i could say yes or no, and it wouldn't have any barring on the subject.Theory fighting proves nothing in regards to the statement made that Rookie QB's means starting over. Which was exposed for a dumb comment. question could be would Andy Dalton be succesful without Green. Which I'm not interested in discussing, for one reason only, I don't care.
c'mon. if you arent willing to accept there are different situations...or you arent willing to accept that different players have different abilities...then why bring it up?rookie QB's succeed because of a few reasons. 1 - they are amazing. 2 - their offense is already amazing. 3 - their defense is amazing. 4 - their team is amazing.
Not at all, I agree with you in regards to different situations, and I also agree with you in regards to different abilities, but that's not what we're talking about. Someone made a statement, which has no merit. Disproving it was effortless, yet we're discussing it as if it has any merit. "Rookie QB's means starting over" Wrong. If you want to discuss your topic at hand then that's a different story, but it's not the same thing that was mentioned.
Simply put, we could do better.
LOL at all of you that think Manziel or Mariota will put us back to our winning ways again. Rookie QB and we're starting over again. I think everyone would be well served to remember that.
What's funny is how you would make such a moronic comment, when just a year earlier 3 rookie QB's took their teams to the play offs.
Hilarious. You think this crop of QBs is as good as Luck, pre-injury RGIII or Russell Wilson. Even funnier? You called my comment moronic. Pot. Kettle. Black.
It amazes me the stupidity that's on these boards. If you're really trying to use a fallacy to save face, stop. It's pathetic.
Stupidity? You suggested that rookie QBs could take their teams to the playoffs and then used RGIII, Wilson and Luck as examples, while failing to identify that these examples were clearly outliers from a superior draft class. How is it stupid to suggest that the '14 draft class isn't as stocked as the '12 in the franchise QB department? Please explain, because you sure as hell didn't in your response. Probably because you can't.
It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego.
So what "factual" evidence are you talking about?
Manziel and Mariota have yet to play a snap in the NFL.
No Sh!t moron, try keeping up, next time you make a ridiculous comment.
Regardless of what RGIII, Luck, and Wilson did in 2012, won't change that 'fact".
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. "
Therefore, I am free to state an opinion that I think these guys will be garbage in the NFL.
Absolutely, it's a shame you were to moronic to do so, or we wouldn't be having a conversation over your idiotic statement, which clearly you are backing out of with, I meant my opinion, pff. Just pathetic...
So, you instead try to give us a history lesson and use the '12 draft class as an example.
History lesson, making you look foolish, it's all the same. Call it what you will, it doesn't change anything. Just further confirms the facts.
Got it. I suppose it's a "fact" that people can be struck by lightening. It's a "fact" that people can win the lottery. It's a "fact" someone can date Kate Upton. What you fail to comprehend are the chances of those "facts" happening. Could it happen?
It's also a fact that you're a simpleton, and it's also a fact that you just don't get it. Moreover, it's also a fact that rather than own up to it, and accept being wrong, all of a sudden it's your opinion. Convenient.
Absolutely. Could it happen to the Bucs? Doubt it. Again, I'm going to use the word "outlier". You should look it up and figure out what it means.
A bit pompous of you to surmise, rather I know or don't know the meaning of a word.
The "fact" remains, that you use a handful of outliers to make your case that a rookie QB (I used Manziel and Mariota in my original post) could take this team to the playoffs.
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. " "Comprehension??? When I have to post the same paragraphs three times, it's counter productive, yet here we are covering the same thing over and over. You just don't get it.
Seeing that NONE of the rookies QBs in this class have the talent of Luck/RGIII/Wilson, I'm saying that it's not going to happen.
Another ridiculous claim... Proof?
Please explain:A) Why I would have to "save face" for what many (maybe not on this board but rational adults) would consider common senseB) Why you think that Manziel/Mariota...etc. are better than Luck/RGIII/WilsonC) Why you think that the opinion of Manziel/Mariota not having the talent to take this team to the playoffs next season is "moronic" :-* :-* :-*
Well at least you know your ABC's so it's not a total waste of time.
Nice presentation. Perhaps you could build an entire PowerPoint brief next time in which you don't answer my questions or acknowledge the "fact" that history is against us riding a rookie QB to the playoffs next season. Hang your hat on the 2012 draft class if you like. Hope you know how to swim.
i could say yes or no, and it wouldn't have any barring on the subject.Theory fighting proves nothing in regards to the statement made that Rookie QB's means starting over. Which was exposed for a dumb comment. question could be would Andy Dalton be succesful without Green. Which I'm not interested in discussing, for one reason only, I don't care.
c'mon. if you arent willing to accept there are different situations...or you arent willing to accept that different players have different abilities...then why bring it up?rookie QB's succeed because of a few reasons. 1 - they are amazing. 2 - their offense is already amazing. 3 - their defense is amazing. 4 - their team is amazing.
Not at all, I agree with you in regards to different situations, and I also agree with you in regards to different abilities, but that's not what we're talking about. Someone made a statement, which has no merit. Disproving it was effortless, yet we're discussing it as if it has any merit. "Rookie QB's means starting over" Wrong. If you want to discuss your topic at hand then that's a different story, but it's not the same thing that was mentioned.
Simply put, we could do better.
LOL at all of you that think Manziel or Mariota will put us back to our winning ways again. Rookie QB and we're starting over again. I think everyone would be well served to remember that.
What's funny is how you would make such a moronic comment, when just a year earlier 3 rookie QB's took their teams to the play offs.
Hilarious. You think this crop of QBs is as good as Luck, pre-injury RGIII or Russell Wilson. Even funnier? You called my comment moronic. Pot. Kettle. Black.
It amazes me the stupidity that's on these boards. If you're really trying to use a fallacy to save face, stop. It's pathetic.
Stupidity? You suggested that rookie QBs could take their teams to the playoffs and then used RGIII, Wilson and Luck as examples, while failing to identify that these examples were clearly outliers from a superior draft class. How is it stupid to suggest that the '14 draft class isn't as stocked as the '12 in the franchise QB department? Please explain, because you sure as hell didn't in your response. Probably because you can't.
It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego.
So what "factual" evidence are you talking about?
Manziel and Mariota have yet to play a snap in the NFL.
No Sh!t moron, try keeping up, next time you make a ridiculous comment.
Regardless of what RGIII, Luck, and Wilson did in 2012, won't change that 'fact".
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. "
Therefore, I am free to state an opinion that I think these guys will be garbage in the NFL.
Absolutely, it's a shame you were to moronic to do so, or we wouldn't be having a conversation over your idiotic statement, which clearly you are backing out of with, I meant my opinion, pff. Just pathetic...
So, you instead try to give us a history lesson and use the '12 draft class as an example.
History lesson, making you look foolish, it's all the same. Call it what you will, it doesn't change anything. Just further confirms the facts.
Got it. I suppose it's a "fact" that people can be struck by lightening. It's a "fact" that people can win the lottery. It's a "fact" someone can date Kate Upton. What you fail to comprehend are the chances of those "facts" happening. Could it happen?
It's also a fact that you're a simpleton, and it's also a fact that you just don't get it. Moreover, it's also a fact that rather than own up to it, and accept being wrong, all of a sudden it's your opinion. Convenient.
Absolutely. Could it happen to the Bucs? Doubt it. Again, I'm going to use the word "outlier". You should look it up and figure out what it means.
A bit pompous of you to surmise, rather I know or don't know the meaning of a word.
The "fact" remains, that you use a handful of outliers to make your case that a rookie QB (I used Manziel and Mariota in my original post) could take this team to the playoffs.
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. " "Comprehension??? When I have to post the same paragraphs three times, it's counter productive, yet here we are covering the same thing over and over. You just don't get it.
Seeing that NONE of the rookies QBs in this class have the talent of Luck/RGIII/Wilson, I'm saying that it's not going to happen.
Another ridiculous claim... Proof?
Please explain:A) Why I would have to "save face" for what many (maybe not on this board but rational adults) would consider common senseB) Why you think that Manziel/Mariota...etc. are better than Luck/RGIII/WilsonC) Why you think that the opinion of Manziel/Mariota not having the talent to take this team to the playoffs next season is "moronic" :-* :-* :-*
Well at least you know your ABC's so it's not a total waste of time.
Nice presentation. Perhaps you could build an entire PowerPoint brief next time in which you don't answer my questions or acknowledge the "fact" that history is against us riding a rookie QB to the playoffs next season. Hang your hat on the 2012 draft class if you like. Hope you know how to swim.
Oh, and you're absolutely right on Dalton. I'm sure his teammates and fans loved the 0 TDs and 3 picks he threw as a rookie in his first playoff game. What was I thinking? Much success!!!!!
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
yep! All we need is one of the 5 best defenses in NFL history and possibly go back 12 years in time.
This defense has one huge advantage over the 2002 unit, and that's age. The 2002 defense was already past their prime. These guys are are just getting started and they're already close to being a top ten D. Another year in the system should put them there. Schiano had a drastic effect on our pass defense this year, on our rush D last year, as well as setting franchise records on offense with Josh Freeman at QB. Jon Gruden got the team over the hump, but it was all downhill from there. He couldn't maintain what he had, and he certainly couldn't build a team. 7 years is proof of that. Schiano has at least shown he can find talented players and correct serious issues. I expect his focus will be on offense for 2014, and I expect a radical change, as in worst to top 10. Another worst to first, as with the rush D, is unreasonable, but respectable is not. This is a young team that's going to get younger, particularly on offense. The progress would have been more evident had Freeman not been here, or had at least played like sh!t from the very beginning. His hot streak last year created false hope and sabotaged both years. Any planning always hinges on the QB with the idea that they want to win to secure their job. That wasn't the case with Freeman. He was doing everything he could to get run out of town. That's a handicap that no coach can overcome. Hopefully the Glazers fully understand that, and the scope of issues Schiano has had to fix on this team. It takes time to get it right. Firing the HC every 2 or 3 years is not the answer. It only complicates matters.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
i could say yes or no, and it wouldn't have any barring on the subject.Theory fighting proves nothing in regards to the statement made that Rookie QB's means starting over. Which was exposed for a dumb comment. question could be would Andy Dalton be succesful without Green. Which I'm not interested in discussing, for one reason only, I don't care.
c'mon. if you arent willing to accept there are different situations...or you arent willing to accept that different players have different abilities...then why bring it up?rookie QB's succeed because of a few reasons. 1 - they are amazing. 2 - their offense is already amazing. 3 - their defense is amazing. 4 - their team is amazing.
Not at all, I agree with you in regards to different situations, and I also agree with you in regards to different abilities, but that's not what we're talking about. Someone made a statement, which has no merit. Disproving it was effortless, yet we're discussing it as if it has any merit. "Rookie QB's means starting over" Wrong. If you want to discuss your topic at hand then that's a different story, but it's not the same thing that was mentioned.
Simply put, we could do better.
LOL at all of you that think Manziel or Mariota will put us back to our winning ways again. Rookie QB and we're starting over again. I think everyone would be well served to remember that.
What's funny is how you would make such a moronic comment, when just a year earlier 3 rookie QB's took their teams to the play offs.
Hilarious. You think this crop of QBs is as good as Luck, pre-injury RGIII or Russell Wilson. Even funnier? You called my comment moronic. Pot. Kettle. Black.
It amazes me the stupidity that's on these boards. If you're really trying to use a fallacy to save face, stop. It's pathetic.
Stupidity? You suggested that rookie QBs could take their teams to the playoffs and then used RGIII, Wilson and Luck as examples, while failing to identify that these examples were clearly outliers from a superior draft class. How is it stupid to suggest that the '14 draft class isn't as stocked as the '12 in the franchise QB department? Please explain, because you sure as hell didn't in your response. Probably because you can't.
It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego.
So what "factual" evidence are you talking about?
Manziel and Mariota have yet to play a snap in the NFL.
No Sh!t moron, try keeping up, next time you make a ridiculous comment.
Regardless of what RGIII, Luck, and Wilson did in 2012, won't change that 'fact".
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. "
Therefore, I am free to state an opinion that I think these guys will be garbage in the NFL.
Absolutely, it's a shame you were to moronic to do so, or we wouldn't be having a conversation over your idiotic statement, which clearly you are backing out of with, I meant my opinion, pff. Just pathetic...
So, you instead try to give us a history lesson and use the '12 draft class as an example.
History lesson, making you look foolish, it's all the same. Call it what you will, it doesn't change anything. Just further confirms the facts.
Got it. I suppose it's a "fact" that people can be struck by lightening. It's a "fact" that people can win the lottery. It's a "fact" someone can date Kate Upton. What you fail to comprehend are the chances of those "facts" happening. Could it happen?
It's also a fact that you're a simpleton, and it's also a fact that you just don't get it. Moreover, it's also a fact that rather than own up to it, and accept being wrong, all of a sudden it's your opinion. Convenient.
Absolutely. Could it happen to the Bucs? Doubt it. Again, I'm going to use the word "outlier". You should look it up and figure out what it means.
A bit pompous of you to surmise, rather I know or don't know the meaning of a word.
The "fact" remains, that you use a handful of outliers to make your case that a rookie QB (I used Manziel and Mariota in my original post) could take this team to the playoffs.
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. " "Comprehension??? When I have to post the same paragraphs three times, it's counter productive, yet here we are covering the same thing over and over. You just don't get it.
Seeing that NONE of the rookies QBs in this class have the talent of Luck/RGIII/Wilson, I'm saying that it's not going to happen.
Another ridiculous claim... Proof?
Please explain:A) Why I would have to "save face" for what many (maybe not on this board but rational adults) would consider common senseB) Why you think that Manziel/Mariota...etc. are better than Luck/RGIII/WilsonC) Why you think that the opinion of Manziel/Mariota not having the talent to take this team to the playoffs next season is "moronic" :-* :-* :-*
Well at least you know your ABC's so it's not a total waste of time.
Nice presentation. Perhaps you could build an entire PowerPoint brief next time in which you don't answer my questions or acknowledge the "fact" that history is against us riding a rookie QB to the playoffs next season. Hang your hat on the 2012 draft class if you like. Hope you know how to swim.
Hypocrite.
i could say yes or no, and it wouldn't have any barring on the subject.Theory fighting proves nothing in regards to the statement made that Rookie QB's means starting over. Which was exposed for a dumb comment. question could be would Andy Dalton be succesful without Green. Which I'm not interested in discussing, for one reason only, I don't care.
c'mon. if you arent willing to accept there are different situations...or you arent willing to accept that different players have different abilities...then why bring it up?rookie QB's succeed because of a few reasons. 1 - they are amazing. 2 - their offense is already amazing. 3 - their defense is amazing. 4 - their team is amazing.
Not at all, I agree with you in regards to different situations, and I also agree with you in regards to different abilities, but that's not what we're talking about. Someone made a statement, which has no merit. Disproving it was effortless, yet we're discussing it as if it has any merit. "Rookie QB's means starting over" Wrong. If you want to discuss your topic at hand then that's a different story, but it's not the same thing that was mentioned.
Simply put, we could do better.
LOL at all of you that think Manziel or Mariota will put us back to our winning ways again. Rookie QB and we're starting over again. I think everyone would be well served to remember that.
What's funny is how you would make such a moronic comment, when just a year earlier 3 rookie QB's took their teams to the play offs.
Hilarious. You think this crop of QBs is as good as Luck, pre-injury RGIII or Russell Wilson. Even funnier? You called my comment moronic. Pot. Kettle. Black.
It amazes me the stupidity that's on these boards. If you're really trying to use a fallacy to save face, stop. It's pathetic.
Stupidity? You suggested that rookie QBs could take their teams to the playoffs and then used RGIII, Wilson and Luck as examples, while failing to identify that these examples were clearly outliers from a superior draft class. How is it stupid to suggest that the '14 draft class isn't as stocked as the '12 in the franchise QB department? Please explain, because you sure as hell didn't in your response. Probably because you can't.
It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego.
So what "factual" evidence are you talking about?
Manziel and Mariota have yet to play a snap in the NFL.
No Sh!t moron, try keeping up, next time you make a ridiculous comment.
Regardless of what RGIII, Luck, and Wilson did in 2012, won't change that 'fact".
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. "
Therefore, I am free to state an opinion that I think these guys will be garbage in the NFL.
Absolutely, it's a shame you were to moronic to do so, or we wouldn't be having a conversation over your idiotic statement, which clearly you are backing out of with, I meant my opinion, pff. Just pathetic...
So, you instead try to give us a history lesson and use the '12 draft class as an example.
History lesson, making you look foolish, it's all the same. Call it what you will, it doesn't change anything. Just further confirms the facts.
Got it. I suppose it's a "fact" that people can be struck by lightening. It's a "fact" that people can win the lottery. It's a "fact" someone can date Kate Upton. What you fail to comprehend are the chances of those "facts" happening. Could it happen?
It's also a fact that you're a simpleton, and it's also a fact that you just don't get it. Moreover, it's also a fact that rather than own up to it, and accept being wrong, all of a sudden it's your opinion. Convenient.
Absolutely. Could it happen to the Bucs? Doubt it. Again, I'm going to use the word "outlier". You should look it up and figure out what it means.
A bit pompous of you to surmise, rather I know or don't know the meaning of a word.
The "fact" remains, that you use a handful of outliers to make your case that a rookie QB (I used Manziel and Mariota in my original post) could take this team to the playoffs.
"It wasn't a suggestion, it was a fact. Suggestion means it was up for debate, discussion, and/or argument, which it's not. It doesn't matter what the draft class was, you should've had the common sense not to make such a statement. It's ridiculous that you would even try to disregard this, but you're here trying to save face, so I get it. The fact remains, three examples rather you accept or not, is factual evidence that you are wrong. You can refute, make excesses, or flat out ignore this, but it doesn't change the fact. Furthermore, you don't have to look far to get the fourth example I gave. Just a post later I mentioned Andy Dalton from the year before, a second round pick, yet it's convenient that you ignore this...What's the excuses this time? That class was also superior? How convenient... So count them, four examples. I'm being nice this time, because I believe deep down you accept this regardless of your ego. " "Comprehension??? When I have to post the same paragraphs three times, it's counter productive, yet here we are covering the same thing over and over. You just don't get it.
Seeing that NONE of the rookies QBs in this class have the talent of Luck/RGIII/Wilson, I'm saying that it's not going to happen.
Another ridiculous claim... Proof?
Please explain:A) Why I would have to "save face" for what many (maybe not on this board but rational adults) would consider common senseB) Why you think that Manziel/Mariota...etc. are better than Luck/RGIII/WilsonC) Why you think that the opinion of Manziel/Mariota not having the talent to take this team to the playoffs next season is "moronic" :-* :-* :-*
Well at least you know your ABC's so it's not a total waste of time.
Nice presentation. Perhaps you could build an entire PowerPoint brief next time in which you don't answer my questions or acknowledge the "fact" that history is against us riding a rookie QB to the playoffs next season. Hang your hat on the 2012 draft class if you like. Hope you know how to swim.
Oh, and you're absolutely right.
And that's all that matters…By the way, Happy Holidays…and you're welcome, for giving you something to do on xmas day. Although it's kind of pathetic that you would spend the morning replying to a post, we'll hope the rest of your day wasn't spent waiting for a rebuttal...
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
Why are you 2 talking about the NFL of over a decade ago like the rules haven't changed at all.Comparing back then with now is useless, if that 02 Bucs team played now they would struggle to even sniff the playoffs.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
Why are you 2 talking about the NFL of over a decade ago like the rules haven't changed at all.Comparing back then with now is useless, if that 02 Bucs team played now they would struggle to even sniff the playoffs.
What's even funnier -- and you are missing it -- is that he is talking about Tony's "offensive schemes" with the Colts being an issue. As if Tony schemed the O there. Kinda like whining about how Gruden's defensive schemes failed us after Tony left...
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
Why are you 2 talking about the NFL of over a decade ago like the rules haven't changed at all.Comparing back then with now is useless, if that 02 Bucs team played now they would struggle to even sniff the playoffs.
What's even funnier -- and you are missing it -- is that he is talking about Tony's "offensive schemes" with the Colts being an issue. As if Tony schemed the O there. Kinda like whining about how Gruden's defensive schemes failed us after Tony left...
Tony Dungy was the one common denominator between two teams that couldn't buy a TD in the playoffs. That's no coincidence. He could get his teams to the playoffs, but, with one exception, his teams always choked. The Colts didn't need Tony Dungy. They probably would have won more SBs without him. There's such a thing as being TOO calm and composed..........and that's Tony. His teams take on his personality, at least on the offensive side of the ball. I remember one game where Dungy tried to send the kicker out on the field, and Peyton sent him back, ran a play for a first down to continue the drive. Dungy is a puzzy. Lombardi would have had Bart Starr by the throat if he tried to pull a stunt like that. Same thing with most any HC you can name. Gruden would have a stroke. I will always believe Gruden would have won more SBs had he gone to the Colts, IF he could have let others make the personnel decisions. There is no doubt the game has changed over the last decade, but it still takes much more than an elite QB to win it all. The Bucs have most of the pieces on defense. They need to overhaul the OL, get a speed receiver, and a TE who can block AND catch. QB is not the highest priority right now.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
This was 2002, not 2013. Tom Brady threw the most TD passes in the entire NFL with 28. Brad threw 22 while missing three games. It's not at all a stretch to say if he played 16 games he would have thrown 25 or 26. That year he had a higher QB rating than Peyton Manning, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, Brady, Mark Brunell, Jeff Garcia, and Brett Favre. Brad was legitimately elite in 2002.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
This was 2002, not 2013. Tom Brady threw the most TD passes in the entire NFL with 28. Brad threw 22 while missing three games. It's not at all a stretch to say if he played 16 games he would have thrown 25 or 26. That year he had a higher QB rating than Peyton Manning, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, Brady, Mark Brunell, Jeff Garcia, and Brett Favre. Brad was legitimately elite in 2002.
It also was a fluke. It was a flash in the pan. Elite QBs end up in Canton. The only way Brad goes to Canton is if he pays his own way. He was drafted in a round that doesn't even exist anymore, and his rookie stats are certainly no better than Glennon's. Glennon has regressed, but he has also shown flashes. To be fair, judge him with decent protection and more weapons, AND proper preparation. He got thrown into the fire this year.
The Bucs won their SB with Brad Johnson. BJ in his prime would be ranked the fourth best QB in the NFCS right now. We don't need to have the best QB in the division to win a SB. We need the best team. Right now the defense has the advantage in talent level. Gruden/McKay filled in the holes on offense and won a SB with Brad Johnson. BJ was in the twilight of his career, and never competitive again. Mike Glennon is at the dawn of his. He needs an OL, some weapons, and a gameplan that matches his skillset. If Schiano/Dominik can deliver that, the Bucs can have the best team in the NFCS.A year ago the fowlgoons had the best record in the league and were 7-1 at home. Their only loss was to the Bucs. Their QB has played in 15 games this season and odds are the fowlgoons will be picking ahead of the Bucs in the draft next may. Matt Ryan has the benefit of years of experience and a veteran coaching staff, and yet his team will likely finish fourth behind the Bucs.It's a team game, and this team needs much more than a second straight year with a rookie QB. Glennon may never be our Peyton Manning, but he very easily could be our next Brad Johnson if Schiano/Dominik can do for the offense what they have done for the defense in two short years.Merry Xmas everyone.
Brad had the #3 QB rating in the NFL in 2002 and if he hadn't missed three games would have been top 5 in TD passes. He was an elite QB that year. If he played like he did most of the rest of his career that year, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. You still do need an elite or at least very good QB to win. You don't win with bums.
22TDs is not elite. 6 interceptions is, but he would still be rated the 4th best QB in the division. The Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer. Nobody on this board would describe him as elite. Very few would even say he was very good. The Ravens let him go, so they weren't that high on him either. Eli Manning has two SB rings. The only thing elite about him is his durability. Peyton Manning IS an elite QB, and should have multiple SB rings. IMO he was handicapped by the coaching and schemes of Tony Dungy. The Bucs and the Colts struggled to score TDs in the playoffs. I believe there were 3 teams that held them to FGs and knocked them out.. That's understandable with the Bucs. Not so much with the Colts. It's a team game, and even an elite QB has to have help. Glennon has been impressive at times, but has regressed. Still, he has shown enough that I want to see what he can do with a fresh start under better circumstances. With a full offseason of preparation, I believe he can be a very good QB in this league. He now has some experience to build on. IMO there are only 4 elite QBs in the league right now, and 3 of them are nearing retirement. Aaron Rodgers sat behind Favre for a few years too so his career will be shorter than most. Steve Young was elite with San Francisco, but he never would have been with the Bucs. If elite is the standard you're looking for, good luck with that. We have never had that with the Bucs, and I'm thinking I'll never live to see it. Glennon has a lot going for him. I hope he gets a fair shot so he can show us all what he is capable of.
This was 2002, not 2013. Tom Brady threw the most TD passes in the entire NFL with 28. Brad threw 22 while missing three games. It's not at all a stretch to say if he played 16 games he would have thrown 25 or 26. That year he had a higher QB rating than Peyton Manning, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, Brady, Mark Brunell, Jeff Garcia, and Brett Favre. Brad was legitimately elite in 2002.
It also was a fluke. It was a flash in the pan. Elite QBs end up in Canton. The only way Brad goes to Canton is if he pays his own way. He was drafted in a round that doesn't even exist anymore, and his rookie stats are certainly no better than Glennon's. Glennon has regressed, but he has also shown flashes. To be fair, judge him with decent protection and more weapons, AND proper preparation. He got thrown into the fire this year.
Obviously it was not representative of the rest of his career. The point is you don't win with mediocre QB play. If Brad was mediocre in 2002, the Bucs wouldn't have won the Super Bowl. But he wasn't mediocre. He was elite. And the Bucs won.
You know I won't be mad either way. He played well enough as a rookie in my opinion to get a chance but it would be exciting to watch Johnny Football out there. Tired of boring football around here.
First of all, whoa on the 50 quote imbedded posts...The stat line on Glennon hasn't changed that much since we went on that 3 game win streak. He is very good when not pressured and very bad when pressured. Up until recently he's had one of the best 10 passer ratings off play action. Glennon hasn't changed. The situations he's being put into have. Our offensive line has crumbled like a stale saltine cracker. The running game was been eaten alive by superior defensive lines which makes the playaction much less effective. People have gotten tape on him and figured out he can pick you apart if you let him stand in the pocket and that becomes virtually ineffective if you get a guy in his face. Again our line has done a poor job of stopping that and we haven't helped ourselves with Scheme at all. Vertical passing game doesn't work with a pressured Glennon or with Bobby Rainey blocking Aldon Smith. We've failed to make the passing game quicker and have looked worse every week.I'm not exonorating Glennon. I've seen multiple occasions in every game where he held the ball to long, didn't pull the trigger, left the pocket to early or missed open WR. He's done his part in returning this offense back to last in the NFL. He's very uncomfortable standing in the pocket and rightly so. He still doesn't see the game as fast as he should and that causes him to miss reads, get jittery in the pocket and watch the blitz and not the WR.He picked apart the best defense in the league in Seattle and dissected the 49ers on two drives at home. He has the skill but it's become unclear whether he's regressing as the main part of this offense that makes it go, the run game, no longer goes and hasn't in a while.I can say for sure that I'm unsure of what exactly to think of us continuing forward or not with Glennon.
