Bucs defense was closer to average (plus) when you look at the games.
Scoring obviously the most important stat but look at the make up of that ranking and it’s much more a mixed performance. Our scoring defense is probably better then average on half the games and below average on have the and some of their best scoring performances were against the Panthers TWICE and Will Levis and the hapless Titans
They had strong games too like the first Saints game and Falcons game. But, they were MANHANDLED by the Eagles in the first game, gave up almost 40 to the Texans, including 3 scores in the 4th. And of course THREE consecutive TD drives of 50 plus yards against the Lions WHEN IT MATTERED MOST
If Mayfield’s and the offenses play is discounted by some because of the weak division and opponents then it stands to reason the same is true of the defense, right? The Bucs defense was not the 7th best in the 2023 NFL
FWIW, I think the 2023 Bucs D underperformed its talent. As much as anything hope to see the D make big strides this year. Hopefully early!
Bucs defense was closer to average (plus) when you look at the games.
The overall scoring stats...the thing that ACTUALLY matters...says otherwise.
Our scoring defense is probably better then average on half the games and below average on have the and some of their best scoring performances were against the Panthers TWICE and Will Levis and the hapless Titans
Our scoring defense held opponents to the league average or better in scoring nearly 59% of the games played in the regular season.
Our scoring offense was under the league average 65% of the games played in the regular season.
And speaking of the hapless Titans. We scored less than the NFL average against them. And, the mighty Panthers? We averaged an earth-scorching 15 points per game against their 29th ranked scoring defense (including a blustering 9 point outing in a must-win game to make the playoffs).
FWIW, I think the 2023 Bucs D underperformed its talent. As much as anything hope to see the D make big strides this year. Hopefully early!
If the Bucs D underperformed its talent last year, I'm not sure what the word would be to describe the offense.
As much as anything, I hope to see the O make big strides this year. Hopefully early (and not score less than league average their first 5 of 7 games).
The overall scoring stats...the thing that ACTUALLY matters...says otherwise.
lots of stats are misleading. I gave my explanation. And you seem to acknowledge that by putting actual math to my guess. I guess 50/50ish
better in scoring nearly 59% of the games
I was close
Both of your next comments are, essentially, "oh yeah but look at the offense," like this . .
and speaking of the hapless Titans. We scored less than the NFL average against them. And, the mighty Panthers? We averaged an earth-scorching 15 points per game against their 29th ranked scoring defense (including a blustering 9 point outing in a must-win game to make the playoffs
So I guess you saw the defensive example I provided, but in any event I was only talking about the defense AND whether the 7th rank scoring is really an accurate reflection of the performance.
Its an opinion. You say 7th ranking scoring. I said well if you look at the actual games . ..
Not sure how thats any different than saying Mayfieled missed open people while throwing for his own personal best stats or that "Eagles were out of it" or that "the Packers defense sucked" (even though they beat the Cowboys in the playoffs). In other words, Mayfield's statistical performances are met with opinions on both sides ("Packers suck" or "he was injured"). J
Just providing ONE VIEW of the underlying context to the defense scoring stat.
against their 29th ranked scoring defense
I think they held the Texans to 13 points. Our 7th rank scoring defense gave up 39.
weird things these stats
but in any event I was only talking about the defense AND whether the 7th rank scoring is really an accurate reflection of the performance.
What’s a more accurate reflection of their performance aside from the actual results?
I mean, you’re giving Baker and the offense every pass imaginable; so I’m curious to hear.
What’s a more accurate reflection of their performance aside from the actual results?
Actual results:
Brady: 90.7 rating, 25 touchdowns and 9 interceptions lead team to first round loss
Mayfield: 94.6 rating, 28 touchdowns and 9 interceptions and led team to 2nd round of playoffs
Mayfield > Brady, right?
;-)
Presumably Leftwich versus Canales is just ONE pice of RELEVANT context, right?
And I am not giving the offense or Mayfield a pass at all? Not sure where you even get that? We are discussing the DEFENSE because the PREMISE of the thread is/was the defense:
I feel our problem unit will be the defense
Thats the OP, not me. You selected a stat to say the defense is "top 7" because you're more worried about the offense. Fair enough. I just gave the CONTEXT to the "top 7" . . . JUST LIKE ONE MIGHT SAY Brady > Mayfield even though the "actual results" dont seem that way.
Ive actually asked here which Mayfield do we get this year, the beneficiary of a system or the now more mature passer? I've even posted that the new control he has can really sink the ship. Geno Smith regressed slightly in his 2nd year in a system like Coens, right? Double-edged sword.
We need the defense, badly. I think they should be better. I dont think i can say the same about the offense. I think its a BETTER offensive philosophy and we shored some things up BUT you still have to EXECUTE
Love it or hate it, Bowles plays the bend-but-don’t-break defense
^^^^. Lmao. Now Bowles is Dungy/Kiffin????
Too funny to pass up when it comes from Mr. Football Acumen.
Bowles is known (to a fault) for his PRESS MAN BLITZING SCHEME. Lmao. Funnier even was that Biggs you offered that whopper as a defense of the "top 7" defense of 2023. This was Bowles himself quoted in ESPN reporting post 2023 EXANS loss:
"There had been no pressure from their front four, and no blitzing from Bowles, who built his reputation as one of the most aggressive defensive playcallers in the league. While his Cover 0 call at the end of the Bucs' 30-27 NFC divisional loss to the Los Angeles Rams in the 2021 playoffs was heavily scrutinized, Bowles has made it clear throughout his career that he's not one to lay down with a game on the line.
He even acknowledged that it was uncharacteristic of him not to blitz on that final drive.
"There's a lot of thought, and usually that's the type of person I am," Bowles said. "But with the way we were playing, and some guys in certain situations, you didn't want to do it."
HE WOULD GO ON TO EXPAND SEVERAL TIMES ON THE "SOME GUYS IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS" . . . he felt he didnt have the players to handle his typical MAn. Even when this was the stats on the ATYPICAL "bend dont break"
"In zone coverage, they've surrendered 10 touchdowns on 207 dropbacks this year - more than any other team in the league. In man coverage, they've given up three touchdowns on 123 dropbacks - tied for the best mark in the league"
Bowles does NOT play the bend dont break defense, he is the Cover ZERO guy. LMAO. Last year he had a USELESS MLB, limited pass rush (the point of the OP) and liabilities at CB (after top 2) and Safety. This offseason they have brought back Whitehead and brought in CBs and safety. Clearly, Bowles wants to run HIS defense.
So, what you’re saying is, sometimes, your personnel dictate the playcalling?
How odd?
So, what you’re saying is, sometimes, your personnel dictate the playcalling?
exactly and our top 7 scoring defense had a personnel problem
And remember that this was easy for McVay to say while he had the best DT of all time with Aaron Donald.
Warren Sapp is on line 1 for you...
@kermit56 - haha! Oh yes. Sapp was great. But Donald was dominant for a lot longer.
And I am not giving the offense or Mayfield a pass at all? Not sure where you even get that?
It’s a real mystery, for sure.
Love it or hate it, Bowles plays the bend-but-don’t-break defense
^^^^. Lmao. Now Bowles is Dungy/Kiffin????
Too funny to pass up when it comes from Mr. Football Acumen.
Bowles is known (to a fault) for his PRESS MAN BLITZING SCHEME. Lmao. Funnier even was that Biggs you offered that whopper as a defense of the "top 7" defense of 2023. This was Bowles himself quoted in ESPN reporting post 2023 EXANS loss:
"There had been no pressure from their front four, and no blitzing from Bowles, who built his reputation as one of the most aggressive defensive playcallers in the league. While his Cover 0 call at the end of the Bucs' 30-27 NFC divisional loss to the Los Angeles Rams in the 2021 playoffs was heavily scrutinized, Bowles has made it clear throughout his career that he's not one to lay down with a game on the line.
He even acknowledged that it was uncharacteristic of him not to blitz on that final drive.
"There's a lot of thought, and usually that's the type of person I am," Bowles said. "But with the way we were playing, and some guys in certain situations, you didn't want to do it."
HE WOULD GO ON TO EXPAND SEVERAL TIMES ON THE "SOME GUYS IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS" . . . he felt he didnt have the players to handle his typical MAn. Even when this was the stats on the ATYPICAL "bend dont break"
"In zone coverage, they've surrendered 10 touchdowns on 207 dropbacks this year - more than any other team in the league. In man coverage, they've given up three touchdowns on 123 dropbacks - tied for the best mark in the league"
Bowles does NOT play the bend dont break defense, he is the Cover ZERO guy. LMAO. Last year he had a USELESS MLB, limited pass rush (the point of the OP) and liabilities at CB (after top 2) and Safety. This offseason they have brought back Whitehead and brought in CBs and safety. Clearly, Bowles wants to run HIS defense.
It would be fruitless to discuss the intricacies of what Bowles does with the defense in the green zone vs. red zone, considering the glaring lack of football acumen and intellectual honesty.
Mr Football Acumen squirms…
dIDnT See DaT comINg
