Hard no.
Defense is a wreck. No offensive players in the first 4 rounds
the problem wasn't trading down, it was how they had their board graded. Kerby Joseph, Trey McBride and Nik Bonitto were available.
I definitely was not criticizing trading down. I was only saying the results of the trade down maybe not that great
and I was providing the context for the "first round DE" .. . . that of course someone like Biggs leaves out
That's a plus-player that Licht, Bowles, and the rest of the defensive scouting department missed out on.
knowingly
Hall is a plus player, so it's actually 3.
Hall is averaging less than three sacks a year since being drafted as a DE. He had a solid - not plus - season in 2024 grading out as the 92nd overall out of 219 DE's, after two duds to start out with. He isn't a plus-player, yet. He's got some work to do to justify his selection.
He had 5.5 last year, give him his credit. And his role isn't as primarily to pass rush. He does the grunt work nobody notices. His ability to shed double teams is impressive. One the Bucs better players.
I did give him credit. After sucking for two seasons, he was solid last season. But nothing special or a plus-player.
The "grunt work" he does is factored into the 92nd ranking among 219 eligible DE's. And there are people that notice and appreciate it, but you don't use your first selection on grunt-work guy. Those guys can found later or in FA.
Hall was a fine pick at 33, but when it comes to your point, the problem wasn't trading down, it was how they had their board graded. Kerby Joseph, Trey McBride and Nik Bonitto were available.
You're not wrong about the board. But you are wrong in that trading down wasn't a problem. That opportunity cost was George Karlaftis, who has averaged over 8 sacks a season to go along with 8 playoff sacks in three seasons. That's a plus-player that Licht, Bowles, and the rest of the defensive scouting department missed out on.
Maybe they shouldn't have taken JTS the year before? Especially after he voluntarily sat out his junior season.
Hard no.
Defense is a wreck. No offensive players in the first 4 rounds
I would be surprised if the Bucs ignore the offense. If they go BAP I can see 1 to 2 players drafted on offense in the first four rounds.
Maybe they shouldn't have taken JTS the year before? Especially after he voluntarily sat out his junior season.
You'll get no argument from me. He's one of the proven defensive duds, along with Devin White. We'll see if Logan Hall joins them or continues to improve.
Maybe they shouldn't have taken JTS the year before? Especially after he voluntarily sat out his junior season.
You'll get no argument from me. He's one of the proven defensive duds, along with Devin White. We'll see if Logan Hall joins them or continues to improve.
People like you said Bowles sucked because the defense was loaded with talent.
Yes I very much understand odds. Just like I'd say it's safe to say Carter or Hunter will also have a better career than anyone at 19.
Using the 1996-2020 drafts, there have only been 4 drafts where any of the first two non QBs drafted had a better PFR wAV than any non QB drafted after 19. That's 16%. Do you actually understand the odds?
Would you like to make the bet?
I understand odds just fine.
You get the 14 worst teams (like the last picks of the first) and I get the Ravens, Bills, and Lions.
You've got the odds, right? Let me know how much you'd like to wager
Hard no.
Defense is a wreck. No offensive players in the first 4 rounds
I get the notion and it logically makes sense... But I cannot stomach another Licht whiff at DE. He has whiffed many times... Diaby is his best pick sadly.
Yes I very much understand odds. Just like I'd say it's safe to say Carter or Hunter will also have a better career than anyone at 19.
Using the 1996-2020 drafts, there have only been 4 drafts where any of the first two non QBs drafted had a better PFR wAV than any non QB drafted after 19. That's 16%. Do you actually understand the odds?
Would you like to make the bet?
I understand odds just fine.
You get the 14 worst teams (like the last picks of the first) and I get the Ravens, Bills, and Lions.
You've got the odds, right? Let me know how much you'd like to wager
I will also make the the bet that Carter or Hunter have a better rookie campaign than anyone drafted between picks 19-32.
You get 13 picks, all the pff advanced voodoo metrics on your side and I get 2 players.
Grading it won't be easy as PFF is not always the best but I'd be fine using them + stats.
Sacks, tackles, int and whatever + pro bowl or all pro value as well.
Messy math but either way I'm happy to take this line of betting against you, you smarmy little wanker.
(Or you can switch it to Hunter and Tet, whichever you like since he's I guess not an elite talent in your eyes compared to unproven ends or a safety playing alongside loaded roster)
Hard no.
Defense is a wreck. No offensive players in the first 4 rounds
I get the notion and it logically makes sense... But I cannot stomach another Licht whiff at DE. He has whiffed many times... Diaby is his best pick sadly.
There is no quick fix on defense honestly from this draft. With like 4-5 blue chip players and 15 players with first round grades this draft is about developing players with upside to be solid players.
The strength of this draft is rounds 2-5 and for that reason if the Bucs do not draft a defensive player in round 1 it doesn't mean they do not address defense.
I can see the Bucs drafting Tet in round 1 if he falls and then in round 2 drafting another Edge. Round 3 they go for a DB and round 4 they go ILB with round 5 going OL to develop along with Haggard and Klein on the interior.
The strength of this draft is rounds 2-5 and for that reason if the Bucs do not draft a defensive player in round 1 it doesn't mean they do not address defense.
Isn't this how the draft sets up well for the Bucs, except maybe at edge? They need DBs an ILB and depth, all positions that should have some good options in those rounds.
Hard no.
Defense is a wreck. No offensive players in the first 4 rounds
I get the notion and it logically makes sense... But I cannot stomach another Licht whiff at DE. He has whiffed many times... Diaby is his best pick sadly.
There is no quick fix on defense honestly from this draft. With like 4-5 blue chip players and 15 players with first round grades this draft is about developing players with upside to be solid players.
The strength of this draft is rounds 2-5 and for that reason if the Bucs do not draft a defensive player in round 1 it doesn't mean they do not address defense.
I can see the Bucs drafting Tet in round 1 if he falls and then in round 2 drafting another Edge. Round 3 they go for a DB and round 4 they go ILB with round 5 going OL to develop along with Haggard and Klein on the interior.
Exactly what I'm thinking if Tet is there. You get a generational talent and then stack the Defense with depth after.
Tet isn't making it to 19 tho. He's not getting past Carolina.
You get a generational talent
I dont think you ever pass on that
Panthers drafted Legette last year so they might consider passing on Tet. Panthers need help on defense so it will be interesting to see for sure.
