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    • Hey Hey Tampa Bay

      Participant
      Post count: 116

      The early realization that Freeman sucked and his eventual replacement with Glennon by Schiano was the undoing of this franchise.  Why?

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    • johnd

      Participant
      Post count: 333

      Schiano was thrown into a no win situation.  was he a good NFL coach?  probably not but Lovie is proving to be even worse. 

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    • Stratobuc

      Participant
      Post count: 29

      Schiano was thrown into a no win situation.  was he a good NFL coach?  probably not but Lovie is proving to be even worse.

      Was he a good NFL coach?Who could've done more with the dumpster fire that was Morris/Freeman and the Bucs?The answer to your question was, YES.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 57

      Schiano was 11-22 after two seasons…unless a miracle takes place and Lovie finds a way to win 9 games this season…then it’s safe to say Schiano did a better job based upon what he had to work with and record.Winston should have been benched after the first half yesterday.  Lovie Smith will ruin this young man's career.  The Saints are going to beat the crap out of us!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 407

      Too many people that don’t understand the game of football had their pitchfork out. They forced the Glazers to fire Schiano. I would have given Schiano one more year without being pressured to start that piece of trash QB Freeman and without all the distractions. Freeman was the real cancer of the team during the Schiano years.But honestly at the time I didn't think Lovie was going to be a bad hire. But boy I was wrong. I think Lovie is just interested in collecting his paycheck nowadays.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 5954

      As God awful terrible an NFL head coach as Greg Schiano was for us, and he was truely horrific in some pretty important areas, he clearly did a far superior job than Lovie.  I don’t see how anyone could question we would have won more games.  That would still make Greg Schiano a horrible NFL coach, but is a good illustration for how monumentally bad Lovie Smith is doing.  The NFL truly isn’t set up for any one team to be as bad as we are.  We are smashing logic and reason bad.  You have to be trying to be that bad, bad. 

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2026

      No we’d still suck probably a little less then what we do now but we would still be bad. Schiano wasn’t a good coach just turns out lovie is worse then him same way schiano was worse the raheem. This team turns everything it touches into suck it looks like.

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    • c.greene55

      Participant
      Post count: 41

      Schiano wasn’t a good coach, though he was a great planner. He would usually have his team prepared for the first half but as the game went along and coaches made adjustments to what Schiano was doing, he was very regimented and couldn’t do better than that. However, I feel pretty confident in saying that Schiano is a better coach than Lovie Smith.

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    • Stratobuc

      Participant
      Post count: 29

      same way schiano was worse then raheem.

      You've got to be kidding, right?  SMH

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1025

      I know our defense wouldn’t suck *** thats for sure

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3341

      Speculation – Schiano and Glennon would’ve had many more wins

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 456

      Even in a loss the shiano bucs looked much better than lovies team in a win.I loved shiano attitude during a game on the side line. He fired up the guys, or tried it.But lovie is like a sleeping pill. Btw, if was the shiano team where I saw my only bucs win out of 8.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2026

      same way schiano was worse then raheem.

      You've got to be kidding, right?  SMH

      Raheem at least had a winning record 1 year I don't give a damn who we beat I'll take 10-6 allday.

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    • suesweat

      Participant
      Post count: 1335

      Too many people that don't understand the game of football had their pitchfork out. They forced the Glazers to fire Schiano. I would have given Schiano one more year without being pressured to start that piece of trash QB Freeman and without all the distractions. Freeman was the real cancer of the team during the Schiano years.

      And he was such a great HC someone else picked him up right?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Raheem was sh1t, schiano was sh1tty, and lovie is sh1ttier.How about we put the blame on the glazers? Theyre the ones who love their manU, don't spend, then hire dumbass coaches on a wim.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 583

      I absolutely hated the Schiano hire and his tenure here.That said, there is zero debate that Schiano/Glennon >>>>> Lovie/Winston.

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    • suesweat

      Participant
      Post count: 1335

      That said, there is zero debate that Schiano/Glennon ===== Lovie/Winston.

      I corrected it for you. After one game each of them lost. We can revisit it next week and point the arrows in the correct direction.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3169

      same way schiano was worse then raheem.

      You've got to be kidding, right?  SMH

      Raheem at least had a winning record 1 year I don't give a damn who we beat I'll take 10-6 allday.

      If it can't be replicated because it was luck, what good is it?

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 7

      Correction: your “truth.” It’s pure speculation. Let the team build. I don’t think you all understand how depleted the roster was before last year. It seems every resource was used to prop up Freeman as the face of the franchise. When that flamed out the Bucs had next to nothing.Pushing for another hard restart at HC will only serve to ruin what's been building. Useless speculation is a distraction. Face the facts: Lovie got outwitted by Whisenhunt. He has his shortcomings, but he is a vast improvement from Schiano and Co.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 7

      Speculation - Schiano and Glennon would've had many more wins

      That's what I'm saying!

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      Correction: your "truth." It's pure speculation. Let the team build. I don't think you all understand how depleted the roster was before last year. It seems every resource was used to prop up Freeman as the face of the franchise. When that flamed out the Bucs had next to nothing.Pushing for another hard restart at HC will only serve to ruin what's been building. Useless speculation is a distraction. Face the facts: Lovie got outwitted by Whisenhunt. He has his shortcomings, but he is a vast improvement from Schiano and Co.

      Yeah, he got "outwitted" alright.Like, "bend over and spell run" outwitted.

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    • c.greene55

      Participant
      Post count: 41

      Correction: your "truth." It's pure speculation. Let the team build. I don't think you all understand how depleted the roster was before last year. It seems every resource was used to prop up Freeman as the face of the franchise. When that flamed out the Bucs had next to nothing.Pushing for another hard restart at HC will only serve to ruin what's been building. Useless speculation is a distraction. Face the facts: Lovie got outwitted by Whisenhunt. He has his shortcomings, but he is a vast improvement from Schiano and Co.

      Qutie frankly this is BS. Lovie came here, got front office control and proceeded to ruin our cap space with players he wanted in FA, then drafted the QB of the future, this roster is Lovie's now. Schiano was 11-21, he had his shortcomings but I haven't seen a single thing from Lovie Smith that makes me think he's even nearly as good of a coach as Schiano was. And I'm not advocating for Schiano to come back, far from it.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 262

      That said, there is zero debate that Schiano/Glennon ===== Lovie/Winston.

      I corrected it for you. After one game each of them lost. We can revisit it next week and point the arrows in the correct direction.

      I disagree, the manner in which Schiano/Glennon lost to Arizona was a competitive one. losing 13-10 and your QB throwing an INT at the end of the game while trying to march down the field and win is a damn sight better than the abject capitulation that Lovie/Winston presided over yesterday, Lovie/Winston had lost the game by the end of the 1st quarter. At least Schiano/Glennon made a game of it.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 337

      There’s very little doubt in my mind that Schiano and Glennon (with continuity at HC/OC and a full offseason of starter reps) would have produced better results than the clown show that Lovie’s regime has been.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 7

      Correction: your "truth." It's pure speculation. Let the team build. I don't think you all understand how depleted the roster was before last year. It seems every resource was used to prop up Freeman as the face of the franchise. When that flamed out the Bucs had next to nothing.Pushing for another hard restart at HC will only serve to ruin what's been building. Useless speculation is a distraction. Face the facts: Lovie got outwitted by Whisenhunt. He has his shortcomings, but he is a vast improvement from Schiano and Co.

      Qutie frankly this is BS. Lovie came here, got front office control and proceeded to ruin our cap space with players he wanted in FA, then drafted the QB of the future, this roster is Lovie's now. Schiano was 11-21, he had his shortcomings but I haven't seen a single thing from Lovie Smith that makes me think he's even nearly as good of a coach as Schiano was. And I'm not advocating for Schiano to come back, far from it.

      1. Cap space is fine.2. The real mistakes that Lovie made was in absolutely cleaning house along the O-line (trading Zuttah and releasing Penn). Which resulted in the problems we see today.3. Drafting Sims in the 3rd (further compounding issues along the O-line. OG should've been the pick.Schiano had his troops playing BALL. Every week you could see that they were putting their all into the game, but the locker room was in shambles. Whether he created or inherited that situation is irrelevant; he completely mishandled it.Lovie must be schematically better than yesterday and we saw the dividends on D late last year. Let it play out.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 2026

      same way schiano was worse then raheem.

      You've got to be kidding, right?  SMH

      Raheem at least had a winning record 1 year I don't give a damn who we beat I'll take 10-6 allday.

      If it can't be replicated because it was luck, what good is it?

      Huh? So u wouldn't take 10-6 right now luck or otherwise? I don't care if it was luck or not 10 wins is more then we have had the last 2 years combined.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3392

      Lovie came here, got front office control and proceeded to ruin our cap space

      We have the 6th highest amount of cap space in the league. Next year we have $48 million to work with (4th highest), and in 2017, we have $101 million (highest amount of room). Whatever faults the current GM/HC have, it's not "ruining our cap space."

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    • c.greene55

      Participant
      Post count: 41

      Correction: your "truth." It's pure speculation. Let the team build. I don't think you all understand how depleted the roster was before last year. It seems every resource was used to prop up Freeman as the face of the franchise. When that flamed out the Bucs had next to nothing.Pushing for another hard restart at HC will only serve to ruin what's been building. Useless speculation is a distraction. Face the facts: Lovie got outwitted by Whisenhunt. He has his shortcomings, but he is a vast improvement from Schiano and Co.

      Qutie frankly this is BS. Lovie came here, got front office control and proceeded to ruin our cap space with players he wanted in FA, then drafted the QB of the future, this roster is Lovie's now. Schiano was 11-21, he had his shortcomings but I haven't seen a single thing from Lovie Smith that makes me think he's even nearly as good of a coach as Schiano was. And I'm not advocating for Schiano to come back, far from it.

      1. Cap space is fine.2. The real mistakes that Lovie made was in absolutely cleaning house along the O-line (trading Zuttah and releasing Penn). Which resulted in the problems we see today.3. Drafting Sims in the 3rd (further compounding issues along the O-line. OG should've been the pick.Schiano had his troops playing BALL. Every week you could see that they were putting their all into the game, but the locker room was in shambles. Whether he created or inherited that situation is irrelevant; he completely mishandled it.Lovie must be schematically better than yesterday and we saw the dividends on D late last year. Let it play out.

      He's 2-15. We could turn it around certainly, I'm not saying we can't. But this idea that Lovie has shown even a slightest bit of competence when he's coached a terrible D (that is supposed to be his speciality) and coached a bottom 1/3rd offense in the league. Schiano's locker room was in shambles, certainly, but the team always was trying, and even though Schiano struggled to adjust from his game plan, he at least came up with game plans to keep us competitive. We lost to a 2-14 team that changed very little in the offseason, they just drafted a QB we could've had and had the game won with 6:00 left in the 1st quarter. That kind of stuff never happened with any regularity under Schiano, it's happened 3 times in Lovie's 17 games.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 8983

      F$ck capspace. Win some games.Idc if you spend nothing, or everything. Do that.The capspace talk is just bonus material to drop on lovie. Lovie is a dinosaur, and not even a good one. Thats the "truth" here.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 3392

      F$ck capspace. Win some games.Idc if you spend nothing, or everything. Do that.The capspace talk is just bonus material to drop on lovie. Lovie is a dinosaur, and not even a good one. Thats the "truth" here.

      It's not "bonus material" if it's factually incorrect.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 1784

      Maybe but were stuck with Lovie right now. It’s a Bucs life.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 407

      Too many people that don't understand the game of football had their pitchfork out. They forced the Glazers to fire Schiano. I would have given Schiano one more year without being pressured to start that piece of trash QB Freeman and without all the distractions. Freeman was the real cancer of the team during the Schiano years.

      And he was such a great HC someone else picked him up right?

      He never showed greatness but he also never had a fair shot. He was pressured to have a QB that doesn't belong in the NFL as the face of the franchise. When the face of your franchise is supposed to be Freeman you had no chance since the start. I though Schiano showed a few positives Doug Martin had a monster season and he drafted Lavontae David. The defense was decent. The problem was the offense (Freeman). I'll say it again, your offense has no shot if Freeman is your franchise QB. Hell, imagine if Chip Kelly would have accepted the Bucs offer. He would have ended up fired too.

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    • Anonymous

      Inactive
      Post count: 7

      He's 2-15. We could turn it around certainly, I'm not saying we can't. But this idea that Lovie has shown even a slightest bit of competence when he's coached a terrible D (that is supposed to be his speciality) and coached a bottom 1/3rd offense in the league. Schiano's locker room was in shambles, certainly, but the team always was trying, and even though Schiano struggled to adjust from his game plan, he at least came up with game plans to keep us competitive. We lost to a 2-14 team that changed very little in the offseason, they just drafted a QB we could've had and had the game won with 6:00 left in the 1st quarter. That kind of stuff never happened with any regularity under Schiano, it's happened 3 times in Lovie's 17 games.... but the defence has been competent. How many times did the offence put the defence in a precarious position last year? ... and again this season. Not saying they played competently yesterday, but they have played well in the past. The results should not be the only thing taken into consideration. Results-bias will have you canning the HC after every season.Anybody even implying the firing of Lovie needs to take a seat. Let the season play out.

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