The Buccaneers gave Luke McCown the biggest contract (2 years, $7.5M) he ever received in the NFL. They wanted him to succeed.
But, like damn near every JC All Star, he simply wasn't very good. Delusional.
They wanted him to succeed so bad they handed the 2009 starting job to a dead end and traded McCown.
That, and the rest of his career, would tell a normal individual how good McCown is. Then there is delusional you.
What might be hard for you deal with is the talent gap isn't as wide as you think it is.
When I want an accurate evaluation of personnel and talent, you're the first guy I think of.
I don't think it helps the talent level when the organization's best offensive player they ever drafted chooses to leave the organization after 12 years for less money because he understands the HC/DC should have been shown the door.
Watt being a hall of famer and Trent Richardson being undraftable are the two best player evals you've ever read.
And didn't Lovie draft Evans? Or does Licht just draft the good players and the coaches draft the bad players. Maybe that's how it works according to this place.
The Buccaneers gave Luke McCown the biggest contract (2 years, $7.5M) he ever received in the NFL. They wanted him to succeed.
But, like damn near every JC All Star, he simply wasn't very good. Delusional.
They wanted him to succeed so bad they handed the 2009 starting job to a dead end and traded McCown.
That, and the rest of his career, would tell a normal individual how good McCown is. Then there is delusional you.
Bucs robbing him of his free agency was a fucked up move. Sign here to start, but we're going to draft a QB and sign another guy to start and then we're going to trade you to a shitty team.
Here's why you're dead ass wrong. He's built up enough equity in the franchise to have one season where we miss the playoffs, on a wonky tie-breaker at that, when we had I believe the most games missed by previous season starters.
This is OBVIOUSLY the mindset of the owners and the front office. Obviously. And that is the type of owner/FO mindset fans should want to support. I dont even agree with it necessarily because it seems like he lost the team, but I hope I am wrong about that and complete respect it. Again, that is the type of owner mindset fans should want to support.
But the Red Board has always been less about fan support and more about fragile ego support. The same voices who LOUDLY attacked Bowles in 2022 . . . did the same in 2023 and 2024, as the Bucs seem to have OVER perfromed in the eyes of the owners and FO. And so to them 2025 is seemingly less about the Bucs and more about some weird form of "vindication" (worst use of a word in history lol) for what has been 3 years of "wrong."
That is silly, almost beyond comprehension, but it is accurate too.
And even if one disagrees with ALL of that . . .. Bowles has, at an absolute bare minimum, "built up enough equity" to NOT deserve to see his failure in 2025 met with a torrent of racist nonsense from a bunch of weak ass anonymous white dudes. That -- the anonymous racism - is perhaps the BIGGEST chicken spit nonsense ever. It only highlights the massive distance IN LIFE between the anonymous racist poster and Bowles.
Onward to 2026!
Watt being a hall of famer and Trent Richardson being undraftable are the two best player evals you've ever read.
Those are almost as good as Orlando Brown is blue chip prospect (drafted 83rd overall) Harold Landry being undraftable (almost 60 career sacks in 7 seasons) Josh Rosen is the "real deal" (lolz) Mike Green having 12, 14, 16 sacks as a rookie (he actually had 3.5 sacks) among many other laughable evals of JC All-Stars.
But I don't blame you holding onto those solid ones from well over a decade ago. You can have the last word you need.
When I want an accurate evaluation of personnel and talent, you're the first guy I think of.
i mean . . . glass house? And with all the glass fully shattered out years ago? Mr. RB1, Canales = Waldron, etc etc
That is the thing that make this particular upcoming season interesting. Everyone is against Bowles so can he prove them all wrong? He already said that is the challenge.
to this exact point . .
"No. I still feel very good about it,” Licht said. “The legacy [Evans and David] left behind, I think it’s trickled down to a lot of players. And now it’s time for some younger guys to step up that we think have the ability step up and be leaders. I still feel very strongly about the locker room.”
"I would say Tykee is one of the toughest young players I’ve been around and I’m looking forward to him taking another step,” Licht said.
Is Tykee as tough as Licht says and smart enough to play the position better than some key games last season?
Will Egbuka emerge and be the Bucs equivalent of JSN
Does Irving bounce back?
What is McMillan like when depended on?
Is Godwin actually healthy?
What is next for Diaby?
He's built up enough equity in the franchise…
Participation Trophy material.
Mediocrity being praised and worshipped on full display.
His early draft picks were bad, especially edge guys, and some ILB’s.I’d like to talk to anyone who wants to bring back Schiano.
I agree with you, was there in the stands for many bad owners, bad coaches, bad seasons, bad GM’s.
Like Bowles, Licht is stubborn, but he’s not bad.
Any wanting both Bowles and Licht (and Baker) to be be sent elsewhere, are just mad with anger and are convinced everyone needs to go. I’m not that guy, but hanging onto Bowles, while firing the guys he hired to fix the last collapse, was idiotic.
While I am no longer a fan of Bowles, I have defended him, even like him as man. I just used-up my last straw on him, last season. When his most recent of 3 mid-season DEFENSIVE collapses (he’s a defensive genius) was only distinguished by his inability to rally the defensive troops, and an even worse defense (and 3rd & 28…don’t care what anyone says).
However, Licht has demonstrated growth and is worth keeping. Some continuity must be maintained or you just keep starting over with the next wunderkinde…every year or two.
Schiano got screwed here. He was bringing in elite players and the team was very well coached. Replacement refs cost them 2 games in 2012 and lost some other flukey games. 2012 team was better than some Bucs teams that made the playoffs. We’ll never know what would have happened if he got a 3rd year but it would have been better than Lovie.
And how has Licht demonstrated growth?
His last several years have shown improvement, especially o-line, WR, and RB. His acquisition of Brady, and then Mayfield, speak for themselves.
He has yet to show an ability to draft and edge or QB. While I don’t like the participation in free agency the last 2 years, his commitment to a strategy of winning by building a roster through a “sum of its parts”, was proven by Seattle. His execution/timing is off, impacted greatly by a horrific number of injuries to the o-line all year, but the concept worked.
Bowles defense was awful. He said at the beginning of last season that he “figured something out” - he didn’t. The defense was trash, all season. He hired the guys that were supposed to fix the problems, then he fired them.
The defense has regressed every year under Bowles.
He's built up enough equity in the franchise…
Participation Trophy material.
Mediocrity being praised and worshipped on full display.
Participation Trophy or literally a Lombardi Trophy?
Bowles performed well in our Superbowl run and in particular exposing the Chiefs down their starting offensive lineman. Kudos to him
BUT....
what about the retarded blitz he had against the Rams when we should have been playing for OT? Cost us the next year. Equity gone.
and then...you say he's built up equity to miss playoffs...but after a 6-2 start? what a collaspe...and he just needed 9 wins...that's 3-6 is all that was needed and he couldn't even do that....yeah equity long gone my friend
He's built up enough equity in the franchise…
Participation Trophy material.
Mediocrity being praised and worshipped on full display.
Participation Trophy or literally a Lombardi Trophy?
I’ve been clearly talking about him in the sense of a HC.
You knew that, though.
Sounds like he will get extended this off season.
30-35 per is more realistic than 50.
id be surprised if he got 40.
Sounds like he will get extended this off season.
30-35 per is more realistic than 50.
id be surprised if he got 40.
He’s not re-upping before a contract year at less than market value.
He’s going to want $55M right now or he’ll play out the year. Doesn’t make sense for the Bucs. If balls out he’ll have earned more. If he falters everyone walks away and a new regime picks their QB. Pretty simple. Only downside is if he leaves he’ll still have a $22M dead cap hit in 2027 because Greenberg is so bad with the cap.
injured so bad that he was still able to play? that's an awfully big leap of faith you are asking people to take
FWIW . . this is LVD
"“Man, Baker was going through a lot, bro,” David said. “Baker had a lot of injuries that you didn’t expect a quarterback to play through. You know what I’m saying? He had the oblique injury, he had the shoulder injury, he had a lot of things. You know, ankle injury, knee injury. … He was really trying to push through and really trying to be the player that we needed him to be.”
Who is to say, but my point was to say that your eyes most likely tell you he was physically off down the stretch. In your eay of describing it, he should have sat down so as to not tarnish his stats? I think one of the big positives of Mayfield is that he would not do that.
It will all work itself out. Mayfield may not want an early deal himself. He may bet on himself. He may worry the Bucs are about to get blown up etc. The Bucs probably want a discount over market to restructure him early. In between those tow positions is a middle ground.