How does waiting a year improve the financial impact of any of this?Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Since you continue to pound the table like an idiot for Baker getting a 5yr, $275M deal...
How many QB contracts in that range have guaranteed money that's LESS than 9 figures?
And, while you're at it, Einstein.
Let us know how many QB's who are making an AAY of $45M per year, that have less than 9 figures guaranteed.
Do folks wringing their hands over cap think the organization wants Baker to have a bad year to either get a better deal, or move on? THAT has been done here numerous times, hint: it takes a decade to recover from it.
AND if he plays well, your $275 turns in $300m… but the “don’t break the bank for Baker crowd” will want to start from $250m…
It’s not a sustainable argument. There are no plug & play NFL starters, waiting to step in - that are also cheap.
Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Since you continue to pound the table like an idiot for Baker getting a 5yr, $275M deal...
How many QB contracts in that range have guaranteed money that's LESS than 9 figures?
And, while you're at it, Einstein.
Let us know how many QB's who are making an AAY of $45M per year, that have less than 9 figures guaranteed.
appreciate comprehension isn’t your strongest suite
I am saying he will most certainly get 100M guaranteed
debatable Debby gonna debate tho 🤡
Why would Mayfield sign a long term deal with the uncertainty with Bowles or Robinson? At this point Mayfield may want to wait not only for a larger pay raise but also some clarity as the next HC next year or the new OC.
Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Bowles future hinges directly on Baker. Guy balls out and Bucs likely making playoffs again which would show progress over the 2025 collapse, Bowles likely staying. If Baker is pedestrian, and Bowles defense jumps from like bottom 10 to maybe 15th-to20th (which let's be honest, it's realistic that marginal improvement over say jumping to 02 buccaneers D)....likely not good enough and could see Bucs moving in different direction.
In terms of Robinson, he will either stay, get fired, or potential get head coaching gig. Does he get promoted in Tampa? Guess it will depend how season plays out but it would appear the Bucs brass loves them some Todd Bowles. Baker is no stranger to having a different OC.
If Bucs were offering Baker market value which would be north of $50M+ a year and 4, 5 year deal, he would accept immediately. Thing is, we dont know what the Bucs are offering but as i've said at nauseum, they are most likely under that figure per year and Baker is betting on himself that hes just as good as Purdy, Lawrence, Love, Hurts, and Goff. And why are they under that figure? Because Baker finished the year poorly and they want to see how he plays this year. Quite frankly, if im the Bucs, he played himself out of a contract extension during that 6 game finish where we were favored in all the games and went 2-4 and he put up 8 touchdowns to 6 INTs and led the offense to greater than 20 points in just 1 of those games. Putrid.
Its best for both parties involved to see how this year plays out.
There is a chance the team goes 8-9 again even if Mayfield balls out. Then what? And there is no guarantee that Bowles is gone in that scenario either. Does Robinson stick around if the team finishes 8-9 or does the team move onto another OC again?
Mayfield may end up taking less money to help out the team add talent. Brady was a more talented QB than a lot of QBs when he signed with the Bucs but he took less money to help the team add players.
Stacking talent is kind of important and that is what is another factor that should be considered. Mayfield is no Mahomes but even the Chiefs ran into a wall last year because of they started to run out of talent to compete within their own division.
The chances of baker throwing 35+ TDs (balling out) and Bucs having a losing record is the same as Baker being what he is as the last 11 games last year throwing 21 TDs, 15 INTs. Then what? Would you want baker back?
if baker balls out which I would describe as doing once in his 8 year career, 2024 season, you most definitely offer him a contact.
i would think if baker balls out, then Robinson did a good job and the defense was the reason for the losing record. So in that situation I think it’s more likely Robinson is retained either via Head coach or OC role again. Bowles would be more on hot seat in that situation where I would just replace Bowles with Robinson
but I’m just saying if baker balls out, it’s unlikely this team isn’t in the playoffs so your scenario is just as likely as mine where Baker regresses out of a starting job
Why would Mayfield sign a long term deal with the uncertainty with Bowles or Robinson? At this point Mayfield may want to wait not only for a larger pay raise but also some clarity as the next HC next year or the new OC.
for context DH, baker would play for anyone (London silly Nannie’) if offered 100M guaranteed
this was in response to baker not signing a longer term deal. Let me know if you need further help here
45M a year. Yeah maybe 5 years ago
It’s also 50% more than his current AAY.
The guarantee I offered was DOUBLE that of his last deal.
The numbers put him within Top 11-14.
Per usual, you’re simply talking out of both sides of your mouth.
when playing to his potential, is baker not arguably a better qb than Jordan love, Jared golf, Brock purdy and Trevor Lawrence?
there values were all north of $50M a year
it’s ok. Market value has risen. Clearly im hesitant to give baker that cash without proving that last year was not his norm
debatable Debbie - waiting on your response here with your 4 year, 180M contract offer
Then he was one of the main reasons for our demise
yikes
baker was bad man.
Mayfield's body of work is NOT 11 games of 2025 lmao, its 2023 with Canales, 2024 with Coen and 2025 with Grizz.
Your positions seems to be "Mayfield is not 2023, 2024 and 2025, he is 11 games of 2025" so with the one coordinator who got fired and a team that spiraled?
Not sure thats reasonable assessment.
Here's one alternative approach:
Say hes not 2024 Mayfield (thats Coen), but then you'd have to also say hes not 2025 Mayfield (thats Grizz). Take out the two outliers. The high and the low.
If you do that then he's 2023 Mayfield.
In 2023 with the vanilla Canales offense he throws for 4000+ yds and 34 TDs to 12 INTs. I think that puts him in top 10-15 range in 2023, but in 2025 he would've been top 10 ish so sort of Josh Allen or Sam Darnold.
Thats probably (and hopefully) a more realistic take
That is not an answer!!!Maybe they could call the Saints or Chiefs to figure it out?According to Spotrac the Bucs only have 10 million in cap space after signing Bain.
Someone show me how the Bucs can sign Baker to a 50 million contract and stay under the salary cap.
The bad news the Bucs have already renegotiated contracts just to get to the 10 million cap space.
Void years, guaranteed money, and roster cuts are the logical pathways. However, the communication from the owners & Licht seemingly aren’t all that worked up about it.
Present a specific plan to sign Baker to a big contract. A contract with void years calls for a signing bonus. Add that signing bonus prorated for the years of the contract, If Baker is given a 100 million signing bonus for a 10 year contract, that still adds 10 million to this season. Takes the Bucs over the salary cap. Put on your Licht hat and provide a specific plan.
I don’t have to present anything. You’ve been given a few potential scenarios, already, but you didn’t address them, you just carp about some a large contract that likely isn’t being discussed.That is not an answer!!!Maybe they could call the Saints or Chiefs to figure it out?According to Spotrac the Bucs only have 10 million in cap space after signing Bain.
Someone show me how the Bucs can sign Baker to a 50 million contract and stay under the salary cap.
The bad news the Bucs have already renegotiated contracts just to get to the 10 million cap space.
Void years, guaranteed money, and roster cuts are the logical pathways. However, the communication from the owners & Licht seemingly aren’t all that worked up about it.
Present a specific plan to sign Baker to a big contract. A contract with void years calls for a signing bonus. Add that signing bonus prorated for the years of the contract, If Baker is given a 100 million signing bonus for a 10 year contract, that still adds 10 million to this season. Takes the Bucs over the salary cap. Put on your Licht hat and provide a specific plan.
No one is advocating for anything near $250m, I simply pointed out the fact that whatever deal you could make now, is going to be more expensive, by waiting.
I’m acquainted with the tactic of using extremism to make a point, but you’ve kinda breached protocol and gone straight to the double-dog-dare.
So, using your scenario, would a ball-out-Baker season be more expensive, or less expensive, than the contract that both sides want to do now?Why would Mayfield sign a long term deal with the uncertainty with Bowles or Robinson? At this point Mayfield may want to wait not only for a larger pay raise but also some clarity as the next HC next year or the new OC.
Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Bowles future hinges directly on Baker. Guy balls out and Bucs likely making playoffs again which would show progress over the 2025 collapse, Bowles likely staying. If Baker is pedestrian, and Bowles defense jumps from like bottom 10 to maybe 15th-to20th (which let's be honest, it's realistic that marginal improvement over say jumping to 02 buccaneers D)....likely not good enough and could see Bucs moving in different direction.
In terms of Robinson, he will either stay, get fired, or potential get head coaching gig. Does he get promoted in Tampa? Guess it will depend how season plays out but it would appear the Bucs brass loves them some Todd Bowles. Baker is no stranger to having a different OC.
If Bucs were offering Baker market value which would be north of $50M+ a year and 4, 5 year deal, he would accept immediately. Thing is, we dont know what the Bucs are offering but as i've said at nauseum, they are most likely under that figure per year and Baker is betting on himself that hes just as good as Purdy, Lawrence, Love, Hurts, and Goff. And why are they under that figure? Because Baker finished the year poorly and they want to see how he plays this year. Quite frankly, if im the Bucs, he played himself out of a contract extension during that 6 game finish where we were favored in all the games and went 2-4 and he put up 8 touchdowns to 6 INTs and led the offense to greater than 20 points in just 1 of those games. Putrid.
Its best for both parties involved to see how this year plays out.
There is a chance the team goes 8-9 again even if Mayfield balls out. Then what? And there is no guarantee that Bowles is gone in that scenario either. Does Robinson stick around if the team finishes 8-9 or does the team move onto another OC again?
Mayfield may end up taking less money to help out the team add talent. Brady was a more talented QB than a lot of QBs when he signed with the Bucs but he took less money to help the team add players.
Stacking talent is kind of important and that is what is another factor that should be considered. Mayfield is no Mahomes but even the Chiefs ran into a wall last year because of they started to run out of talent to compete within their own division.
The chances of baker throwing 35+ TDs (balling out) and Bucs having a losing record is the same as Baker being what he is as the last 11 games last year throwing 21 TDs, 15 INTs. Then what? Would you want baker back?
if baker balls out which I would describe as doing once in his 8 year career, 2024 season, you most definitely offer him a contact.
i would think if baker balls out, then Robinson did a good job and the defense was the reason for the losing record. So in that situation I think it’s more likely Robinson is retained either via Head coach or OC role again. Bowles would be more on hot seat in that situation where I would just replace Bowles with Robinson
but I’m just saying if baker balls out, it’s unlikely this team isn’t in the playoffs so your scenario is just as likely as mine where Baker regresses out of a starting job
Seems, as Olaf points out, you want to narrow the outcome by limiting the negotiation to his last 11 games. Not only is that poor position, it wouldn’t even be considered by the QB that just endured 8 games behind one of the worst o-line deployments in the NFL. You forced him to play without the line, without his two starting receivers, without his starting running back, and he STILL managed to win 6 of those 8 games - but now he’s pissed because the injuries you forced him to endure, finally accumulated to the point where it affected his ability to perform when some of those offensive weapons were finally back. BUT your defense couldn’t consistently stop an opponent when they had them in 3rd & 28!?
Yet you don’t think that should be considered, but rather insist on only reviewing those 11 games that you think work to prove your point?
It’s sophistry, actually.
So, using your scenario, would a ball-out-Baker season be more expensive, or less expensive, than the contract that both sides want to do now?Why would Mayfield sign a long term deal with the uncertainty with Bowles or Robinson? At this point Mayfield may want to wait not only for a larger pay raise but also some clarity as the next HC next year or the new OC.
Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Bowles future hinges directly on Baker. Guy balls out and Bucs likely making playoffs again which would show progress over the 2025 collapse, Bowles likely staying. If Baker is pedestrian, and Bowles defense jumps from like bottom 10 to maybe 15th-to20th (which let's be honest, it's realistic that marginal improvement over say jumping to 02 buccaneers D)....likely not good enough and could see Bucs moving in different direction.
In terms of Robinson, he will either stay, get fired, or potential get head coaching gig. Does he get promoted in Tampa? Guess it will depend how season plays out but it would appear the Bucs brass loves them some Todd Bowles. Baker is no stranger to having a different OC.
If Bucs were offering Baker market value which would be north of $50M+ a year and 4, 5 year deal, he would accept immediately. Thing is, we dont know what the Bucs are offering but as i've said at nauseum, they are most likely under that figure per year and Baker is betting on himself that hes just as good as Purdy, Lawrence, Love, Hurts, and Goff. And why are they under that figure? Because Baker finished the year poorly and they want to see how he plays this year. Quite frankly, if im the Bucs, he played himself out of a contract extension during that 6 game finish where we were favored in all the games and went 2-4 and he put up 8 touchdowns to 6 INTs and led the offense to greater than 20 points in just 1 of those games. Putrid.
Its best for both parties involved to see how this year plays out.
There is a chance the team goes 8-9 again even if Mayfield balls out. Then what? And there is no guarantee that Bowles is gone in that scenario either. Does Robinson stick around if the team finishes 8-9 or does the team move onto another OC again?
Mayfield may end up taking less money to help out the team add talent. Brady was a more talented QB than a lot of QBs when he signed with the Bucs but he took less money to help the team add players.
Stacking talent is kind of important and that is what is another factor that should be considered. Mayfield is no Mahomes but even the Chiefs ran into a wall last year because of they started to run out of talent to compete within their own division.
The chances of baker throwing 35+ TDs (balling out) and Bucs having a losing record is the same as Baker being what he is as the last 11 games last year throwing 21 TDs, 15 INTs. Then what? Would you want baker back?
if baker balls out which I would describe as doing once in his 8 year career, 2024 season, you most definitely offer him a contact.
i would think if baker balls out, then Robinson did a good job and the defense was the reason for the losing record. So in that situation I think it’s more likely Robinson is retained either via Head coach or OC role again. Bowles would be more on hot seat in that situation where I would just replace Bowles with Robinson
but I’m just saying if baker balls out, it’s unlikely this team isn’t in the playoffs so your scenario is just as likely as mine where Baker regresses out of a starting job
Seems, as Olaf points out, you want to narrow the outcome by limiting the negotiation to his last 11 games. Not only is that poor position, it wouldn’t even be considered by the QB that just endured 8 games behind one of the worst o-line deployments in the NFL. You forced him to play without the line, without his two starting receivers, without his starting running back, and he STILL managed to win 6 of those 8 games - but now he’s pissed because the injuries you forced him to endure, finally accumulated to the point where it affected his ability to perform when some of those offensive weapons were finally back. BUT your defense couldn’t consistently stop an opponent when they had them in 3rd & 28!?
Yet you don’t think that should be considered, but rather insist on only reviewing those 11 games that you think work to prove your point?
It’s sophistry, actually.
if baker balls out, he is likely looking at 50M+, maybe 55 and we are happy about it
if baker performs above average (call it 2023 season type performance) he is getting 50M and it will be questioned by some. We really have no option and baker likely gives us best chance to win
if back half of 2025 was not a fluke and Baker performs below average again, Bowles is likely gone and a new coach might want to move in a different direction. Talking ultimate regression - 21 TDs, 15 INTs. I don’t think it’s likely but it’s possible. If that happens are you happy with $50M per year?
in DHs scenario, 45M per year, I just don’t think bakers camp would accept that before the season as he wants to get the going rate for an above average starting QB (50,55M)
I clearly lost confidence in baker given he shit the bed last year. I’ll be back on the bandwagon when he’s winning us games again. Problem I see, he hasn’t been consistent enough his entire career for us to just chalk up last year to “bad luck”
Then he was one of the main reasons for our demise
yikes
baker was bad man.
Mayfield's body of work is NOT 11 games of 2025 lmao, its 2023 with Canales, 2024 with Coen and 2025 with Grizz.
Your positions seems to be "Mayfield is not 2023, 2024 and 2025, he is 11 games of 2025" so with the one coordinator who got fired and a team that spiraled?
Not sure thats reasonable assessment.
Here's one alternative approach:
Say hes not 2024 Mayfield (thats Coen), but then you'd have to also say hes not 2025 Mayfield (thats Grizz). Take out the two outliers. The high and the low.
If you do that then he's 2023 Mayfield.
In 2023 with the vanilla Canales offense he throws for 4000+ yds and 34 TDs to 12 INTs. I think that puts him in top 10-15 range in 2023, but in 2025 he would've been top 10 ish so sort of Josh Allen or Sam Darnold.
Thats probably (and hopefully) a more realistic take
listen, I don’t think we will do better than Baker for our 2027 QB
but I’m hesitant given his regression last year as I am sure some in the Bucs front office is. He played so poorly the last half he played himself out of a contract extension
Let me ask you something if he hit 30 TDs last year, call it an extra 4 in those final 6 - isn’t it likely 1) Bucs make playoffs 2) baker is already extended as we sit here May 9th.
I’m hesitant to prematurely extend him because there is a small chance he is no longer a starting QB caliber (last 11 games). If that happens, we basically gave out a $200M + contact when we didn’t have to. If he dominates like he did in 2024, you are only taking on Bucs losing out on $20M contract value which who cares.
let Baker prove himself and play with fire this year. Then we can gladly give him his contract but go ahead and say the Bucs brass is just as confidence as you guys are while no contract extension materializes
and listen I am hoping for a baker bounce back clearly. you know I was one of the few that was in his camp over Kyle freaking trask lol but also I just don’t give him a free pass like many of you do for last years collapse.
Mike Evans wouldn’t have left tom Brady 🤔
Why would Mayfield sign a long term deal with the uncertainty with Bowles or Robinson? At this point Mayfield may want to wait not only for a larger pay raise but also some clarity as the next HC next year or the new OC.
Baker Mayfield wanting 9 figures guaranteed money? Yeah he would play for the London silly nannies if they offered him that
Bowles future hinges directly on Baker. Guy balls out and Bucs likely making playoffs again which would show progress over the 2025 collapse, Bowles likely staying. If Baker is pedestrian, and Bowles defense jumps from like bottom 10 to maybe 15th-to20th (which let's be honest, it's realistic that marginal improvement over say jumping to 02 buccaneers D)....likely not good enough and could see Bucs moving in different direction.
In terms of Robinson, he will either stay, get fired, or potential get head coaching gig. Does he get promoted in Tampa? Guess it will depend how season plays out but it would appear the Bucs brass loves them some Todd Bowles. Baker is no stranger to having a different OC.
If Bucs were offering Baker market value which would be north of $50M+ a year and 4, 5 year deal, he would accept immediately. Thing is, we dont know what the Bucs are offering but as i've said at nauseum, they are most likely under that figure per year and Baker is betting on himself that hes just as good as Purdy, Lawrence, Love, Hurts, and Goff. And why are they under that figure? Because Baker finished the year poorly and they want to see how he plays this year. Quite frankly, if im the Bucs, he played himself out of a contract extension during that 6 game finish where we were favored in all the games and went 2-4 and he put up 8 touchdowns to 6 INTs and led the offense to greater than 20 points in just 1 of those games. Putrid.
Its best for both parties involved to see how this year plays out.
There is a chance the team goes 8-9 again even if Mayfield balls out. Then what? And there is no guarantee that Bowles is gone in that scenario either. Does Robinson stick around if the team finishes 8-9 or does the team move onto another OC again?
Mayfield may end up taking less money to help out the team add talent. Brady was a more talented QB than a lot of QBs when he signed with the Bucs but he took less money to help the team add players.
Stacking talent is kind of important and that is what is another factor that should be considered. Mayfield is no Mahomes but even the Chiefs ran into a wall last year because of they started to run out of talent to compete within their own division.
The chances of baker throwing 35+ TDs (balling out) and Bucs having a losing record is the same as Baker being what he is as the last 11 games last year throwing 21 TDs, 15 INTs. Then what? Would you want baker back?
if baker balls out which I would describe as doing once in his 8 year career, 2024 season, you most definitely offer him a contact.
i would think if baker balls out, then Robinson did a good job and the defense was the reason for the losing record. So in that situation I think it’s more likely Robinson is retained either via Head coach or OC role again. Bowles would be more on hot seat in that situation where I would just replace Bowles with Robinson
but I’m just saying if baker balls out, it’s unlikely this team isn’t in the playoffs so your scenario is just as likely as mine where Baker regresses out of a starting job
Baker is a gun slinger and is capable of throwing a lot of TDs. But even in his down year he only threw 11 INTs last season. Of those 11 INTS the lion share came during that bad stretch of game play from Mayfield. I believe Mayfield playing injured impacted his decision making big time and also his touch on a lot of throws as he was never a super accurate passer to begin with. Throwing 10, 16, and 11 INTs over three seasons works in favor of Mayfield if Bowles remains the HC because, like Arians, Bowles wants a QB that does not throw a lot of INTs to play ball control.
I can see a situation where Mayfield hits 30+ TD passes but the Bucs still finish near, at or slightly above .500. Then what?
Bottom line is if they believe they can win playoff games with Mayfield they will offer him a contract. The challenge is how do you build around Mayfield with what is offered to him this off season or the next?
Mayfield is projected to be in the Darnold, Goff and Geno Smith territory aka 10-15 QB tier. But then again Darnold has now won more playoff games and may be firmly in the top 5, and Goff is further along and no longer considered a fringe 10-15 QB and more of a top 10 QB. It is possible that the Bucs FO feels that Mayfield will catch up this tier of QBs if given enough time and talent around him to win more playoff games to elevate himself.
But that hinges on a lot of ifs and unknowns.
I just think that waiting for the other shoe to drop is pointless as Licht needs to stack talent regardless of a Mayfield contract. This because if Mayfield fails you can draft a QB in round 1 on a rookie contract with an option and really add even more talent to compete during this window of time due to the cheap rookie 1st round contract on a QB.
I believe that the Bucs playing punt on a lot of decisions this off season and trying to cram them into next off season as possibly being too much in my view. But I can respect the decision of Mayfield, his agent, Licht and the Bucs FO if they want to make a deal next year. But Licht has a responsibility to compete this year too and to re up some of these players this year and next year other than Mayfield as well.
as I am sure some in the Bucs front office is. He played so poorly the last half he played himself out of a contract extension
sure sounds that way lol
"Baker is at the forefront of our mind at all times,” Licht said, via JoeBucsFan.com. “All of our plans revolve around Baker, and that’s something that we’ll get to at some point. I have had a lot of discussions with Baker about the team. We texted during the draft about some of the picks. I know he’s excited about the players that we took. We have a great relationship. Listen, nobody here wants Baker playing for [any] other team. So I’ll just leave it at that."
I think you're pretty much on an island. Even JC5100 is starting to wonder about you :-)