I get it. Gay men are sexual attracted to other men. So to a straight guy, we think that it is the same as us showering with women....and we know that we'd be totally perving out and horny as hell even if those women were our respected coworkers. So we assume the same can be said for a gay man in shower full of athletic men. Is it true? I don't know. But why can't the showers just have stalls with doors so everyone can shower with privacy and then none of it matters? I fully expect more gay players to start coming out now....so why not be proactive and install shower privacy stalls now and avoid the entire issue?
you do realize we aren't talking about a Lifestyles gym right? these men live a considerable portion of their lives strolling around naked, getting dressed and undressed in tight quarters, receiving medical treatment in areas I didn't know could be injured on a football field. I am assuming you have never spent time in an NFL locker room, because you would understand how absurd you shower door solution is.
I get it. Gay men are sexual attracted to other men. So to a straight guy, we think that it is the same as us showering with women....and we know that we'd be totally perving out and horny as hell even if those women were our respected coworkers. So we assume the same can be said for a gay man in shower full of athletic men. Is it true? I don't know. But why can't the showers just have stalls with doors so everyone can shower with privacy and then none of it matters? I fully expect more gay players to start coming out now....so why not be proactive and install shower privacy stalls now and avoid the entire issue?
you do realize we aren't talking about a Lifestyles gym right? these men live a considerable portion of their lives strolling around naked, getting dressed and undressed in tight quarters, receiving medical treatment in areas I didn't know could be injured on a football field. I am assuming you have never spent time in an NFL locker room, because you would understand how absurd you shower door solution is.
But they did that around guys who are in the closet. Now that one guy can admit it, they want to be up in arms about it?
I get it. Gay men are sexual attracted to other men. So to a straight guy, we think that it is the same as us showering with women....and we know that we'd be totally perving out and horny as hell even if those women were our respected coworkers. So we assume the same can be said for a gay man in shower full of athletic men. Is it true? I don't know. But why can't the showers just have stalls with doors so everyone can shower with privacy and then none of it matters? I fully expect more gay players to start coming out now....so why not be proactive and install shower privacy stalls now and avoid the entire issue?
you do realize we aren't talking about a Lifestyles gym right? these men live a considerable portion of their lives strolling around naked, getting dressed and undressed in tight quarters, receiving medical treatment in areas I didn't know could be injured on a football field. I am assuming you have never spent time in an NFL locker room, because you would understand how absurd you shower door solution is.
But they did that around guys who are in the closet. Now that one guy can admit it, they want to be up in arms about it?
well, if the team mates were in the closet, they wouldn't know to be uncomfortable would they? If you don't know there is a camera in the room, you don't feel uncomfortable being filmed right? Once you know, it affects your behavior. Just like Missouri players didn't have to deal with a media distraction because it wasn't known to folks outside of the locker room. Ignorance is bliss sometimes. To be clear, I am not saying these guys are right, but they are entitled to their opinions, and like all people their concerns have a right to be heard and respected without calling them homophobes or bigots- just like Sam should be free to say he is gay without being called any number of insulting names.
I get it. Gay men are sexual attracted to other men. So to a straight guy, we think that it is the same as us showering with women....and we know that we'd be totally perving out and horny as hell even if those women were our respected coworkers. So we assume the same can be said for a gay man in shower full of athletic men. Is it true? I don't know. But why can't the showers just have stalls with doors so everyone can shower with privacy and then none of it matters? I fully expect more gay players to start coming out now....so why not be proactive and install shower privacy stalls now and avoid the entire issue?
you do realize we aren't talking about a Lifestyles gym right? these men live a considerable portion of their lives strolling around naked, getting dressed and undressed in tight quarters, receiving medical treatment in areas I didn't know could be injured on a football field. I am assuming you have never spent time in an NFL locker room, because you would understand how absurd you shower door solution is.
But they did that around guys who are in the closet. Now that one guy can admit it, they want to be up in arms about it?
well, if the team mates were in the closet, they wouldn't know to be uncomfortable would they? If you don't know there is a camera in the room, you don't feel uncomfortable being filmed right? Once you know, it affects your behavior. Just like Missouri players didn't have to deal with a media distraction because it wasn't known to folks outside of the locker room. Ignorance is bliss sometimes. To be clear, I am not saying these guys are right, but they are entitled to their opinions, and like all people their concerns have a right to be heard and respected without calling them homophobes or bigots- just like Sam should be free to say he is gay without being called any number of insulting names.
Such a simple premise, yet so many let it sail right over their head. I truly have to question the intelligence of those repeating such nonsense as "what about the gay guys in locker rooms already", as several have done. If having this information known before hand didn't change anything, there wouldn't be a single story about it. I've been waiting for a select few to finally come to that realization, but it's apparent they're just fools with an agenda.
Don't like it? Go home and shower. Hard concept to grasp for people.
No matter which side of the fence a person is on that is the dumbest comment and somehow it keeps getting repeated.Ever hear of little things called away games?"Yeah, don't shower. Just sit unwashed on the team bus, then a plane and another bus while flying home to Tampa from Seattle."It's not as simple as jump in the car & wash at home.
Don't like it? Go home and shower. Hard concept to grasp for people.
No matter which side of the fence a person is on that is the dumbest comment and somehow it keeps getting repeated.Ever hear of little things called away games?"Yeah, don't shower. Just sit unwashed on the team bus, then a plane and another bus while flying home to Tampa from Seattle."It's not as simple as jump in the car & wash at home.
They stay at a hotel. You never played football did you?
.... its reading threads like these that make me wanna meet some of these guys in person.
Stop being gay . :P
Don't like it? Go home and shower. Hard concept to grasp for people.
No matter which side of the fence a person is on that is the dumbest comment and somehow it keeps getting repeated.Ever hear of little things called away games?"Yeah, don't shower. Just sit unwashed on the team bus, then a plane and another bus while flying home to Tampa from Seattle."It's not as simple as jump in the car & wash at home.
They stay at a hotel. You never played football did you?
I'm pretty sure they don't go back to the team hotel after the game, they head straight home. Not that it makes any difference, the idea is absurd and anyone who agrees with it is a dumbass.
Pretty sure he said meet not meat.
So because I have a good knowledge base on human sexuality, that makes me confused? Dude, are you f***ing retarded?
You've made the statement that everyone is Bisexual and you are calling others retarded. LOL . Complete falsehood. "Myth # 3: "Everybody is bisexual" Although most people experience an attraction for someone of the same gender at some point in their lives, this does not mean that everyone is bisexual. For most people these feelings pass or change over time without the person ever questioning or redefining their sexual orientations. " http://www.uic.edu/depts/quic/bisandallies/myths.html http://fliponymous.wordpress.com/2012/09/19/everyone-is-not-bisexual-or-kinsey-is-not-the-last-word-in-research/ Besides , a person with a good knowledge base on human sexuality would probably realize the scientific reason for sexuality to begin with. The very basis for human sexuality , it's only biological function , is for the purpose of reproduction. Being gay or attraction towards men does not really serve that purpose . It does exist in a small minority of course , due most likely to hormonal imbalances . That's fine , and no one denies it or wants to punish those people , but it's a FACT that is is not biologically normal. If it was our species would be extinct.So , in short : It is clear that Lord Beavis , once again , is clueless and he mad. I leave you and Hate to carry on with your little gay pride parade now .Feel free to go on accusing anyone who disagrees with you of being gay , and asking to meet other men in person for date night. It's a really solid argument you guys are making . LOL
If being in an NFL locker room shower with another man who is openly gay makes you or anyone else feel uncomfortable, that's perfectly fine with me. I'm just curious as to why it makes them uncomfortable, which no one has explained to me yet. It wouldn't bother me in the least and so I'm curious.
Insecurity, perhaps?
insecurity is an easy go to answer here, almost cliche as a comeback for people who express such misgivings. perhaps it is insecurity- but there are other insecurities that may be at play than their manhood or their suppressed sexuality as every one is so quick to say. perhaps there is just a social insecurity of being around someone so different ( in their eyes) in such a personal and exposed setting. I don't know how many of you have been in locker rooms, or an NFL locker room, but it is a home away from home for these guys. they are very unguarded, and real there, with their language behavior- everything. Perhaps they are insecure that they might say or do the wrong thing. I am sure most of us are slightly different people within the walls of our home and among our families than we are elsewhere. No one likes to feel they are being judged or must be careful with how they behave, especially in so private a setting. When family or friends stay for an extended time, it's always nice when they leave, because I know I am a free to stroll around in my undies or be less guarded with my speech- maybe that is the insecurity.Maybe there is no discernible reason- some people are uncomfortable around clowns for no reason at all. I actually can understand the objections to women reporters much more clearly than the gay team mate, and can agree with those concerns. I just think that name calling on either side is silly. And when folks taunt guys like Vilma, who have the fortitude to be upfront with their reservations, as being a closet gay who is afraid he'll pop a boner or worse a bigot, they are doing just as much to derail open and frank conversation as those who call Sam names.
Finally, someone with a good answer to my question. Thanks for providing it, I'll keep your words in mind.
thanks, it's nice to hear something in the way of honest dialogue about this. in another thread, I was called a "bigot" and " morally gutless" because I had the audacity to say that GM will, and should, have to weigh Sam's coming out and the ensuing press when evaluating his draft status and his fit in a locker room. no amount of logic or reason could move them from their knee jerk reaction of labeling anything they felt was remotely different from their opinion or threatened their black and white world of right and wrong - as hateful. Honest dialogue and open discussion is the only way to grow more tolerant and understanding. Genuine tolerance and acceptance will not come by legislative fiat or social brow beating and name calling, but from honest give and take of opinion, experience and time. Oppressing dissenting opinions or points of view with shame or ostracizing won't lead to changing hearts or minds, just resentment. Too many posters here and people everywhere react to opinions with rabid fervor fueled, I believe, more by a desire to prove their greatness and purity of heart than by a desire to improve the world and create change.
Which is pretty much the only thing that most people on this board have been saying in support of Vilma. That being there are legitimate concerns of an openly gay athlete coming out that would need to be addressed. It is the response to that viewpoint that waylaid this thread.
25 pages about Vilma? ZOMG!
"They stay at a hotel. You never played football did you?"Checkout time is 11:00 AM. You never stayed at a hotel did you?
"They stay at a hotel. You never played football did you?"Checkout time is 11:00 AM. You never stayed at a hotel did you?
Not for VIP's. They waive my late check-out fee if I leave late (before 4 pm). Checkout time is set by the hotel so not all are the same. I typically have a noon checkout time where I say. I don't see how any of this matters to this thread though. ;)
"They stay at a hotel. You never played football did you?"Checkout time is 11:00 AM. You never stayed at a hotel did you?
Not for VIP's. They waive my late check-out fee if I leave late (before 4 pm). Checkout time is set by the hotel so not all are the same. I typically have a noon checkout time where I say. I don't see how any of this matters to this thread though. ;)
Some are arguing that they wouldn't feel comfortable showering in an NFL locker room with an openly gay teammate because it would make them uncomfortable. So the point was made that they could shower elsewhere, but some feel that is too big of an inconvenience.It's literally just a thread of meaningless first-world problems gone mad.
