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SR’s Fab 5 is a collection of inside scoop, analysis and insight from yours truly, PewterReport.com publisher and Bucs beat writer Scott Reynolds. Here are a few things that caught my attention this week at One Buc Place and around the NFL.

FAB 1. Bucs Trade Rumors

The NFL trading deadline is next Tuesday, October 30 at 4:00 p.m., and as of right now, expect the Bucs to be rather passive barring a calamity in Cincinnati with injuries that forces general manager Jason Licht to make some moves in an attempt to salvage the season – win or lose.

“Jason and his staff are working on that,” Bucs head coach Dirk Koetter said. “Jason has talked to me about a couple guys, but I personally am not involved in that right now other than to listen to whatever they want to tell me because we’re busy doing our other thing. I can assure you that Jason’s looking into all avenues and it’s his job to make decisions that are best for the Bucs. I trust him to make those decisions because he’s good at that.”

An Internet report surfaced on Thursday suggesting that DeSean Jackson was on the trading block, citing frustration with quarterback Jameis Winston’s inability to hit him with the deep ball. While the latter part of that statement may be true, Jackson is not on the trading block for a couple of reasons.

The first of which is the fact that the Bucs love their depth at receiver. There are still 10 games to go, and if Jackson were traded and Mike Evans were to miss some time with an injury, all of a sudden Tampa Bay’s receiving corps is reduced to Chris Godwin and Adam Humphries as the starters with Justin Watson as the No. 3. The Bucs would have to bring back Freddie Martino or bring Bobo Wilson up from the practice squad to go to a four-wide receiver set.

While Jackson isn’t being utilized the way he was with Ryan Fitzpatrick and the deep connections against New Orleans and Philadelphia, Jackson did score on a 14-yard end around against Cleveland and had a key 14-yard catch to set up Chandler Catanzaro’s 59-yard game-winner in overtime.

“Every game is different depending on the defense,” Koetter said. “If you remember in the very first drive, the very first time we had him open and Jameis [Winston] overthrew him. Then going this other way later in the game it was a pretty good throw, DeSean had is hands on it – [Denzel] Ward actually made a heck of a play on that. That’s why Ward was drafted where he was drafted. He made a nice play.

“DeSean had a touchdown, had a big play at the end, probably could’ve had two other touchdowns if we execute a little bit better. The other team’s getting paid as well. We played 95 snaps on offense, so we’ve got to rotate those guys and as much as DeSean’s running deep routes, probably somewhere 40ish is probably a good number for him. We have packages. We have stuff where we think this ball is going to go to Mike, we think this ball is going to go to DeSean, think it’s going to go to Chris, think it’s going to O.J. [Howard], but ultimately we don’t get to pick. The defense can take a guy out by rolling it, doubling it, etcetera. We try to even it out, it’s never going to be perfect.”

Jackson still plays a vital role on the team with his speed, drawing safety help away from Evans and Godwin as decoy on some plays.

Bucs WR DeSean Jackson - Photo by: Mary Holt/PR
Bucs WR DeSean Jackson – Photo by: Mary Holt/PR

Secondly, Jackson will still be owed $6.1875 million after Sunday’s game at Cincinnati. Only about 15 teams have the necessary cap room to acquire Jackson’s salary in a trade. Eleven of those teams reside in the AFC, which is where Licht would ship him if he’s inclined to pursue a trade, which I don’t believe he will. Out of those 11, only a handful would probably be interested in Jackson.

Have the Bucs fielded inquiry calls about Jackson? I’m guessing they have, as teams like to poke and prod around the trade deadline to see who’s available. When the phone rings, you answer it.

Is Jackson on the trading block with the Bucs calling around other teams to try to unload him? No, they’re not.

Jackson has one more year left on his three-year contract, but the Bucs can release him or trade him next year with no dead cap ramifications and save $10 million towards their 2019 cap if they so choose. If they traded him now, the Bucs would save $6.1875 million on this year’s cap, but Tampa Bay still has over $6 million worth of cap space, so it’s not like it needs the room right now.

The Bucs will need to find some cap room next year for contract extensions for middle linebacker Kwon Alexander and left tackle Donovan Smith, in addition to taking on the $20.92 million reserved for Winston. They might need Jackson’s $10 million in 2019, but he still has value to the team in 2018.

The Bucs won’t be trading Humphries, either. The running joke is that New England head coach Bill Belichick hasn’t met a quick, undersized white receiver he hasn’t loved – referencing former Patriots receivers Wes Welker and Danny Amendola, and current pass-catcher Julian Edelman.

Bucs WR Adam Humphries – Photo by: Cliff Welch/PR
Bucs WR Adam Humphries – Photo by: Cliff Welch/PR

Yet it would take a premium draft pick to pry one of Winston’s favorite and most-trusted receivers from the Buccaneers. Licht won’t be parting ways with Humphries, who signed a one-year deal worth $2.914 million as a restricted free agent because the Bucs are hopeful that they can sign him to a long-term deal in the offseason before he hits free agency if the numbers work out for both sides.

The only player I could see Tampa Bay deal right now given their injury situation at several positions is defensive end Noah Spence, the second-rounder from the 2016 draft. Spence has regressed from his rookie season when he recorded 5.5 sacks and three forced fumbles despite playing with a shoulder that kept going in and out of socket. Spence played in a handful of games last year before going on injured reserve and needing a second shoulder surgery, but only recorded one sack-fumble, which came in the season opener.

While Spence is fully healthy this year, and added 20 pounds of size to hold up better against the run, he had a poor preseason in which he logged just half a sack despite getting plenty of opportunities in all four games. Once a second-rounder, Spence would have little trade value right now I’m guessing.

And with Licht and Koetter’s jobs on the line, don’t look for them to trade backup quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick. He’s too valuable to part ways with this year in case Winston gets hurt.

So will the Bucs be active on the trade market in terms of acquiring a player or two? You could make the case that Tampa Bay could use a cornerback like New York’s Janoris Jenkins, a running back like Buffalo’s LeSean McCoy or a strong safety like Oakland’s Karl Joseph or New York’s Landon Collins.

Licht has already swung a trade with Giants general manager David Gettleman for defensive end Jason Pierre-Paul, dealing the Bucs’ 2018 third-round pick. Why not offer a 2019 third-round pick for Collins or Jenkins to see if the Giants bite? The fact that the Bucs travel to New York to play the Giants might be a bit of a barrier in any trade, but with the G-Men’s season already over at 1-6, it shouldn’t be.

I really liked the hard-hitting Joseph, a former first-round pick, coming out of West Virginia and he had two decent years with the Raiders before landing in Jon Gruden’s doghouse. I bet he could be had for a Day 3 pick next year and could come in and compete with Jordan Whitehead for the strong safety job.

Bucs GM Jason Licht - Photo by: Cliff Welch/PR
Bucs GM Jason Licht – Photo by: Cliff Welch/PR

I have no doubt that Licht did his due diligence and called good friend Steve Keim out in Arizona to inquire about the availability of cornerback Patrick Peterson last week, only to find out that the Cardinals are keeping their best player. That’s a smart move on Keim’s part as Peterson is still one of the best shutdown cornerbacks in the game.

It will be interesting to see what happens over the next couple of days and if Licht ends up pulling the trigger on a trade. But unless there is another major injury in Sunday’s game, don’t bet the mortgage on it happening.

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Scott Reynolds is in his 23rd year of covering the Tampa Bay Buccaneers as the vice president, publisher and senior Bucs beat writer for PewterReport.com. Author of the popular SR's Fab 5 column on Fridays, Reynolds oversees web development and forges marketing partnerships for PewterReport.com in addition to his editorial duties. A graduate of Kansas State University in 1995, Reynolds enjoys giving back to the community as the defensive line coach for his sons' Pop Warner team, the South Pasco Predators. Reynolds can be reached at: [email protected]

94 COMMENTS

  1. No Shady McCoy, please. Guy is a monster for what he did to his girlfriend. Plus, what would he do behind this O-line?

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    • Agree. Shady is not the guy anymore. He might have 1 season left. Let him go somewhere else and be someone else’s headache.

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  2. We have to give Winston – heck any QB a decent running game before we can evaluate him. Most of his interceptions are in the middle of the field where linebackers drop into coverage. Those become easy throws when linebackers don’t drop into coverage and actually try to stop the run. No team fears our running and hence are happy to drop their linebackers. We have no play action, we can’t run from from Shot gun hence passing the ball becomes that more difficult. But yes he needs to make better decisions and throw the ball away or take a sack every now and then when the throw is too difficult. I’m happy that he is not fumbling the ball anymore though. In the previous seasons, almost every sack was a fumble.

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    • This is his forth year, and he’s knocking on the door of setting a NFL turn over record.

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      • And in those 4 years what was our running record? I’m not saying he is awesome or anything but if you want to cut down his turnovers then start helping him with a run game so that he will throw less. Oh btw that will also help our defense. Stats don’t tell you the whole story.

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      • Amen jlog! Winston had a pretty good runner his rookie year and still tossed 15 picks. As a rookie, you get a pass. Three years on and with recent rules changes and new schemes a franchise QB who wants to get paid needs one trait above all others — accuracy. Great and even good WRs can be unstoppable with today’s pick (oops, I mean “rub”) routes, favorable PI rules and RPO schemes. All those positives go out the window when you beat yourself with off-target throws. JW has all the arm strength and mobility he needs, but even with his improved completion rate he has average-at-best accuracy. He rarely hits receivers in stride and is pretty awful when throwing deep. Fitz’s iffy arm on an accuracy streak showed what can be with the Bucs receiving riches (Evans, Jackson, Howard, Godwin, Brate and Humphries… insane!). Let someone else pay $20M+ in hopes JW realizes his potential… draft/sign greater accuracy and ball placement… while spending the savings elsewhere.

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  3. Let’s face it, the BUCS are in trouble. The defensive injuries are just brutal through the first 6 games, and they have to make it through 10 more games with a patchwork group & a shit load of rookies starting. I got to believe more injuries are coming with 3/4 of the season left.

    Not being able to run the ball at all is killing the offense. The BUCS caught their opponents off guard the first 2 weeks, but the NFL quickly adjusts. Winston certainly doesn’t look the same as he did at the end of 2017, but you ask any QB to throw 40-50 times with no real threat to run and you’re asking for disaster!! The team is putting Winston in a bad position, because it is ALL up to him to move the ball.

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    • Consider this – When Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, Phillip Rivers, Jared Goff or Aaron Rodgers throws it 40-50 times in a game, they win. Those QB’s have been very efficient when throwing it a bunch this season. Only Goff has a legit rushing attack this year that could single handedly win a game for the team. The rest of them have rushing attacks that work because of the passing attack.

      Quit making excuses for Jameis. If he’s throwing it 40 times, you’d think he would get better at it.

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      Rating: -12. From 44 votes.
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      • Consider this – All those in that list except Rodgers have atleast one RB to whom who you can dump it off or give a screen pass and you will get 10-15 yards easy. We dont have such a pass catching RB threat. A two yard pass to flat for all those team results in a first down but for our team it results in 2nd and 8 or worse.

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      • Bucwild02, I completely agree with you. All I ever hear at excuses. When Fitz was playing great all I heard was its the play calling, Winston can do it also. Then when given the opportunity its excuse after excuse. We have no defense, no running game, no Oline. Guess what, Fitz had none of those things either the first 2 games and was able to maximize our offensive capability. Now that Winston can’t its all excuses. Quit making excuses and start holding him accountable.

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      • Are you serious? Every one of those teams besides Aaron Rodgers has a run game? Brees has Kamara and Ingram, Mahomes has Kareem hunt, Brady has Sony
        Michale and James white, Geoff has Gurley and

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      • Are you serious? Every one of those teams besides Aaron Rodgers has a run game? Brees has Kamara and Ingram, Mahomes has Kareem hunt, Brady has Sony
        Michale and James white, Geoff has Gurley and rovers has Gordon and Austin Ekler, spelling. So your statement makes zero sense. In fact I saw a star that 70 percent of Geoff’s yards come off ply action. Imagine that…. so yes, a running game benifits anwuarterback greatly!!

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        • Sorry for all the terrible typos. Typing on a phone with wide thumbs proves tricky at times lol

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        • I bet if Tom Brady or any other capable QB were here, we’d all be putting Peyton Barber on our fantasy team because he would be killing it and catching tons of passes, just like James White is. It ISN’T James White that makes Tom Brady Great. Its Tom Brady.

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    • As I said in a post before the season started we lead the NFL in IR every year. I don’t believe in curses and hexes, but I do believe that only leaves out training and medical staffs. They must really suck, but no one mentions it.

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      • Except we aren’t leading in injury categories. Tampa was middle of the pack last year in man-games lost due to injury. https://twitter.com/ManGamesLostNFL/status/951253740933312512

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      • Not only that, from 2009-2016 Tampa was middle of the pack as well in total man games lost (how can they be middle of the pack and lead every year). https://twitter.com/ManGamesLostNFL/status/825129590922305538

        So quit it with the “my feelings are facts” based arguments.

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        • Like all stats, they can obscure reality. If a team suffers its IR losses early in the season, even if only a couple players are lost, even if it’s only scrubs list, they lead in man games lost. But another team that loses a bunch of key starters to IR in the last month of the season looks like a winner

          Stats don’t lie, but taken singly or out of context of other factors do mis-represent reality.

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  4. “He has all the talent in the world, he can make all the throws and is a tremendous leader, but Winston simply can’t turn the ball over with such a high frequency rate.

    History suggests that Winston won’t stop committing turnovers.”

    Close to what I have been writing, yet I get crucified on this. Winston can make most throws, not all. If you look at Winston over 25 yards passing in the air, he becomes pretty inaccurate. On the previous page, the writers mention that Jackson with Winston has not been very useful. It has to do with Winston’s accuracy over 25 yards – it just is not there. It just makes Jackson go crazy. On passes less the 25 yards what is not quite understandable, Jackson doesn’t seem to catch the ball. That makes no sense to me (end zone drop was under 25 yards).

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    • For me, life is a work in progress. I want to weigh in on one thing though. I believe there is a difference between leadership and energy. Jameis has a lot of energy. Energy can temporarily excite those around you, but it won’t make those around you perform better consistently. Leadership really has more to do with trust, accountability, and charisma. Jameis just doesn’t inspire those around him to take it to the next level. Sorry. He just doesn’t. That’s why people argued against taking Fitz out. His leadership was obvious. The team responded to him. They trusted him. He was accountable. He was charismatic. He wasn’t an energy guy, unless you count the 15 seconds after a great play. His teammates saw that. That felt EARNED. It didn’t feel forced or fake. It was authentic. Just my two cents.

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  5. I think the bucs stand pat and dont trade anything. If DeSean wants to complain about tha, how about he holds on to the ball that he had for a td this week? Hit him right in the bread basket and he dropped it. As for the Jameis int.s they clealry have to stop, but there is something here you aren’t looking at Scott. No team is asking g their qb to throw it more than the bucs. You realize Jameis is averaging 47 last attempts a game!? Cam newton , 28. Jameis dropped back 62 times last week and we want to complain about 2 pick, one that was Rojas fault? A little balance is needed and Jameis is throwing any too much.

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    • Lol. DJax is trying to get traded. He must love playing with Jameis!

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  6. Fab 1: Let’s face it, Desean Jackson is right. Winston can’t hit deep receivers in stride. It’s so rare for him. That being said, Desean Jackson to Houston for a 1st round pick looks pretty good right now. A classic win-win if Will Fuller did tear his ACL as feared. Jackson is exactly the player that could fill Fuller’s position on a team that has firepower on both sides of the ball in a weak division. The Bucs get something out of Jackson instead of frustration when Jameis is under center.

    Fab 2 : Leopards can’t change their spots. SR said Jameis can make all the throws, but I disagree. He doesn’t throw a great ball. His deep pass is wildly erratic and he is late on his other throws which puts his receivers into unnecessary jeopardy. Because he holds on to it for too long, he gets sacked and stripped a lot, which makes his O-Line look bad. Last, he stares down receivers. He either can’t or won’t look off a safety.

    Fab 3 : Duffner and his defensive gameplan were better although Cleveland isn’t very good offensively. I will add that Bucs D let the dawgs out. Maybe that’s Duffner’s attitude. It sure wasn’t McCoy. McCoy was NOT missed. There’s another player to trade.

    Fab 5 : Gruden. Crying Carr will be gone next year because he’s soft. He’s a “praise Jesus” guy which isn’t a Gruden fit. Nothing against religion, but I don’t see Gruden putting a lot of faith(pun intended) into someone who plays soft, talks soft, acts soft and is constantly thumping a bible. Sure, Brooks was deeply religious, but he’d knock the snot out of you and he DIDN’T help you up. Big difference.

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    • Jameis he doesn’t need to hold on to the ball to make this o line look bad, they do that themselves. Did you watch these past three games? The online has been a turnstile and if Jameis did t have good wheels to escape the pocket wed have given up like 8 sacks last week, but you dial to me tion that. You probably thought the 2.02 seconds Jameis had on the Myles garret sack was plenty of time to throw the ball. Ill agree ,his deep ball isnt good or consistent but saying he cant throw long is completely wrong. No one has more air yards a throw than Jameis. It also might help if we had ANY threat of a running game to play with. Again, no qb in the NFL is asked to throw even remotely the amount of times Jameis is.

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      • Aaron Rodgers has NO rushing attack. His Oline is also not great. He’s still extremely efficient though. I can list 10 more guys that aren’t Aaron Rodgers but ask yourself this…

        If Brady/Brees/Rodgers/Mahomes/Goff/Rivers/Luck/Ryan/Cousins/Watson were here, would there be a discussion about failed deep balls and bad turnovers?

        Then ask yourself a second question…

        If Eli/Bortles/Stafford/Carr/Mariotta/Bradford/Taylor were here, would the results be about the same?

        Winston clearly belongs in one of these groups. Can you see which one?

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        • Um luck,Brady, and brees had more interceptions in his first three seasons that Jameis so please let’s do talk about it. Heck Roger’s didnt even play for three seasons so that comparison doesnt even work. As for the rest of those guys, my point still stands. NONE of them throw the ball even remotely as much as Jameis and that’s a fact. I’m not saying g Jameis doesnt have his flaws as he does, but dont compare the offensive lines after watching ours as they cant even run block and the right side of our line is a gaping hole.

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          • Winston has to throw it more. He puts his team in a hole constantly with turnovers. His first NFL pass attempt was a pick 6, but that wasn’t his fault right? Lol. Homer.

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          • Who had more wins? Luck, Rodgers, Brady or Winston?

            I can hear you firing up all the excuses now.

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          • Buc n wild- Peyton Manning’s first career throw was a pick 6 so I guess that means he sucks too

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        • Aaron Rodgers is also hurt now due to his shitty O Line. Come on! You can’t even make that comparison anyway. There are only 3 QB’s of Rodgers level in the NFL now anyway. And Rodgers has not had a good year.
          You can dislike Winston all you want but he is the best QB this Team has ever had (as a starter, don’t count Steve Young) and if we put ANY semblance of an O Line and run game and he would be TITS!!!

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          • Lol. It’s frustrating for sure. Im not a Winston hater. Im not a Mariotta guy. Winston’s just not very good. Just my observation.
            Luck was much better in his first 3 seasons. So was Brady. He won a superbowl in his second year in the league for Pete’s sake! Watson, Rivers, Brees, Mahomes, Goff, Ryan have all been better their first 3 seasons(so far).

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          • Winston has all the weapons and what has he won.. NOT the best qb ever!!

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      • Same O line played for Fitz, and Fitz played better than Winston.

        The Winston fan boys have done nothing but make excuses, point fingers, and project future greatness for four years running, but it’s always the SOS – same old shit.

        WYSIWYG

        I never bought the BS 4 years ago, still not buyin’ it now.

        The team owners need to fire Licht and his coaches, and trade Winston. If people think we’re having trouble now affording quality players, both new hires, and paying our quality players on the roster now, it is going to be much harder when we have to pay a mediocre uncoachable quarterback upwards of $21 to $25M a year

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    • What???? No is giving up a 1st rounder for DJax! Maybe a 3rd rounder….maybe.

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      • Gruden just got a 1st rounder for Amari Cooper. Concussion. Drops. Slower this year. It’s a deal they couldn’t refuse. They do everything big in Texas!

        Truth be told, I think a 3rd round pick might be worth it. It’s better than the nothingburger the Bucs will get when they cut him after another failed season with Jameis.

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    • Yes! Houston has cap room for DJax and Jackson would love playing with a young gun who can aim. Might even make Bucs more willing to go after a CB or G for the home stretch and future. Here’s hoping…

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  7. If Winston can make all the throws why can’t he hit DJax? Winston struggles mightily hitting targets in stride with good ball placement maybe.

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  8. Trade Spence to a 3-4 defensive team and get what you can get. The people in charge may have no interest in doing it. Getting a fourth round pick for the 2019 draft may not concern the current regime; especially if they have the sense that they are going to be gone after the season. With the head coach making comments like, “Winston’s going to be around long after I am gone.” Belichick would never say that even if it was true. He has a competitive attitude just as strong as Brady’s. You got to be interested in surviving to retain your job. With the head defensive coordinator gone, you bet that these antsy owners that normally only give a two year judgement period are already looking for replacement options for the entire front office and current coaching staff.

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  9. Before we pin the rose on Winston here, let’s look at the play of the offensive line and their ability to hold blocks coming off the edge or pick up blitzes. Let’s not even entertain DJAX and his history of complaining about his starting QBs. Every pre-madona receiver in this league complains at some point or another but trading him when we have one of the deadliest passing attacks out there would be a pretty historic “dumb ass buc” move and if there is anyone we should be considering to trade on the offensive side…”maybe” Cameron Brate even though I like him a lot. We trade DJAX and our fastest wide out is gone, he not only is a threat to catch passes but also disrupts coverages where others like the Godwins and Humpheries and Howards of the world can get open. We trade him and then it will turn into another Winston attempting to throw to Mike Evans 9/10 times we throw. Why have we not heard of us making a run at any of these DBs out there? Lastly, and this is going back to Winston, someone alluded to the fact that YES!, when you’re asking your QB to throw 50 times a game and put up 30 plus points because the defense hasn’t been worth a damn, expect a few of the balls to not be perfect and yes, this means some mistakes and some picks unfortunately. We scored 27 in a loss to Pittsburgh and 29 in a loss to Atlanta, the problem here ultimately is defensively, though there are some blown assignments and some mistakes on the offensive side, it’s not like we are not scoring points here. We need 2 more splash players on defense and the run game COULD be effective if we didn’t abandon it so much especially if it has some success early in games.

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    • Just a quick note…It’s not “pre-madona”, as in before Madonna. Its “prima donna”. Has to do with lead opera singers being ego driven.

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      • Ok, but you understated where I was going and where I was getting at…..my apologies for the bad grammar people

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        • “understood” correction ha ha

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        • Just trying to help a brotha out!

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  10. The Bucs are on a trajectory to throw 29 picks this year – Fitz has 5 and Winston has 6 – that’s Testerverde territory and we don’t want to go there. That has to change if the Bucs envision any chance of making the playoffs this year.
    Yes, interceptions are bad and 29 INTs would be catastrophic, but let’s not panic or all get aboard the “Get rid of Winston” train just yet!
    Let’s take a look at some of the NFL greats over their first three seasons. Keep in mind that this is the beginning of Winston’s 4th season.

    INTs over 1st 3 seasons:

    Dan Marino: 61
    Peyton Manning: 58
    John Elway: 52
    Brett Favre: 51
    Jameis Winston: 48

    Winston has been a knucklehead off the field and that is behavior that has to stop and stop now. It created a needless distraction that has perhaps contributed to Winston’s late and erratic start.
    I rewatched the Browns game and came away with a slightly different opinion than I had at games end. Winston completed 32 of 52 passes for a 66.2 percent completion rate for 365 yards and no TDs, 2 INTs, and a fumble. But for the fumble and the INTs, it would have been a different game and it would have been a different game If Catanzaro had made the 40yd FG that would have ended the game and prevented the ugly we saw from Winston in OT.

    Winston led the team in rushing with 55 yds rushing. Why? Because ROG Caleb Bennenoch couldn’t block a street cone and Winston was pressured most of the day as DE Myles Garrett whipped OT Donovan Smith like a rented mule all afternoon which led to his one fumble of the day.

    Does any of that excuse Winston from turning the ball over. No, but it does contribute to it. If I sound like I’m making excuses for his bad play, I’m not. It is there for all to see. At the end of the day he is responsible for protecting the ball. Pretty sure he would like to have the INTs back and he must surely change the trajectory he is on now. but let’s not pretend turnovers automatically determine a QB as a bust. Gunslinger QBs are going to throw INTs, but they can also go on to be great as shown by the HOFers mention here. Let’s hope that is the case for Winston too. Go Bucs!

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    • Lol. You compared Winston to a gunslinger. HOF gunslingers actually! That’s funny.

      Favre, Marino, and Elway had tremendous arm talent. Canton level arm talent.
      Peyton was a coach on the field. Also, Canton level.

      No one is going to be putting a yellow jacket on Winston at this point based on his arm talent. Actually, he’s one accusation away from being suspended indefinitely.

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      • True BucWild but let’s be real, did anyone know those were going to be HOF’s in their first 3 seasons? Magic 8 ball says “probably not”.

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        • No, but the interceptions stat tells part of the story. In their first 3 years, all of the listed QB’s showed massive improvement and cut their INT’s about in half. They all had three times as many 4th quarter or game winning drives. They also were winners. They lead their teams to victory. It’s not a valid comparison.

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        • Actually, people thought the first three were destined to be HOFers after year 3….

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      • No, I compared the number of INTs they threw in their 1st three years. Nothing else. Sorry to disappoint!

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        • Macabee-I aint mad at you. Im just saying its not a valid argument. Those guys all cut their int’s to about half. Favre actually passed for 38 TDs and 13 INTs in his 3rd year.

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        • Mac- trying to discuss Winston logically with BucWild is a dead end. His facts are eschew & twisted to make his arguments. If you watch the games you’re dead on.

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          • I havent twisted or misused a fact Mudman. I think the eschew facts are comparing Elway and Marino to Winston.

            I wonder, did Winston pass for more yardage than Johnny Unitas in his first 3 seasons? How about Ron Jaworski? He must be in the same class then. Better even!

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      • Good job proving despite stats and anything else others through at you, you fire up your own excuses why they dont count. Hater. It’s easy to spot those like you.

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        • Winston is 19-28 as a Bucs starter. With the EXACT same team around him, JOURNEYMAN RYAN FITZPATRICK is 4-3. Thats the only stat i care about.

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    • Hello Mac, I think you make a reasonable statement but I do disagree. There are times when historical data is useful and there are also times when it’s not. I think it is safe to say the game has changed and continues to change dramatically in terms of talent, rules, systems,etc..Has the NFL ever been a passing league and defenses so ordinary as today? Who was the last team that had a true CONSISTENT shutdown defense? Winston may be a late bloomer and become slightly better than average but at what cost. Look at the talent we have at WR and TE. Also in this QB discussion you can’t leave out bad coaching. There are several younger QBs that are more talented in terms of performance than Winston. New coaches with rookie QBs are playing better. Winston DOES NOT have the “it” factor; the list you provided did.

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      • And you make a reasonable statement as well. I am simply saying at this point in their careers, Winston has the same opportunity to be great. You/and or others may be saying he does not and you’ve seen enough to be sure. On that point, I disagree. And I conclude in my original post that I hope that to be true as I don’t know the future. You may be right. Time will tell. I’m willing to wait and see. Good looking out, my friend. Go Bucs!

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    • The Buccaneers released a mashup video on Facebook for every offensive snap of the Browns game. In a majority of the snaps, Jameis was under duress in less than 3 seconds. How can people expect there to be even an opportunity to throw a deep ball?

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    • A voice of calm reason on the Red Board. Thank you.

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    • Besides the uproariously laughable notion that Winston belongs in a list of HOF great quarterbacks of all time, cough cough … you are completely offbase in comparing the type of football played by all those guys. They came up in an era when defense dominated the game, whereas today offense completely dominates the game of NFL football, moreso this season than any other. We all know that.

      You have to compare Winston to other quarterbacks playing today of similar experience. Winston has played in the league since 2015 – care to guess which NFL quarterback is tied for first in the entire league in INTs and giveaways? That would be Jameis Winston, tied with … cough cough… Blake Bortles, considered by the entire NFL universe as a clear bust.

      Look at all the other young quarterbacks in the league who’ve been lighting it up since Winston entered in 2015, but are not turnover machines, and are producing many wins for their teams. Guys like Patricki Mahomes, Carson Wentz, Deshaun Watson, Jared Goff. These are Winston’s peers for the last several years. They are collectively putting up better stats than the old HOFers not because they are better player, but because the NFL offense of today has all the advantages over defenses.

      30 years ago a player putting up 2,500 yards in passing was considered very good … today the standard is 4,000 yards, even 5,000 + yards of passing. We no longer have dominant running backs the likes of Eric Dickerson, any RB who puts up 1,000 yards in a season is considered a star today. The NFL has become a passing dominant league. We all know that.

      And so Winston suffers in comparison with his contemporary peers.

      He is probably not a “bust” on an absolute basis, but he is clearly a bust in comparison to the “Winston is the greatest all time Buc” that his fanboys routinely proclaim, apparently with a straight face.

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      • What is uproariously laughable is that you cannot comprehend a simple post. The subject of the article is Winston’s turnovers, more specifically, his INTs.

        My post simply says that at this point in Winston’s career, he has thrown fewer INTs than some of the NFL greats and that if he were to change the arc of his current trajectory, I would hope that he could have similar success. No other comparisons were made.

        Your unmistakable bias or otherwise ignorance of the facts would not allow you to see that or as a Buc fan wish him success in the future. By your own admission, you have never liked the pick and perhaps you would waste time proclaiming Mariota was the better pick. Please don’t waste mine with that laughable notion!

        Hey, I get it. You don’t like Winston and I think it safe to say if he knew how you felt about him, he wouldn’t like you either. As for me, the few times I’ve read your posts, my honest opinion, you couldn’t find your a$$ if I tied both hands behind your back when it comes to this subject. Pretty sure you won’t have any trouble comprehending this post!!!!

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        • Break it up you two. Lol.

          Era’s are different and so it’s hard to compare. I get it macabee…you are hopeful for Winston and want him to succeed. Most on here do. I know I do. I just get frustrated watching him play. The point about the INT’s though is a false equivalency. I could point these facts out…

          Ryan Leaf only had 36 INT’s in his first 3 seasons.
          Jamarcus Russell had 23 INT’s in his first 3 seasons.
          Christian Ponder had 34 INT’s in his first 3 seasons.

          All former 1st round picks with Russell going 1st overall. After 3 years, you can see what kind of player you picked. The guys on your list were considered greats at that stage and they maintained that level of greatness. Winston is a middling QB. I hope he changes but so far he is who he is.

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          • As I watch the Cinncy game today, I have to admit I’m wrong about Winston. He is imploding. He is playing god awful. Can’t defend the indefensible. You are obviously right. Not to proud to admit that I couldn’t see all the flaws – demonstrated right before my eyes today. Oh well, back to the drawing board. lol.

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        • I have no bias. I have eyes and a brain. Winston in no way shape or form belongs in any comparative discusion of HOF greats who came up in an entirely different era of defensive dominance.

          Unlike you I used my brain and common sense to compare Winston with his contemporaries …. and he suffers greatly in that comparison.

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          • I owe you an apology for having a bad day yesterday. The language I used is not my normal diplomatic approach in discussion – even in argument. Had nothing to do with your position, but all to do with my emotional state at the time. So again I sincerely apologize if you were offended in any way. Your opinion is respected even when I disagree.

            After yesterday’s game your argument regarding Winston as a wise pick holds water. He was horrible yesterday. I do still think you are carrying my eval too far. Never meant to compare Winston as a complete QB to the greats. Just said he had thrown fewer INTs. Anyway, we agree to disagree and I do so respectfully!

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  11. First off I wish all of the football experts would quit behaving like the Bucs barely beat a sub par SEC team last week.
    The Browns were 2 and 4 with three of their games going into OT. Against the Steelers, who they also took into OT, Big Ben threw 3 INTs against the Browns.
    I’m not saying Winston doesn’t need to steop throwing INT’s, but he also dropped back over 50 times last week to toss the rock.
    How about some balance.
    I did watch the replay of the Bucs game to see what happened on his first INT near the end of the first half.
    The decision to throw the ball to Howard was not bad but either the throw or the route Howard ran was.
    If Howard was supposed to break the route off in front of the LB the throw was good.
    But if the route called for him to continue on the toss was bad but the decision was good because there was nobody between Howard and the goal line if Winston puts about one more foot of air under it.
    So instead of working out on his INT’s, why don’t you ask a simple question to Winston to see what caused them.

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    • Have you ever heard on confirmation bias? I voted “like” for your post because I feel sorry for you.

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      • That’s just dumb….

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  12. Maybe bucs could trade Winston b4 deadline

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    • Seriously! I would love to hear what the Giants would give us for him. If the Backup QB has better or the same stats as the “franchise” QB, its time to move on.

      1. Trade Winston
      2. Start Fitz
      3. Draft a QB next year
      4. Have more cap space to sign our own guys next year.

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      • Fitz wanted to retire this year, and have you looked at the crop of QBs coming out next year? This is not fantasy football. Go Bucs!

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        • What does FF have to do with this? Stats are stats, take a look for yourself…

          http://www.nfl.com/teams/tampabaybuccaneers/statistics?team=TB

          If you think we are making the playoffs with crab legs, you are sorely mistaken. I would much rather secure the future of the Bucs with trading him now for ANYTHING we can get and draft a QB next year. Fitz has performed better than wINsTon, who’s jersey went to the HOF again?? I’ll wait….

          Are you against having more cap room for the player who actually play up to their potential? Can we sign both Alexander (LB) and Smith (LT) next year with Winston on the team?

          Will Grier would be a great fit for the Bucs. Fitz can retire if he’d like when the season is over. Production between either of them is the same if not better for Fitz. Only the delusional FUWho fans want him on the team. The only reason the Bucs drafted him was to hope he sells more tickets. He is a horrible turnover machine and always will be.

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        • Fitz is a far better value to the Bucs today than Winston – he performed better, and cost way less than Winston. Too bad he’s as near to retirement as he is. But he could make a great transitional starter while developing a young quarterback perhaps a late first rounder or early second rounders, like Drew Brees was. And that would leave a helluva lot more money in the salary cap to pay for much better defensive talent that Jason Licht is completely unable to identify and sign, whether in the draft or in free agency.

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      • If people complain today that the Bucs don’t have enough talent, particularly on the defensive side of the ball, just wait til next year when we have to stay under the salary cap AND pay Winston $21M. Or sign him to a long term contract at $22-26M a year which is the going rate for other mediocre second contract quarterbacks in the NFL like Joe Flacco, Jimmy Garrapolo, Derek Carr, Alex Smith, and Sam Bradford – which ALL of their teams are sorely regretting today.

        The model of the future NFL championship team is a high quality first contract QB like Kansas City, or a team that manages to convince their QB to sign a below market QB like New England.

        You cannot afford to build a championship NFL team today with a too-expensive quarterback. Even the great quarterbacks like Aaron Rodgers at $33.5M a year makes himself effectively unaffordable – there just aren’t enough dollars available to pay for the rest of the talent needed for a winner.

        The free market is asserting itself yet again .. quarterbacks are largely overvalued, they do not deliver championships by themselves, and today’s market rate for a second or third contract QB is simply unaffordable for championship teams.

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  13. Scottie, I agree Jameis needs to stop the turnovers. However, this paragraph does not summurize that the way I think you wanted:

    “To summarize Winston’s career, he is 9-11 in games with no interceptions, but more importantly, Winston is 8-5 in games with no turnovers. For the Bucs to win, they need Winston to start playing turnover-free football on a regular basis.”

    9-11 when dude doesn’t throw an INT? The way we harp on his turnovers you’d think the Bucs would be better, but that stat doesn’t show it. The 8-5 is better, but again for the way we harp on him for his faults you’d think the team record would be better? Am I wrong here?

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    • Good point, Chev. It tells me that the team hasn’t been good enough around him to overcome the turnovers, especially on defense.

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  14. I get it Winston needs to have less turnovers. I agree, but if he didn’t throw for 400 yards and have brilliant scrambles all time we don’t win last week or many games regardless of turnover margin. He was leading rusher last week and that is BS. You want to see any QB struggle, just take away the run and play action and see how other guys like say Mariota or Prescott play. I’m not making excuses, but if defense doesn’t keep playing better like they did last week it won’t matter if Winston turns ball over or not. Also if you are asking Winston to drop back 50-60 times and not make a mistake or two that’s unreasonable imo. Who else does that on consistent basis? They have to have some balance with run and I’m not saying has to be 50/50, but if you are going to continually force Winston to throw that many times that’s stupid and not going to work consistently. He needs to play better though for sure.

    You know who else needs play better? This stupid O line. He’s had been hit and stripped on blond side several times. You cannot out that on the QB. I also don’t see other QBs having to Scramble and run for their lives as much as Winston does and if your going to be critical of turnovers you better give credit to his scrambling because most other QBs would be sacked a lot more than he has. He throws good out of pocket why not some more naked bootlegs etc if play action isn’t going to work? He also took couple sacks last week where he should have got rid of it. We have 9 games to evaluate Winston and they can franchise him next year if they want so talking about moving on from him is asinine at this point. To me makes it hard to impossible to evaluate him if they can’t run ball at all and protect him little better, and D hold teams to under 30 points!

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  15. Hit on blind side lol

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  16. Is Kendell Beckwith not getting back to the roster this year? I just checked the depth chart over at bucs.com and he’s not listed. I didn’t happen to see any recent news on his recovery from his ankle surgery. It would be a relief to me to hear he’s close to being back with the loss of Kwon. I thought he improved steadily last season and would be great to have back to avoid drop off in talent at the middle tier of the defense.

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    • Hes on the non football injury/reserve list. He can recover with the team but doesn’t count against their 53 man roster. Also, different than IR.

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  17. Trade McCoy, please. Most overrated player on the team.

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  18. If a lot of you are right, and Winston is not a franchise Q.B. then Licht should be the one shipped out of town. Licht has picked some good players, he should, we’ve been in the top half of the first round since he’s been G.M.. However, there have simply been to many high second rounders who have not panned out. His 2016 draft class is almost a complete bust. His free agent pick ups have been mostly over paid, and dismal also. Licht has had 5 years to build a winner, and in year five do any of you really believe we make the playoffs this year, or even finish with a winning record? I for one don’t. So keep talking about how bad our run game is, our secondary, pass rush, run blocking, pass blocking, how bad some of our so called elite talent is, and remember who assembled this team. I love Mike Evans, but I wouldn’t have passed on Donald for him. You can find receivers, but a talent like Donald is rare. Licht has not done a good job building this team. If you want to disagree, just look at his win, loss record as G.M.. Facts don’t lie.

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  19. I didn’t read many of the comments but have a good idea what the rest of them are. They hate Jameis is probably the majority of them.

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    • Nothing wrong with stating the truth!

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      • This is probably the most well thought out comment I’ve seen on this thread. Surprisingly, there have been a few

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  20. I knew when I saw there were 60 comments that Scott’s Fab 4 plus 1 Advertisement must have been about religion, politics or Jameis Winston. Thank goodness it was the latter.

    Having been through every QB in Tampa Bay history I can speak with some authority that the citizens of Bucville never have accepted any of them for long. Oh, we’ve had a few who piqued our interest over the years. There was “Why Not Minot” and more recently “Fitzmagic”, but those were short lived. We had Steve Young the QB, who nearly drowned in the snow, and wasn’t much better than Steve Young the OT. “Dougie” and “The Bull” won games mostly due to stellar Defense. If Jameis is a “Turnover Machine”, what analogy would Vinny be?

    Any QB can avoid interceptions by playing it safe. They can be made to look good by throwing to the RB half the time like Brees does. I tend to look at each interception and fumble individually rather than see the statistic and automatically blame the QB. That’s not to make an excuse, it’s simply to be cognizant of the situation. Jameis has had some poor throws to be sure. He’s also thrown the ball where perhaps he shouldn’t. He’ll do that, then make a play that few other QB’s can. Things that can’t be taught.

    A middle of the pack Defense, a solid PK, a pass catching RB, at least the threat of a running game and just a mediocre O-line would surely improve the results with Jameis under center. Maybe then folks would stop making him the scapegoat for the rest of the team’s shortcomings.

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  21. The biggest problem is that the confidence…or over-confidence that leads to Winston’s turnovers is the same confidence that results in his game changing throws. It may be something we just have to learn to overcome rather than have him become a “dink and dunk” type of QB.

    As for the trade deadline coming up, I agree that Spence is the only real candidate at this moment. DJax might get us some good return, but it would be a big gamble with the way the injury bug plagues this team every year.

    On an unrelated note, on Thursday I sat there watching Desean Watson hit DeAndre Hopkins repeatedly with the deep ball and just kept thinking to myself, “What if Winston and DJax were to develop this kind of chemistry?” Could you imagine what our offense would look like then?

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    • I also watched Watson on TNF.

      He throws a really good looking football. It doesn’t flutter. It doesn’t wobble. It doesn’t sail. It doesn’t nose dive.

      Watson throws a really good looking football.

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      • How did this comment get two (and counting?) thumbs down?

        Winston fans with their panties in a bunch? Dig them out of your crack and relax. I didn’t bring up Winston’s passes. Just admiring Watson’s.

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        • Awww….. Cookie wants a participation thumbs-up. Don’t worry, I gave you one in hopes of salvaging your feelings.

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          • Thanks GrayBalls!! I feel much better now! Participation thumbs-ups are what it’s all about!

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  22. Winston will always have turnovers. He is a QB that needs a running game. The playbook must be 50/50 run/pass, it can not be 70 percent plus throwing. With Winston that is a disaster. Some of the legendary QBs of the eighties like Dan Marino or Warren Moon could do it in what was “Run and Shoot” offenses. Jameis Winston will never be one of those guys. If he is around long enough he will have a lot of career yards, but he will be a challenger to Brett Favre’s all time career interceptions. Further, that Run and Shoot era never lead to any Super Bowels. It lead to the NFC dominating the Super Bowls for around 15 years. It was the Denver Broncos who broke that mold by having a balanced attack, and they had one of the great QBs in John Elway. Jameis will never be John Elway and Elway needed a running game to get a Super Bowl. Jameis needs a running game to keep the interceptions for the year under 20. And finally, Jameis will never get it with DeSean Jackson. He promoted in getting DeSean here (see the Bently with a Ferrari engine comment), but Jameis is not a precise or accurate QB, thus the turnovers. With Jackson you need to be able to “Drop it in the Bucket.” Winston can not do that. Whether in college or the pros he has needed tall receivers or receivers with a wide catch radius. Jackson is a juke move and then sprinter. That requires precision and accuracy that Winston does not have. Running game is a must; expecting Winston to change is asking to much.

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    • Good observations SelmonRules1000.

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  23. GREAT comments and feedback, PR readers. Thank you!

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  24. Jameis’ performance yesterday reminds me of Tiger Woods after his scandal. Once Tiger has finally resolved his mental problems he is back on top. Jameis is not playing as well as he has before his recent scandal. He needs to sit on the bench while Fitz starts until he gets his mental problems behind him and his confidence back.

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