Charlie Garner ...... 2003 ....... definitely = 3 years after ........ Gruden ........... HC/DC for $2 million dollars ....... bargain bin signings ........ punter .......... kicker ................. "build through draft" ........ farce ........ suckers
damn . . . who knew the Glazers were "cheap" because they dedicated a BOAT LOAD of money to the wrong players . . . . Quincy Black definitely thinks the Glazers are "cheap" . . as does Carl Nicks . . Charlie Garner . . Jeff Faine . . . and they were RIGHT! Bad money don't spend!
Nicks wasn't a bad signing it just has worked out to be a crappy one because he hasn't played. Garner, Faine, Black, he's those weren't very good ones.
damn, I guess we need a new definition of "cheap" then ;)
Cowher would have been interesting I think. I think Gruden would have been a mistake again. I like the guy and what he did for us early on but I thought it was his time to go when it was. He is good in the booth on MNF. I know I'm in the minority on that one on this board.
That's from February of 2012. A month later the Bucs spent more money in free agency than any other team. Why are you complaining about that year?
http://www.bucscentral.com/general-news/bucs-2009-salary-cap-update
I forget the exact numbers, but the Bucs spent between $20-30 million in new money for 2009.
Gruden is the gift that keeps on giving on this board.Just because Gruden had a HORRIFIC record when its comes to bringing in players doesn't mean he was a bad x and o guy and yet some of you are so sensitive about that issue (brining in players) that you come up with one conspiracy after another to explain his failure. lol. I couldn't even name them all, but Rob Johnson, Bert Emanuel, Charlie Garner ($20 mill of "cheapness"), Clayton (fell in love with him), Alex Smith (because TEs were the rage!). Zemaitis . . . Caddy over Rodgers (because we needed a runner and any QB would work!) .. . Stovall (because every team needs a big receiver), Dexter Jackson (because we need speed at WR!) . .. Sabby . . Gaines Adams. . . . these were moves made because the Glazers were "cheap"?Could be wrong, but the only Gruden-era draft picks that survived his tenure were who? Clayton, Joseph, Trueblood, Qunicy Black? Zuttah? and yet, its because "the Glazers were cheap" and "Monte won the battle" and "that was Allen, not Gruden" etc. . . .etc. . . . etc. lol. Guys, Gruden is a good coach BUT . . . . and its a HUGE CAVEAT . . . . he was the most powerful guy in the building at all times after starting with a SB win . . . and yet his kingdom was littered with bad, bad, bad, bad personnel movessaying that Gruden would win with THIS team is like saying cars would be great for traveling the seas . . if they were fish. In other words, the same Gruden that is good with x and o football is also the Gruden that would never have this team, never have drafted Freeman to start or many of the other guys that are now on this team. In 2009 we wouldve rolled with Garcia . . . . hell, he would still be on the team . . . unless Rob Johnson was still around. :-)The Bucs tried to correct the Gruden-era mistakes. They failed, but that doesn't turn Gruden into a great builder of franchises. If anything it just means the Glazers are also flawed . . . oh wait . . I meant "cheap" . . selectively . . .sometimes ::)
Excellent analysis.No one was happier than I at his acquisition....loved the guy for '02. After that, its the same mediocre mess that we've seen from Raheem and Schiano. The fact that the Glazer failed at adequately replacing him in no way dismisses the notion that it was time for him to go.Kinda odd that some fans hold him in the highest esteem yet you rarely hear a former player offer that same level of support.
You say Overtures. I say the Glazers were doing there due diligence.
You say Overtures. I say the Glazers were doing there due diligence.
^this
The entire Gruden discussion is a human nature case study. Gruden nostalgia says "he won a Super Bowl" while ignoring most that followed. Gruden nostalgia says "he won division titles" without acknowledging the 4 and 5 win seasons in between. Gruden nostalgia says "he is a great coach" while explaining away personnel failures with wacky conspiracy theories. Gruden nostalgia says the late season collapse was Kiffin's fault and not the product of having 9 or so starters that were so far past their prime they essentially never played again. When it comes to the Super Bowl, Gruden gets all the credit, he was lord over all he surveyed. When it comes to anything negative, Gruden is the victim .. helpless against the decisions made by those cheap Glazers, his own hand-picked GM (lol), Kiffin, talk radio and those no good fans who drove him away. Human nature. "Glory Days"
That's from February of 2012. A month later the Bucs spent more money in free agency than any other team. Why are you complaining about that year?
More reference to previous years. They had the 2nd most $$$$ available in part do to the amount being rolled over and not spending much (relatively speaking) in previous years
The entire Gruden discussion is a human nature case study. Gruden nostalgia says "he won a Super Bowl" while ignoring most that followed. Gruden nostalgia says "he won division titles" without acknowledging the 4 and 5 win seasons in between. Gruden nostalgia says "he is a great coach" while explaining away personnel failures with wacky conspiracy theories. Gruden nostalgia says the late season collapse was Kiffin's fault and not the product of haing 9 or so starters that were so far past their prime they never played again. When it comes to the Super Bowl, Gruden gets all the credit, he was lord over all he surveyed. When it comes to anything negative, Gruden is the victim .. helpless against the decisions made by those cheap Glazers, his own hand-picked GM (lol), Kiffin, talk radio and those no good fans who drove him away. Human nature. "Glory Days"
that is some good stuff right there!!
The entire Gruden discussion is a human nature case study. Gruden nostalgia says "he won a Super Bowl" while ignoring most that followed. Gruden nostalgia says "he won division titles" without acknowledging the 4 and 5 win seasons in between. Gruden nostalgia says "he is a great coach" while explaining away personnel failures with wacky conspiracy theories. Gruden nostalgia says the late season collapse was Kiffin's fault and not the product of haing 9 or so starters that were so far past their prime they never played again. When it comes to the Super Bowl, Gruden gets all the credit, he was lord over all he surveyed. When it comes to anything negative, Gruden is the victim .. helpless against the decisions made by those cheap Glazers, his own hand-picked GM (lol), Kiffin, talk radio and those no good fans who drove him away. Human nature. "Glory Days"
Except it's a very negative way of assessing the post-Super Bowl Era. He had two seasons of 4 or 5 wins and a total of 4 of 9 or more. Do you trade 3 division titles for 2 awful years? Every time, even if you add the 7-9 year too. He didn't draft well. He was a victim of bad luck with injuries, but his whole demise goes back to the Clayton pick. Take Steven Jackson then Rodgers is the 2005 pick and history is different. Such is life. It's the Lovie Era. Let's hope he is better than all of them.that is some good stuff right there!!
I think at this point in time, everyone can see he was very poor at personnel decisions. I don't see how anyone could argue that point. Good guy, good gameday coach, but keep him away from personnel decisions.
