@donkey_hunter I think he would be solid. A smidge concerned with his time in NO But I understand it was an anomaly. Solid suggestion. The more I read about him, the more intrigued I am. My favorite coach in the league, despite him not having any rings, is Shanahan and by proxy, Kubiak has some of that in him.
So good coaches need good players? And if they have bad players they’ll look bad, even if they’re a good coach?
Bad players can be coached into being competitive in the NFL. Think about the Jags. They wasted their first round pick and next year’s first round pick to go up in the draft and grab an undersized DB/not super great WR. Didn’t hurt them at all. They have a coach who can get what’s necessary out of the team he has.
We have talent in Tampa. We aren’t getting enough out of them.
So why were the 2019 Bucs bad?
Because their QB accounted for 35 turnovers.
So was Brady/ Winston the only addition they made to the roster? I don’t remember.
@donkey_hunter I think he would be solid. A smidge concerned with his time in NO But I understand it was an anomaly. Solid suggestion. The more I read about him, the more intrigued I am. My favorite coach in the league, despite him not having any rings, is Shanahan and by proxy, Kubiak has some of that in him.
So good coaches need good players? And if they have bad players they’ll look bad, even if they’re a good coach?
Bad players can be coached into being competitive in the NFL. Think about the Jags. They wasted their first round pick and next year’s first round pick to go up in the draft and grab an undersized DB/not super great WR. Didn’t hurt them at all. They have a coach who can get what’s necessary out of the team he has.
We have talent in Tampa. We aren’t getting enough out of them.
So why were the 2019 Bucs bad?
Because their QB accounted for 35 turnovers.
So was Brady/ Winston the only addition they made to the roster? I don’t remember.
If you need jarring of your memory, go ask the GM who brought them in and won a SB.
What’s his name again?
I don’t remember.
@donkey_hunter I think he would be solid. A smidge concerned with his time in NO But I understand it was an anomaly. Solid suggestion. The more I read about him, the more intrigued I am. My favorite coach in the league, despite him not having any rings, is Shanahan and by proxy, Kubiak has some of that in him.
So good coaches need good players? And if they have bad players they’ll look bad, even if they’re a good coach?
Bad players can be coached into being competitive in the NFL. Think about the Jags. They wasted their first round pick and next year’s first round pick to go up in the draft and grab an undersized DB/not super great WR. Didn’t hurt them at all. They have a coach who can get what’s necessary out of the team he has.
We have talent in Tampa. We aren’t getting enough out of them.
So why were the 2019 Bucs bad?
Because their QB accounted for 35 turnovers.
So was Brady/ Winston the only addition they made to the roster? I don’t remember.
If you need jarring of your memory, go ask the GM who brought them in and won a SB.
What’s his name again?
I don’t remember.
So if I’m understanding this correctly, there was really no difference from Koetter to Arians until they made drastic roster upgrades?
I wonder if Karl Scott would come over from Seattle with Kubiak?
@donkey_hunter I think he would be solid. A smidge concerned with his time in NO But I understand it was an anomaly. Solid suggestion. The more I read about him, the more intrigued I am. My favorite coach in the league, despite him not having any rings, is Shanahan and by proxy, Kubiak has some of that in him.
So good coaches need good players? And if they have bad players they’ll look bad, even if they’re a good coach?
Bad players can be coached into being competitive in the NFL. Think about the Jags. They wasted their first round pick and next year’s first round pick to go up in the draft and grab an undersized DB/not super great WR. Didn’t hurt them at all. They have a coach who can get what’s necessary out of the team he has.
We have talent in Tampa. We aren’t getting enough out of them.
So why were the 2019 Bucs bad?
Because their QB accounted for 35 turnovers.
So was Brady/ Winston the only addition they made to the roster? I don’t remember.
If you need jarring of your memory, go ask the GM who brought them in and won a SB.
What’s his name again?
I don’t remember.
So if I’m understanding this correctly, there was really no difference from Koetter to Arians until they made drastic roster upgrades?
Hmm…good question.
Let’s look at their resumes.
Good topic. John Gruden or Bill Belichick! OK I had to get that out of the way now lets get serious...
Step 1) Clean house.
Underwhelming, uninspiring, impotent. I usually call for patience. We don't need to have a coaching carousel. We don't knee jerk fire coaches just because we're mad. But "unacceptable" doesn't describe the magnitude of the last two games. Those two losses are not the last straw - they alone are worth a whole barrel of straws. The whole staff needs to be fired in order to move forward. There's no other way.
Player freindly coaches inevitably meet their end when the players don't play. I don't think they didn't care or were going through the motions on game day, but whatever goes on the other six days of the week isn't working.
Griz was a Bowles' hire. Its who he felt comfortable with. It's not fair to totally rip Griz when the defense is the biggest problem, but we need a serious OC with experience and credibility. They should never have hired an inexperienced guy to coach a contending team. I didn't like it when they did it. Sorry Bake, you get another OC, but this time it's on you as well because you undoubtedly had input into the Griz hire.
Step 2) Take stock.
Players - Can we put humpty dumpty back together? No. Long story short we do have some pieces, but not enough that we can hire a new coach ala Gruden or Arians and expect to be back on the Superbowl train. Bowles was a transition coach who the tried to project into a Superbowl coach and he wasn't and now we have a mess. It's not a total rebuild, but it's a mess and it needs cleaning up. It's going to take a couple years.
Step 3) Hire a coach.
IMO we're looking for a HC who comes from the offensive side. If we are going to stick with Baker then having some familiarity with him would be a plus, but not a requirement. The new HC is going to have to realize he's coming into a situation with offensive players who have been through multiple system changes. He's got solid talent on the O-line, but they need a reset.
He'll need to bring in a young, creative DC who can rebuild a failed defense. The DBs are OK, but the rest of the defense is a mess. Trade Vea. He's been Mr. Reliable, but he's getting past his prime. We'll need a couple years to build and by that time Vea will be done.
Candidates
Todd Monken
Kliff Kingsbury
Lincoln Riley
Kevin Stefanski
Klint Kubiak
Joe Brady
I'd love to have Stafanski get fired by the browns then roll with him.
@donkey_hunter I think he would be solid. A smidge concerned with his time in NO But I understand it was an anomaly. Solid suggestion. The more I read about him, the more intrigued I am. My favorite coach in the league, despite him not having any rings, is Shanahan and by proxy, Kubiak has some of that in him.
So good coaches need good players? And if they have bad players they’ll look bad, even if they’re a good coach?
Bad players can be coached into being competitive in the NFL. Think about the Jags. They wasted their first round pick and next year’s first round pick to go up in the draft and grab an undersized DB/not super great WR. Didn’t hurt them at all. They have a coach who can get what’s necessary out of the team he has.
We have talent in Tampa. We aren’t getting enough out of them.
So why were the 2019 Bucs bad?
Because their QB accounted for 35 turnovers.
So was Brady/ Winston the only addition they made to the roster? I don’t remember.
If you need jarring of your memory, go ask the GM who brought them in and won a SB.
What’s his name again?
I don’t remember.
So if I’m understanding this correctly, there was really no difference from Koetter to Arians until they made drastic roster upgrades?
Hmm…good question.
Let’s look at their resumes.
Let’s examine their resumes under Jason Licht.
Koetter had a 0.400 win %. The same resentment the media and fans have for Bowles was what Koetter was facing. So Koetter gets fired and Arians comes in, he’s going to fix it. Well his first year, with a similar roster to Koetter, he has a 0.438 win %.
All it took for Arians to get the Bucs better was adding Tom Brady, Rob Gronkowski, Tristan Wirfs, Antoine Winfield, Leonard Fournette, Antonio Brown.
Bowles is very likely to get fired but the one wrinkle is how much he is on the inside of known roster problems that Licht was working through.
I dont know that that is the case though because of player like McCollum. McCollum is part of the "got paid half-ass" group and he 100% Bowles.
If there is a new HC in the offseason we could see more change than people expect. Evans retires, new QB brought in. New style of defense requires house cleaning. Most likely all for the good over time, but 2026 could be that transitional year that we have avoided.
If there is a new HC in the offseason we could see more change than people expect. Evans retires, new QB brought in. New style of defense requires house cleaning. Most likely all for the good over time, but 2026 could be that transitional year that we have avoided.
i don't know. the strength of this team is the offense. They were top 5 with a competent OC a year ago. Evans showed Thursday that he can still change a game. Baker looks to have regressed from 2024 levels but maybe can return there with the right OC and less injuries to his supporting cast.
Thing is....can't give Grizz the benefit of the doubt with injuries. It is what it is there.
Point being is that i would think much like Brady; the reason somebody would come to coach Tampa would be with that offensive fire power in tact.
It was a bad week for Todd Bowles. at 7-5, we lost to good teams. Now at 7-7, just lost back to back home games against terrible teams. Like wow. There isn't any coming back from that
they would need to magically flip a switch on to beat Carolina twice and make playoffs for him to have any chance of remianing.
Even then....aren't we tired of this drama. Team starts off hot every year goes into a nose dive mid year, then in years past was able to rebound in time for playoffs. This year, looks like end of year has been worse...but assuming they can flip a switch....go 2-1, 3-0; at what point are we over this 9,10 win performances.
I think Evans will play as long as he can contribute. The new guy isn't going to nudge him out the door. Licht will find a way to pay him. So I don't think Evans is going anywhere for next year at least.If there is a new HC in the offseason we could see more change than people expect. Evans retires, new QB brought in. New style of defense requires house cleaning. Most likely all for the good over time, but 2026 could be that transitional year that we have avoided.
We need total change of the coaching staff, not only Bowles
Who should follow him? … really no clue! The one who offers the best complete package, that simple!. Of course, if Tomlin becomes available he would be no brainer, but at least ten other teams would chase him as well
Will be a hard task for the owners.
Very unlikely but not impossible that Griz stays on. They tried that with Byron Leftwich who perhaps felt snubbed, and Bowles was basically stuck with him. That whole situation isn't going to happen again. If the new HC is from the defensive side there's a slight chance but still it's unusual to retain a coordinator from the past regime.
Unlike Leftwich I don't think Griz has any legitimate claim to any HC job so he wouldn't be feeling snubbed if another coach was hired. Players like Wirfs and Goedeke who will be around for awhile will really have to go to bat for Griz. I mean they'll have to do some real campaigning with the new HC who will have the final say not Licht. All Licht can do is ask if the new HC will give Griz an interview for the OC job.
Licht is not going to foist Griz on a new HC.
What is we stayed put but hired a DC.
There are few teams in the league with more offensive fire power than Tampa right now. So our team would be very attractive to a sound offensive mind but, I can see us keeping Bowles and mandating he hire a DC.
It’s astounding Tampa is here after a 5-1 start. Particularly with wins over the 9ers (best team in the league) and Seattle, the second best team in the league. Will be impossible for Todd to keep his job if we don’t make the playoffs but, if he does…
