defense's are playing much better than we are.

      You are too optimistic think the Bucs have as much talent on defense like the Eagles or Steelers.  The Titans I believe are over achieving, but they still have far more consistent safety play.The Eagles made an effort to improve the defensive side of the ball this off season.  The Steelers underwent their defensive transition last season and it continued into this season.It is not rocket science people.  You need talent to win in this league consistently.

      The Bucs have 3 former All Pro's on their defense. McCoy and David are two excellent pieces to build around, and we have many other quality players such as Banks, Kwon, McDonald, Gholston, Verner (he was an All-Pro before he came here), etc. Take a look at the Eagles roster. Don't think there's a single All Pro on that team, although Fletcher Cox and Malcom Jenkins (don't know how he got so good) are playing at a very high level. Is there a single position where they have better players than us other than Safety? Give me our CB's and LB's over there's any day, and I'd say our D-line is a push. Both teams have very good DT's, but not the best outside rushers. The Steelers secondary definitely has less talent than ours and their front 7 is probably about equal. How are they getting so much more out of their guys than we are?

      You have fallen into the trap of overrating the Bucs talent versus other NFL teams.McCoy hasn't even played three full NFL seasons yet.  David is still very young. You say quality players but other than Banks, Alexander, Smith, and Gholston the rest are stop gaps. Here is the defensive talent the Bucs have drafted since the year 2005:2(36) B. Ruud5(141) D. Nicholson6(178) A. Bryant7(231) H. Abudullah4(122) A. Zemaitis5(156) J. Jenkins7(235) J. Phinisee7(241) C. Bennett1(4) G. Adams (RIP)2(64) S. Piscitelli3(68) Q. Black4(106) T. Jackson5(141) G. Peterson6(182) A. Heyward7(245) M. Hamilton1(20) A. Talib4(115) D. Moore6(175) G. Hayes3(81) R. Miller4(117) K. Moore7(217) E. J. Biggers1(3) Gerald McCoy2(35) B. Price3(67) M. Lewis7(210) C. Grimm7(217) D. Watson1(20) A. Clayborn2(51) D. Bowers3(84) M. Foster5(151) A. Black7(222) A. Gaitor1(7). M. Barron2(58) L. David5(140) N. Goode6(174) K. Tandy2(43) J. Banks4(100) A. Spence4(126) W. Gholston5(147) S. Means4(25) K. AlexanderBucs have to address both sides of the ball.  The made the choice of building an offense first, especially with the drafting of Jameis Winston #1 overall.Rebuilding is a process and important one for the Bucs which has missed on many draft choices (especially on defense).

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3316

      Lovie is hot garbage and so is anyone that supports keeping that loser as our head coach.  I want perma ban bets that this guy never wins here in Tampa.  You go when that loser goes?  Deal?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Those free agents failed that is why the Bucs are rebuilding with the blessing of the Glazers.  Why the team released most of those signed free agents and started the slate clean.The current 2015 Bucs defense has mostly stop gaps.  You are at this point in denial of:1. Sheer amount of stop gaps on defense that are 1-3 year deals and a lot of them on vet min.2. The number of missed defensive draft choices over a decade of football.Lilo have a plan in place.  They have built up the offensive side of the ball first and then they will address the defense.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Who are you to question the ultimate wisdom of master builder Lovie Smith?He's already well ahead of schedule and yet, you complain?I'm not sure anything will be good enough for this unappreciative fan base.  If these fans can't see the genius that Lovie brings to the table, then maybe we don't deserve him....

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      The Glazers signed off with the release of these free agents signed in 2014 as they agree with LiLo that the 2015 team would be rebuilding and need to start the slate clean again.Especially with the drafting of Jameis Winston #1 overall.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Those free agents failed that is why the Bucs are rebuilding with the blessing of the Glazers.  Why the team released most of those signed free agents and started the slate clean.The current 2015 Bucs defense has mostly stop gaps.  You are at this point in denial of:1. Sheer amount of stop gaps on defense that are 1-3 year deals and a lot of them on vet min.2. The number of missed defensive draft choices over a decade of football.Lilo have a plan in place.  They have built up the offensive side of the ball first and then they will address the defense.

      Those FA's that you admit are a failure were part of Lovie's original plan.  I highly doubt the plan was not to sign them in 2014 then replace in 2015 via the draft.  That failure and thus the required fixes is all Lovie's fault.  In 2014, there was not a plan to spend two picks on a LT and G in 2015.  The plan was changed because of failure that were solely Lovies fault in 2014..

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      The Glazers signed off with the release of these free agents signed in 2014 as they agree with LiLo that the 2015 team would be rebuilding and need to start the slate clean again.Especially with the drafting of Jameis Winston #1 overall.

      Wait, so are you now saying, 2014 was a total bust but the owners have agreed to give the person responsible for that total bust three more years to build a competitive team?  I guess 2014 never happened huh?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      The Glazers signed off with the release of these free agents signed in 2014 as they agree with LiLo that the 2015 team would be rebuilding and need to start the slate clean again.Especially with the drafting of Jameis Winston #1 overall.

      Wait, so are you now saying, 2014 was a total bust but the owners have agreed to give the person responsible for that total bust three more years to build a competitive team?  I guess 2014 never happened huh?

      Yes.The Glazers will sign off with the release of these 2015 free agents as they agree with LiLo that the 2016 team would be rebuilding and need to start the slate clean again.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Those free agents failed that is why the Bucs are rebuilding with the blessing of the Glazers.  Why the team released most of those signed free agents and started the slate clean.The current 2015 Bucs defense has mostly stop gaps.  You are at this point in denial of:1. Sheer amount of stop gaps on defense that are 1-3 year deals and a lot of them on vet min.2. The number of missed defensive draft choices over a decade of football.Lilo have a plan in place.  They have built up the offensive side of the ball first and then they will address the defense.

      Those FA's that you admit are a failure were part of Lovie's original plan.  I highly doubt the plan was not to sign them in 2014 then replace in 2015 via the draft.  That failure and thus the required fixes is all Lovie's fault.  In 2014, there was not a plan to spend two picks on a LT and G in 2015.  The plan was changed because of failure that were solely Lovies fault in 2014..

      Your logic is poor and not coherent.The reason the Bucs signed those free agents in 2014 was because of the poor drafts before Lovie and Licth arrived to the team.  Dominik barely even bothered to draft offensive linemen and the defensive end spot had a lot of talent that never reached its potential. The free agents failed to fill the gaps so they went and drafted players as the next logical step.This isn't hard to follow but you are an amateur football fan, so I guess that is a given.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Those free agents failed that is why the Bucs are rebuilding with the blessing of the Glazers.  Why the team released most of those signed free agents and started the slate clean.The current 2015 Bucs defense has mostly stop gaps.  You are at this point in denial of:1. Sheer amount of stop gaps on defense that are 1-3 year deals and a lot of them on vet min.2. The number of missed defensive draft choices over a decade of football.Lilo have a plan in place.  They have built up the offensive side of the ball first and then they will address the defense.

      Those FA's that you admit are a failure were part of Lovie's original plan.  I highly doubt the plan was not to sign them in 2014 then replace in 2015 via the draft.  That failure and thus the required fixes is all Lovie's fault.  In 2014, there was not a plan to spend two picks on a LT and G in 2015.  The plan was changed because of failure that were solely Lovies fault in 2014..

      Your logic is poor and not coherent.The reason the Bucs signed those free agents in 2014 was because of the poor drafts before Lovie and Licth arrived to the team.  Dominik barely even bothered to draft offensive linemen and the defensive end spot had a lot of talent that never reached its potential. The free agents failed to fill the gaps so they went and drafted players as the next logical step.This isn't hard to follow but you are an amateur football fan, so I guess that is a given.

      Yes, its not very hard to follow.  Lovie busted on draft picks and almost every FA in 2014.  Then he had to use 2015 to not only address problems from before his time, but also to fix problems he himself created.  Even a 5 year old can understand that.  Why can't you?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      And if Lovie didn't bust on FA's like Cousins and Collins, then maybe the Smith and Marpet picks could have been a CB and DE.More than half the defense is "talent" acquired by Lovie.  If the talent sucks, it's Lovie's fault that he brought them in.

      Lovie brought in stop gaps on defense because the plan is to build up the offensive side of the ball first through the draft.This isn't hard to follow folks but apparently I have to use crayons and diagrams to show what this means long term for the franchise.

      Johnson - 5 years $43 millionVerner - 4 years $26 millionCarter - 4 years $17 millionCollins - 5 years $30 millionDoesn't sound like stop gaps to me.  A lot of the defensive FA's signed this year to one year deals, sure.  But how many of those were signed because the previous years class was such a failure and a second draft year would have to be devoted to fix 2014 mistakes?

      Those free agents failed that is why the Bucs are rebuilding with the blessing of the Glazers.  Why the team released most of those signed free agents and started the slate clean.The current 2015 Bucs defense has mostly stop gaps.  You are at this point in denial of:1. Sheer amount of stop gaps on defense that are 1-3 year deals and a lot of them on vet min.2. The number of missed defensive draft choices over a decade of football.Lilo have a plan in place.  They have built up the offensive side of the ball first and then they will address the defense.

      Those FA's that you admit are a failure were part of Lovie's original plan.  I highly doubt the plan was not to sign them in 2014 then replace in 2015 via the draft.  That failure and thus the required fixes is all Lovie's fault.  In 2014, there was not a plan to spend two picks on a LT and G in 2015.  The plan was changed because of failure that were solely Lovies fault in 2014..

      Your logic is poor and not coherent.The reason the Bucs signed those free agents in 2014 was because of the poor drafts before Lovie and Licth arrived to the team.  Dominik barely even bothered to draft offensive linemen and the defensive end spot had a lot of talent that never reached its potential. The free agents failed to fill the gaps so they went and drafted players as the next logical step.This isn't hard to follow but you are an amateur football fan, so I guess that is a given.

      Yes, its not very hard to follow.  Lovie busted on draft picks and almost every FA in 2014.  Then he had to use 2015 to not only address problems from before his time, but also to fix problems he himself created.  Even a 5 year old can understand that.  Why can't you?

      There is no way to know if the 2014 draft picks will be busts.  Again you are making assumptions.The 2015 season was a clean state, a starting over a.k.a rebuilding.  When you draft a #1 QB overall that is a sign the team is starting over.This isn't difficult to understand if you have followed the game of football for any certain length in time.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Noticeably absent is an answer to the question, so I'll ask again:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Noticeable absent is an answer to the question, so I'll ask again:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Bucs don't need All pros at FS or RDE but they need NFL average which they do not have currently at either position.And using a logical fallacy exposes you badly as well in trying to push your narrative.https://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/659/03/

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Noticeable absent is an answer to the question, so I'll ask again:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Didn't you know, King ADW is not required to answer questions or provide proof to support wild accusations.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Noticeable absent is an answer to the question, so I'll ask again:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Bucs don't need All pros at FS or RDE but they need NFL average which they do not have currently at either position.And using a logical fallacy exposes you badly as well in trying to push your narrative.https://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/659/03/

      Smith has proven to be NFL average RDE.I'll ask a third time: How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?Why don't you save yourself a lot of time and admit that having two All-Pro's on defense is something most NFL teams don't have.  Are you coherent enough to admit that, or will you continue to bury your little noggin in the sand?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      It is all about talent.

      How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      You need talent to run a defensive scheme.  Bucs do not have enough talent. It has been apparent for quite a while since the 2007 season.

      Noticeable absent is an answer to the question, so I'll ask again:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?

      Bucs don't need All pros at FS or RDE but they need NFL average which they do not have currently at either position.And using a logical fallacy exposes you badly as well in trying to push your narrative.https://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/659/03/

      Smith has proven to be NFL average RDE.I'll ask a third time: How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need not to suck?Why don't you save yourself a lot of time and admit that having two All-Pro's on defense is something most NFL teams don't have.  Are you coherent enough to admit that, or will you continue to bury your little noggin in the sand?

      Smith is a LDE in pass rushing situations.Where is the RDE on the roster to team up with Smith?And you are coming back with a logical fallacy. Bucs don't even have NFL average at RDE, FS and arguably at CB.The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Dude started thread titled "Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule" ... He pwned himself.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Dude started thread titled "Rebuilding Bucs are ahead of schedule" ... He pwned himself.

      And remember, the purpose of this thread was to put Red Board members in their place.  Poor ADW. No wonder he is such a staunch defender of Lovie, they both thrive in failure.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      You guys, it’s not that hard to follow. Any homer can see that this team is trending upwards.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      You guys, it's not that hard to follow. Any homer can see that this team is trending upwards.

      80zgc.jpg

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      And remember, the purpose of this thread was to put Red Board members in their place. 

      Well I'm glad he got that sorted out.  I wasn't quite sure where to place ADW.  Now I know.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      You guys, it's not that hard to follow. Any homer can see that this team is trending upwards.

      Going from absolutely the worst to almost the absolutely worst is not improvement to be proud of.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      Lets also praise St. Lovie for running such a predictable defense that multiple redskin players knew they won the game before they even snapped the ball Such a delicious upward trend we are on. the last 2 Lovie coached teams are TIED for dead last in points allowed.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Lets also praise St. Lovie for running such a predictable defense that multiple redskin players knew they won the game before they even snapped the ball Such a delicious upward trend we are on. the last 2 Lovie coached teams are TIED for dead last in points allowed.

      It's all part of the master rebuild plan.Lovie knows he needs 5 years of top 5 picks.He can't do that if the offense keeps putting up 500 yards and 30ppg ... he NEEDS the defense to allow >30ppg so we can maintain those coveted top 5 picks ... That's how NE stays on top!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Still more bullshit without answering a seemingly simple question.  I'll ask a fourth time:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need to not suck?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Still more bull(censored) without answering a seemingly simple question.  I'll ask a fourth time:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need to not suck?

      8. The answer is 8.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9891

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Still more bull(censored) without answering a seemingly simple question.  I'll ask a fourth time:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need to not suck?

      8. The answer is 8.

      LolThis conversation is hill-air-e-us

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2412

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Still more bull(censored) without answering a seemingly simple question.  I'll ask a fourth time:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need to not suck?

      8. The answer is 8.

      LolThis conversation is hill-air-e-us

      Typical ADW though.  Won't answer simple questions or post proof for any of his wild claims.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 4274

      Bucs need a RDE and a FS. Maybe even a CB.

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 9128

      Bucs need a RDE and a FS. Maybe even a CB.

      Ya' think?

      Please wait…

    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 232

      The Bucs have all two all pros on defense and they are very young and still learning.  It seems to me that you lack a logical argument and are stuck on the all pro logical fallacy.

      This is cute.Your argument about lack of talent is countered with the multiple defensive All-Pro's on the team, something not many NFL teams can claim.  You say that's a logical fallacy, which is just precious.Pwned.

      Your logical fallacy is very easy to break down.Just because the Bucs have two all pros on defense doesn't mean the Bucs have all the players necessary to run the scheme.  If A, ---> the B must be true.That is the logical fallacy you have set up.The Bucs do not have NFL average at RDE or FS as an example which are two important components of this defensive scheme.I can see the white flag or surrender all the way here from Winter Haven.

      Still more bull(censored) without answering a seemingly simple question.  I'll ask a fourth time:How many All-Pro's on defense does your coach need to not suck?

      8. The answer is 8.

      the answer is eleven plus6 on the bench and 3 on the practice squad

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    • johnd

      Participant
      Post count: 333

      Bucs need a RDE and a FS. Maybe even a CB.

      Ya' think?

      LOL

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      I think what scares me is how we have let teams come back when the team was clearly outplaying them in the beginning of the games. We should have won last weeks game. I would say the texans game was probably a game we should have won. Carolina game should have been closer. The team continues to find ways to shoot themselves in the foot. So I am still not sold on this team yet. They need to clean up a lot of things first before we can say the rebuild is “ahead of schedule”. I always like me some good homerism but this is too much.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      I think what scares me is how we have let teams come back when the team was clearly outplaying them in the beginning of the games. We should have won last weeks game. I would say the texans game was probably a game we should have won. Carolina game should have been closer. The team continues to find ways to shoot themselves in the foot. So I am still not sold on this team yet. They need to clean up a lot of things first before we can say the rebuild is "ahead of schedule". I always like me some good homerism but this is too much.

      Way ahead of schedule.1333652083_apartment_building_collapses.gifClap for 'em.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1875

      While not wishing to ruin anyone’s fun, isn’t more important to have zero less than average players starting than a specific number of pro bowlers, or any other outstanding adjective one would prefer to use?  To avoid a rush of responses - let me help - yes it is - so 8 is not the right answer - it is simply an answer... and yes, CB should be any rational evaluation of bucs needs  ;D ;D ;D

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      ADW Googled logical fallacy…so now it will be in all of his postsThen he will return to having his head up St. Lovie's hiney

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      BTW…excellent troll job by ADW with his title selections

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5438

      Lovie was definitely given the credit he deserved for the defense he hand selected the last two offseasons.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 407

      Too much pro Lovie diarrhea. This is just garbage lol. OP has to own up.

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    • dalaca

      Participant
      Post count: 1975

      So much for taking a step forward. The Glazers just gave us two more years of sh!t teams and another run at the #1 draft pick. Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8044

      So much for taking a step forward. The Glazers just gave us two more years of sh!t teams and another run at the #1 draft pick. Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

      i don’t get this train of thought.  In all likelihood the offense will remain in place.  In all likelihood, the defense can’t get any worse.  So why the step back or 2 more wasted years?In all likelihood, with a more difficulty schedule next season, a year of growth for the offense, and a defense that hopefully schemes around players rather than a playbook then we will be around .500 with a playoff shot.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 407

      So much for taking a step forward. The Glazers just gave us two more years of sh!t teams and another run at the #1 draft pick. Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

      Lovie sucked m8. How can you not see it? Easiest schedule in team history and still only finished 6-10. We played the weakest division in football in 2014 and finished 2-14. That's inexcusable Lovie deserved to be fired. It is very unlikely the Bucs will hire a worse coach than Lovie Smith. Even Raheem and Schiano had better winning percentages with less to work with.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1830

      So much for taking a step forward. The Glazers just gave us two more years of sh!t teams and another run at the #1 draft pick. Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

      Lovie sucked m8. How can you not see it? Easiest schedule in team history and still only finished 6-10. We played the weakest division in football in 2014 and finished 2-14. That's inexcusable Lovie deserved to be fired. It is very unlikely the Bucs will hire a worse coach than Lovie Smith. Even Raheem and Schiano had better winning percentages with less to work with.

      BINGO!!!3-13 @ home and 8-24 flat out SUCKS!!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1151

      tumblr_m7ucxqiuFR1rv1ckao1_400.gif

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

      You'll have lots to pick from, but with the 4-12 record they'll have in 2016, I'd hold off on hotel reservations.

      Enough already.You want to stand behind your words here Lovie Lover?How about a wager?If (Koetter's) Bucs have 4 wins or less, I don't post here anymore.  5 or more, you're gone.Deal?

      How 'bout it, Goth?  Sack up or shut up.

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    • dalaca

      Participant
      Post count: 1975

      So much for taking a step forward. The Glazers just gave us two more years of sh!t teams and another run at the #1 draft pick. Next season, the Bucs max out at four wins.

      Lovie sucked m8. How can you not see it? Easiest schedule in team history and still only finished 6-10. We played the weakest division in football in 2014 and finished 2-14. That's inexcusable Lovie deserved to be fired. It is very unlikely the Bucs will hire a worse coach than Lovie Smith. Even Raheem and Schiano had better winning percentages with less to work with.

      I can't argue with the fact that Lovie made some bad choices and never brought a defense that was successful, and yes, with one of the weakest schedules in the NFL. (I believe the Falcons were listed as the easiest.)That just adds to what I'm concerned about for next season. The NFC & AFC West, coupled with a healthy Dallas team does not bode well for expecting a better end result. As I've mentioned, I would love to be wrong, but four of the teams we play are valid SB contenders, and Dallas could be, should they field a healthy team.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1452

      OK Goth, they’re going to suck next year without the great leadership of Lovie …4 wins or less right?

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    • dalaca

      Participant
      Post count: 1975

      OK Goth, they're going to suck next year without the great leadership of Lovie ...4 wins or less right?

      Dude, give it a rest, or maybe go to law school, where folks love to just argue for the sake of it. Nowhere did I say Lovie would have made a direct impact on winning more games.

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