Arians was good for sure but not even he could coach up the shit 2021 draft class
The 2021 draft class is one of the worst ones I can recall.
- 2014 was bad with the exception of Mike Evans.
- 2015 was OK overall. Marpet was a find. I wanted the Buccaneers to take him after watching his tape.
- 2016 was low grade dog food. Taking a kicker in the second round?
- 2017 Godwin. Had Licht ever had a good draft class or just one guy hits, and we given him credit?
- 2018 Vea - great, Davis and Jones passable
I think Licht is mid at best. I think a coach made him look better.
the 2016 draft was one of the worst in NFL history. my god that was brutal. a botched top 11 pick in Hargreaves, noah spence amounted to nothing and trading up for a kicker who ended up being dogshit. brutal.
and yeah 2014 through 2017 landed Evans, Marpet, and Godwin. Would argue Donovan Smith was serviceable. The rest...ehh
i am just saying 2018 through 2020 drafts landed 13 guys who all contributed to the Superbowl run (Vea, Jones, Davis, Cappa, Whitehead, White, SMB, Dean, Edwards, Nelson, Miller, Wirfs, and AWJ). Not all of these guys ended up being a success but all were good contributors to a solid core of that 2020 squad
the 2021 draft was Licht's 2nd worst draft only because of how bad 2016 was.
2022 through 2025 have been mid. Sure we landed alot of starters but for a .500 squad. Not exactly great.
A lot of the players from the 2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025 have not hit their stride yet so I am not worried about these drafts. McCollum and Otton have more room to grow but both are going to be solid 2s in this league for a long time which is why Licht opted to resign both. However it was an interesting uses of cap space when the Bucs do not have a clear 1 at CB now or at TE which is why the talk of drafting a TE in round 1 is still on the table.
That is diametrically different how Rich Mckay would do business as he would sign his 1 to a long term deal and let the 2 walk and replace the 2 with a draft pick. That is why Lynch was the mainstay at safety for so long and the other starting safety spot opposite of Lynch was a revolving door.
For the 2023 class they really need to take the next step up because they are in danger of being just average which means they can be replaced with this upcoming 2026 draft class or even free agents off the streets.
Too soon for the 2024 and 2025 draft classes for people to be passing judgement on them honestly. Have to give them another year or two to really see what you have (Braswell is the exception he is just not good enough).
I’m not a Braswell guy, I was very low on him coming out in the draft. But what is frustrating is he got strip sacks in 24 and 25 and they next week they sign Barrett and JPP to take his reps. If a young player is showing something why take away his opportunities for a clear dead end.
If a young player is showing something why take away his opportunities for a clear dead end.
Hmm…
Who would be the guy that controls the reps he’s getting?
If a young player is showing something why take away his opportunities for a clear dead end.
Hmm…
Who would be the guy that controls the reps he’s getting?
100% Bowles
Arians was good for sure but not even he could coach up the shit 2021 draft class
The 2021 draft class is one of the worst ones I can recall.
- 2014 was bad with the exception of Mike Evans.
- 2015 was OK overall. Marpet was a find. I wanted the Buccaneers to take him after watching his tape.
- 2016 was low grade dog food. Taking a kicker in the second round?
- 2017 Godwin. Had Licht ever had a good draft class or just one guy hits, and we given him credit?
- 2018 Vea - great, Davis and Jones passable
I think Licht is mid at best. I think a coach made him look better.
the 2016 draft was one of the worst in NFL history. my god that was brutal. a botched top 11 pick in Hargreaves, noah spence amounted to nothing and trading up for a kicker who ended up being dogshit. brutal.
and yeah 2014 through 2017 landed Evans, Marpet, and Godwin. Would argue Donovan Smith was serviceable. The rest...ehh
i am just saying 2018 through 2020 drafts landed 13 guys who all contributed to the Superbowl run (Vea, Jones, Davis, Cappa, Whitehead, White, SMB, Dean, Edwards, Nelson, Miller, Wirfs, and AWJ). Not all of these guys ended up being a success but all were good contributors to a solid core of that 2020 squad
the 2021 draft was Licht's 2nd worst draft only because of how bad 2016 was.
2022 through 2025 have been mid. Sure we landed alot of starters but for a .500 squad. Not exactly great.
A lot of the players from the 2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025 have not hit their stride yet so I am not worried about these drafts. McCollum and Otton have more room to grow but both are going to be solid 2s in this league for a long time which is why Licht opted to resign both. However it was an interesting uses of cap space when the Bucs do not have a clear 1 at CB now or at TE which is why the talk of drafting a TE in round 1 is still on the table.
That is diametrically different how Rich Mckay would do business as he would sign his 1 to a long term deal and let the 2 walk and replace the 2 with a draft pick. That is why Lynch was the mainstay at safety for so long and the other starting safety spot opposite of Lynch was a revolving door.
For the 2023 class they really need to take the next step up because they are in danger of being just average which means they can be replaced with this upcoming 2026 draft class or even free agents off the streets.
Too soon for the 2024 and 2025 draft classes for people to be passing judgement on them honestly. Have to give them another year or two to really see what you have (Braswell is the exception he is just not good enough).
I’m not a Braswell guy, I was very low on him coming out in the draft. But what is frustrating is he got strip sacks in 24 and 25 and they next week they sign Barrett and JPP to take his reps. If a young player is showing something why take away his opportunities for a clear dead end.
hes had tons of opportunities on a team dying for someone to emerge in that role.
Arians was good for sure but not even he could coach up the shit 2021 draft class
The 2021 draft class is one of the worst ones I can recall.
- 2014 was bad with the exception of Mike Evans.
- 2015 was OK overall. Marpet was a find. I wanted the Buccaneers to take him after watching his tape.
- 2016 was low grade dog food. Taking a kicker in the second round?
- 2017 Godwin. Had Licht ever had a good draft class or just one guy hits, and we given him credit?
- 2018 Vea - great, Davis and Jones passable
I think Licht is mid at best. I think a coach made him look better.
the 2016 draft was one of the worst in NFL history. my god that was brutal. a botched top 11 pick in Hargreaves, noah spence amounted to nothing and trading up for a kicker who ended up being dogshit. brutal.
and yeah 2014 through 2017 landed Evans, Marpet, and Godwin. Would argue Donovan Smith was serviceable. The rest...ehh
i am just saying 2018 through 2020 drafts landed 13 guys who all contributed to the Superbowl run (Vea, Jones, Davis, Cappa, Whitehead, White, SMB, Dean, Edwards, Nelson, Miller, Wirfs, and AWJ). Not all of these guys ended up being a success but all were good contributors to a solid core of that 2020 squad
the 2021 draft was Licht's 2nd worst draft only because of how bad 2016 was.
2022 through 2025 have been mid. Sure we landed alot of starters but for a .500 squad. Not exactly great.
A lot of the players from the 2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025 have not hit their stride yet so I am not worried about these drafts. McCollum and Otton have more room to grow but both are going to be solid 2s in this league for a long time which is why Licht opted to resign both. However it was an interesting uses of cap space when the Bucs do not have a clear 1 at CB now or at TE which is why the talk of drafting a TE in round 1 is still on the table.
That is diametrically different how Rich Mckay would do business as he would sign his 1 to a long term deal and let the 2 walk and replace the 2 with a draft pick. That is why Lynch was the mainstay at safety for so long and the other starting safety spot opposite of Lynch was a revolving door.
For the 2023 class they really need to take the next step up because they are in danger of being just average which means they can be replaced with this upcoming 2026 draft class or even free agents off the streets.
Too soon for the 2024 and 2025 draft classes for people to be passing judgement on them honestly. Have to give them another year or two to really see what you have (Braswell is the exception he is just not good enough).
I’m not a Braswell guy, I was very low on him coming out in the draft. But what is frustrating is he got strip sacks in 24 and 25 and they next week they sign Barrett and JPP to take his reps. If a young player is showing something why take away his opportunities for a clear dead end.
hes had tons of opportunities on a team dying for someone to emerge in that role.
Then how do you explain him getting strip sack vs Carolina Week 17 in 2024 and then getting just 5 snaps week 18? While Barrett signed off the street got 12 snaps?
Then how do you explain him getting strip sack vs Carolina Week 17 in 2024 and then getting just 5 snaps week 18? While Barrett signed off the street got 12 snaps?
Hmm….I wonder who would push for that?
Keeping Bowles does not make sense in any other scenario.
a few possibilities
1. the loyalty they keep mentioning
2. belief (even if wrong) that 2025 was an injury-related outlier
3. the need to transition older players out without FORCING them out like post first SB
4. the challenges of finding a better HC who would deal with BOTH the "cash management" you mention AND how to deal with Evans, LVD etc.
5. the influence of Arians and Licht
6. the combination of a number of those things
You could be right though. Just alternative food for thought.
I think the disaster that happened after firing Gruden has made them gun-shy. They flailed around trying to find a coach.
The pendulum swung too far IMHO. They need to learn that you might keep a guy like Gruden who won and won a Super Bowl. You do not keep a guy like Bowles who barely produces winning seasons.
I think the disaster that happened after firing Gruden has made them gun-shy.
Totally agree
That isn’t true because retrospectively they should have given Schiano a 3rd year.
not even sure how that relates to the point but no way was he getting 3rd year
Bucs fans and media are working their brains to understand why the Bucs kept Bowles and the answer is simply he’s built enough equity in the franchise to survive an injury riddled missed playoff season.
The argument that they kept him because things got worse after firing Gruden is wrong because they cut the cord on Schiano too early and things got worse.
The argument that they kept him because things got worse after firing Gruden is wrong because they cut the cord on Schiano too early and things got worse.
That is a fair point. I think Schiano had clearly lost the locker room. I don't think Bowles has. I don't think Gruden had.
I think that is the difference.
I think the disaster that happened after firing Gruden has made them gun-shy. They flailed around trying to find a coach.
I don't recall the flailing around after firing Gruden. The owners pretty clearly had Morris (and Dominik) in mind when they fired Gruden (and Allen), as he was announced within 24 hours of Gruden's firing.
Is that the disaster you're referring to?
The argument that they kept him because things got worse after firing Gruden is wrong because they cut the cord on Schiano too early and things got worse.
That is a fair point. I think Schiano had clearly lost the locker room. I don't think Bowles has. I don't think Gruden had.
I think that is the difference.
The 2013 team was playing decent after the bad start, especially Glennon. They definitely didn’t quit. After 0-7 they finished 4-5 with 2 losses being well fought vs Seattle and SF who were arguably the two best teams. Schiano was bringing in some serious talent in just 2 years. JBF was just talking about how the Glazers were replacing him in October.