Rich McKay vs Licht - You be the Judge! To me it’s not even close… McKay won a Super Bowl and so has Licht. But McKay drafted, traded, and turned this team around from worse and kept it successful for longer. The team got significantly worse once he was gone
Players Drafted:
-95’) Warren Sapp, Derrick Brooks
-96’) Mike Alstott , Marcus Jones, and Donnie Abraham
-97’) Warrick Dunn, Ronde Barber, Al Harris (yes- that Al Harris, although he never did anything for the Bucs, but as the GM he drafts the talent, not develops it that’s the coaches job.)
-98’) Brian Kelly, Jamie Duncan, Lorenzo Neal
-99’) Anthony McFarland, Shaun King, Martin Gramatica, Dexter Jackson (No, not that one, the Super Bowl MVP safety).
-00’) KeyShawn johnson, Cosey Coleman, Nate Webster
-01’) Kenyatta Walker, Dwight Smith, John Howell, Jameel Cook, and Ellis Wyms
-02’) Jon Gruden and Jermaine Phillips
Draft Trades:
-95’) The Bucs traded their 1st and 3rd round pick to the Eagles for their first (12th overall) and two second round picks. They then traded the two second round picks to the Cowboys to move back into the first round and select Derrick Brooks.
-96’) Additional 1st round pick came from the Indianapolis Colts in return for QB Craig Erickson. The extra 4th round pick came from the New York Jets for DT Marc Spindler and WR Charles Wilson. The Bucs traded their original 2nd round pick to San Diego in return for a No.1 the following year, but gained a 2nd round pick from the Cleveland Browns in return.
-97’) The additional 1st round pick came courtesy of the San Diego Chargers in return for the Bucs' second round pick the previous year. The additional 4th and 7th round picks were compensatory for the loss of free agents. The Bucs originally traded their 1st and 4th round picks to the Jets to move up two spots in the first round. They then traded that top pick to Seattle for the 12th overall pick and an extra 3rd rounder.
-98’) raded their first round pick to Oakland for a pair of second round picks. They then traded the second of those 2nd rounders to San Diego in a deal that brought them a 2000 first round selection and gained them an additional 2nd round pick in this draft. Another deal was done with Atlanta to move up in the 2nd round that cost a 4th rounder. The additional 4th round pick came from Baltimore in return for the following year's third round pick as part of the Errict Rhett trade. The extra 6th round pick was a compensatory pick in return for losing free agent. A 5th round pick was sent to the Jets for FB Lorenzo Neal.
-99’) The additional 6th and 7th round picks came from the Jacksonville Jaguars in return for swopping 6th round picks. The original 6th round pick had been traded to Baltimore for QB Eric Zeier, but an additional 6th round pick came from the Kansas City Chiefs in return for S Melvin Johnson.
00’) The additional 1st round pick came from San Diego as a result of draft day dealings in 1998. The two 1st rounders were then traded to the Jets for Keyshawn Johnson. The fourth round pick was traded to Carolina for the chance to swop picks in the 2nd round.
01’) Moved up seven spots in the 1st round. The price was a 2nd rounder/ The remaining rounds of the draft saw them select alternately 20th, 23rd, 22nd and 21st. The additional 7th round pick came from Atlanta for QB Eric Zeier.
02’) The top two picks in this draft went to Oakland as part of the deal that brought Jon Gruden to Tampa Bay. The Bucs selected alternately 22-21 in this draft. They also received three additional 7th round selections as compensatory picks.
Draft Grades:
-95’) A+ (Best Ever)
-96’) A
-97’) A
-98’) A
-99’) A
-00’) B
-01’) C (IDK How this got a C??)
-02’) Jon Gruden Super Bowl
It’s close but McKay keeps nod for now. Both had power play moves (Gruden, Brady)
we’ve sucked for decades prior to McKay and his HOF selections in sapp and brooks helped change the culture. Was not able to develop young QB and the offense was neglected
litch seems hit or miss with draft and was not able to make playoffs prior to Brady, had 1 pick to select QB and wiffed.
how the next few years play out will define litch as GM tenure but he still has a shot to overtake McKay
Licht’s worst trait is locking himself into “must draft this position”scenarios. Look at the Wirfs pick. We had to have an OT. The run in OT started and Licht traded up(using a 4th) to get Wirfs. We also needed a RB. We didn’t have a 4th so we had to draft K. Vaughan in the 3rd. RB probably would have been a great spot to pick in the 4th round, and the 3rd could have been OL or DL depth.
Wirfs was arguably one of his best picks lol
No doubt. My point is he puts himself in bad spots with poor roster management. The busts on Hargreaves and j Evans led to having to draft multiple db’s in the same draft. Then they all come up for free agency at the same time. Rich McKay did a beautiful job of stocking the roster (except for Oline). I fully believe that the Mike Shula offense Dungy was running would have been just fine with a dominant oline.
Wirfs was arguably one of his best picks lol
Are you really complaining about the Wirfs pick? Licht helped win a super bowl so I'm cool with him. He has had his negatives but people also need to give him his credit. Let's see how his retool goes.
Not complaining about the Wirfs pick. I’m complaining about the situation Licht let fester on the oline prior to the Wirfs pick. I forget when Demar Dotson retired. But it was obvious that RT was a crippling need going into that draft. Ideally we should have had a young tackle ready to step up. Licht drafts oline men when he needs them and he quits when he gets 5. Remember how last year Goedeke starting was crucial? Hell, the only reason we have some depth is because Aaron Stinnie and Leverette were FA. One of the picks that doesn’t fit this Licht tendency ( and where he actually did a good job) was drafting Hainsey.
Bucs have had some amazing bad GMs. Phil Kruger wouldn't pay Doug Williams $600,000 a year bad. McKay and Licht were/are very, very good. Both turned really bad teams into SB champs. McKay also gets credit for keeping the Bucs in Tampa when it looked like they were leaving, which is huge. But McKay bailed on us and went to a division rival leaving us in salary cap hell, which sucked. Tough call, but I give the nod to Licht because he didn't desert us and it looks like he's bailing us out of salary cap hell. If Licht delivers another SB, which I think he will, there will be no no doubt who was better. Really nice we can have such a debate here.
Licht vs McKay
Players Drafted:
-14’) Mike Evans
-15’) Jamies Winston??, Donavon Smith, Ali Marpet, Kwon Alexander
-16’) GARBAGE potentially worst draft in Bucs history
-17’) Chris Godwin
-18’) Vita Vea, Ronald Jones, Carlton Davis, Alex Cappa, and Jordan Whitehead
-19’) Devin White, Sean Murphey-Bunting, Jamal Dean, Mike Edwards, Anthony Nelson, Scotty Miller
-20’) Tristian Wirfs, Antoine Winfield
-21’) Robert Hainsey
-22’) Rashaad White, Cade Otton, Jake Camarda
Draft Trades:
-14’) The 4th round pick was traded to the NY Jets for Darrelle Revis. The Bucs sent a 7th and 2015 5th round picks to Buffalo for an additional 5th round pick. The Bucs obtained a 6th round pick from Buffalo for Mike Willams. The Bucs sent a 6th round pick to Chicago for T Gabe Carimi.
-15’) traded their 3rd round pick and a 4th round pick to Indianapolis for the additional 2nd round pick. Various other trades took place to leave the Bucs with a selection in each of the final four rounds.
-16’) traded their 3rd round pick and a 4th round pick to Kansas City for the additional 2nd round pick. They moved down two spots in the first round with Chicago. The additional 6th round pick came from Washington in the Dashon Goldson trade and saw them lose their 7th round pick in the process.
-17’) traded their 4th and 6th round picks to the NY Jets for an additional 3rd round selection. They traded up in the 7th round with Miami in return for a 2018 7th round selection.
-18’) swopped 1st round picks with Buffalo for two 2nd round picks. They traded a 3rd round pick the Giants for DE Jason Pierre-Paul. Other trades were made with Minnesota and New England to move selections in the 3rd and 4th rounds. The 7th round pick was traded to Miami as part of a deal made the previous year.
-19’) traded a 3rd round pick to the Rams in exchange for two later 3rd round picks.
-20’) traded a 4th round pick to the Patriots for TE Rob Gronkowski and a 7th round pick. They traded a 4th round pick to San Francisco to move up one spot in the 1st round but received a 7th round pick in return. The original 7th round pick went in the 2019 trade involving WR DeSean Jackson.
-21’) traded a 6th round compensation pick to the Seahawks to move up eight spots in the 4th round. They traded a 6th round pick
and received a 7th round pick back from the Steelers in the 2019 trade for Jerald Hawkins
-22’) gained additional 4th and 6th round picks by swopping
selections 27 and 33 with Jacksonville. The 6th round pick was traded to Buffalo to move up in the 2nd round. They gained additional 5th and 7th round picks from Jacksonville in return for a 2023 4th round pick. A 6th round pick was traded to the Jets in the Steve McLendon deal. They also traded two 7th round picks for an additional 6th round selection.
Draft Grades:
-14’) B
-15’) B
-16’) F
-17’) B
-18’) A
-19’)Not Yet Graded (NYG)
-20’) NYG
-21’) NYG
-22’) NYG
- Rich McKay
- SEASONS: 1995-2003 (9)
- Head Coaches: 3
- RECORD: 89-71
- Losing Seasons: 95’, 96’, and 03’
- PLAYOFFS: 5-4
- SUPERBOWL: 1-0
- Key Players Drafted: Warren Sapp, Derrick Brooks, Mike Alstott, Marcus Jones, Donnie Abraham, Warrick Dunn, Ronde Barber, Brian Kelly, Jamie Duncan, Lorenzo Neal, Anthony McFarland, Shaun King, Martin Gramatica, Dexter Jackson, KeyShawn johnson (trade), Cosey Coleman, Nate Webster, Kenyatta Walker, Dwight Smith, John Howell, Jameel Cook, and Ellis Wyms, Jon Gruden (trade) and Jermaine Phillips
- Draft grades: A+ (2), A (4), B (1), C (1)
- Jason Licht (GM)
- SEASONS: 2014-2022 (9)
- Head Coaches: 4
- RECORD: 66-80
- Losing Seasons: 14’-19’, and 22’ (6 straight seasons - 7 total)
- PLAYOFFS: 3-2
- SUPERBOWL: 1-0
- Key Players Drafted: Mike Evans, Jamies Winston, Donavon Smith, Ali Marpet, Kwon Alexander, Chris Godwin, Vita Vea, Ronald Jones, Carlton Davis, Alex Cappa, and Jordan Whitehead, Devin White, Sean Murphey-Bunting, Jamal Dean, Mike Edwards, Anthony Nelson, Scotty Miller, Tristian Wirfs, Antoine Winfield, Robert Hainsey, Rashaad White, Cade Otton, and Jake Camarda
- Draft grades: A (1), B (3), F (1), NYG (4)
- Draft Accolades: players who have been to at least one Pro Bowl (6) who have been drafted.
Licht's success is tied to 1 player.
So is Bill Belichick's.
Brady having the success he had in Tampa did hurt Belichick's legacy, yes. Difference is that Belichick has had some success away from Tom Brady: Two rings as coordinator with Giants, built Browns pretty well before Modell pulled the plug mid season, made the playoffs with Mac Jones, 11-5 with Matt Cassell. Whereas Licht without Brady has not made the playoffs and has a losing record with all 3 head coaches and busted on a #1 overall pick.
Licht's success is tied to 1 player.
So is Bill Belichick's.
Brady having the success he had in Tampa did hurt Belichick's legacy, yes. Difference is that Belichick has had some success away from Tom Brady: Two rings as coordinator with Giants, built Browns pretty well before Modell pulled the plug mid season, made the playoffs with Mac Jones, 11-5 with Matt Cassell. Whereas Licht without Brady has not made the playoffs and has a losing record with all 3 head coaches and busted on a #1 overall pick.
That's a rather rosey view of Belichick's career without Brady. In reality, he's 61-69 (.469) without Tom Brady on his roster as a Head Coach.
My point being, that "one player" can make a pretty big difference for any GM or HC.
Phil Kruger wouldn't pay Doug Williams $600,000 a year bad
That wasn't Kruger's call. That was Culverhouse's call.
