Even in game where fans get on to the offense they end up scoring 26+ points. Hopefully our defense can keep Washington under 30.
great points and certainly agree
Establishing the run cannot mean run every play of the first couple drives or even run every first down because the Bucs are often CORRECTLY passing to open up the run. This is the somewhat comical flaw in the JC's argument. It is the possibility of both types of plays that really opens up both. That is why staying on track down and distance matters. More important than running on fist down is getting 5-6 yards or more because that sets up a 2nd down and even a 3rd, if needed, that could be either run or pass. And that really mater on a 3rd down because 3rd and 2 the opposing d-line is not pinning its ears back like i would on 3rd and 12 when the O-line had a false start on an earlier down.
I used "when the O-line had a false start on an earlier down" part because maybe the one place I would deviate a bit from your take (if I am reading it correctly) would be to say it not just final points scored because the way the game plays out does matter and impacts that. The TIMING of the scoring also matters because the offense starting fast keeps the offense and the running game on the field MORE which DEFENDS against the Washington offense.
Any team, not just with the Bucs and Bowles, given the choice wants an offense that scores early to allow you to play with the lead. You want that even over the offense that is capable of eventually scoring 36 points in a 36-37 loss . . . . that ended when the offense threw an INT late in the 4th trying to get into field goal range. Any team, but ESPECIALLY WITH THE BUCS DEFENSE because playing with the lead gives you so much more margin for error.
If you look at some of the Bucs losses the offense is not only starting slow (relative to its own performance) but its coming just short on a turnover or something that it cannot overcome because there is no more time and every thing has to be perfect, not just good. In the Sainst game, Mayfield had to improvise and throw a dime for a TD and then improvise again to lateral a ball to Irving for a TD.
First loss to Flacons is an absolute destruction of Bowles' defense, but the Bucs are still in it until they go BACKWARDS on offense etc etc.
Anyway, it matters that the offense come out string and score more than that they come out an run. They want to be running a lot in the second half. They want Emmit Smith to come in . . er. . .. I mean Tucker . . to run during a 4 minute offense
As Grant White, with SportsGrid, put it during his article Ranking All 6 NFC Offenses for the Weekend.
”No team’s success depends more heavily on their offense than the Bucs.”
As Grant White, with SportsGrid, put it during his article Ranking All 6 NFC Offenses for the Weekend.
”No team’s success depends more heavily on their offense than the Bucs.”
yes agree for sure because the Bucs offense is part offense and part defense, especially when the Bucs defense is playing a much improved MOBILE QB who throws to a very experienced TE and a great WR.
Add in a weak run defense for Washington and this is really a battle for time of possession
media calls for Bowles to be fired for Coen.
If his defense gives us 34 points, like in your scenario, it will be justified. You and one other moron will be the only ninnies saying otherwise.
I don't agree with everything Bowles does on defense but the problems are generally due to personnel. The edge rushers don't win and the DBs just aren't good enough. Whenever something goes wrong with a drive on offense the problem can almost always have been prevented by handing the ball to Irving or Tucker.
If the defense gives up 34 to the Eagles it's because their offensive personnel is that much better than our defensive personnel. You can combat that with running the ball, which is our greatest strength.
@bucsbits - true. And the fact that most of the success for this team this season is due to the offense’s performance week in and week out.
It's true the team depends on the offense, but perhaps the underrated part of it is Baker Mayfield creating and making something out of nothing on 3rd and 4th down and sustaining drives when by all rights we should have been punting.
@catherder - absolutely. You have to have players that are going to make a play when there’s nothing there. But you don’t rack up the points and yards without a schemes up offense like we have.
True, but I don't think Coen would be quite as successful in a new job without a top ten QB and an O-line like he has here. He has to keep that in mind that if he goes to a struggling franchise all that creativity won't turn bad players into good ones. At the end of the day the buck stops with the head coach, and there's no guarantee that the players the GM provides you with will work out no matter how good your schemes are. A lot of times the coach can't overcome talent deficiencies.@catherder - absolutely. You have to have players that are going to make a play when there’s nothing there. But you don’t rack up the points and yards without a schemes up offense like we have.
@bucsbits - true. And the fact that most of the success for this team this season is due to the offense’s performance week in and week out.
Yes i dont think that anyone would disagree with that and for me the difference is the run game because of the impact it has on the overall offense
Anyway, my instinct would be to heavily credit Coen and I do because our PPG year over year is +8
But, when you actually look its is also partially a league-wide trend. The top teams are all up. Detroit +6. Buffalo +5. Baltimore +4. Washington +9. Cincinnati +6
Even in our division, expect for the Aints . .Panthers +6. Saints -4. Falcons +4
Still pretty awesome by Coen
Bowles has the Bucs defense at +3 pts allowed more than last year in a league that seems to be at least that much UP, but the actual schedule is up only +1.5 average. So the Bucs 2024 defense is NET 1.5 worse than last year, which is saying something given the revolving DBs.
This is why I have said Coen may actually stay. We are in the playoffs with 10 wins in a year with historic injuries on both sides. Imagine he gets Godwin back next year and they restock the defense, maybe Crosby opposite Diaby etc etc. Football-wise his chances ata. Super Bowl have to be best right here. Now imagine that all along Licht has said to him . . . "we restock the D in 2025 (now that we have handled most of the debt issues) and you will be the HC in 2026!"
ahhhh . . . one can dream!
He has to keep that in mind that if he goes to a struggling franchise all that creativity won't turn bad players into good ones.
he has suggested as much and thats obviously been the thought process of Ben Johnson
In his 2025 offense Coen would have a HOF left tackle (on a line that has a very promising 1st rounder and 2 very good 2nd rounders), a HOF WR, a top 5 QB, the best rookie RB and one of the best in the league overall and 3 promising TEs . . and with Godwin back he would have a WR duo that has won a Super Bowl with McMillan coming on strong as the third.
And a defense that THIS YEAR is almost on par with the SB defense (scoring), meaning it doesnt take much more
Compare that situation to the Raiders or one of the other teams he is connected with.
@ehinote Grant should watch the effort of our D in the second half of the past 5 games. Tampa has given up 9 points total in those 5 games. The defense is ready for the playoffs.
there you go again . . lmao
Whenever something goes wrong with a drive on offense the problem can almost always have been prevented by handing the ball to Irving or Tucker.
Look, instead of me just talk to Josh Q
"Headed into Week 18, Liam Coen has been a fairly conservative first-down play caller. On first down in neutral situations outside of the two-minute warnings Coen has called a run 54% of the time, which ranks 14th in the NFL. In the first half against the Saints that number ballooned to…50%. He called a run on four of eight first downs.
On second down, Coen called just three runs. But Tampa Bay was only in second-and-8-or-less three times in the first half. They were in second-and-10-or-more five times. That doesn’t lend itself to a lot of run calls."
"even the best play-callers are going to struggle when having to contend with dropped passes and penalties. And that’s exactly what Liam Coen had to deal with during the first half on Sunday. A second-and-10 dropped pass put the Bucs behind the eight ball and eventually stalled the first drive. A timing issue between quarterback and receiver stopped the offense from going more than three plays on the second drive.
@mouserat - I hope. But that’s the one area the national pundits are worried about for the Bucs. And they are right. We haven’t faced powerhouse offenses over the last 5 weeks. We likely only win this if we score 30+ points on Sunday night.
@mouserat - I hope. But that’s the one area the national pundits are worried about for the Bucs. And they are right. We haven’t faced powerhouse offenses over the last 5 weeks. We likely only win this if we score 30+ points on Sunday night.
yeah but that's been true throughout our recent 5 year run
We need to score 30 points and we have a 90% chance to win
Drop that to 24 and we are looking at a coin flip, to slight disadvantage
Fully expect Washington to put up 24-27 points on Sunday night. It will be a matter if we are buzzing on offense which we should be....their run defense is awful.
I think the Bucs key to this game is to score by being multiple - and could win big.
…and we do pass to set up the run.
