FAB 4. Bucs – Browns Game Notes

If time permits in my schedule, I plan on adding some notes about the previous week’s Bucs game from my film study during the week into each week’s SR’s Fab 5 column. I’m not going to spend a lot of time rehashing the obvious. Instead, I’ll try to dig deeper and offer some insight you may have missed when watching the game and tie it into the up-coming match-up.

Here are my thoughts from re-watching the Bucs vs. Browns game.

• The first thing I want to highlight is the Bucs’ first sack of the game, which came courtesy of defensive end Jason Pierre-Paul, who now has six sacks on the season, including at least one in each of the last four games. We saw new defensive coordinator Mark Duffner bring out the exotic look that generated Pierre-Paul sacks against Chicago and Atlanta where JPP and defensive end Carl Nassib are standing up and the Bucs have two defensive linemen in three-point stances with 11:18 left in the first quarter.

But unlike the looks that the Bucs gave the Bears and Falcons with his personnel group, Pierre-Paul wasn’t on the outside right edge. He and Nassib were standing up in the A gaps with Will Gholston and Rakeem Nunez-Roches lined up in the B gaps. Linebackers Kwon Alexander and Lavonte David are showing blitz in the C gaps, but drop into coverage at the snap and safety Isaiah Johnson blitzes the A gap instead, as Nassib and JPP execute a twist stunt that brings a ton of pressure up the middle and brings Baker Mayfield down.

I don’t know who is responsible for this new wrinkle – whether it is Duffner or defensive line coach Brentson Buckner – but it’s genius. The Bucs are 3-of-3 with this exotic look in terms of getting sacks and I can’t wait to see the new spin Tampa Bay’s coaches put on this formation in Cincinnati and in the coming weeks.

• What else caught my eye was the play of defensive tackle Vita Vea, who got his first NFL start in place of the injured Gerald McCoy. Vea easily had his best game as a pro and did way more than the stats line – one tackle – suggests. The film review shows that he is impacting the Bucs defensive line and doing what he did at Washington, which is be the assist man on sacks.

Vea will never be a double-digit sacker in the NFL. He wasn’t with the Huskies. He’s not McCoy, and he’s nowhere near being Warren Sapp. If you get five or six sacks out of Vea a year that’s ideal, but he’s showing that he’s capable of helping Tampa Bay’s defensive ends and linebackers get to the quarterback, which is important.

Vea got an assist from me on Adarius Taylor’s sack, which came at 8:44 in the third quarter. Vea did a nice job of scraping from the middle of the line to the right as he saw Mayfield escape the pocket and roll to his left. Although Vea overruns the play and just misses out on his first NFL sack, he did his job by forcing the nimble Mayfield back into the middle of the field where Taylor was pursuing him and dropped the Browns rookie QB for his first sack of the season. I think in time and with better conditioning, Vea gets the sack in that situation.

“Vita looks like a guy that is still getting his legs under him,” Bucs head coach Dirk Koetter said this week. “I think Coach Buckner said it best, he might’ve said it to you folks when he talked to you that Vita’s basically played his third preseason game or maybe he’s around his first game where everybody else is six games into the season.

“I mean he looks like a guy that’s still finding his way with his pad level a little bit, with his conditioning. We’ve talked about this before – riding the bike and losing 20 pounds is one thing but playing football against offensive linemen is another. We’re encouraged by the way Vita’s working at it, but I don’t think he’s where he’s going to end up being when it’s all said and done.”

I agree wholeheartedly. Vea still has a lot of work to do. My biggest criticism of Vea from what I’ve seen thus far is that he sometimes has tunnel vision on the player he’s blocking and needs to do a better job of locating the ball. With 8:36 left in the first quarter, Vea does a great job of driving Zeitler back into the backfield, but is oblivious to the fact that rookie running back Nick Chubb just ran by him.


Buckner needs to work on Vea’s ball awareness in practice and get the big, 340-pounder looking for the ball and not the guy he’s blocking. Keep in mind that Vea didn’t play defensive tackle until he got to Washington. He was actually a running back in high school, so this is his fourth year playing defensive tackle – ever. He’ll get better under Buckner. I have no doubt.

Here’s a look at Nassib’s second sack. You can see Vea has complete control over right guard Kevin Zeitler and is essentially two-gapping him and driving him back towards Mayfield with sheer power. As Mayfield feels pressure from Nassib, who is coming off the left edge of the defense with a great long arm move and a spin to the inside, he sees the pocket collapse and steps up. Vea sees this and has the lateral agility and balance to move from Zeitler’s inside shoulder to his outside shoulder, essentially shutting off Mayfield’s escape route as Nassib closes in for the sack.

• I went back and looked at the safety the Bucs gave up in the first quarter when Peyton Barber got tackled in the end zone. It’s easy to suggest that the offensive line is to blame, but really the blame falls on tight end Antony Auclair, who got stoned at the line of scrimmage by rookie linebacker Genard Avery. Fullback Alan Cross also tried to double team with Auclair and move Avery, but the strongside linebacker did a great job of setting the edge.

It didn’t help that left tackle Donovan Smith got flattened by defensive end Myles Garrett, but that didn’t really affect the play as he was down-blocking while the Bucs pulled left guard Ali Marpet. The problem was that Marpet tripped over Auclair, creating a pile-up that Barber couldn’t move around in time to avoid the safety.

• I have praised right guard Evan Smith and called for him to start ahead of Caleb Benenoch this year, but on Sunday he had his worst game of the season and played down to Benenoch’s level. Smith had a holding call that erased Peyton Barber’s touchdown run, and was driven into the backfield on more than one running play. Benenoch had a holding call of his own against Cleveland, and the right guard position remains the weak link on Tampa Bay’s offensive line.

I’m concerned with how Benenoch and Smith will fare against Cincinnati Pro Bowl defensive tackle Geno Atkins. And I’m equally concerned with how right tackle Demar Dotson will handle Bengals defensive end Carlos Dunlap. I think both of those match-ups clearly favor the Bengals.

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Scott Reynolds is in his 24th year of covering the Tampa Bay Buccaneers as the vice president, publisher and senior Bucs beat writer for PewterReport.com. Author of the popular SR's Fab 5 column on Fridays, Reynolds oversees web development and forges marketing partnerships for PewterReport.com in addition to his editorial duties. A graduate of Kansas State University in 1995, Reynolds spent six years giving back to the community as the defensive line coach for his son's Pop Warner team, the South Pasco Predators. Reynolds can be reached at: [email protected]
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thewbacca
1 year ago

No Shady McCoy, please. Guy is a monster for what he did to his girlfriend. Plus, what would he do behind this O-line?

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  thewbacca

Agree. Shady is not the guy anymore. He might have 1 season left. Let him go somewhere else and be someone else’s headache.

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slaythembucs
1 year ago

We have to give Winston – heck any QB a decent running game before we can evaluate him. Most of his interceptions are in the middle of the field where linebackers drop into coverage. Those become easy throws when linebackers don’t drop into coverage and actually try to stop the run. No team fears our running and hence are happy to drop their linebackers. We have no play action, we can’t run from from Shot gun hence passing the ball becomes that more difficult. But yes he needs to make better decisions and throw the ball away or take a… Read more »

Jlog
Jlog
1 year ago
Reply to  slaythembucs

This is his forth year, and he’s knocking on the door of setting a NFL turn over record.

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slaythembucs
1 year ago
Reply to  Jlog

And in those 4 years what was our running record? I’m not saying he is awesome or anything but if you want to cut down his turnovers then start helping him with a run game so that he will throw less. Oh btw that will also help our defense. Stats don’t tell you the whole story.

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WestChap
1 year ago
Reply to  Jlog

Amen jlog! Winston had a pretty good runner his rookie year and still tossed 15 picks. As a rookie, you get a pass. Three years on and with recent rules changes and new schemes a franchise QB who wants to get paid needs one trait above all others — accuracy. Great and even good WRs can be unstoppable with today’s pick (oops, I mean “rub”) routes, favorable PI rules and RPO schemes. All those positives go out the window when you beat yourself with off-target throws. JW has all the arm strength and mobility he needs, but even with his… Read more »

MudManVA
1 year ago

Let’s face it, the BUCS are in trouble. The defensive injuries are just brutal through the first 6 games, and they have to make it through 10 more games with a patchwork group & a shit load of rookies starting. I got to believe more injuries are coming with 3/4 of the season left. Not being able to run the ball at all is killing the offense. The BUCS caught their opponents off guard the first 2 weeks, but the NFL quickly adjusts. Winston certainly doesn’t look the same as he did at the end of 2017, but you ask… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  MudManVA

Consider this – When Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, Phillip Rivers, Jared Goff or Aaron Rodgers throws it 40-50 times in a game, they win. Those QB’s have been very efficient when throwing it a bunch this season. Only Goff has a legit rushing attack this year that could single handedly win a game for the team. The rest of them have rushing attacks that work because of the passing attack. Quit making excuses for Jameis. If he’s throwing it 40 times, you’d think he would get better at it. Rate this item:Thumb UpThumb DownSubmit Rating00 No votes yet.… Read more »

slaythembucs
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Consider this – All those in that list except Rodgers have atleast one RB to whom who you can dump it off or give a screen pass and you will get 10-15 yards easy. We dont have such a pass catching RB threat. A two yard pass to flat for all those team results in a first down but for our team it results in 2nd and 8 or worse.

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wnb0395
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Bucwild02, I completely agree with you. All I ever hear at excuses. When Fitz was playing great all I heard was its the play calling, Winston can do it also. Then when given the opportunity its excuse after excuse. We have no defense, no running game, no Oline. Guess what, Fitz had none of those things either the first 2 games and was able to maximize our offensive capability. Now that Winston can’t its all excuses. Quit making excuses and start holding him accountable.

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chefboho
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Are you serious? Every one of those teams besides Aaron Rodgers has a run game? Brees has Kamara and Ingram, Mahomes has Kareem hunt, Brady has Sony
Michale and James white, Geoff has Gurley and

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chefboho
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Are you serious? Every one of those teams besides Aaron Rodgers has a run game? Brees has Kamara and Ingram, Mahomes has Kareem hunt, Brady has Sony
Michale and James white, Geoff has Gurley and rovers has Gordon and Austin Ekler, spelling. So your statement makes zero sense. In fact I saw a star that 70 percent of Geoff’s yards come off ply action. Imagine that…. so yes, a running game benifits anwuarterback greatly!!

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chefboho
1 year ago
Reply to  chefboho

Sorry for all the terrible typos. Typing on a phone with wide thumbs proves tricky at times lol

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  chefboho

I bet if Tom Brady or any other capable QB were here, we’d all be putting Peyton Barber on our fantasy team because he would be killing it and catching tons of passes, just like James White is. It ISN’T James White that makes Tom Brady Great. Its Tom Brady.

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76Buc
1 year ago
Reply to  MudManVA

As I said in a post before the season started we lead the NFL in IR every year. I don’t believe in curses and hexes, but I do believe that only leaves out training and medical staffs. They must really suck, but no one mentions it.

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Wright
1 year ago
Reply to  76Buc

Except we aren’t leading in injury categories. Tampa was middle of the pack last year in man-games lost due to injury. https://twitter.com/ManGamesLostNFL/status/951253740933312512

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Wright
1 year ago
Reply to  76Buc

Not only that, from 2009-2016 Tampa was middle of the pack as well in total man games lost (how can they be middle of the pack and lead every year). https://twitter.com/ManGamesLostNFL/status/825129590922305538

So quit it with the “my feelings are facts” based arguments.

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Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  Wright

Like all stats, they can obscure reality. If a team suffers its IR losses early in the season, even if only a couple players are lost, even if it’s only scrubs list, they lead in man games lost. But another team that loses a bunch of key starters to IR in the last month of the season looks like a winner

Stats don’t lie, but taken singly or out of context of other factors do mis-represent reality.

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Buc stops here
1 year ago

“He has all the talent in the world, he can make all the throws and is a tremendous leader, but Winston simply can’t turn the ball over with such a high frequency rate. History suggests that Winston won’t stop committing turnovers.” Close to what I have been writing, yet I get crucified on this. Winston can make most throws, not all. If you look at Winston over 25 yards passing in the air, he becomes pretty inaccurate. On the previous page, the writers mention that Jackson with Winston has not been very useful. It has to do with Winston’s accuracy… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  Buc stops here

For me, life is a work in progress. I want to weigh in on one thing though. I believe there is a difference between leadership and energy. Jameis has a lot of energy. Energy can temporarily excite those around you, but it won’t make those around you perform better consistently. Leadership really has more to do with trust, accountability, and charisma. Jameis just doesn’t inspire those around him to take it to the next level. Sorry. He just doesn’t. That’s why people argued against taking Fitz out. His leadership was obvious. The team responded to him. They trusted him. He… Read more »

cgmaster27
1 year ago

I think the bucs stand pat and dont trade anything. If DeSean wants to complain about tha, how about he holds on to the ball that he had for a td this week? Hit him right in the bread basket and he dropped it. As for the Jameis int.s they clealry have to stop, but there is something here you aren’t looking at Scott. No team is asking g their qb to throw it more than the bucs. You realize Jameis is averaging 47 last attempts a game!? Cam newton , 28. Jameis dropped back 62 times last week and… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Lol. DJax is trying to get traded. He must love playing with Jameis!

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BucWild02
1 year ago

Fab 1: Let’s face it, Desean Jackson is right. Winston can’t hit deep receivers in stride. It’s so rare for him. That being said, Desean Jackson to Houston for a 1st round pick looks pretty good right now. A classic win-win if Will Fuller did tear his ACL as feared. Jackson is exactly the player that could fill Fuller’s position on a team that has firepower on both sides of the ball in a weak division. The Bucs get something out of Jackson instead of frustration when Jameis is under center. Fab 2 : Leopards can’t change their spots. SR… Read more »

cgmaster27
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Jameis he doesn’t need to hold on to the ball to make this o line look bad, they do that themselves. Did you watch these past three games? The online has been a turnstile and if Jameis did t have good wheels to escape the pocket wed have given up like 8 sacks last week, but you dial to me tion that. You probably thought the 2.02 seconds Jameis had on the Myles garret sack was plenty of time to throw the ball. Ill agree ,his deep ball isnt good or consistent but saying he cant throw long is completely… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Aaron Rodgers has NO rushing attack. His Oline is also not great. He’s still extremely efficient though. I can list 10 more guys that aren’t Aaron Rodgers but ask yourself this… If Brady/Brees/Rodgers/Mahomes/Goff/Rivers/Luck/Ryan/Cousins/Watson were here, would there be a discussion about failed deep balls and bad turnovers? Then ask yourself a second question… If Eli/Bortles/Stafford/Carr/Mariotta/Bradford/Taylor were here, would the results be about the same? Winston clearly belongs in one of these groups. Can you see which one? Rate this item:Thumb UpThumb DownSubmit Rating00 No votes yet. Please wait...

cgmaster27
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Um luck,Brady, and brees had more interceptions in his first three seasons that Jameis so please let’s do talk about it. Heck Roger’s didnt even play for three seasons so that comparison doesnt even work. As for the rest of those guys, my point still stands. NONE of them throw the ball even remotely as much as Jameis and that’s a fact. I’m not saying g Jameis doesnt have his flaws as he does, but dont compare the offensive lines after watching ours as they cant even run block and the right side of our line is a gaping hole.… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Winston has to throw it more. He puts his team in a hole constantly with turnovers. His first NFL pass attempt was a pick 6, but that wasn’t his fault right? Lol. Homer.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Who had more wins? Luck, Rodgers, Brady or Winston?

I can hear you firing up all the excuses now.

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Tyler21
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Buc n wild- Peyton Manning’s first career throw was a pick 6 so I guess that means he sucks too

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Buc-n-Philly Fan
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Aaron Rodgers is also hurt now due to his shitty O Line. Come on! You can’t even make that comparison anyway. There are only 3 QB’s of Rodgers level in the NFL now anyway. And Rodgers has not had a good year.
You can dislike Winston all you want but he is the best QB this Team has ever had (as a starter, don’t count Steve Young) and if we put ANY semblance of an O Line and run game and he would be TITS!!!

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BucWild02
1 year ago

Lol. It’s frustrating for sure. Im not a Winston hater. Im not a Mariotta guy. Winston’s just not very good. Just my observation.
Luck was much better in his first 3 seasons. So was Brady. He won a superbowl in his second year in the league for Pete’s sake! Watson, Rivers, Brees, Mahomes, Goff, Ryan have all been better their first 3 seasons(so far).

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sunshineben
1 year ago

Winston has all the weapons and what has he won.. NOT the best qb ever!!

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Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Same O line played for Fitz, and Fitz played better than Winston. The Winston fan boys have done nothing but make excuses, point fingers, and project future greatness for four years running, but it’s always the SOS – same old shit. WYSIWYG I never bought the BS 4 years ago, still not buyin’ it now. The team owners need to fire Licht and his coaches, and trade Winston. If people think we’re having trouble now affording quality players, both new hires, and paying our quality players on the roster now, it is going to be much harder when we have… Read more »

fbleichner
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

What???? No is giving up a 1st rounder for DJax! Maybe a 3rd rounder….maybe.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  fbleichner

Gruden just got a 1st rounder for Amari Cooper. Concussion. Drops. Slower this year. It’s a deal they couldn’t refuse. They do everything big in Texas!

Truth be told, I think a 3rd round pick might be worth it. It’s better than the nothingburger the Bucs will get when they cut him after another failed season with Jameis.

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WestChap
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Yes! Houston has cap room for DJax and Jackson would love playing with a young gun who can aim. Might even make Bucs more willing to go after a CB or G for the home stretch and future. Here’s hoping…

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Jlog
Jlog
1 year ago

If Winston can make all the throws why can’t he hit DJax? Winston struggles mightily hitting targets in stride with good ball placement maybe.

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SelmonRules1000
SelmonRules1000
1 year ago

Trade Spence to a 3-4 defensive team and get what you can get. The people in charge may have no interest in doing it. Getting a fourth round pick for the 2019 draft may not concern the current regime; especially if they have the sense that they are going to be gone after the season. With the head coach making comments like, “Winston’s going to be around long after I am gone.” Belichick would never say that even if it was true. He has a competitive attitude just as strong as Brady’s. You got to be interested in surviving to… Read more »

MWD
MWD
1 year ago

Before we pin the rose on Winston here, let’s look at the play of the offensive line and their ability to hold blocks coming off the edge or pick up blitzes. Let’s not even entertain DJAX and his history of complaining about his starting QBs. Every pre-madona receiver in this league complains at some point or another but trading him when we have one of the deadliest passing attacks out there would be a pretty historic “dumb ass buc” move and if there is anyone we should be considering to trade on the offensive side…”maybe” Cameron Brate even though I… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  MWD

Just a quick note…It’s not “pre-madona”, as in before Madonna. Its “prima donna”. Has to do with lead opera singers being ego driven.

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MWD
MWD
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Ok, but you understated where I was going and where I was getting at…..my apologies for the bad grammar people

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MWD
MWD
1 year ago
Reply to  MWD

“understood” correction ha ha

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  MWD

Just trying to help a brotha out!

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macabee
1 year ago

The Bucs are on a trajectory to throw 29 picks this year – Fitz has 5 and Winston has 6 – that’s Testerverde territory and we don’t want to go there. That has to change if the Bucs envision any chance of making the playoffs this year. Yes, interceptions are bad and 29 INTs would be catastrophic, but let’s not panic or all get aboard the “Get rid of Winston” train just yet! Let’s take a look at some of the NFL greats over their first three seasons. Keep in mind that this is the beginning of Winston’s 4th season.… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Lol. You compared Winston to a gunslinger. HOF gunslingers actually! That’s funny.

Favre, Marino, and Elway had tremendous arm talent. Canton level arm talent.
Peyton was a coach on the field. Also, Canton level.

No one is going to be putting a yellow jacket on Winston at this point based on his arm talent. Actually, he’s one accusation away from being suspended indefinitely.

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MWD
MWD
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

True BucWild but let’s be real, did anyone know those were going to be HOF’s in their first 3 seasons? Magic 8 ball says “probably not”.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  MWD

No, but the interceptions stat tells part of the story. In their first 3 years, all of the listed QB’s showed massive improvement and cut their INT’s about in half. They all had three times as many 4th quarter or game winning drives. They also were winners. They lead their teams to victory. It’s not a valid comparison.

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GIJoeWasThere
1 year ago
Reply to  MWD

Actually, people thought the first three were destined to be HOFers after year 3….

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macabee
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

No, I compared the number of INTs they threw in their 1st three years. Nothing else. Sorry to disappoint!

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Macabee-I aint mad at you. Im just saying its not a valid argument. Those guys all cut their int’s to about half. Favre actually passed for 38 TDs and 13 INTs in his 3rd year.

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MudManVA
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Mac- trying to discuss Winston logically with BucWild is a dead end. His facts are eschew & twisted to make his arguments. If you watch the games you’re dead on.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  MudManVA

I havent twisted or misused a fact Mudman. I think the eschew facts are comparing Elway and Marino to Winston.

I wonder, did Winston pass for more yardage than Johnny Unitas in his first 3 seasons? How about Ron Jaworski? He must be in the same class then. Better even!

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cgmaster27
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Good job proving despite stats and anything else others through at you, you fire up your own excuses why they dont count. Hater. It’s easy to spot those like you.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  cgmaster27

Winston is 19-28 as a Bucs starter. With the EXACT same team around him, JOURNEYMAN RYAN FITZPATRICK is 4-3. Thats the only stat i care about.

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Dbuc63
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Hello Mac, I think you make a reasonable statement but I do disagree. There are times when historical data is useful and there are also times when it’s not. I think it is safe to say the game has changed and continues to change dramatically in terms of talent, rules, systems,etc..Has the NFL ever been a passing league and defenses so ordinary as today? Who was the last team that had a true CONSISTENT shutdown defense? Winston may be a late bloomer and become slightly better than average but at what cost. Look at the talent we have at WR… Read more »

macabee
1 year ago
Reply to  Dbuc63

And you make a reasonable statement as well. I am simply saying at this point in their careers, Winston has the same opportunity to be great. You/and or others may be saying he does not and you’ve seen enough to be sure. On that point, I disagree. And I conclude in my original post that I hope that to be true as I don’t know the future. You may be right. Time will tell. I’m willing to wait and see. Good looking out, my friend. Go Bucs! Rate this item:Thumb UpThumb DownSubmit Rating00 No votes yet. Please wait...

thewbacca
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

The Buccaneers released a mashup video on Facebook for every offensive snap of the Browns game. In a majority of the snaps, Jameis was under duress in less than 3 seconds. How can people expect there to be even an opportunity to throw a deep ball?

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BucWonder
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

A voice of calm reason on the Red Board. Thank you.

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Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Besides the uproariously laughable notion that Winston belongs in a list of HOF great quarterbacks of all time, cough cough … you are completely offbase in comparing the type of football played by all those guys. They came up in an era when defense dominated the game, whereas today offense completely dominates the game of NFL football, moreso this season than any other. We all know that. You have to compare Winston to other quarterbacks playing today of similar experience. Winston has played in the league since 2015 – care to guess which NFL quarterback is tied for first in… Read more »

macabee
1 year ago
Reply to  Naplesfan

What is uproariously laughable is that you cannot comprehend a simple post. The subject of the article is Winston’s turnovers, more specifically, his INTs. My post simply says that at this point in Winston’s career, he has thrown fewer INTs than some of the NFL greats and that if he were to change the arc of his current trajectory, I would hope that he could have similar success. No other comparisons were made. Your unmistakable bias or otherwise ignorance of the facts would not allow you to see that or as a Buc fan wish him success in the future.… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

Break it up you two. Lol. Era’s are different and so it’s hard to compare. I get it macabee…you are hopeful for Winston and want him to succeed. Most on here do. I know I do. I just get frustrated watching him play. The point about the INT’s though is a false equivalency. I could point these facts out… Ryan Leaf only had 36 INT’s in his first 3 seasons. Jamarcus Russell had 23 INT’s in his first 3 seasons. Christian Ponder had 34 INT’s in his first 3 seasons. All former 1st round picks with Russell going 1st overall.… Read more »

macabee
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

As I watch the Cinncy game today, I have to admit I’m wrong about Winston. He is imploding. He is playing god awful. Can’t defend the indefensible. You are obviously right. Not to proud to admit that I couldn’t see all the flaws – demonstrated right before my eyes today. Oh well, back to the drawing board. lol.

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Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  macabee

I have no bias. I have eyes and a brain. Winston in no way shape or form belongs in any comparative discusion of HOF greats who came up in an entirely different era of defensive dominance.

Unlike you I used my brain and common sense to compare Winston with his contemporaries …. and he suffers greatly in that comparison.

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macabee
1 year ago
Reply to  Naplesfan

I owe you an apology for having a bad day yesterday. The language I used is not my normal diplomatic approach in discussion – even in argument. Had nothing to do with your position, but all to do with my emotional state at the time. So again I sincerely apologize if you were offended in any way. Your opinion is respected even when I disagree. After yesterday’s game your argument regarding Winston as a wise pick holds water. He was horrible yesterday. I do still think you are carrying my eval too far. Never meant to compare Winston as a… Read more »

drdneast
1 year ago

First off I wish all of the football experts would quit behaving like the Bucs barely beat a sub par SEC team last week. The Browns were 2 and 4 with three of their games going into OT. Against the Steelers, who they also took into OT, Big Ben threw 3 INTs against the Browns. I’m not saying Winston doesn’t need to steop throwing INT’s, but he also dropped back over 50 times last week to toss the rock. How about some balance. I did watch the replay of the Bucs game to see what happened on his first INT… Read more »

Dbuc63
1 year ago
Reply to  drdneast

Have you ever heard on confirmation bias? I voted “like” for your post because I feel sorry for you.

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Buc-n-Philly Fan
1 year ago
Reply to  Dbuc63

That’s just dumb….

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sunshineben
1 year ago

Maybe bucs could trade Winston b4 deadline

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gunderss
1 year ago
Reply to  sunshineben

Seriously! I would love to hear what the Giants would give us for him. If the Backup QB has better or the same stats as the “franchise” QB, its time to move on.

1. Trade Winston
2. Start Fitz
3. Draft a QB next year
4. Have more cap space to sign our own guys next year.

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BucWonder
1 year ago
Reply to  gunderss

Fitz wanted to retire this year, and have you looked at the crop of QBs coming out next year? This is not fantasy football. Go Bucs!

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gunderss
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWonder

What does FF have to do with this? Stats are stats, take a look for yourself… http://www.nfl.com/teams/tampabaybuccaneers/statistics?team=TB If you think we are making the playoffs with crab legs, you are sorely mistaken. I would much rather secure the future of the Bucs with trading him now for ANYTHING we can get and draft a QB next year. Fitz has performed better than wINsTon, who’s jersey went to the HOF again?? I’ll wait…. Are you against having more cap room for the player who actually play up to their potential? Can we sign both Alexander (LB) and Smith (LT) next year… Read more »

Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWonder

Fitz is a far better value to the Bucs today than Winston – he performed better, and cost way less than Winston. Too bad he’s as near to retirement as he is. But he could make a great transitional starter while developing a young quarterback perhaps a late first rounder or early second rounders, like Drew Brees was. And that would leave a helluva lot more money in the salary cap to pay for much better defensive talent that Jason Licht is completely unable to identify and sign, whether in the draft or in free agency. Rate this item:Thumb UpThumb… Read more »

Naplesfan
1 year ago
Reply to  gunderss

If people complain today that the Bucs don’t have enough talent, particularly on the defensive side of the ball, just wait til next year when we have to stay under the salary cap AND pay Winston $21M. Or sign him to a long term contract at $22-26M a year which is the going rate for other mediocre second contract quarterbacks in the NFL like Joe Flacco, Jimmy Garrapolo, Derek Carr, Alex Smith, and Sam Bradford – which ALL of their teams are sorely regretting today. The model of the future NFL championship team is a high quality first contract QB… Read more »

cheveliar
1 year ago

Scottie, I agree Jameis needs to stop the turnovers. However, this paragraph does not summurize that the way I think you wanted: “To summarize Winston’s career, he is 9-11 in games with no interceptions, but more importantly, Winston is 8-5 in games with no turnovers. For the Bucs to win, they need Winston to start playing turnover-free football on a regular basis.” 9-11 when dude doesn’t throw an INT? The way we harp on his turnovers you’d think the Bucs would be better, but that stat doesn’t show it. The 8-5 is better, but again for the way we harp… Read more »

fredster
1 year ago

I get it Winston needs to have less turnovers. I agree, but if he didn’t throw for 400 yards and have brilliant scrambles all time we don’t win last week or many games regardless of turnover margin. He was leading rusher last week and that is BS. You want to see any QB struggle, just take away the run and play action and see how other guys like say Mariota or Prescott play. I’m not making excuses, but if defense doesn’t keep playing better like they did last week it won’t matter if Winston turns ball over or not. Also… Read more »

fredster
1 year ago

Hit on blind side lol

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fl0nase
1 year ago

Is Kendell Beckwith not getting back to the roster this year? I just checked the depth chart over at bucs.com and he’s not listed. I didn’t happen to see any recent news on his recovery from his ankle surgery. It would be a relief to me to hear he’s close to being back with the loss of Kwon. I thought he improved steadily last season and would be great to have back to avoid drop off in talent at the middle tier of the defense. Rate this item:Thumb UpThumb DownSubmit Rating00 No votes yet. Please wait...

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  fl0nase

Hes on the non football injury/reserve list. He can recover with the team but doesn’t count against their 53 man roster. Also, different than IR.

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Dman
1 year ago

Trade McCoy, please. Most overrated player on the team.

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surferdudes
1 year ago

If a lot of you are right, and Winston is not a franchise Q.B. then Licht should be the one shipped out of town. Licht has picked some good players, he should, we’ve been in the top half of the first round since he’s been G.M.. However, there have simply been to many high second rounders who have not panned out. His 2016 draft class is almost a complete bust. His free agent pick ups have been mostly over paid, and dismal also. Licht has had 5 years to build a winner, and in year five do any of you… Read more »

tampaspicer
1 year ago

I didn’t read many of the comments but have a good idea what the rest of them are. They hate Jameis is probably the majority of them.

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gunderss
1 year ago
Reply to  tampaspicer

Nothing wrong with stating the truth!

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GrayBalls
1 year ago
Reply to  gunderss

This is probably the most well thought out comment I’ve seen on this thread. Surprisingly, there have been a few

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scubog
1 year ago

I knew when I saw there were 60 comments that Scott’s Fab 4 plus 1 Advertisement must have been about religion, politics or Jameis Winston. Thank goodness it was the latter. Having been through every QB in Tampa Bay history I can speak with some authority that the citizens of Bucville never have accepted any of them for long. Oh, we’ve had a few who piqued our interest over the years. There was “Why Not Minot” and more recently “Fitzmagic”, but those were short lived. We had Steve Young the QB, who nearly drowned in the snow, and wasn’t much… Read more »

plopes808
1 year ago

The biggest problem is that the confidence…or over-confidence that leads to Winston’s turnovers is the same confidence that results in his game changing throws. It may be something we just have to learn to overcome rather than have him become a “dink and dunk” type of QB. As for the trade deadline coming up, I agree that Spence is the only real candidate at this moment. DJax might get us some good return, but it would be a big gamble with the way the injury bug plagues this team every year. On an unrelated note, on Thursday I sat there… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  plopes808

I also watched Watson on TNF.

He throws a really good looking football. It doesn’t flutter. It doesn’t wobble. It doesn’t sail. It doesn’t nose dive.

Watson throws a really good looking football.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

How did this comment get two (and counting?) thumbs down?

Winston fans with their panties in a bunch? Dig them out of your crack and relax. I didn’t bring up Winston’s passes. Just admiring Watson’s.

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GrayBalls
1 year ago
Reply to  BucWild02

Awww….. Cookie wants a participation thumbs-up. Don’t worry, I gave you one in hopes of salvaging your feelings.

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BucWild02
1 year ago
Reply to  GrayBalls

Thanks GrayBalls!! I feel much better now! Participation thumbs-ups are what it’s all about!

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SelmonRules1000
SelmonRules1000
1 year ago

Winston will always have turnovers. He is a QB that needs a running game. The playbook must be 50/50 run/pass, it can not be 70 percent plus throwing. With Winston that is a disaster. Some of the legendary QBs of the eighties like Dan Marino or Warren Moon could do it in what was “Run and Shoot” offenses. Jameis Winston will never be one of those guys. If he is around long enough he will have a lot of career yards, but he will be a challenger to Brett Favre’s all time career interceptions. Further, that Run and Shoot era… Read more »

BucWild02
1 year ago

Good observations SelmonRules1000.

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owlykat
1 year ago

Jameis’ performance yesterday reminds me of Tiger Woods after his scandal. Once Tiger has finally resolved his mental problems he is back on top. Jameis is not playing as well as he has before his recent scandal. He needs to sit on the bench while Fitz starts until he gets his mental problems behind him and his confidence back.

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