If you would have asked me that heading into 2025, no frickin way Lawrence is anywhere close to Baker as Baker easily in the top 10.
you have quite a volatile relationship with Mayfield lol
and an interesting relationship with statistics
[Lawrence] really came into his own the last 7 games last year.
So Mayfield is defined by a negative subset of games from 2025, Lawrence a positive subset?
To each their own, but how about a whole season in the same offense?
If you compare them in the same offense and even adjust for the help/hurt they were getting from other aspects of the team, I'd say Mayfield is better.
If you would have asked me that heading into 2025, no frickin way Lawrence is anywhere close to Baker as Baker easily in the top 10.
you have quite a volatile relationship with Mayfield lol
and an interesting relationship with statistics
[Lawrence] really came into his own the last 7 games last year.
So Mayfield is defined by a negative subset of games from 2025, Lawrence a positive subset?
To each their own, but how about a whole season in the same offense?
If you compare them in the same offense and even adjust for the help/hurt they were getting from other aspects of the team, I'd say Mayfield is better.
the part you always conveniently ignore is it’s the last xxx amount of games meaning “what have you done for me lately”
I could see the rolling of eyes if it was a subset of games non consecutive but when talking NFL, people look at recent
Darnold was very pedestrian last year and worse than 2024 but he played lights out in playoffs particularly in nfc champ game and when it mattered most, hence most would rate him higher than baker now.
same with Lawrence. Only reason he gets the nod now is despite him being overrated he played at elite level for last half of season
with baker, ok. Let’s assume it was the injuries. That’s fine. But he was not effective or good and some of the fan base is ignoring that. We are 11-6 if a baker plays just mediocre the last 6 games. Now grant it, Bucs hands were tied because they didn’t have a backup QB, but guarantee now browning will see time if baker is too banged up to be effective. 100% why they signed him
but none the less approaching July with no contact extension. Guess we will see who Bucs brass is more like….negative ole me….or homer sign baker now team
So Mayfield is defined by a negative subset of games from 2025, Lawrence a positive subset?
The “Philly Special” takes on a whole new meaning on these boards.
the part you always conveniently ignore is it’s the last xxx amount of games meaning “what have you done for me lately”
I dont conveniently ignore the last subset of games. I just dont emphasize it as much as you do.
But look, even you must see the hilarious position you put yourself in by comparing two QB by a different subset of games, one the toughest the other the best?
Come one now. It's funny right?
with baker, ok. Let’s assume it was the injuries. That’s fine. But he was not effective or good and some of the fan base is ignoring that
It wasnt the injuries. It was poor play, injuries, the offense, Evans, the team sliding, the defense.
But again, the hilarious part of your position is that Mayfield WON games early, some in dramatic fashion. Those games seem to matter for Lawrence (came on strong at the end), but then NOT for Mayfield (played strong in the beginning).
Look, see it however you want (is this really abut Manning?), but as just a matter of simple logic and fairness its probably a better comparison to put them side by side in Coen's offense then to put Mayfield 11 against Lawrences six or whatever. You approach makes JC5100 jealous
the part you always conveniently ignore is it’s the last xxx amount of games meaning “what have you done for me lately”
I dont conveniently ignore the last subset of games. I just dont emphasize it as much as you do.
But look, even you must see the hilarious position you put yourself in by comparing two QB by a different subset of games, one the toughest the other the best?
Come one now. It's funny right?
no, I’m not understanding where you are having an issue with last half of year stats let’s call it. If one is playing better than the other, would you not call them playing better more recently?
with baker, ok. Let’s assume it was the injuries. That’s fine. But he was not effective or good and some of the fan base is ignoring that
It wasnt the injuries. It was poor play, injuries, the offense, Evans, the team sliding, the defense.
But again, the hilarious part of your position is that Mayfield WON games early, some in dramatic fashion. Those games seem to matter for Lawrence (came on strong at the end), but then NOT for Mayfield (played strong in the beginning).
Look, see it however you want (is this really abut Manning?), but as just a matter of simple logic and fairness its probably a better comparison to put them side by side in Coen's offense then to put Mayfield 11 against Lawrences six or whatever. You approach makes JC5100 jealous
I sent in another thread links. Do some research of what pundits are saying and you ask who has which QB rated higher heading into 2026 season. It’s not me, it’s you.
again heading into 2024 and 2025 seasons, I’d argue mayfield was clearly higher than Lawrence, what changed?
baker Cleveland 22 season = baker Tampa 25 season
so he didn’t survive 22, he barely hanging on in 25
he needs a better agent to tell him to sit when he’s hurt
he needs a better agent to tell him to sit when he’s hurt
Lol
Badabing I'm worried about you. Did you suffer a concussion recently?
Maye played tier 1 last year
With Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson missing time - maybe.
Herbert is tier 1
I haven't heard anybody outside of San Diego or Eugene say Herbert is top-5 QB. The 26 TD to 13 Int last season certainly doesn't support that. Neither do his other stats.
9th in yards
7th in TD's
4th most Int's
14th in comp percentage
13th in YPA
15th in QB rating
And, again, that's with Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson not being on top of those lists. Hell, he and Baker has pretty similar seasons. Do you think Baker is tier 1 too?
Herbert had a fanatic year last year despite limited weapons and a line playing exclusively practice squad players with the worst statistical center in the league.
Early in the season he was an MVP candidate. Timely play making. Elite throws.
He's never had elite play makers. He's never had a good line.
Take him off the chargers and they are a 4-5 win team
It’s not me, it’s you.
I didnt make the 11 games versus last 6 games argument
So, keeping in mind this is all just kidding around, I was poking fun at the argument coming back to bite you (as it would inevitably do). I dont think Lawrence is better than Mayfield, but I am sure many people do. Everyone thought Mayfield was terrible in 2021, 2022 . . thats why we got him for $4 million. Didnt turn out that he was terrible.
And then . . . Mayfield came back towards the Bucs
“I would love to be there,” Mayfield said of staying with the Bucs. “I think both sides want to get it done. It’s a matter of finding that middle ground and what makes both sides happy."
Maye played tier 1 last year
With Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson missing time - maybe.
Herbert is tier 1
I haven't heard anybody outside of San Diego or Eugene say Herbert is top-5 QB. The 26 TD to 13 Int last season certainly doesn't support that. Neither do his other stats.
9th in yards
7th in TD's
4th most Int's
14th in comp percentage
13th in YPA
15th in QB rating
And, again, that's with Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson not being on top of those lists. Hell, he and Baker has pretty similar seasons. Do you think Baker is tier 1 too?
Herbert had a fanatic year last year despite limited weapons and a line playing exclusively practice squad players with the worst statistical center in the league.
Early in the season he was an MVP candidate. Timely play making. Elite throws.
He's never had elite play makers. He's never had a good line.
Take him off the chargers and they are a 4-5 win team
Those are simply opinions, which you’re welcome to have. But none of that is proof that Herbert was top 5 elite last season.
Again, his performance was almost identical to Baker Mayfield’s. And only the biggest Tampa/Oklahoma homers act like he had an elite top 5 QB season.
Maye played tier 1 last year
With Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson missing time - maybe.
Herbert is tier 1
I haven't heard anybody outside of San Diego or Eugene say Herbert is top-5 QB. The 26 TD to 13 Int last season certainly doesn't support that. Neither do his other stats.
9th in yards
7th in TD's
4th most Int's
14th in comp percentage
13th in YPA
15th in QB rating
And, again, that's with Mahomes, Burrows, and Jackson not being on top of those lists. Hell, he and Baker has pretty similar seasons. Do you think Baker is tier 1 too?
Herbert had a fanatic year last year despite limited weapons and a line playing exclusively practice squad players with the worst statistical center in the league.
Early in the season he was an MVP candidate. Timely play making. Elite throws.
He's never had elite play makers. He's never had a good line.
Take him off the chargers and they are a 4-5 win team
Those are simply opinions, which you’re welcome to have. But none of that is proof that Herbert was top 5 elite last season.
Again, his performance was almost identical to Baker Mayfield’s. And only the biggest Tampa/Oklahoma homers act like he had an elite top 5 QB season.
https://www.chargers.com/news/sam-monson-justin-herbert-nfl-mvp
Of course it's opinion but also, as you know, stats are like bikinis.
That chargers team was average at best when healthy. Herbert played through a broken hand, won 11 games, his line was maybe top 5 worst unit after the injuries.
Using your logic... Mahomes had the same stats but he is tier 1 so... Explain your logic there (assuming you think he's still top tier).
Mahomes
3500 yards, 22 TDs, 11 picks, 422 rushing yards, 5 TDs
6 wins
Herbert
3700, 26 TDs, 13 picks, 498 rushing yards, 2 TDs
11 wins
Mahomes has a better team and a better coach. Same division. Herbert 2-0 h2h
Again since we're talking stats and not "my opinion".
And we both know that chargers team is 6 wins at beat without him.
