It's easy to forget what Bucky was running into...
It was the same stuff White and Tucker ran into.
Both of them were better than Bucky (from basic to advanced metrics), even when he was healthy.
Yes agree.
And yet . . .they shipped out White and tried to ship out "Emmitt Smith II" and brought in an outside RB. I would think that means they value Bucky as the star, but are hedging their bets because of injuries and inability to be a bell cow, and they did not think much of White and see only limited value in "Emmitt Smith II," more than White but not enough to not get an outside guy.
I am nowhere near JC on "Emmitt Smith II" but I am hopeful that he continues to progress. Undeniably adds speed to the unit, already a good option in 4 minute offense late, just need to work on his vision and blocking, maybe receiving.
one interesting side question would be was there ANOTHER RB they were trying to bring in?
They sign Gainwell in March
White is gone the next day
Tucker resigns right before the draft, so they probably were not drafting someone. I think he was tendered in March too
Was there a RB they were trying to get, but lost out on, so they went back to Tucker?
Or maybe Tucker was the guy its just that he went out looking for a market and didnt find one?
It's easy to forget what Bucky was running into...
It was the same stuff White and Tucker ran into.
Both of them were better than Bucky (from basic to advanced metrics), even when he was healthy.
The lions share of Tucker's production came again the Bills, who were top 3 worst run defense.
320 rushing yards on the season, of which 106 came vs Buffalo. Literally 100% of his receiving yards in that game as well.
So of his 354 yards on the season, 140 came in one game vs one of the worst run defenses in the league.
Surely that skews the stats, yes?
It's easy to forget what Bucky was running into...
It was the same stuff White and Tucker ran into.
Both of them were better than Bucky (from basic to advanced metrics), even when he was healthy.
Yes agree.
And yet . . .they shipped out White and tried to ship out "Emmitt Smith II" and brought in an outside RB. I would think that means they value Bucky as the star, but are hedging their bets because of injuries and inability to be a bell cow, and they did not think much of White and see only limited value in "Emmitt Smith II," more than White but not enough to not get an outside guy.
I am nowhere near JC on "Emmitt Smith II" but I am hopeful that he continues to progress. Undeniably adds speed to the unit, already a good option in 4 minute offense late, just need to work on his vision and blocking, maybe receiving.
KG though isn't a bell cow either so far in his career, and he is more of a specialist returner/third down RB. Bucs are paying him for his future potential to emerge that type of feature player if Bucky can't go or does not return to form. There were more proven RBs on the market that have been featured backs and starters that were available in free agency and the Bucs opted otherwise. It is a gamble as well as paying Robinson so much money as well as Otton.
Licht is going to receive a lot of scrutiny based on the performances of Otton, Gainwell and Robinson if they look mid and not players that can boost this team to new heights. But if Gainwell looks like a 1, Otton takes the next step and Robinson makes the Panthers look stupid then Licht looks like the smartest GM in the room again.
There were more proven RBs on the market
thats why i asked in the next post about who might they have been considering? Maybe they were not.
It's easy to forget what Bucky was running into...
It was the same stuff White and Tucker ran into.
Both of them were better than Bucky (from basic to advanced metrics), even when he was healthy.
The lions share of Tucker's production came again the Bills, who were top 3 worst run defense.
320 rushing yards on the season, of which 106 came vs Buffalo. Literally 100% of his receiving yards in that game as well.
So of his 354 yards on the season, 140 came in one game vs one of the worst run defenses in the league.
Surely that skews the stats, yes?
Well, since you want to cherry pick, would you like to discuss a good chunk of Bucky's carries out of the pony in his rookie year?
You, know, the gimmicky ones that spurred the insane YPC?
The ones, we both discussed were being favored towards him and not White (and when White did get them, his YPC were well over his average)?
Last year, he was stuck in a more traditional "old school" RB role. Again, thanks to our absolute genius HC.
Didn't work out so well for him, did it?
He's in no way, shape, or form a "bell cow" back.
You have to take him off the field on 3rd down, because a legless hobo would be better in pass protection.
Hope he has an insane year, so his trade value sky rockets.
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle who put up 1076 yards on 236 attempts as a Panther last year. The year before he put up 1079 yards on 235 attempts as a Cowboy. Back to back 1000 yard campaigns with 200+ carries per season. Dowdle also had 39 receptions in back to back seasons in addition to carrying at least 200 times per season.
Then you have Allgeier (Cardinals) that has already proven he can be a 1000 yard runner as a RB1. And he knows Robinson's offense fully well.
Then you have fringe sub 1000 yard runners in Brian Robison (Falcons), Pacheco (Lions), Dillon (Panthers).
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle
It looks like they passed on a guy like Dowdle over Gainwell. They are both the same age, roughly the same money because Gainwell also plays special teams and they have Sean Tucker already. Looking more closely, Tucker was shopping himself with the Bucs offer open, not really the other way around
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle who put up 1076 yards on 236 attempts as a Panther last year. The year before he put up 1079 yards on 235 attempts as a Cowboy. Back to back 1000 yard campaigns with 200+ carries per season. Dowdle also had 39 receptions in back to back seasons in addition to carrying at least 200 times per season.
Then you have Allgeier (Cardinals) that has already proven he can be a 1000 yard runner as a RB1. And he knows Robinson's offense fully well.
Then you have fringe sub 1000 yard runners in Brian Robison (Falcons), Pacheco (Lions), Dillon (Panthers).
Gainwell by any measure, was the best RB for what Tampa is trying to do. He was the offensive MVP for the Steelers. Does everything he’s asked to do.
It's easy to forget what Bucky was running into...
It was the same stuff White and Tucker ran into.
Both of them were better than Bucky (from basic to advanced metrics), even when he was healthy.
The lions share of Tucker's production came again the Bills, who were top 3 worst run defense.
320 rushing yards on the season, of which 106 came vs Buffalo. Literally 100% of his receiving yards in that game as well.
So of his 354 yards on the season, 140 came in one game vs one of the worst run defenses in the league.
Surely that skews the stats, yes?
Well, since you want to cherry pick, would you like to discuss a good chunk of Bucky's carries out of the pony in his rookie year?
You, know, the gimmicky ones that spurred the insane YPC?
The ones, we both discussed were being favored towards him and not White (and when White did get them, his YPC were well over his average)?
Last year, he was stuck in a more traditional "old school" RB role. Again, thanks to our absolute genius HC.
Didn't work out so well for him, did it?
He's in no way, shape, or form a "bell cow" back.
You have to take him off the field on 3rd down, because a legless hobo would be better in pass protection.
Hope he has an insane year, so his trade value sky rockets.
Is there a way to look at his stats in the pony? I know he excelled in it but we also watched Bucky CONSISTENTLY make something out of nothing his rookie year. Or turn modest gains into big gains where as White would fall forward in those instances.
There's a million ways to dissect stats but it's pretty telling when, in b2b seasons, Tucker got over a third of his production in one game against a putrid run defense.
Are you saying Tucker is better than Bucky? I'm not sure I follow... You want him traded now?
It's really hard to gauge last year because we went from elite play calling and relative health to awful play calling and relatively injured.
I haven't gone over play by play by any stretch but I don't recall a ton of instances where Bucky missed an opportunity with poor vision etc.
I do recall rubbing my temples over and over at Grizz's predictability and vanilla scheme... That only seemed to work when we played against atrocious run defenses.
Are you saying Tucker is better than Bucky?
No, I'm not saying Tucker is better.
I'm saying Kyren is better. And so would 31 other GM's.
That's not a knock against Bucky.
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle who put up 1076 yards on 236 attempts as a Panther last year. The year before he put up 1079 yards on 235 attempts as a Cowboy. Back to back 1000 yard campaigns with 200+ carries per season. Dowdle also had 39 receptions in back to back seasons in addition to carrying at least 200 times per season.
Then you have Allgeier (Cardinals) that has already proven he can be a 1000 yard runner as a RB1. And he knows Robinson's offense fully well.
Then you have fringe sub 1000 yard runners in Brian Robison (Falcons), Pacheco (Lions), Dillon (Panthers).
Gainwell by any measure, was the best RB for what Tampa is trying to do. He was the offensive MVP for the Steelers. Does everything he’s asked to do.
Gainwell is closer to Patriots White (retired now) than what the Bucs needed. He is a third down ace and special teams maven. But the Bucs need a a guy that can pound the rock with Tucker till Irving returns and that is my concern with Gainwell. When Irving returns Gainwell will go back to his intended role of third down specialist but when will Irving be full go? That is the problem.
This is why I was surprised they went after Gainwell first as most teams grab the early down runners first and then go out to grab specialists later.
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle
It looks like they passed on a guy like Dowdle over Gainwell. They are both the same age, roughly the same money because Gainwell also plays special teams and they have Sean Tucker already. Looking more closely, Tucker was shopping himself with the Bucs offer open, not really the other way around
They were not sure if they would bring back Tucker so I think that they decided to bring back Tucker despite bringing in Gainwell after his Gainwell's signng. Most likely they received updated information regarding Irving rehab progress and figured they might as well double up at RB at that point.
There were more proven RBs on the market
Debatable.
Rico Dowdle
It looks like they passed on a guy like Dowdle over Gainwell. They are both the same age, roughly the same money because Gainwell also plays special teams and they have Sean Tucker already. Looking more closely, Tucker was shopping himself with the Bucs offer open, not really the other way around
They were not sure if they would bring back Tucker so I think that they decided to bring back Tucker despite bringing in Gainwell after his Gainwell's signng. Most likely they received updated information regarding Irving rehab progress and figured they might as well double up at RB at that point.
Yeah exactly, insurance for Bucky and since nobody else wanted Tucker, a cheap option to return.
to be fair, we had Bucky, White, and Tucker last year so with Gainwell replacing White; Tucker a cheap steady option that knows playbook in a clear reserve role if Bucky and Gainwell play to expectations.