Former Bucs K Nick Folk - Photo by: Getty Images
A win, then a loss; a win, then a loss. That’s been the Bucs season so far. It’s easy to praise when things are going right, and there are still good things that happen in losses, but the disappointments are bigger, for sure.
These were our most disappointing Buccaneers from the 19-14 loss to the Patriots.
He disappointed. Greatly.
Winston finished the game 26-for-46 with 334 yards, one touchdown and no interceptions, so was his game really that bad?
Winston was extremely inconsistent all game. He couldn’t sustain drives with simple passes, and worst of all, he couldn’t hit from beyond 20 yards. We’ve been saying this for too long now. This offense won’t get better until he starts playing better than his statistics indicate.
Is it the coaches or is it Hargreaves that asking him to play the style of defense he is? No one knows except for him and the coaches, but whatever it is, it’s bad. Hargreaves plays far too timid, and good quarterbacks burn him for it.
The pass rush not existing doesn’t help, but at some point he has to get aggressive and make a play for himself. He rarely has four games in, and is instead getting picked on and manipulated.
Bad, bad, bad, bad, bad.
It was questionable last week when the Buccaneers failed to score on the goal line from six inches away, and tonight it flourished into a full game plan of ineffectiveness. After a half that did not see much success, there were not many adjustments. The Bucs neglected the running game, despite Doug Martin’s success, and just continued to out-think themselves.
They make things harder on themselves with how they call games, and we don’t know why. Keep it simple.
The Bucs got three sacks this game, which is the most they’ve had in a single game this season, but Brady was comfortable all night, and without a few overthrows and drops, they would have had an even easier night.
Now, some could say, “they did hit their average points per game,” which is true, but they basically hit their average yards per game because the Bucs defense was not aggressive in any unit of the field.
It starts with pass rush, but it was really the lack of aggression from the whole defense.
They won’t beat many good quarterbacks playing that soft.
Trevor Sikkema is the Tampa Bay Buccaneers beat reporter and NFL Draft analyst for PewterReport.com. Sikkema, an alumnus of the University of Florida, has covered both college and professional football for much of his career. As a native of the Sunshine State, when he's not buried in social media, Sikkema can be found out and active, attempting to be the best athlete he never was. Sikkema can be reached at: [email protected]
Winston, Fold, OC Koetter, DC Smith most disappointing for me . Time to find another field goal kicker.
Time for another kicker and a new play caller. Jameis wasn’t great, most of the stagnant first half was on Koetter–Doug Martin was working — what happened? where did that go? why stop using Martin– so many times we needed 3 yards and he has Winston throwing a rocket down the field.
Winston was to blame for most of the stagnant first half. Winston constantly threw behind and over players. He threw behind Sims, over Martins head which would have been a first down, and way over threw a wide open Jackson streaking down the sideline which would have been a TD. You can blame the play calling all you want but put Brady as our QB with the same play calls and we are winning at half. Winston was just really off that first half.
Folk me. He better not be the Bucs kicker when I wake up. Doug looked impressive. Ten days off… I really hope we get Kwon & David back by then. All is not lost 2-2 in the first quarter of the season… This team will start to tighten things up and I expect that they are still on course for a wild card bid at this point.
Dude Trevor are u freaking serious put dirk on the freaking list his play calling was terrible the whole game vanilla play calling all game long no adjustments yea Jameis didn’t play good but the play calling was horrible.. u killing me every time u so freaking quick to throw all the blame at Jameis it’s not all Jameis dude!!! I’m sick of you especially Jameis this Jameis that dude where are our bunch formations where are no huddle play calls or hot routes on blitzes what about trying something new dirk?? call the freaking coach out dude!!!
Did you even read this article?? Play calling is on the list. Which by the way….our HC does. Trevor absolutely called it out. He nailed every one of these right on the head.
Dirk was bad. He’s been bad for two games. Thought that was clear with the play calling thing.
To many dropped balls to many bad throws and to many kicks missed. Other than that great game.
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!! I agree!!!!!!! watch Koetter go and blame Jameis–since there were no interceptions it will be tough to blame it all on Jameis but he will try–play calling was awful–need 3 yards for a first down so he picks that time for a rocket to Charles sims–stupid plays like that all night.
They tried to give us the game and we couldn’t win it. Jameis was asleep for the first three quarters. The play calling was horrible. How aren’t you going to let a defense who has had communication issues, just sit in cover two all game? Where were the adjustments?
Heck cam brate could’ve been on this list too. A dropped td and at leaste two other that I can think of.
As for folk, that dude needs to be gone tomorrow, end of story. Those kicks weren’t even close.
Agree with this list, and the fact that we were even that close is mind boggling.
No Rob call the coach out by name is he untouchable to be called out by name?? He calls out JAMEIS WINSTON every freaking week dude!!! I swear let Jameis go somewhere else I’m going with him unloyal a## fans and writers!!
I’m with you dude!!!! A QB can have an off game and STILL keep you in the game, WHICH IS WHAT JW did!!! Brady wasn’t stellar, but his kicker was.
JW hung in there and kept fighting, but lets ignore the dropped td, td run called back and then missed FG.
Trevor says stats lie, no they don’t. JW did enough to outduel the GOAT and his kicker and TE let him down. Is Brady the GOAT without Vinatieri?!?!?
I’ll be ecstatic when JW leaves Tampa!!! Doug Williams 2.0. SMDH!!!!
It’s because I went to Florida.
Brady wasn’t stellar? What game was you watching. He went 30 for 40 and at one point connected on like 13 consecutive throws. Not to mention he was missing his top WR and best TE in the NFL. Winston look bad the first half. He missed wide open targets. He threw behind Sims on what would have been a first down. He over threw a wide open Martin on what would have been a first down. He over threw a wide open Jackson on what would have been a Touch Down. You give us Brady the first half with the same play calls and we put up 21 points period. Brady doesn’t miss open targets often and def not multiple a game.
Brady was certainly far from “stellar”. His QBR was only 34.0, only one passing touchdown, 19 points total when his offense prior to last night was averaging over 30 PPG.
So yeah, Brady wasn’t stellar. But he was good enough to beat the Bucs.
All of this is BS. Jameis played well enough to win. The coach called plays good enough to win. The defense gave up 19 points, good enough to win. The game was lost because of one thing and one thing only. Roberto Aguayo has kidnapped Nick Folk and wearing a mask to look like him, missed 3 field goals. That’s it, that’s all.
Jameis Winston was bad.
Dirk Koetter was bad.
Mike Smith was bad.
But he still gave his team a chance. He didn’t fold. Isn’t that what y’all called for after the Minny game? Make up your mind.
And how can you ignore the td drop, td called back, missed fg? THAT sequence changed the game.
At what point do we realize that “always giving his team a chance to win at the end” is partially on him because he continually starts game slow and is also a reason the team is in a hole by the time he has to play hero in the 4th quarter?
The end zone drop by Brate was a killer, as were the other drops by Brate. I should have put those in, you are right. But, the holding penalty is what got Winston that other touchdown, so it doesn’t really count because it was a penalty, and I obviously touched on the kicks being bad.
I’m not sure why you guys think I’m this big Winston hater when you watch the offense continue to be inconsistent – because of throws that happen and throws that don’t. I think Jameis is incredibly talented, but I also think he has yet to string all that talent together for a long period of time minus one year at Florida State. He is not where he needs to be to win big games. That’s a disappointment three years in.
The play calling sucked. We talk about that a bunch on the post-game podcast. It’s making things difficult for Winston, or , at least, not as easy as it should be. That’s on Dirk Koetter. That’s his job. He had blue prints to how to confuse and move the ball against this defense and he didn’t do it.
He also said the defense was running a lot of zone coverage instead of their traditional man coverage and was dropping players back to confuse Winston. But guess what, it’s the NFL. That happens all the time. Winston and Koetter still both need to know what to do and how to do it when that stuff happen.
Koetter was disappointing, and Winston was disappointing. And the biggest reason why we call them disappointing is because we know they can be much better than what they showed. If they weren’t that good, they wouldn’t be disappointing, but they are. That’s why they’re both on the list.
Might want to rethink your statement–Jameis continually starts slow–didn’t you watch the Giants game? 13 points in first quarter. On the board in first quarter against Bears.
Koetter needs to get a new kicker and and a new play caller that can call plays that are more Winston friendly. The disappointment is Koetter is such an egomaniac that he doesn’t see the obvious fact that he is not helping Jameis. So Trev why are you afraid to write an article about koetter and his poor play calling ?
Koetter an “egomaniac”.
Dude, you’re out of your freaking mind.
Winston threw a broken play to Howard that went 58 yards wide open and the second touchdown was Rodgers breaking open a 36-yard run.
Yes, he made the plays; he got the points. I’m not taking that away from him. But don’t use that as evidence for him as not a slow starter in different circumstances without context.
P.s. I’m not trying to be a dick to anyone. I never will be. First big back-and-forth I’ve had with some of you, so I just wanted to say that. Even though I’ll disagreed with some of you every now and then, it’s never personal form me.
Had to throw that out there because I always appreciate the reads and the conversations. If I’m wrong and you prove me wrong, I’ll admit it.
The ONLY QB that could be consistent in DK’s offense is Aaron Rodgers, IMO. If JW’s and DJax’s timing is off on 9 routes, run posts or skinny posts, crossing patterns, screens or some other route. Just get the ball in his hands. This constant bleating about bombs has gotten silly. Cater to HIS strengths, not what you want him to be.
Btw, for reference, Matt Ryan was an inconsistent deep ball qb, until recently. Time is on the Bucs side, if they’re patient.
Also, I’ve NEVER seen a coach throw his qb under the bus like DK. If it continues this marriage will expire, sooner rather than later. Mark my words!!!
There’s such a dearth of quality NFL qb’s right now, and the press this guy gets is maddening. Btw, Brady was worse tonight, but his kicker is competent and they don’t drop td’s…just sayin’…
You’re welcome for my down vote. Your posts are literally stupid, dude.
I agree with Naples. No way Brady was worse than Winston tonight. Brady connected on 75% of his passes and at one point had 13 straight completions and he did it with Cooks and some back ups. You can blame our play calling all you want but the players were open if Jameis makes the throws. I am upset that we didn’t run the ball more with Martin in the 2nd half. With the way Winston was playing we should have taken the ball out of his hands.
“The play calling sucked. We talk about that a bunch on the post-game podcast. It’s making things difficult for Winston, or , at least, not as easy as it should be. That’s on Dirk Koetter. That’s his job. He had blue prints to how to confuse and move the ball against this defense and he didn’t do it.”
This is the crux of the issue to me. This is the first year I’ve had the game pass and time to watch the rest of league. Winston is being told be sure to go win the game, but also make sure you don’t lose it. Also, some of the play schemes are demanding tight window throws. Some of the plays really need to be thrown out. The first and ten play call/design with 3:42 left in the half looked as if the idea was to gain maybe three yards. With the additions of Jackson, Howard and Godwin, I don’t understand why , we rarely spread the field and work in space.
Jameis was bad…in the 1st half. However, to blame him for Doug Martin’s drop is a little crazy to me. The ball was a little high but that is a catch that any NFL player who suits up has to make.
Brate had I believe 4 drops (including one in the end zone that was completely inexcusable). Would think he deserves a disappointing tag more than Jameis does.
Also, agree with the play calling designation. It’s pretty sad that Tony Romo predicted what Belichick was going to run before the game and Dirk not only was blindsided…but couldn’t even adjust to it until the 4th quarter.
I don’t know if the answer is Koetter completely giving up calling the plays or more heavily relying on input from Monken but I think as of now there is too much on his plate. It’s very hard to be a Head Coach and an Offensive Coordinator at the same time. McVay is succeeding currently but he is basically just Head Coach Offense while Wade Phillips is Head Coach Defense.
I am not sure what the answer is but the Bucs do strike me as a team that is very very slow to adjust if their game plan is not working and that normally falls at the feet of the coach.
And to add to the Hargreaves thing , pass rush wasn’t great but Hargreaves plays so soft and with so much cushion the pass rush would have to be otherworldly (like Von Miller, Khalil Mack coming off the edge with Aaron Donald next to McCoy otherworldly) to cover that up. It’s too early to call VH3 a bust but he has been one of the worst corners in the entire NFL in his short career. Something has to change because he is a detriment to the team right now.
me too Talleyban! Koetter will not take any blame and he will be throwing Jameis under the bus.
Uhhh, dude, this is the Pewterreport … not the Winston report. Stop trying to turn this into a Winston vs. the Bucs thing. I can guess where your real loyalties lie, with a particular college program. This site is all about the Bucs, and Winston is a Buc and that’s all that matters when it comes to Winston..
Winston is the first to take it upon himself to accept responsibility for his shortcomings and need to play better. He’s not going anywhere.
The notion that Coach Koetter somehow “throws Jameis under the bus” is absolutely ridiculous. He simply says whatneeds to be said, stuff virtually everybody in the whole freaking NFL world says, which is that Jameis Winston is very talented and a great leader, but he’s never going to be top tier unless he can learn to read a freaking NFL defense, stop throwing passes to the other team, and gets more accurate in his ball placement. Literally everybody in the freaking NFL world knows that and says that. The jury is still out on whether Jameis will ever get that. It will likely require several more years of play to prove one way or the other.
In the meantime, we Bucs fans are pulling for Jameis to become elite. He’s the best QB we’ve ever had, but at the same time, that’s not saying much. He needs to get way better if we are going to challenge for championships. Ditto with Coach Koetter’s play calling. Ditto with our defense. Ditto with our pass catching.
There is a subset of “Bucs” fans that don’t want JW and never will. That is a fact. You all clamor about “elite” in game 36 of his career when there is example after example of now veteran qb’s, considered to be elite, who haven’t done what JW has done at this stage of his career. Rivers, early Brees, early Big Ben, Russ, early Ryan, Romo, Stafford, Bradford, early Smith, both Mannings, etc, etc. The list is long and littered with “underachievers”.
This, put it all on the qb, JW can take it, trope is so cliched and silly. The problem I see is fans ignoring complimentary football. If JW is off, who picks him up? EVERY SB winning QB had something else to lean on when struggling. The coaching, the D, or the kicking game, or the running game, etc. Tampa is at the point where if 3 isn’t “elite” in every game, they lose. That is unrealistic and the history of the league backs up my assertion.
And the scorn and ridicule 3 receives is off the charts. The praise NEVER equals the hate. The accolades never match the nitpicking. And when there is a compliment, it’s given grudgingly, or with some caveat. THAT is my opinion, no more, or no less valid than yours, but I know that many people agree with me.
You say my posts are stupid, fine. I accept that and agree to disagree. More than anything I’m a JW fan first. I know he has flaws, just like every qb in the league. I expect, understand, embrace and accept them. I’m a pragmatist, so it’s easy for me, but the desire,or expectation for him to be perfect for four quarters, at this stage, is insane.
By this time you all know what he is, yet that’s not good enough, for a large contingent of Bucs fans. He works hard, AND NEVER FOLDS, OR GIVES UP!!! He throws for 260 yards in the second half, and all I read is, stats lie and what about the missed passes in the first half?!? What about the drops? What about the stupid penalties? What about the two missed FG’s? That is why y’all lost, BECAUSE AS POORLY AS JW PLAYED FOR STRETCHES, UNLIKE THE GOAT, HE DIDN’T GIVE THE GAME AWAY. On some gamedays that’s all you can ask for. Btw, the short pass to DM wasn’t over his head, it went right past his hands. It looked like he lost it in the lights, IMO. Again, agree to disagree.
Neither the GOAT or JW had their B game last night, that is true, but JW had y’all RIGHT THERE EVEN AS HE STRUGGLED. I wish my team had JW,, warts and all. I’d wake up every Sunday with a smile on my face. I guess soon we’ll see what’s up. Maybe TB will refuse to extend JW. Either way, JW will have a remarkable career.
The number of fans who post here at PR who want Jamies gone is approximately zero.
The number of fans who post here at PR who both want, and expect, Jameis to become truly elite is approximately the sum total of all who post here.
The number of fans – all Noles super-partisans, like you, who think this is pre-draft 2015 forever – who go apeshit because the rest of us, and the entire NFL world, and Jameis himself, acknowledge where his play is not yet good enough, is far too many in this thread.
Stop attacking Trevor for telling it like it is. Stop attacking Koetter for telling it like it is, and lying about him by saying he is a super-egotist who relishes throwing Jameis under the bus … which is like the dumbest thing I’ve ever read on PR in years.
There are many involved with the Bucs who need to step it up. The quarterback is always the most important player on any NFL team, so it is more important that the quarterback step it up than for any other player. It goes with the job.
Jameis understands and openly takes this responsibility to heart. He’s being far more mature about it than you and one or two other Super Noles here in this thread are.
FIrst off, just because I think Jameis played like crap for 3 quarters doesn’t mean I don’t want him on the bucs. Everyone on here wants him and wants him to exceed. No one expects him to be elite yet but we would like to see progress in that direction. With all the weapons and talent we have gotten him, I expected to see a better showing last night. Of all those QB’s you just named only P Manning, Brees, and maybe Ryan would be considered elite. No one expects him to be perfect but I do expect him to make most of the easy throws, The 5 yd crossing routes, the 8 yd curls. Even the throws that he completed was off target. Had they been accurate, our WRs could have gotten more yards on the plays. Jameis was off for 3 quarters and yet his team kept him in the game.
Next, we aren’t ignoring complimentary football. I think the D and the running game both stepped up last night. Yes the defense at times let Brady pick them apart but they bent and didn’t break. They held the number 1 offense to 19 points with a bunch of back ups. The defense stepped up when they had to. So did Martin. When Jameis was struggling, Martin turned it on and looked back to his pro bowl form.
Your right, stats do lie. Jameis did throw fro 260 in the 2nd half but 222 of those yards came with 10 minutes left in the game. By then the Patriots was playing a prevent defense and it gave Winston most of those yards.
This team is built around Jameis and our offense. When he struggles it is noticeable by everyone. last night he struggled. He didn’t even look like a starting NFL QB for 3 quarters. Even the announcers last night commented on how off he was. The QB is the most important player on the team and also the most criticized. We could have won the game last night with no kicker if Winston would have had at least his B game. Despite his play, none of us want to get rid of him neither does the Bucs because the potential is there. We all want him to develop into a great QB for us. I know it takes time but show me some progress. At least make the easy throws and the occasional deep bomb to Jackson. You talk about complimentary football, well when the kicking game is off who needs to step up? I expect our captains to step up and make plays and Winston failed to do that for 3 quarters last night. McCoy and our defense stepped up big last night, doug Martin stepped up bug last night, our kicker sucked again but unfortunately he is not a captain nor a leader of this team and I don’t expect him to step up. It wasn’t just Winston who had us right there even when he struggled. It was our defense and running game that kept us in this game while Winston Struggled. Its a team effort. They win and lose as a team. AS long as Winston continues to struggle we will not win many games.
The kicking game in the NFL should NEVER be off. The margin between victory or defeat is too thin in the league to keep trotting out a poor kicker.
Right I don’t kno what else HE has to do he gave us multiple chances to win the game. I’m sorry if ur online doesn’t flinch and give 10 seconds we have time for two shots at the end zone. jw has faults but when the head coach doesn’t call plays to get his qb in rythym what can we expect. Just look how different our offenses were. Deion sanders said our offense lacks imagination and I agree whole heartily. We need to just admit Dirk may not have been head coach material and that’s telling it like it is
O and JW had a touchdown taken away by penalty so it seems he did everything possible
I hear you trev I get it… but at some point I need to see that name stamped on there just how you stamp Jameis’s name up there pretty much every week I like you guys at pewter report pretty much always on here but man i feel like you especially under appreciate Jameis..i understand dirk calls the plays but I kinda feel you let him off the hook much more than you let Jameis off the hook…remember play calling and coaching makes a MAJOR difference in football see(JARED GOFF) …
I don’t mean to under appreciate him. It is rare to have a quarterback in the NFL that gives you hope. But hope can’t mask all of the inconsistencies – you gotta have both at some point.
I hear what you’re saying. I don’t mean to make it seem like I always put everything on Winston, and I don’t have a problem calling people out, whether I see them at the podium or not. Ultimately it’s Winston’s arm that makes the plays or not, but there are plenty of factors around him that also go into it. I pride myself in trying to always mention those, too. If I failed, I apologize.
mention dirk koetter by name as being responsible for the poor play calling–start with that. FYI, I do appreciate your cover 3 columns
He totally is.
Kin, Talley, htown and Byron are blithering idiots. Sorry you have to put up with this.
Please continue being you, providing us detailed, well-reasoned, extremely insightful analysis instead of spinning things positively to placate the homers the way a lot of the other articles on this site do.
Trevor – you’re being victimized by one of those bad-old Nole Troll-storms from back in days of Winston v. Mariota. They’re not Bucs fans, they’re Nole fans first and foremost. Just read some of the crap they posted in this thread, about happily ditching the Bucs if Jameis goes to some other team.
Ignore their stupid asses. I’m sure Jameis would be the first in line to tell them to STFU.
Mike Smith just needs to have the balls to call CBs to press a little hard. I’m talking 2-3 yards closer. I really do think Grimes and Hargreaves can handle that, and the pass rush is showing some signs of life here.
Receiving corps in general disappointing, with highlights here and there. Yes, Winston didn’t always hit spot on but c’mon ppl, I saw like 5 times just while watching the game where the ball hit them right between the hands and they couldn’t come up with it.
As always, I’m disappointed in our ticket broker season pass members who take away any semblance of home field advantage. Offense on the field and having to deal with the “Defense-Defense” chants.
The whole team seemed a bit awe-struck and out of sync.
Patriots controlled the clock and eventually the defense was gassed. I thought Dirk should have recognized that, slowed it down a little and concentrate on picking up a few first downs. Brady saw our defense tiring and seemed to pick up the pace.
Often a player can make the Most Disappointing List for a single play. If that were the case Cameron Brate didn’t help out Jameis with at least two drops. Great catch on a throw in the tightest of windows.
Can’t get past the missed field goals and their demoralizing effect on the psyche of the team.
I’ve been quick to praise your analysis, but to put Winston in the top 5 most disappointing of this game is pretty harsh. I want to wait to see the coach’s film to really know what was going on. He did have a very big miss to Jackson that would’ve been a game changer, but this is the type of game Koetter is coaching him and so many want him to play. Careful. Winston had his share of dropped passes too that would’ve changed this game. Winston made enough throws to win this game. He could’ve been better, sure but putting him in this grouping indicates he is a primary reason for the loss. I don’t see it. This is the deal. If this game and anything below this game is now disappointing for Winston, we need to trade him and hope we can get another QB. I expected him to somehow win the game at the end and he very nearly did. Howard has to read that situation, Winston fired the ball toward a soft spot. Howard ran his route into the pressure. Winston’s throw trusted Howard to make a read.
Very poor special teams play giving up a huge return on a returnable punt, down the middle of the field, plus an Unsportsmanlike tacked on gave instant points. Folk was awful in every aspect including that onside kick. Folk can’t find the ball all of the sudden. This gets most kickers cut. Do the Bucs have a kicking specialist coach? Maybe they should. Folk makes just one of his earlier attempts, the Bucs are in position to win with a game winning field goal inside 40 yards as time expires.
The last play of the game Howard has to see the field and understand whats up, but hey if Dotson doesn’t move early there, we have another 10 seconds to play with. OJ Howard had a particular challenging night with two penalties (the holding looked really iffy) and 0 catches. He needs to start running better routes. Howard is relying too heavily on his blocking. As fast as he is, he doesn’t appear to be using the speed/burst that he has. I love the td last week but he must start making more consistent plays in the passing game. Koetter needs to look at how KC uses Kelce and run a few underneath shuttle screens to OJ.
This was the most consistent pass rush in any game to this point. Needs to improve but if this was the average, I’d be more than happy.
Now to Koetter/play calling. He has been poor on this now for 20 games as a coach/coordinator. He is not calling a good game. As solid as Martin was and the energy that he had to move away from him at all was scandalous. After the TD drive which Martin was a such a big factor. Koetter starts the next drive (after a TD drive by the Pats) in shotgun with Sims in the offset. First play, sack. Next play 2nd and 15, 6 yard out to Evans, 3rd and 9. (at this point in the season, the Pats had given up 0 conversions on 3rd and 10 or longer, so 3rd and 9 is not even close to easy) Next play should’ve been intercepted (but Evans could’ve had another too so ifs and should’ves don’t really matter and special teams gave the Pats way better field position with a punt down the middle, huge return and penalty. The INT would’ve been a better result).. This sequence is confounding. Even with 3:42 First play, is either a Martin draw, or a play action to slow pressure down. Instead it looks like the play just has 3 players coming off the line slowly, running 5 yard curl routes, Humphries running a route in the flat (I believe this is where the read was, but a stupid play design given time) and Sims coming out late. Winston wanted one of his three guys running curls, not sure why. With the half looming, and as hot as Martin was, if he wasn’t injured this was just poor.
My assessment, and this is a bigger issue, is that Koetter has some poor play design as well as play calling. His job is to make sure that his guys are in the best spots on the field to make plays.
Wow. This string of posters, with their panties in a bunch attacking Trevor for posting the truth about our QB – who has yet to translate his potential into consistent play at or near the level of other ‘franchise QBs’ – is shocking and disappointing to me. It’s a microcosm of what’s going on in this country – stupid, unhappy angry people lashing out based on emotion instead of objective thought about complicated situations. Probably a bunch of drunkards, too.
Did you JW apologists bashing him even stop to think about how lucky we are to have someone as talented as Trevor writing at such a high level about a relatively small market, relatively poorly performing team like ours?
You should cherish the time we have with him, his work is so far better than anything else on PR and anything I read about football overall, not just the Bucs. It’s a matter of time before he is on a much bigger stage, will you imbicles please not chase him away any sooner than necessary. Now that you’ve sobered up, each of you owes him an apology. And no, I’m not his mom 😀
Hey that great kicker from Florida State is a free agent. I’m sure we can pick him up, I think his name is Aguayo. He was at least good for 60% and that would have won is the game 🙄🙄.
We’re not the Patriots offense or the Packers offense but you know what neither were they2 years in with their coach and QB combo. Let this team grow together, it’s not just going to happen.
Both Rodgers and Brady we’re behind great QBs just learning never with the pressure of starting as rookies with all the responsibilities of a team on their backs.
Folks makes 2/3 we win, that’s what you want.
That has been the same thing the Giants fans feel about Manning’s play and they have 2 Superbowl ribs with him.
We can do the same eventually.
It did but to watch this plays again but I loved that we still had a chance to win the game with :03 seconds on the clock.
My two cents
Simple – we let this on slip away. Had it and lost it multiple times. D did enough to win this game, period. Offense was terrible from play calling to execution by almost everyone. But Jameis still almost pulled it out. The onside kick at the end was dumb. And OJ Howard looks nothing like a first round pick. We’ve got a mini bye – let’s see what we do with it.
The pass rush does not belong on this list, they were effective but extremely overused due to an inconsistent offense that put them on the field too much and VHIII playing his usual 15 yard cushion coverage. That guy(VHIII) goes right below Folk in my opinion because the chunk plays he allowed kept NE marching down the field despite penalties backing them up. Now on to Jameis Winston being listed, this is absolutely insane. We had an offense that prepared for NE playing defense how they have all season and the COACH never adjusted the play calling and took advantage of what they gave us THIS WEEK. Doug ran the ball well on the TD drive and then the following drive it’s pass, pass, pass and punt. Was Jameis as accurate as he could have been no, but he kept us in the game and you saw him keeping the guys going despite Nick Folk looking like kids from the Punt, Pass and Kick contest could give him a run for his money. That man marched us down the field late and gave us a shot to win late in a game that was lost on the foot of Folk and the play calling of Dirk. Everybody is so fixated on the fact that Jameis and Desean haven’t connected deep that they forget there are other ways to get Desean the ball until that chemistry is worked out like the underneath crossing route that Desean turned into a large chunk play. Expecting perfection from Jameis every week is crazy but it’s hard to put a guy that threw for 300 yards and no turnovers with a TD that could’ve been 2 without a Brate drop on the disappointment list. Also the onside kick to end the game was absolutely stupid, kick the ball deep and try to get better field position. Folk is terrible so why ask him to do anything additional to cost us a game, he hadn’t executed all game not shocked he failed us again on the onside attempt without the ball ever bouncing in the air. Dirk and Jason need to stop being so stupid about these things and get rid of this kicker. I said it after last weeks win that he was trash and Im not sure what else he needs to do to lose his job. The pass rush did not cost us the game, Jameis’ errant throws in the first half did not cost us the game but Dirk’s inability to take advantage of the run game and to recognize Folk was not the answer is what ultimately cost us the game.
I agree completely with stlbuc–could not of said it better!
I’ve been ridiculed in the past for saying Koetter needs to turn over play calling duty to Monken, I’m glad some of you are catching on. Having an Arron Rodgers is one thing, but Jameis is in the infancy of his career. He needs his O.C. in his ear the whole game. Koetter no longer has that luxury to sit with J.W. after a bad series, and get on the same page. They were joined at the hip his rookie season, and now there seems to be a disconnect. How does it work? Monken does the heavy lifting all week game planning, then Koetter says O.K., I’ll take it from here on game day? If Jameis is frustrated with the play calling, does he tell Monken on the sideline, who then must relay that to Koetter sometime during the game? Dirk, let Monk make a name for himself as an O.C., therefor giving him a chance to one day get his own gig. I also believe Koetter no longer has the time to draw up new plays, so his offence becomes stale, and more predictable. This game came down to missed opportunities. Dropped passes, missing open receivers, and for goodness sakes, do I have to take a Valium every time our field goal kicker takes the field? One other thing. Grow some Balls Dirk. At some point you needed to go for it instead of depending on an undependable kicker.
A freaking men!
I so badly want JW to be a great quarterback- but objectively he was bad last night. The play calling left alot to be desired, but overthrowing open receivers is not a playcalling problem. He was just not in rhythm all night. He forced passes to D Jax. He would not take what the defense was giving him. The defense played well enough to win this game and JW and the kicking game let them down. Trevor pointing this out does not make him a hater, it makes him an analyst.
I think the problem with the critique is that Jameis did not win the game for us, that’s entirely different than saying he lost the game, which he did not. He was unable to connect on passes down the field, so the reason I’m taking some of the blame off of him is because he ran the ball well but did not commit to it. If he was having problems connecting downfield then newsflash stop calling plays that require him to throw downfield. Adjust the passes called to more underneath routes and screens which were actually available given the zone they sat in. It’s the job of the head coach to sense that his QB is slightly off and call plays that are easy completions not make the problem worse by continuing to dial up shots downfield. Jameis is not without fault but he’s hardly the reason we lost yesterday.
At no point did I say that Winston was the main reason they lost. I agree with you that Koetter is. Totally. This list isn’t in order of importance. But many people take it that way so perhaps I should start doing it like that.
Koetter was out-coached, that’s why they lost. But even knowing that, I’d still say Jameis was disappointing – not the worst, not the reason they lost. That’s why he’s on the list.
I’m an FSU alumnus and Jameis did the same thing his last year there. He needs some easy throws in the beginning to get into a rhythm or he’ll be off most of the game. He doesn’t have a natural touch on deep and swing passes. He was great at throwing jump balls to 6’5 Kalvin Benjamin, but he doesn’t do it alot with our tall WR’s and TE’s. He forces it between 2-3 defenders instead of throwing up a jump ball where only our guy can catch it.
Putting the pass rush on this list is really harsh. They forced a fumble, hit & hurried Brady a lot and got 3 sacks. Defense did their job last night as best they could without 3 elite defenders.
Folk was plain awful & needs to be released. Disappointing for a vet to completely melt under the pressure. I’m not going to give him hell for missing a 56 yarder. But 48 & 31 are kicks you have to make. That’s 6 points we needed. Unacceptable.
Jameis was terrible for 3 quarters. No rhythm. Sluggish. Total lack of execution. If even half of his ability shows up last night, we score 24+ easily. Hell, even with his crap play and shit play calling we still should have scored 27 (Brate drop TD & 2 missed FG) Frustrating these type of games happen. Dropped passes didn’t help, but they’re not major reason why he was bad for 3 quarters. He’s 50/50 in game performances this year. We’ll see how he responds next week.
Thank you for finally taking the play calling and Dirk to task. The gameplan was horrible. We threw it 46 times. We ran it 17. Madness. Pats were getting opened up in the run game & again we abandoned it. Jameis was clearly not sharp, yet we didn’t run a screen until middle of the 4th. Didn’t run bunch formation until 4th. Didn’t go hurry up until 4th. The adjustment was so slow to come. Dirk’s decisions to not go for it on 4th and 1 late in the 3rd & the onside kick were awful. He has to be better.
Hargreaves with six tackles because they throw at him all the time. If he played any further off the line he would be out of the end zone.
Beckwith – what a pleasant surprise!
Matador yea u must be his dad or his lawyer then shut up dude like I said call out dirk…saying play calling is just as Vanilla as Dirks play calling…trev had jameis on most disappointing in a winning week like cmon man..my point is some of y’all fans don’t give Jameis enough credit and damn sure dont give dirk the negative credit he deserves…and it’s wearing old with me yea Jameis needs to play better definetly agree with that and stated that but qbs COACHING and defense win games right… o and yes i will admit im not from FL so im not a homer fan yall inherited me when Jameis was drafted here(bias) maybe but I’ve grown to love the Bucs and the organization as a whole but I call a spade when I see it and trev calls out JAMEIS routinely same as some fans be grateful we have a future HOFer ride with him help him be fair with him and yes critique him
, I am worried they win against bottom basement team The Bears. They lose to a team that wins 50% of it games Vikings, win against 0-4 Giants by the hair of small rabbit and only score 14 points in a loss against a team that it opponents average 30 against them so far this year the Patriots.
I think the Bucs Defence is better than the average team. That said!
Winston supposes to have talent, maybe it is not Winston fault that Bucs hired a coach that as offence coordinator for Bucs 2014 2015 had the worst record in NFL 2 years in a row.
Does anybody ask why they hired a coach that was the offensive coordinator for Bucs when they win 6 games in 2 years Bucs fire Lovie Smith then hire worst Offence coordinator in NFL to be the head coach My question is what if they hired in 2016 a coach that was best offence coordinator in the NFL to work with Winston.
Why is no one else asking this question? This team has a better defence than most teams has Winston, Martin, Evans and is going nowhere fast. Does anybody think maybe it is the head coach !!!
The defense is very pedestrian. Usually no pass rush to speak of, as they have very average talent at t he end position, are thin at linebacker, and the secondary is led by a cb who played for Lombardi…so lets draft another TE. I believe it’s getting closer to start looking at the GM who is running the entire show.
Trevor (or TS as I’ve referred to you in previous posts…hope you don’t mind but I’m lazy when it comes to posts and I abbreviate as much as a can…I do the same with SR and MC) I feel bad for you (even though you’re a Gator and I’m an FSU fan) because you didn’t work at PR about 3 years ago when I said much of what you are saying now was going to happen with Jameis. The jury is still out on Jameis being a franchise QB and I said about 3 years ago I would give him 3 seasons before I make my final assessment and I’m sticking to that. I just wanted to let you know it doesn’t matter whether you’re being a dick or not with some of these posters. I never insulted anyone directly (check the archives) but it’s clear that stating an opinion against Jameis is seen as a sin around here no matter how much evidence you provide to support your claim. I just didn’t want you to beat yourself up over it because you aren’t the first and won’t be the last…especially if January rolls around and we don’t make the playoffs.
To clarify, I never insulted anyone directly or indirectly. I don’t know why I added the word “directly” there. I do insult people’s performance or assessments, just not the performer or assessor.
Oh, I don’t ! I appreciate the looking out, but I’ve been writing for a pretty long time (though this is the biggest platform). I know how it goes. There will always be disagreements. But I would much rather people always be real with me, as I will be with them.
Just wanted to put that out there to the Pewter Nation that even though we’ll disagree and have our back and forths that, I will do my best to not be stubborn or a dick about things. I don’t have an agenda or a narrative I’m trying to write about players or people. I try to always let what I watch do the talking. If I am wrong and I get called out, I have no problem admitting that. But I think I do my homework and will standby it.
Lastly how is Cam Brate not on the list. I love the guy and his story is fantastic but he had 2 big drops and 1 of which would’ve been the game winning touchdown. If we are blaming Folk for the obvious and Jameis for missing some throws then certainly someone who drops a touchdown should be listed.
He should have been. You are right! Probably his worst game as a Buccaneer.
– OJ Howard has thus far for some reason been treated like grandma’s fine china yet when the game is on the line you are looking for him. Makes no sense.
-Jackson and Winston have no chemistry together whatsoever. The third down play when Jackson has Butler Rod Jones’ed is a play that MUST be made. 6 all the way and a momentum changer.
-Hargreaves is a first round bust. Plays softer than a sneaker full of spit and shows very little interest in getting physical. I’d throw at him all day long.
-The stone age offense needs to go. I’ve been saying this for almost 30 years, since my first year of watching them with Mark Carrier and Bruce Hill. Those 2 could stretch a D. Maybe get another piece of grandma’s china on the field, Chris Godwin, who seems severely underused to this point.
I have nothing against Trevor and I wish him much success in his chosen profession, HOWEVER, I disagree with some of his assertions. I do so without vitriol or name calling, unlike some of you, yet I’m a FSU troll…ooookay. I suppose I’m more of an USMC/FSU troll since I met JW at the Tampa VA once, but you know me and my intentions I guess, so Carry On!!!
I’m curious. I’d like to see who some of you consider to be franchise QB’s in today’s NFL. Exclude the obvious from your list, Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Ryan….
So I’m an idiot because I feel as if our qb is a good talent who 3 years in has given all fans more hope since when we won our only superbowl. Im an idiot because with JW i feel like we are never out of a game and with other guys you knew we didn’t have comeback abilities. I’m an idiot because for every bad throw jw had and i will say he had about 5 to 6 awful no chance should have been an int throws he had equal the number of drops. I’m a idiot because we fired lovie Smith because of his soft Tampa 2 but we hired Mike Smith and his soft cover 4 and I think he needs to shape up or be shipped out. I’m an idiot because I know that if we want to give our cbs and blitzes a chance we need to press and jam more. I’m a idiot because Dirk koetter can’t call an offense and I think he needs to b really evaluated like lovie was if we have less than 10 wins. Maybe we all need to realize that we have bigger problems than our qb and take a look at the weak offensive and defensive playbook, the fact that we didn’t draft one defensive end or cb when we needed them, the fact that we keep trying to force djax deep instead of using his speed in the seams or on crossing routes or more slants or quick hitters or important punt returns . Mayb if we updated the playbook and actually try what some of the really good teams do u kno take advantage of a certain personnel grouping like putting linebackers on wide receivers mayb our qb will be able to sustain more drives. As I have stated JW annoys me cuz one drive he looks like he gets it and has hall of fame written all over him and another drive he looks like he doesn’t know what’s going on but I’m smart enough to know that he is a small problem compared to lack of pass rush, lack of cb play outside of brent grimes and poor play calling on both sides even tho the d played awesome last night Justin Evans has some real potential and beckwith is becoming a real asset. I do enjoy your insight Trevor I just disagree that Winston was unimpressive mayb a dishonarable mention but I would have put cam brate and Mike Evans on the list cuz cam u gotta make that catch and Mike your an elite receiver 5 for 48 is not good enough. Add the online to that list too illegal hands wipes out a td and both tackles jump offside and get a 10 sec runoff. I am a fan Trevor I love all u have brought to the site and can’t wait for more content
Being an old f*rt …
I have watched the development of some of the best and the “fizzling out” of a few “sure things” in regard to some NFL quarterbacks over the years. I have followed the development of John Elway, Bret Farvre , RG3 and Andrew Luck (?? “jury’s still out”) … just to name a few.
I see Jameis as “right on schedule” so far. He is still up and down in his play. Now, after the end of this season ……?
Hargreaves is terrible. Don’t know why he plays so soft. Not sure whether that is by design or he just has no confidence. The clown celebrated in the Giants game when the WR dropped a pass which would have been a first down like he had something to do with it. You could hear on the sideline, Inside the NFL, Manning was saying, “We are going after his @ss all day long”
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