I think that's a little dramatic. I think the team has good players just needs to build off of it. And injuries happen to all teams it's just what you have after that and we never seem to have great players after 1. That's most of the league too tho and it's no different here but to have that is a difference maker to getting beyond 1st 2nd round of playoffs.
I'm not sold on Bowles. However I think he should get the end of the year to see if he can turn it around. He's experienced and there's not much anything to gain from firing him now. We also have a schedule ease up soon where if we are in a little better health and maybe a trade wouldn't be a bad idea for right match and not giving away too much to continue to build this team in the future is ideal to me.
@bucballa85 - I agree Bowles should finish the season. And we have some good young talent. But we have and will have more holes at important positions. David has made a major difference on this defense over the years. Edge, LB, and Corner as a whole, are in as bad of a situation as any team in the league. Injuries haven’t been a major issue for our defense this year. If we go into next year with Bowles and this defense, minus David, we will be a joke.
well that's just it...Mike Tomlin is a hall of fame head coach - easily top 5 in todays NFL
Mike Tomlin was NOT going to leave the Steelers in Match of 2022 to coach Brady for a year lol
Kidding aside, if you look back at the timeframe Bowles is all over the HC candidate lists so OF COURSE he's our head coach as soon as Arian bails out
I doubt there was even another candidate because of the timing. Most head coaches are hired in January or early February
2022 was a free pass for Bowles (for all but the Red Board smart set)
2023 the team over performed
2024 the team MAY be underperforming but big * because of injuries and circumstances.
we will all know soon enough
David has made a major difference on this defense over the years.
definitely
for years he basically locked down short passing
not anymore
I agree with the fact that they chose to ride it out…I’m just not sure that Todd Bowles is part of the “they”. I think acquisition of talent falls on Jason Licht. As much as we have lauded him for the things he was able to accomplish, I’m not sure what he’s saving/rolling over that cap space, for?Everybody has the same budget in the NFL regardless of market size. We have cap room for depth players. I'm not saying the Bucs should or can abandon the overall plan. It's a good plan. I get it. But they are 17th in the league in cap space at $9+ mil. They had cap room to sign a couple minor depth players. When you see there is a need crops up because of injuries or underperformance, do you do something or just ride it out with the guys you have? Well, they chose to just ride it out, and it probably cost us a chance to get in the playoffs. After the Atlanta game we're on the outside looking in, and at this point I wouldn't recommend spending any energy trying to do something at the trade deadline.
Let’s don’t get it twisted. I’m only advocating for assigning the blame where it’s due. We don’t know if Bowles lobbied for trades/signing FA’s… we can only hold Bowles accountable for the players we have and their availability. In my experience, changing coaches to this organization historically (with few exceptions) means losses. It means the talent you have assembled, at least on one side of the ball, may not transfer under a new HC/DC. That means rebuild, that closes the window.
And PS, large market teams do have a competitive advantage from a standpoint of the type of marketing is available to players. A tax advantage gives us some leverage, but the non-contract incentives for star players is still a pretty big draw. It’s also a reason small commercial/TV markets don’t get balanced coverage.
It does appear that we are rolling with what we have - which is frustrating. I really thought we would have signed an edge by now…or competent CB/ILb…but I think that may get back to a point someone else made about over-valuing current rostered players.
I also don’t want to underplay the impact of massive injuries that began in the pre-season, but really hurt us in a big way in the first game, and then rippled throughout this season. We have gotten some of our stars back on offense & defense, but now the offense has been hammered with the loss of heart of the team, losing Mike & Chris has been loss of not just elite physical talent, but also a huge psychological loss to the team.
I’m not giving up, I think we can still compete despite these injury losses, and hopefully those we expected to take the next step (Yaya & Calijah, especially), will begin to do so. I’m not sure about Braswell - he flashes, but still too early. JTS is just disappointing in the way you knew he would likely not show, but you were hoping he could turn it up, but just isn’t.
In short, I’m not thinking it’s coaching, im thinking that who we have can’t do what Bowles requires on defense, and what we’re left is playing vanilla defense and doing it like back-uos who are filling in.
The offense is playing well enough to win - even with young receivers (thankfully a guy like JMac dropped to us this season, and some due diligence was done on Shepard and Rak Jarrett) to allow the passing game to keep the pressure off the run game - but the defense just can’t seem to dial up stops until the 3rd or 4th quarter.
I said at the beginning of the I felt we’d finish 9-8, with a stretch of 10-7 - I’m still comfortable with that assessment (but I readily admit the blanket is starting to feel itchy, and maybe not long enough)…
Of course we don't know what's going on behind closed doors between Bowles and Licht, and we'll never know about any disagreements that may have arisen. We do know how Licht operates in general, and he isn't a "My way or the highway" type of guy.
well that's just it...Mike Tomlin is a hall of fame head coach - easily top 5 in todays NFL
Mike Tomlin was NOT going to leave the Steelers in Match of 2022 to coach Brady for a year lol
Kidding aside, if you look back at the timeframe Bowles is all over the HC candidate lists so OF COURSE he's our head coach as soon as Arian bails out
I doubt there was even another candidate because of the timing. Most head coaches are hired in January or early February
2022 was a free pass for Bowles (for all but the Red Board smart set)
2023 the team over performed
2024 the team MAY be underperforming but big * because of injuries and circumstances.
we will all know soon enough
2024 is a mixed bag. We have solid wins in surprisingly Washington, Detroit, and Philadelphia. We laid an egg to apparently good team in Denver. The underperformance comes into getting swept by the Falcons.
We will be 4-6 in a couple weeks and hopefully get Evans back after the bye week. How the Bucs do during the winnable stretch will be key.
@bucsbits - oh do I have a confirmed story about Bowles and a Head Coaching opportunity that didn’t work out right before Arians stepped down… but I’ll save that for another day.
It is hardly a novel concept for the DC of the Super Bowl winning team to be a HC candidate across the league. Leftwich was reportedly offered a HC job because he was the OC of a Super Bowl winning team.
@bucsbits - of course. But there’s more that goes with this one and it’s pretty telling for why things happened the way they did. Maybe something for this coming offseason.
@bucsbits - of course. But there’s more that goes with this one and it’s pretty telling for why things happened the way they did. Maybe something for this coming offseason.
apologies I was just adding a general comment not responding directly to your comment. I look forward to the story!
If I had a position on Bowles before last season, it was somewhere between good DC/but suspect HC.Sorry, been a Bucs fan a long time. I don’t agree with firing a coach who has been plagued by injuries - and hasn’t had the cap space to build both sides of the ball. That Super Bowl defense was stocked full, he hasn’t had that since. He could not back-fill JPP & Shaq, or upgrade/replace the DB’s.
We’re just now getting our cap space cleared. He & Licht took a chance on this season knowing we were thin at Edge, Corner & ILB. That is on them.
We’re angry because we had a lot of potential through 6 games, but until the Ravens game, we’d had the worst attrition on defense, that’s where we are now. It’s not so much the scheme, it’s the lack of available talent on game day.
Some of that is on Licht, mid-season trades are still an option.
Hey, White Tiger. Good post.
I don't want him fired for those reasons. I want him fired for the number of head scratchers he seems to do on regular basis. That defensive performance against the Chiefs in the Super Bowl is really the lone game I can recall that he actually called a good game and the prep work heading into that game was spot on. The rest of his tenure here has been suspect in my opinion.
You are right, this team has a ton of injuries in key positions but that is just window-dressing to me for an already suspect coach. It's easy to point to those guys seeing the field right now that shouldn't, but that talent on the field didn't call a fake punt when the Falcons were more than prepared for it and the field position they were at. That talent on the field didn't leave Godwin in during mop up time and inevitably led to him getting hurt when his night should have been over against the Ravens. That talent on the field didn't leave Evans in after he was already hobbled when he should have been pulled immediately after scoring the initial touchdown against the Ravens. Those are just the most recent examples of poor decisions by a head coach. I could probably find twenty more since he was brought to Tampa.
I have never liked him at any position or level. Felt like he was always overvalued, but I agree, he isn't going to be fired any time soon and us armchair guys (like me) will continue to call for his job on message boards.
Outside of the problem with NOT calling a timeout against Detroit in last seasons playoff game, I thought he did a great job with that incredible Suoer Bowl defense, and how he identified/lobbied for Mayfield when we had no QB, and the way he motivated the team last season. I’m sure it wasn’t all him, but he’s able to attract OC’s like Canales and Coen, and until recently, defensive players rave about playing for him and in this system.
It may just be me, but I’ve always felt that there should be room for growth for a HC - more than one season. I know I’m in the minority, but I get the sense this organization is building something here, and they’re giving Bowles some room, and some support with one of largest staff’s in the NFL.
We all know we’re dealing with the worst injury spat in many years and it’s definitely cost us some games - and confidence. I’m not arguing against those that feel otherwise, I’ve just been down the road of firing a coach to fix the problems - except in my experience that historically translates into a LOT of losing.
I get the frustration, I just also know this organization has a long history of failure in picking replacement HC’s. It’s why I have the take that it’s not over yet. I think Bowles has earned a chance to see how it goes. I’m sure the organization will deal with what needs to happen if we underperform.
Very frustrated with the total LACK of participation in mid-season trades…but I don’t think that is squarely on Bowles.
When did you find out that Bowles was lobbying for Mayfield…during that season, or after?Of course we don't know what's going on behind closed doors between Bowles and Licht, and we'll never know about any disagreements that may have arisen. We do know how Licht operates in general, and he isn't a "My way or the highway" type of guy.
Point being, Bowles doesn’t air dirty laundry, Licht doesn’t either.
@white-tiger - Great post. And well articulated. I feel your concern. I would give Bowles time if it was about his growth as a head coach. But for me it’s about his defense’s decline. He is a one trick pony and the NFL is figuring that out. Good DCs make a huge difference with slowing down offenses despite their personnel. Our defensive injuries have not been major. Not one day-1 starter od the front 7 were out on Sunday. We were missing a starting corner and our nickel. Bowles runs our defense and it is 28th in the NFL. That is why I hope for a change in the offseason.
Agree, to a point. You sound like you think the talent isn’t where it needs to be - if so - that’s where we agree. In my estimation, it’s Licht that’s responsible for bringing-in/trading for talent. He either can’t, or won’t. Bowles seems to have a list of guys, when we’re without…ala Baker…so…@white-tiger - Great post. And well articulated. I feel your concern. I would give Bowles time if it was about his growth as a head coach. But for me it’s about his defense’s decline. He is a one trick pony and the NFL is figuring that out. Good DCs make a huge difference with slowing down offenses despite their personnel. Our defensive injuries have not been major. Not one day-1 starter od the front 7 were out on Sunday. We were missing a starting corner and our nickel. Bowles runs our defense and it is 28th in the NFL. That is why I hope for a change in the offseason.
