i get called a Bowles bro much like I was called a baker bro because I live in reality
Many of the takes here are some distance from reality because they are sort of venting more than meaningful takes.
Bowles was a dead man walking in 2022, 2023 and 2024 . . all for slightly different reasons lol.
2022 team was a "SB contender" team that Bowles held back . . .except it was not, as we all know now.
2023 Bowles was incompetent as the team slumped . . .except he was not. The team won in the playoffs.
2024 he was dead unless he went far in the playoffs and then dead because of Coen . . except he was not.
Baker only beat Trask because of experience . . except that was not true, not even close.
Baker was going to get grossly overpaid by the team sinking chances of keeping other key players. . . except he was not and we kept all the players
Baker was also doomed when Canales left. . . except he improved . . consistently inconsistent
The issue is that success is relative... Winning the easiest division to win has given Bowles an inside track to keep his job. If you take out the division championships and focus on his record... We're talking about a 500 team that has largely been carried by the parts of the game he abstains from.
All the ways we struggle are in alignment with Bowles' shortcomings:
- lack of aggressiveness of critical 4th downs.
- struggling to win close games late (see Coen's comment about Rams and didn't mention the Bucs).
- struggling with time/clock managment; top 3 worst in the league for someone in his 7th year as a head coach.
- poor defensive scheme, especially poor when it matters most in close games late. He allowed 6 game winning drives with a tie game or the lead.
- poor scheme/evaluation of talent to match the scheme (or talent)... Ie - he doesn't have a defensive identity and he hasn't put players in a position to succeed.
All of that amounts to winning with mediocrity.
And that's why we couldn't let him go and that was always my fear.
Imo Coen departing will prove to be a lose/lose murder suicide by Jax.
The issue is that success is relative... Winning the easiest division to win . . . WHILE THE TEAM IS UNDERGOING AN INTENTIONAL CLEAR OF DEAD CAP . .. has given Bowles an inside track to keep his job
So I agree with this (IN BOLD) for sure.
Success is relative, but in my view you leave out the main relative point (in all caps above)
That is the reality that most here seem to ignore. Licht all but said as much after the FIRST ROUND loss this season that many here said would kill Bowles.
It did not. Why?
Because he's done really well versus their LOW talent-based expectations on defense AND he's not "incompetent," especially as a defensive play caller.
I dont understand the resistance to that reality other than just normal impatience, but reality it is.
Division History
2019 - Saints dominated, no other team with a winning record - Bucs at 7-9.
2018 - Saints dominated, no other team with a winning record - Bucs at 5-11.
2017 - 3 teams in the playoffs from this division, Bucs 5-11
2016 - Falcons win at 11-5, Bucs fall short at 9-7
2015 - Carolina dominated, no other team with a winning record. Bucs at 6-10
2014 - Carolina won it with a losing record. Bucs at 2-14
2013 - Carolina and Saints made playoffs, Bucs at 4-12
2012 - Atlanta wins it, no other team with a winning record. Bucs at 7-9
2011 - Saints and Falcons in playoffs, Bucs at 4-12.
2010 - Falcons and Saints in playoffs, Bucs fall just short at 10-6.
2009 - Saints dominate, Buc at 3-13
so this right here is why Bowles Bucs performance post Brady is impressive. The 11 seasons between Gruden firing of mired in mediocrity and Brady coming to Tampa
the division was worth a damn maybe 4 out of the 11 seasons. Bucs managed to make the playoffs ZERO times and get to a winning record just 2 out of 11 seasons.
Now let's look at the last 6 seasons - the division was worth a damn just 1 out of 6 seasons and the Bucs had a winning record just 1 time.
If you compare Bowles Bucs to Arians Bucs...then yes....a huge failure - Bucs won a Superbowl and had a franchise best 13 wins.
i was ready to see Bowles head on a spike after the 2022 season and Bradys only losing season. Bucs the Bucs going 9-8 and 10-7 in the years without Brady, making the playoffs both times, and even winning a playoff game - yeah...the dude has earned some goodwill with ownership keeping the Bucs relevant.
The expectations from ownership were not comparing to Brady led Bucs but rather the lost decade preceding that.
The issue is that success is relative... Winning the easiest division to win . . . WHILE THE TEAM IS UNDERGOING AN INTENTIONAL CLEAR OF DEAD CAP . .. has given Bowles an inside track to keep his job
So I agree with this (IN BOLD) for sure.
Success is relative, but in my view you leave out the main relative point (in all caps above)
That is the reality that most here seem to ignore. Licht all but said as much after the FIRST ROUND loss this season that many here said would kill Bowles.
It did not. Why?
Because he's done really well versus their LOW talent-based expectations on defense AND he's not "incompetent," especially as a defensive play caller.
I dont understand the resistance to that reality other than just normal impatience, but reality it is.
That can certainly be true but it doesn't change his shortcomings. In some ways in exacerbates them
For example:
Ok we have an under-talented defense riffe with poorly drafted defensive players especially on the edge. So are defense that is tough to rely on, especially late in games because our pass rush is weak and we have to play soft zone. Ok let's assume all of that is true and no other coordinator in the league could do better.
Then why isn't he going for it on 4th down? Why kick a FG to tie the game with 2 minutes left if the defense can't do it? Why not go for 2 against KC? There is an incongruency there.
It also doesn't explain his abysmal clock managment.
The offense is carrying its weight with the same dead cap but the defense is not. Yes there might be a talent gap but Coen had us competitive with Godwin AND Evans out in multiple games where the defense down the stretch gave up the winning score AFTER Bowles went conservative (KC and SF specifically).
We're forgetting we had no money the last 2 years and had to pay the piper. We can actually hvae money now. Bowles was a transition HC who kept this team in the playoffs, not many guys can do that. He also has handpicked 2 head coach OC, I trust that hes able to make a 3rd pick again
We're forgetting we had no money the last 2 years and had to pay the piper. We can actually hvae money now. Bowles was a transition HC who kept this team in the playoffs, not many guys can do that. He also has handpicked 2 head coach OC, I trust that hes able to make a 3rd pick again
Why does a salary cap handcuff excuse Bowles clock managment and lalc of aggression?
Why does he want to rely on the defense when the offense has carried?
We're forgetting we had no money the last 2 years and had to pay the piper. We can actually hvae money now.
This keeps being tossed about on this board, but I remember the team giving out $400+ million in contracts last offseason to Wirfs, Mayfield, Evans, Winfield, David, Whitehead, etc.. They had money to give out, they just chose to stay mostly within the organization.
There is an incongruency there.
I dont think there is.
I think that most fans see the head coach ONLY through their own lens of "bad" or "good" and that manifests itself in all kinds of ever-evolving critiques .
For example, lots of people were claiming Bowles needed to adjust . . while he was adjusting. He needs to play more man . . . when we manned up against most good receivers. His defense was the reason we lost in the playoffs (not the fumbles etc). . . even though it performed better against the Comms (scoring) than several other defenses (ie it bent but did not break). And the Commanders were good, better than most thought.
And not going for it on 4th (JQ said he was the 12th most aggressive HC this year, way up form before) is sort of a thing that every fan says, ESPECIALLY those who think that ESPN analytics are FACTS, those fans not realizing that even ESPN analytics says they are skewed aggressive relative to NFL HCs.
Point: if your Bowles meter points at "bad" then everything is bad. Piling on IS THE NORM. Like a race to come up with the next flaw. Like last year, the running game struggled because Mayfield was sending guys the wrong way lol
Not suggesting Bowles is great or immune from criticism, just suggesting that it is a FACT -- even to this day - that there is resistance amongst Bowles outspoken critics to pointing at the lack of defensive talent in the backfield, injuries etc.. .. . even when Licht himself has said it.
. He needs to play more man . . .
Yes he does. Jam at the line, not soft man coverage when our backups are in because Dean is made of glass.
Why does he want to rely on the defense when the offense has carried?
kicking a field goal in that playoff scenario is not "relying on the defense"
. He needs to play more man . . .
Yes he does. Jam at the line, not soft man coverage when our backups are in because Dean is made of glass.
so, this is a great example.
In the playoff game, so back and look and count yourself how many times we are at the line against McLaurin. And it worked, both Dean and McCollum had big man v man stops on McLaurin . . but then Dean gets hurt and McLaurin scored because now its Josh Hayes covering him STILL IN MAN
iNjURiEs dOnT MA tTer
late in the game , Bowles even tried to HIDE Hayes by moving him over to the other side . ..
We're forgetting we had no money the last 2 years and had to pay the piper. We can actually hvae money now. Bowles was a transition HC who kept this team in the playoffs, not many guys can do that. He also has handpicked 2 head coach OC, I trust that hes able to make a 3rd pick again
Why does a salary cap handcuff excuse Bowles clock managment and lalc of aggression?
Why does he want to rely on the defense when the offense has carried?
There will be those that will make excuses for the poor HC’ing decisions nonstop.
Wirfs, Mayfield, Evans, Winfield, David, Whitehead,
Whitehead is, I think the only outside player to get a multiyear contract . . . they are BARGAIN shopping.
If they are actively engaged in FA then we dont have the Britt/SVD platoon right from the start. We also do what the Lions when a key player was injured, we trade for replacement
The team is/was CAP-CONSTRAINED rebuildiing for a few years . . good grief
Licht even suggested as much in praising Bowles
